MR

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 12:09 am**

Here is an excerpt of an old Neal Schon interview where he discusses the band reuniting for TBF and the subsequent events that led to the breakup and moving forward without Perry and the making of Arrival.

"Jeb: Which album was more exciting for you to make: Trial By Fire or Arrival?

Neal: Trial By Fire was an exciting record to make because we had not been together for over ten years. It was great to have the old band in the studio actually playing, writing and working together. It was a pretty fun record to make but all of a sudden we had the brakes put on because Steve had a health condition. We couldn’t do anything, which was super frustrating to all of us, not just me but for everybody. The record came out and we were met with a lot of over the top success that none of us were really expecting. We had an #1 single with “When You Love A Woman” and our record entered at #3 on the Billboard Charts. A lot of green was on the table being offered to us to do 25 shows. Steve just said, “I can’t do it” and that was pretty much it; we were kaput. We had all this momentum going for us and after ten years being embraced that way by our audience and not being able to do anything with it…. , I wanted to kill someone!

Jeb: I had actually written here on my notes to ask you, “How angry were you when Steve Perry backed out of the tour” and I think you just told me.

Neal: I was angry but I was more frustrated. I was more frustrated because there was nothing that I could do. There was nothing that any of us could do. I think out of frustration and having just rekindled the band, I was not able to let it go -- even if Steve Perry was not going to be involved. At that point I went up to Jonathan and said, “Let’s just move on. We have nothing to lose is the way I am looking at it. Right now, we don’t have anything.”

Jeb: Was there any reluctance?

Neal: Steve, as you can see on Behind The Music, was very much saying, “Don’t fracture the name Journey.” I am like, “Fracture what? There is nothing there anymore. What are you talking about?” It was like we had nothing. We had something but it was like a big tease. We got together, it was a big tease and now it is gone already. Screw it man. I was getting ready to do my own band when Steve Perry got together with Jonathan Cain and talked to him about doing a record. I think there was clearly other motives at the time he called Jon to do the record. I know that Steve was not happy being on Sony at the time and I think they may have made him an ultimatum. This is my own take on it and I don’t know if there is any truth or validity to it but after thinking about it and seeing what actually came down, I’m entitled to that. This is America! I think that they might have made a proposition to where if he did another record with Journey that they would release him solo wise and from Journey so he could go elsewhere and do wherever he wanted to do. That is exactly what happened. We handed in the record and he was like, “No, I’m not touring. I’m out of here.” I am sure that he had some health issues like we all do. When you get older you have health issues. I think there is a lot of cover up there.

Jeb: That is just bullshit. It is too bad that things had to happen that way. At the same time though, you have moved on. Was Jonathan Cain as excited as you were to move on?

Neal: Everybody was apprehensive. It was a big step to move forward without Steve. He had become the vocal point of all our music. Had we kept a lot of where we started and added vocals to it and done it in a different way like Van Halen or whatever then it would have been much easier to say, “We can do this.” I was ready to make a move one way or another no matter what direction we went in. We knew that we were looking for someone to convey the older material. When we auditioned guys we were looking to see if they could do they older material. I think that where we missed the boat on Arrival is the fact that we were actually being led down a road so to speak from Sony concerning what we could do and what we couldn’t do. They wanted to play it very safe. They wanted the most Journey sound alike material -- just stuff that sounded like our old stuff. I think that if we had been able to be creative and allowed to go where we are now without trying to recreate ourself once again, then it would have been a much better record.

Jeb: I think you are being a little hard on yourself. The first three songs, while they do sound more like Frontiers and Escape era Journey since anything since, are great songs.

Neal: I think that is a good thing but I think we have to make a huge turn here. We don’t want to freak out our fans; we are always going to sound like we sound but I think we can get much more creative with our music. Everything doesn’t have to be girl/boy. We have some really cool things to write about as a lot of things have happened in our world. All you have to do is look around. There are so many things out there that you can tap into that are meaningful."

