Steve vs. Neal, Ross and Jon

[madsplash]

You know what? I've just been doing a lot of rereading of the stuff that's out there since the split, and despite the fact that Neal, Ross and to a lesser extent, Jon have many times said nasty and negative things about SP, the fact is that SP has not said one negative or bad thing about ANY of those guys, ever!

He's taken the high road and complimented how great they are as musicians and as people. Never being immature or saying anything that taints the legacy of his time with them.

It really makes feel good about the way SP has handled things with class. And you know what, as Neal said at the end of that one interview, I'll turn it around and say it ABOUT Neal.........................................FUCK HIM!

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

[wednesday's child]

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

We'll see.

[Rick]

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

We'll see.

Yep. Good post by madsplash though. I think he's figured out how to win this place over.

Go Perry!!

Putting that in my sig.

[KDOUBLEU]

It seems like Neal has the most negative comments about Steve. Probably because deep down he knows that the band could have been an even greater legacy if Steve would have stayed (or been allowed to stay).

[MrsPerry]

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

We'll see.

we can all dream.

[alesson]

You know what? I've just been doing a lot of rereading of the stuff that's out there since the split, and despite the fact that Neal, Ross and to a lesser extent, Jon have many times said nasty and negative things about SP, the fact is that SP has not said one negative or bad thing about ANY of those guys, ever!

He's taken the high road and complimented how great they are as musicians and as people. Never being immature or saying anything that taints the legacy of his time with them.

It really makes feel good about the way SP has handled things with class. And you know what, as Neal said at the end of that one interview, I'll turn it around and say it ABOUT Neal.........................................FUCK HIM!

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

There is always the two sides of the coin. When you keep quiet about something that is being said about you is like almost admitting that is true or partly true. If you did a rebuttal about it, its either defending your honor against malicious accusations because it is not true. Or ViceVersa.

SP chosen the high road as you said. He is a class act in my opinion.

But.. to settle these things once and for all. Would it be better if SP issue at least ONE statement regarding the matter? Just to clear the air about it.
Or..SP loves MR people so much that his reason for keeping quiet is for us to have these never ending debacle to keep the forum alive.

[PowerChords]

SP was a dick during his tenure with the band even though he made them rich and famous with his girly whines, awesome songwriting skills and very unique vocal affectation.
It's human nature that they will easily remember the bad things SP did with the band. The good stuff unfortunately goes to the back burner.

[madsplash]

SP was a dick during his tenure with the band even though he made them rich and famous with his girly whines, awesome songwriting skills and very unique vocal affectation.
It's human nature that they will easily remember the bad things SP did with the band. The good stuff unfortunately goes to the back burner.

OK , a dick(do you KNOW him ?)with all of the talent, drive and direction of the band. Without SP, Neal wouldn't be able to pay his many ex-wives alimony each month.

[madsplash]

2009/2010 wil be the time of The Voice.

We'll see.

Yes we will. And it's gonna be fuckin' grand!

[Red13JoePa]

Neal, Ross and to a lesser extent, Jon have many times said nasty and negative things about SP, the fact is that SP has not said one negative or bad thing about ANY of those guys, ever!

Reading the interviews Schon and Cain always qualify the remarks they make about perry, IE they have their reasons and they cite them.

[jrnyjunky]

Steve is a class act. I think when Neal is saying what a shit Steve was and and it was Steve's fault blah blah blah, he is just looking for justification for what happened. Maybe he is feeling gulity, maybe it just that he enjoyed being 16 so much that he continues to act that age. For whatever reason, it just makes him look bad. Regardless of what happened, I'm sure they are both equally guilty. When you are in an argument with someone, you are a dick, or a bitch. I can be a BIG bitch, but I don't think I'm a bitch all the time. Just when prevoked. Steve has said he was no day at the beach. Has Neal ever taken responsibility for anything regarding the bad times? Not that I know of. That says alot about Neal. Always the victim.

[Saint John]

I'm sure that fault lies on both sides and that during their years together they were all difficult to work with at times. That said, let's examine who put Journey on ice, who toured singing Journey songs with others first, who stepped in at the 11th hour and dismantled a lineup that wanted to write, record and tour, fired the band's long-time manager (a man many believe is one of the greatest managers ever; at the very least one that changed the industry standards in countless ways) and who has recorded and toured behind that recording exactly once in the last 22 years...yet expects us to believe that Neal and Jon are the ones that destroyed that particular incarnation of the band.

Steve Perry remains a narcissistic, self-centered, passive-aggressive jackoff who had more to do with Journey's fall from grace by shanghaiing the control and direction of the band, and running that motherfucker right into the ground. Right around the same time the AOR music industry peaked and Bon Jovi was releasing Slippery When Wet (which would sell over 12 million copies) and Def Leppard was recording Hysteria (which would sell well over 10 million albums), Nostrildamus decided that Journey needed to change gears, sound more like Tears For Fears and fire Steve Smith and Ross Valory, and replace them with powerhouse drummer Lorrie Londin and bassist Randy Jackson, a guy that looked more like he should be screaming "Hey, Hey, Hey" on the TV show What's Happening?