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 12:37 am**

Neal Schon wrote: I was getting ready to do my own band when Steve Perry got together with Jonathan Cain and talked to him about doing a record. I think there was clearly other motives at the time he called Jon to do the record. I know that Steve was not happy being on Sony at the time and I think they may have made him an ultimatum. This is my own take on it and I don’t know if there is any truth or validity to it but after thinking about it and seeing what actually came down, I’m entitled to that. This is America! I think that they might have made a proposition to where if he did another record with Journey that they would release him solo wise and from Journey so he could go elsewhere and do wherever he wanted to do. That is exactly what happened. We handed in the record and he was like, “No, I’m not touring. I’m out of here.” I am sure that he had some health issues like we all do. When you get older you have health issues. I think there is a lot of cover up there.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 12:50 am**

Now let's hear SP's version of it again. What's Neal GONNA say. Thanks for posting this, although I had read it before.
It's just a matter of who you believe.

Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets. That's called integrity and Neal Schon doesn't have a drop of it. He's one of the greatest guitarists of all time. But as he said about SP in one childish interview, I'll say about Neal.................FUCK HIM!

Go keep playing your live tributes to Steve Perry. That's what they are now. What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:16 am**

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

About the same as the ratio of Journey to Perry solo tunes in the FTLOSM setlists.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:18 am**

madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:20 am**

madsplash wrote::roll:

Now let's hear SP's version of it again. What's Neal GONNA say. Thanks for posting this, although I had read it before.
It's just a matter of who you believe.

Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets. That's called integrity and Neal Schon doesn't have a drop of it. He's one of the greatest guitarists of all time. But as he said about SP in one childish interview, I'll say about Neal.................FUCK HIM!

Go keep playing your live tributes to Steve Perry. That's what they are now. What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

As I've said before, I don't think anyone is blameless in this situition. I love Steve Perry, but I do think he sort of left the band twisting in the wind. Neal and the band wanted to continue playing and for whatever reason Steve didn't. If it were just the hip thing, Steve would have resumed a solo career after he had hip surgery but he didn't. That leads me to believe that there may be some truth to what Neal said about Perry's motives. But who are we to judge? We weren't there, we can't get into their heads. So I just accept it as it is what it is... nothing stays the same, everything changes, life goes on...Steve Perry and Journey have all moved on I suggest we do the same.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:28 am**

madsplash wrote::roll:

Now let's hear SP's version of it again. What's Neal GONNA say. Thanks for posting this, although I had read it before.
It's just a matter of who you believe.

Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets. That's called integrity and Neal Schon doesn't have a drop of it. He's one of the greatest guitarists of all time. But as he said about SP in one childish interview, I'll say about Neal.................FUCK HIM!

Go keep playing your live tributes to Steve Perry. That's what they are now. What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

I will say this about the whole 'who has been classier' argument, which I think is complete bullshit by the way. If you, as a grown adult, cannot even be mature enough to answer the phone from someone that you had a brilliant working relationship with, and refuse to even speak to that person because they made a business decision with the very business that THEY started...you are so void of any level of class, it's remarkable. I cannot begin to image the level of ego you must possess to think that is acceptable. NS made it very clear that he wanted Perry in the band. But he also said he was tired of sitting around, while watching the Journey 'brand' deteriorate to nothing. If you honestly have to lawyer up, and refuse to communicate to the people who helped make you a millionaire 100 times over...then don't be surprised when people start questioning your 'class'. Cause there isn't enough to even comment on.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:31 am**

Onestepper wrote:I will say this about the whole 'who has been classier' argument, which I think is complete bullshit by the way.

That's the biggest misnomer/strawman argument loons use...gotta look at the ACTIONS, not merely the lack of words.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:33 am**

Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

Horseshit. Unless you can say who the "firsthand accounts" are from, and not Neal or Jon, what you are saying is rumor.
Strange, he had just sang the hell out of the dirty dozen only a half step down(on some, not on all)on the FTLOSM tour not eeven 2 years earlier. And almost 3 years LATER he sang the hell out of I Stand Alone. While not as high as some of the dirty dozen, his voice sounded excellent.

And you'd know about stupid arguments, wouldnt you? You're a pro aren't you, dude? :roll:

Let's not make this a pissing match, you won't win it. Nobody will.

And as for the percentage, my point was that people are there to hear them sing songs HE sang on. Not from Arrival or Revelation, at least not many. I didn't say they didn't have the RIGHT, but if they've really "moved on" :roll:

, move on and do more, or mostly, your new stuff without SP's signature all over it, and don't have a singers that TRY and sound just like him.

The difference when SP toured solo was that he never claimed to have moved on.

I'm waiting to hear who the "firsthand accounts" are.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:39 am**

madsplash wrote: Unless you can say who the "firsthand accounts" are from, and not Neal or Jon, what you are saying is rumor.

Yea, SJ.
Firsthand accounts from Neal or John NOT allowed :lol:

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:45 am**

madsplash wrote:I'm waiting to hear who the "firsthand accounts" are.

Keep waiting. You know damned well I'm not gonna divulge that. You can call it "rumor" all you want, but it change the fact that I heard from people that were actually there, in the studio.

And let me say this...if Perry's impact on the band was so huge (and I'm not denying it was very large) why is it that people gather in masses (26,000+ in Chicago last year) to hear the songs every year, knowing he's not fronting the band anymore? And why were his solo shows at small theatres? Seems to me, using your logic, that it should be the exact opposite. But it's not, because the music is greater than any one individual and the entity known as "Journey" continues to flourish in its latest incarnation, singing songs that were written, produced and performed by members within Journey, regardless of current affiliation. Those songs are the property of Journey...period. And that band, Journey, is the baby of Neal Schon. Save for Tapegate, he is the only one that has showed constant concern for it and has the name's best interest in the forefront. He has been there since the beginning and my guess is that he will be there in the end...unlike someone else.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:50 am**

Red13JoePa wrote:
madsplash wrote: Unless you can say who the "firsthand accounts" are from, and not Neal or Jon, what you are saying is rumor.

Yea, SJ.
Firsthand accounts from Neal or John NOT allowed

My accounts are from neither. I have never discussed anything like that with them. I will be the first to admit that I do not know them any better than a 1998 meet and greet and I met Jon again this past tour and simply took a picture with him. Oh, and Tito and I saw them in Hooters in Milwaukee. :lol:

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:50 am**

"I know that Steve was not happy being on Sony at the time and I think they may have made him an ultimatum. This is my own take on it and I don’t know if there is any truth or validity to it but after thinking about it and seeing what actually came down, I’m entitled to that. This is America! I think that they might have made a proposition to where if he did another record with Journey that they would release him solo wise and from Journey so he could go elsewhere and do wherever he wanted to do. That is exactly what happened. We handed in the record and he was like, “No, I’m not touring. I’m out of here.” I am sure that he had some health issues like we all do. When you get older you have health issues. I think there is a lot of cover up there. "

And there you have it. Not so hard to believe. Perry had been saying since the end of the RoR tour that he couldn't/didn't want to "do it any more". There were, however, contractual obligations that needed to be met. He met them. He split. End of story.

Now, I may be a loon (gawd knows I love me some SMFP), but I'm not a fool. This whole break-up story has more holes in it than Sonny Corleone. :evil:

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:54 am**

Well yea perry admittedly was STEAMED at Sony/Columbia maybe the band was part collateral damage in his payback plan to label.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:56 am**

Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:I'm waiting to hear who the "firsthand accounts" are.
Keep waiting. You know damned well I'm not gonna divulge that. You can call it "rumor" all you want, but it change the fact that I heard from people that were actually there, in the studio.