Now I know that substance and alcohol abuse probably ran rampant through the band at various times, and that none of the main characters were easy to deal with, but I'll defer to Herbie Herbert, the man that built the band from the ground up and hired the very guy that would later wrestle virtually all control from him and turn a well oiled machine into a stagnant, non-touring, on ice, entity. So I don't give a shit about "high roads" and the like. Neal has no reason to take the high road, but he does have a reason to be frustrated by a former "brother" that shelved a great band, picked up and toured with others, and wasted a decade of peoples' careers. Why is it that Rolie, Smith, Valory, Schon, Cain and Herbert can all face each other and Perry runs around speaking through lawyers? I know...the high road.

[Jana]

Steve is a class act. I think when Neal is saying what a shit Steve was and and it was Steve's fault blah blah blah, he is just looking for justification for what happened. Maybe he is feeling gulity, maybe it just that he enjoyed being 16 so much that he continues to act that age. For whatever reason, it just makes him look bad. Regardless of what happened, I'm sure they are both equally guilty. When you are in an argument with someone, you are a dick, or a bitch. I can be a BIG bitch, but I don't think I'm a bitch all the time. Just when prevoked. Steve has said he was no day at the beach. Has Neal ever taken responsibility for anything regarding the bad times? Not that I know of. That says alot about Neal. Always the victim.

Well, Steve sure played the ultimate victim, too, saying he never felt he was part of the band. Come on . . . . . . . . what a statement. He was there b/f Cain and had a lot of things his way and was calling the shots at the end. His explanation many years later in GQ trying to explain away that comment didn't wash for me.

[madsplash]

You missed the point(as usual), SJ. Has SP said anything negative about the other members? That's what I thought. Show me if he has. And fuck Herbie, also. SP and Journey were a cash cow to him, that's all. Jealous, bitter, asshole= Herbie Herbert. Talkin shit on SP and promoting friggin ROXETTE? Get him and them the hell out.

[Gideon]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

[madsplash]

Just because you're the leader of a band, doesn't mean that the rest of the band made you feel like you were part of it.

[Gideon]

Just because you're the leader of a band, doesn't mean that the rest of the band made you feel like you were part of it.

For the record? Everyone in the band -- even Steve Smith (who, despite being fired by Perry, left when Perry was outed) -- thought that comment was the very definition of fucking retarded. How can you not be a part of that which you are completely controlling?

One wonders if Perry's probable narcissism may have been a contributing factor to his claimed alienation.

[Jana]

Just because you're the leader of a band, doesn't mean that the rest of the band made you feel like you were part of it.

See, I gave you an example and you can't handle it. At least, I can see the faults in all of them, and Steve "in public" has defiintely in some respects handled himself much better. But that statement was an asshole statement, plain and simple.

[Saint John]

Has SP said anything negative about the other members? That's what I thought.

Your argument is akin to saying because a thief hasn't said anything "negative" about his victims that that makes the decade of their (Journey) careers he wasted justified. You remain a deluded dumbfuck that puts capital into his voice and thinks that because he "made the band millions" that it was ok for him to decide that because he no longer wanted to go on, that no one could.

[madsplash]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

[Gideon]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

[madsplash]

Has SP said anything negative about the other members? That's what I thought.

Your argument is akin to saying because a thief hasn't said anything "negative" about his victims that that makes the decade of their (Journey) careers he wasted justified. You remain a deluded dumbfuck that puts capital into his voice and thinks that because he "made the band millions" that it was ok for him to decide that because he no longer wanted to go on, that no one could.

And you remain a childish asshole that starts namecalling when he has no logical answer to post. And yes, if that was SP's decision, it was his to make. They were all holding on to his tux tails and grabbing all of the money and fame that HE brought them, and then later had the balls to complain about something that THEY wanted to happen.

Listen, SP remains classy and the other 3 or 4 including Herbie and especially Neal, sound like little, jealous, bitter puppies, who are dissapointed that the big dog has left thet porch, and now they don't know who's hind teet to suckle. They're doing the best they can with replacement puppies, but you know that if the big dog EVER decides to come back to the porch, their tongues and tails will be wagging, and they'll be following him just like they used to.

[madsplash]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong. He actually fucked this band into ever mattering. A lot of fans care what they've said. You're clueless.

[Gideon]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong. He actually fucked this band into ever mattering. A lot of fans care what they've said. You're clueless.

I'm losing my patience with your double standards. You'll bitch to SJ about namecalling and then troll and whine and cry and pout whenever someone doesn't agree with you.

Welcome to the fucking real world. You made this thread trying to argue a case, deal with the fucking rebuttals.

Throw out one more pejorative, and I'll go to Andrew. MR stands for Melodic Rock, not Madsplash's Rules.

[Rick]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong. He actually fucked this band into ever mattering. A lot of fans care what they've said. You're clueless.