And let me say this...if Perry's impact on the band was so huge (and I'm not denying it was very large) why is it that people gather in masses (26,000+ in Chicago last year) to hear the songs every year, knowing he's not fronting the band anymore? And why were his solo shows at small theatres? Seems to me, using your logic, that it should be the exact opposite. But it's not, because the music is greater than any one individual and the entity known as "Journey" continues to flourish in its latest incarnation, singing songs that were written, produced and performed by members within Journey, regardless of current affiliation. Those songs are the property of Journey...period. And that band, Journey, is the baby of Neal Schon. Save for Tapegate, he is the only one that has showed constant concern for it and has the name's best interest in the forefront. He has been there since the beginning and my guess is that he will be there in the end...unlike someone else.

I didn't think you would say. You have nothing to divulge. Well then, let's use your logic and ask why the last shows they were playing live when SP was in the band were in front of 60-70 thousand people? Hmm...

And I can guarantee you on the FTLOSM tour there weren't any taped backing vocals. Yea, that's caring about the band's legacy.
And Neal sure gave control of "his baby" up pretty easily when he knew who could keep making him more money, didn't he?

Strange that in Modern Drummer how Steve Smith said that when they were rehearsing that it was sounding great and the magic came back right away. I can find that issue and quote it to you EXACTLY, if you'd like. Was he not there? Did he not have ears? Why haven't Jon or Neal EVER said that it wasn't sounding good and that SP's voice was shot? Smith said the exact opposite.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 2:07 am**

madsplash wrote:I didn't think you would say. You have nothing to divulge. Well then, let's use your logic and ask why the last shows they were playing live when SP was in the band were in front of 60-70 thousand people? Hmm...

I've never denied that the was the greatest incarnation of the band (but with Ross and Smith).

madsplash wrote:And I can guarantee you on the FTLOSM tour there weren't any taped backing vocals. Yea, that's caring about the band's legacy.

They should have. Perry sounded very good, but the backing vocals were nothing short of atrocious.

madsplash wrote:And Neal sure gave control of "his baby" up pretty easily when he knew who could keep making him more money, didn't he?

As with 90% of bands, the lead singer is the most recognizable member, and Perry basically held a gun to their heads, so to speak.

madsplash wrote:Strange that in Modern Drummer how Steve Smith said that when they were rehearsing that it was sounding great and the magic came back right away. I can find that issue and quote it to you EXACTLY, if you'd like. Was he not there? Did he not have ears? Why haven't Jon or Neal EVER said that it wasn't sounding good and that SP's voice was shot? Smith said the exact opposite.

Neal aqnd Jon have been sealed by a gag order. Wonder why that is? I wonder why Perry wanted stuff to remain quiet? Probably because, like now, his voice "sounds as good as anytime in the mid 80's." :lol:

You shut people up when you have, A) leverage ("fire these guys or else", sign this or else", etc...you know, his usual bullshit) and B) something to hide. My guess is that "something" was the truth.

And to correct you...Herbie Herbert brought this band to the top. From plucking Perry from a farm and believing in him when he didn't even believe in himself to every innovative feature in the business to having every DJ in the country in his pocket, it was Herbie's ideas that took them to the summit, and Perry's that brought them to the darkest valley of firings, cancelled tours, destroyed lineups that didn't include him, the firing of Herbie Herbert and no tours to back up released albums.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 4:38 am**

My .2cents on the article and Steve Perry/Journey.

Steve Perry is the Journey killer. He killed Journey and forced Neal to move on, obviously. They gave him enough time to come back, and by the sounds of it, even if they would of waited 4 more years for him he would of never returned anyway. I like the point where Neal responds to the fractured comment, and how he said they how can you fracture something when nothing is there. Good point. I will always be on Neal's side with all of this breakup shit, and will always believe that if Steve Perry wasn't such a egotistical ASSHOLE then they could of met in the middle and went on from there to re-form.