I'm losing my patience with your double standards. You'll bitch to SJ about namecalling and then troll and whine and cry and pout whenever someone doesn't agree with you.

Welcome to the fucking real world. You made this thread trying to argue a case, deal with the fucking rebuttals.

Throw out one more pejorative, and I'll go to Andrew. MR stands for Melodic Rock, not Madsplash's Rules.

Please don't go to Andrew, his plate is over full. Don't go to anyone for that matter. We can handle it, like adults, right here.

[Jana]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

I did. He said he never felt part of the band. That is the worst thing he could have said regarding his bandmates he worked with for all those years, much worse than Neal's "Fuck Him." Go back on the video and look at the reactions by the members to that remark. Pretty "negative" remark. But you overlook and have reasons for everything re Steve Perry. Nothing new with you.

[Gideon]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong. He actually fucked this band into ever mattering. A lot of fans care what they've said. You're clueless.

I'm losing my patience with your double standards. You'll bitch to SJ about namecalling and then troll and whine and cry and pout whenever someone doesn't agree with you.

Welcome to the fucking real world. You made this thread trying to argue a case, deal with the fucking rebuttals.

Throw out one more pejorative, and I'll go to Andrew. MR stands for Melodic Rock, not Madsplash's Rules.

Please don't go to Andrew, his plate is over full. Don't go to anyone for that matter. We can handle it, like adults, right here.

That would require something common. Like sense. Or single standards. The bottom line is that agreeing with the Perry-didn't-do-anything-wrong is Madsplash's right, even though I don't see how anyone could go down that road. But whining about "namecalling" and then trolling to everyone who disagrees?

It's bullshit. And as someone who loves debate and discussion, it's the ultimate pet peeve. Especially when he was the one who started the fucking discussion in the first place.

Edit: Fucked up there, lol.

[Saint John]

And yes, if that was SP's decision, it was his to make.

Pretty much says it all right there. You're saying that he had a right to decide to end Journey...a band that pre-dated him? I think the Journey gig was a mutually beneficial endeavor. An artist that had all but given up was coaxed into giving it one more try and he took a somewhat struggling band and provided the missing ingredient. The man's exit was simply void of class, unlike that of Gregg Rolie.

They were all holding on to his tux tails and grabbing all of the money and fame that HE brought them, and then later had the balls to complain about something that THEY wanted to happen.

I know. He could have ditched them long before he did and lit up the charts with albums like Against The Wall and For The Love Of Strange Medicine.

[Rick]

I realize that this will no doubt yield nothing but flaming and excuses, but I want an explanation. A genuine, credible explanation from the Loons, SPoons, or whatever the hell you all call yourselves for absolving, whitewashing, cherrypicking, or outright forgetting Perry's selfish, egomaniacal transgressions and focusing purely on the problems made by Jon and Neal.

I have to know, because it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not forgetting that SP had mixed emotions a few times. He knew that HE was driving the bus and could go where he wanted but had shit happening in his life that he was dealing with.

I'm just saying that he never knocks the other guys and they have taken many shots at him. I keep asking anyone to post ANYTHING negative that SP has EVER said about anyone in Journey, and no one ever posts ANYTHING. Their problems are well documented, but how each side has handled it is also documented. SP with positivity and fond memories and the other 3 with negativity and childish bitterness. That's pure fact.

Show me ANYTHING negative that SP has ever said about ANY of those guys.

I hope they all sign "The Voice" below their own names on the checks that they deposit into their bank accounts. They should fall to the ground and thank their lucky stars that SP came into their lives.

Unbefuckingleviable.

Anything SP said? So fucking what? He actually directly fucked this band out of egomania. Jon? Neal? Not so much. Who the fuck cares what any of them said?

Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong. He actually fucked this band into ever mattering. A lot of fans care what they've said. You're clueless.

I'm losing my patience with your double standards. You'll bitch to SJ about namecalling and then troll and whine and cry and pout whenever someone doesn't agree with you.

Welcome to the fucking real world. You made this thread trying to argue a case, deal with the fucking rebuttals.

Throw out one more pejorative, and I'll go to Andrew. MR stands for Melodic Rock, not Madsplash's Rules.

Please don't go to Andrew, his plate is over full. Don't go to anyone for that matter. We can handle it, like adults, right here.

That would require something common. Like sense. Or single standards. The bottom line is that disagreeing with the Perry-didn't-do-anything-wrong is Madsplash's right, even though I don't see how anyone could go down that road. But whining about "namecalling" and then trolling to everyone who disagrees?

It's bullshit. And as someone who loves debate and discussion, it's the ultimate pet peeve. Especially when he was the one who started the fucking discussion in the first place.

If you have to go to someone, go to T-Bone. Andrew's about ready to throw this whole forum to the dung heap.

[Rhiannon]

If you have to go to someone, go to T-Bone. Andrew's about ready to throw this whole forum to the dung heap.

I don't think I could blame him at times.