So, my opinion.. Steve Perry is a home-wrecker, and he is to blame for all of this and the bitter fans to go along with it.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 6:19 am**

YoungJRNY wrote:My .2cents on the article and Steve Perry/Journey.

Steve Perry is the Journey killer. He killed Journey and forced Neal to move on, obviously. They gave him enough time to come back, and by the sounds of it, even if they would of waited 4 more years for him he would of never returned anyway. I like the point where Neal responds to the fractured comment, and how he said they how can you fracture something when nothing is there. Good point. I will always be on Neal's side with all of this breakup shit, and will always believe that if Steve Perry wasn't such a egotistical ASSHOLE then they could of met in the middle and went on from there to re-form.

So, my opinion.. Steve Perry is a home-wrecker, and he is to blame for all of this and the bitter fans to go along with it.

You're wrong about Perry and the Steelers suck! :lol:

Seriously Neal, nothing there? How about your fucking legacy? What wasn't there for Neal was MONEY. Not enough of it rolling in anymore. Give me a brake.

And the Steelers Suck.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 6:43 am**

Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

Oh god two whole steps down is massive!!! A band I'm playing in last night was doing Long Train Running in D and I was playing my keyboard realizing it's two whole steps down. At that point it really does sound very different.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:01 am**

Red13JoePa wrote:Well yea perry admittedly was STEAMED at Sony/Columbia maybe the band was part collateral damage in his payback plan to label.

Bullshit. You a loon now, Joe?
Yeah, he was pissed at the label.
Yes, it sucks to have your "solo" career held hostage to another Journey album,
but "vengeance" as a motive is far nobler than what I think drove Perry.

I say it was insecurity over his voice.
The guy to this day can barely admit his voice had deteriorated circa TBF.
He was faced with a vocalist's "death", after years of serious grind-out.
When confronting death at the hands of an enemy, some people choose "suicide",
engineering a way out for themselves on their own terms, even if it means abandoning
their compatriots who might be willing to fight to the end.

That doesn't mean Neal et al are clean either --their touring schedule over the previous years
was totally fucked up. I've posted before that strings and skins can be replaced,
keyboards re-tuned, but a human voice isn't as regenerable.

If Perry had been more honest with the others, or the others had been more considerate,
things might have been different.

wech

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:31 am**

Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:40 am**

SherriBerry wrote:If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Incorrect. For whatever reason, they took the guy at his word that he would get into touring shape. He had time to do so. Whether he was reluctant to do so or just felt that he couldn't do it I'm not sure, but I believe that his "injury" (as an excuse not to tour) is 100% bullshit.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:42 am**

SherriBerry wrote:
Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Yeah, with all due respect, there are people to this day who still think that TBF-era Perry can sing his '70s-era tunes effortlessly and is "just OMFGz purfffect!!1!"

It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were people who saw him in the studio struggling and still clung to the notion that in a live environment he'd just be devastating.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:55 am**

Yet another fault finding thread. :roll:

They all had a part in an arguement none of us were a part of.

Perry admitted making bad choices in the past, Neal has admitted to a drinking problem.

People get on each others nerves, life hands you problems, and I think a hip replacement is more than a little health issue.

But I am not going to get into a tit for tat arguement that has all the makings of a which came first the chicken or the egg.

If you think for a second that Neal, Jon, or Steve is to be raked over the coals and burned at the stake because of XYZ, I cannot stop you from feeling that way. Seems some people on this board hate one, two, or all of the above.

I love their music, individually or collectively. I have met Jon, and Neal and found them both to be charming people. Jon more so than Neal. People who met Steve tell me he's a nice guy. Some people have met them and had bad experiances.

My take is.........Maybe, just maybe, they are human beings with feet of clay. Personalities don't always mesh in bands. But I am not going to make anyone a monster, without knowing them personally.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:56 am**

Gideon wrote:
SherriBerry wrote:
Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Yeah, with all due respect, there are people to this day who still think that TBF-era Perry can sing his '70s-era tunes effortlessly and is "just OMFGz purfffect!!1!"

It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were people who saw him in the studio struggling and still clung to the notion that in a live environment he'd just be devastating.

In no point in my statement did I claim that his voice was in prime condition - there is a big difference between struggling and needing "hours and hours of arduous takes" and his voice being so "vastly deteriorated" that he had to sing 2 steps down. If that were the case, he would not be able to tour, period.

Edit: Here is a quote from Herbie Herbert in the 'Castles Burning' interview regarding TBF: "He got to the rehearsal and impressed all those guys, singing the old material". Yeah, he was struggling two steps down - that would have really impressed them - Bullshit.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:57 am**

SherriBerry wrote:
Gideon wrote:
SherriBerry wrote:
Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Yeah, with all due respect, there are people to this day who still think that TBF-era Perry can sing his '70s-era tunes effortlessly and is "just OMFGz purfffect!!1!"

It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were people who saw him in the studio struggling and still clung to the notion that in a live environment he'd just be devastating.

In no point in my statement did I claim that his voice was in prime condition - there is a big difference between struggling and needing "hours and hours of arduous takes" and his voice being so "vastly deteriorated" that he had to sing 2 steps down. If that were the case, he would not be able to tour, period.

No, he would not be able to tour well. Augeri went through the same shit and they rolled on with him.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:04 am**

Gideon wrote:
SherriBerry wrote:
Gideon wrote:
SherriBerry wrote:
Saint John wrote:
madsplash wrote:Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets.

Several observations: Smith, like everyone else, has bills to pay and mouths to feed. He's on record as saying that Journey music isn't much of a passion of his anymore, but I'm sure the money was just too hard to turn down. Each member was guaranteed approximately $15 million. Of course, they had to give it all back because Perry never planned on touring. Do you have any idea what you're talking about, dude? Do you know about the hours and hours of arduous takes it required for Perry sing the simplest of lines on TBF? Do you know that his voice was so deteriorated that they practiced each of the Dirty Dozen 2 whole steps down and that it sounded vastly different? Do you know that Perry's body language suggested a guy that knew the songs didn't sound right. Yet he continued the charade and went to Hawaii to get into "touring shape." Believe what you want, but these are firsthand accounts from people in the studio during that time.

madsplash wrote: What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........
This is a really stupid argument, but coming from you it's not really surprising. Each member has their own instrument. How many Perry shows did Perry have Neal's, Jon's, Ross's, and Smitty's instruments replicated in? Remember, the band was called "Journey." Hence, Journey has a right to play its songs if the lead singer refuses to tour for, what at the time was, over a decade. Journey is playing about the same amount of non-Perry fronted songs as Perry did non-Journey songs. So, I fail to see your point.

If it required hours of arduous takes for SP to sing the simplest lines of TBF and his voice were actually that vastly deteriorated, there is no way that anyone would have believed they would be able to tour. If he couldn't sing in the studio, he certainly couldn't sing live on the road, so whoever fed you that is likely full of it.

Yeah, with all due respect, there are people to this day who still think that TBF-era Perry can sing his '70s-era tunes effortlessly and is "just OMFGz purfffect!!1!"

It wouldn't surprise me at all if there were people who saw him in the studio struggling and still clung to the notion that in a live environment he'd just be devastating.

In no point in my statement did I claim that his voice was in prime condition - there is a big difference between struggling and needing "hours and hours of arduous takes" and his voice being so "vastly deteriorated" that he had to sing 2 steps down. If that were the case, he would not be able to tour, period.

No, he would not be able to tour well. Augeri went through the same shit and they rolled on with him.

Augeri struggled - what SJ is saying about Steve is completely different and it's also a crock. If Herbie is saying SP impressed them, SJ's sources are not reliable.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:06 am**

Pardon?

Herbie said that Perry impressed them? When was this? 1976 or 1996?

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:07 am**

madsplash wrote:
YoungJRNY wrote:My .2cents on the article and Steve Perry/Journey.

Steve Perry is the Journey killer. He killed Journey and forced Neal to move on, obviously. They gave him enough time to come back, and by the sounds of it, even if they would of waited 4 more years for him he would of never returned anyway. I like the point where Neal responds to the fractured comment, and how he said they how can you fracture something when nothing is there. Good point. I will always be on Neal's side with all of this breakup shit, and will always believe that if Steve Perry wasn't such a egotistical ASSHOLE then they could of met in the middle and went on from there to re-form.

So, my opinion.. Steve Perry is a home-wrecker, and he is to blame for all of this and the bitter fans to go along with it.

You're wrong about Perry and the Steelers suck!

Seriously Neal, nothing there? How about your fucking legacy? What wasn't there for Neal was MONEY. Not enough of it rolling in anymore. Give me a brake.

And the Steelers Suck.

They are the worst team in the NFL. :lol:

Anyway, artist, that's the thing, and you bring up an excellent point. I'd rather stay away from the meet and greet type stuff, because.. personally, I don't want to HANG out with them in their parents basement being their drummer to ROCKBAND and staying up to 6 in the morning drinking Rolling Rock. They are humans just like any of us.. they just happen to be involved in a business that is different than what some of us are used to.

I go by the things that is put out there in writing, and when it comes to as easy as singing a damn song to make people feel better while making mega money, I think it is deserving to be shit-faced in a play like this, and I DO believe Perry did more wrong than did Neal or Jon.

Posted: **Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:12 am**

Onestepper wrote:
madsplash wrote::roll:

Now let's hear SP's version of it again. What's Neal GONNA say. Thanks for posting this, although I had read it before.
It's just a matter of who you believe.

Just as side note: How does it make you feel about it, when SP fired Steve Smith, then Smitty not only came back happily for the reunion, and once it was decided that SP wouldn't be in the band anymore, Smitty bailed saying, and I quote" No thanks, a Journey without Steve Perry doesn't interest me".

Now this is a man who was fired and pricked over by SP(and Jon and Neal), yet he comes back and won't go on without SP.

That speaks fucking volumes. That says that Smitty was a true, loyal friend, who felt shitty trying to push someone into major surgery for the sake of putting money in Neal's pockets. That's called integrity and Neal Schon doesn't have a drop of it. He's one of the greatest guitarists of all time. But as he said about SP in one childish interview, I'll say about Neal.................FUCK HIM!

Go keep playing your live tributes to Steve Perry. That's what they are now. What's the percentage of songs in the current set list SP DID sing, compared to the percentage of ones he didn't? Hmm........

I will say this about the whole 'who has been classier' argument, which I think is complete bullshit by the way. If you, as a grown adult, cannot even be mature enough to answer the phone from someone that you had a brilliant working relationship with, and refuse to even speak to that person because they made a business decision with the very business that THEY started...you are so void of any level of class, it's remarkable. I cannot begin to image the level of ego you must possess to think that is acceptable. NS made it very clear that he wanted Perry in the band. But he also said he was tired of sitting around, while watching the Journey 'brand' deteriorate to nothing. If you honestly have to lawyer up, and refuse to communicate to the people who helped make you a millionaire 100 times over...then don't be surprised when people start questioning your 'class'. Cause there isn't enough to even comment on.

What a ridiculous statement! How do you know what has gone down personally between them or why SP has chosen not to speak directly with Neal on the phone? I work with one woman who was married for 20 years whose ex calls her at work when he's drunk and screams at her. If she could block his calls, she would. I'm not saying that is the case here, but I'm sure SP has his reasons - it is his business and you have no basis to judge that.

MR

Neal Schon Discusses TBF and Breakup of Band

Neal Schon Discusses TBF and Breakup of Band

Re: Neal Schon Discusses TBF and Breakup of Band