Can someone clarify this re:Manila DVD......

[jrnyjetster]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

[Rip Rokken]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

[fightingilliniJRNY]

I'd just like it clarified that this thing is actually going to be released on October 2. The lack of information two weeks away from the supposed release date is baffling.

[Eric]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

I'd rather pay $50 and have it on Blu-ray to be honest

[Rip Rokken]

I'd just like it clarified that this thing is actually going to be released on October 2. The lack of information two weeks away from the supposed release date is baffling.

I haven't even pre-ordered it. I'm just going to show up that day and figure it all out when I get there... LOL.

[steveo777]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

We'll just have to live with it. I mean all the DVDs that we had before Blue Ray must have been terribly inferior, that's why nobody bought them.

[fightingilliniJRNY]

I'd just like it clarified that this thing is actually going to be released on October 2. The lack of information two weeks away from the supposed release date is baffling.

I haven't even pre-ordered it. I'm just going to show up that day and figure it all out when I get there... LOL.

Agreed. I'm not about to preorder something that has no information. Plus, I wouldn't preorder it any way. I had no trouble finding a copy of Revelation on release day last June.

[Enigma869]

I had no trouble finding a copy of Revelation on release day last June.

Shocking that people are lined up around the corner for a release from a 1980's band on their third lead singer in two weeks

[Don]

If it's on Blu-Ray, I'll buy it but after all that bragging about the concert being filmed in 4X HD, if it comes only as a standard DVD, I'll probably acquire an evaluation copy first.

Wal-Mart is selling AC/DC's Blu-Ray concert for 20 bucks. No reason to settle for a music video in an inferior form this day and age.


This is why I want a Blu-Ray version of the concert.

The Necessity: Enabling 8-channel Audio on Blu-ray Discs
Movies ship with multi-channel audio tracks so that users with more than two speakers can enjoy what ultimately boils down to surround sound. Audio takes up a lot of space and studios keep trying to pack more data onto discs so most multi-channel movie audio is stored in a compressed format.

In the days of DVDs the studios used either Dolby Digital or DTS encoding for their audio tracks, but with Blu-ray (and HD-DVD) the stakes went up. Just as video encoding got an overhaul with the use of H.264 as a compression codec, audio on Blu-ray discs got a facelift of its own. Dolby Digital and DTS were both still supported, but now there were three more options: Dolby Digital TrueHD, DTS-HD Master Audio and uncompressed LPCM.

Dolby Digital and DTS, as implemented with the original DVD standard, had two flaws: 1) They were lossy codecs (you didn't get a bit for bit duplicate on disc of the audio the studio originally mastered when making the movie), and 2) they only supported a maximum of 6-channels of audio (aka 5.1 surround sound: right, left, center, left surround, right surround and LFE/sub channel).

DVDs could store 4.5GB or 9GB of data on a single disc, so using lossy audio codecs made sense. Blu-ray discs are either 25GB or 50GB in size meaning we can store more data and higher quality data at that, for both audio and video.

Both Dolby Digital TrueHD and DTS-HD MA improve upon their DVD counterparts by: 1) being lossless (when decoded properly, you get a bit for bit identical copy of the audio the studio originally mastered for the movie), and 2) currently supporting up to 8-channels of audio (aka 7.1 surround sound: right, left, center, left surround, left rear, right surround, right rear, and LFE/subwoofer channel; both specs actually support greater than 8-channels but current implementations are only limited to .

These standards are lossless, which is great. While we're not quite there on the video side, the fact that we can store and playback the original audio track from a movie is an incredible feat and a feather in the cap of technology in general.

[Eric]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

We'll just have to live with it. I mean all the DVDs that we had before Blue Ray must have been terribly inferior, that's why nobody bought them.

Why not just release it on VHS then...

[Eric]

I had no trouble finding a copy of Revelation on release day last June.

Shocking that people are lined up around the corner for a release from a 1980's band on their third lead singer in two weeks

You're on a Journey board because........................?

[Don]

Journey board? Not anymore. But a new one might be in the works, so hang in there.

[stevew2]

I'd just like it clarified that this thing is actually going to be released on October 2. The lack of information two weeks away from the supposed release date is baffling.

I haven't even pre-ordered it. I'm just going to show up that day and figure it all out when I get there... LOL.

What is your hat size?

[jrnyjetster]

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

Rip, I'm disappointed....you usually have all the answers lately.....

Ten bucks is friggin' unbelieveably cheap, BUT will this DVD be in the new "beyond HD" format the producers were bragging about? MY guess is probably not, for that price. Will we be surprised? If this ends up being a watered down version, I'll wait for the better one.

[steveo777]

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

Rip, I'm disappointed....you usually have all the answers lately.....

Ten bucks is friggin' unbelieveably cheap, BUT will this DVD be in the new "beyond HD" format the producers were bragging about? MY guess is probably not, for that price. Will we be surprised? If this ends up being a watered down version, I'll wait for the better one.

I heard the boot has been around Asia for a while now. It's a nice collaboration of cell phone cam vids

[fightingilliniJRNY]

Ten bucks is friggin' unbelieveably cheap, BUT will this DVD be in the new "beyond HD" format the producers were bragging about? MY guess is probably not, for that price. Will we be surprised? If this ends up being a watered down version, I'll wait for the better one.

There's no reason to assume that just because it costs $10, it won't be in full "beyond HD" glory. Remember, like with the Revelation album Wal-Mart pays Journey a flat fee to be the official supplier of the DVD. Then, they can sell it for whatever they want, and they'll obviously try to make a profit. Journey could spend whatever they want to make the DVD, and as long as Wal-Mart pays enough to cover that then the band is happy.

It's out of their hands, then. Journey doesn't care what price Wal-Mart is selling the DVD at, since the band has already gotten their money from Wal-Mart. Regardless of if it sells one copy or 1,000,000, Journey the band is out of the equation. They've gotten paid and made their money.

[Enigma869]

You're on a Journey board because........................?

Because I feel like being here! Let me know when Drew makes you a moderator and then you can dictate who hangs out here. Until then, shut your pie hole!

[steveo777]

Nothing about this article screams "budget", infact quite the contrary. So, I have no idea why this would not be released in Blue Ray, except that the Walmart deal must gear the pricing to only have DVD format. That, I believe is out of Journey's hands. I hope later there is a high quality disc available on Journey's website, perhaps? But the the production of this was anything but budget.

http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/83626
RED's 'Journey' to Manila

by Steve Gibby, 07.07.2009

MANILA, THE PHILIPPINES
In mid-March, a multi-challenging HDTV production scenario unfolded in Manila:

Document the world-famous classic rock band Journey in concert before 20,000-plus fans in an outdoor tropical location, use a conglomeration of digital cinema and EFP technology, with a diverse crew from the United States and Asia, using 10 RED cameras hard-lined for simultaneously live-switching to a big screen, while recording 4k footage to hard drives onboard each camera—at four times 1080p resolution.

Event programs like this have traditionally been shot using 2/3-inch HD camera systems. Though our end product would be HDTV, Blu-ray, and DVD, the band members of Journey and our production team wanted to future-proof our acquisition format by taking it up to the next resolution level: 4k RAW. When processed correctly, 4k down-samples beautifully to color-saturated 1080p. With its high quality and low cost, RED One was the logical camera to use. RED shoots in 4k, 3k, and 2k, and can be used with cine lenses, 35mm stills lenses, or B4 2/3-inch lenses (2k only).

"Shooting RED not only gave us the opportunity to capture in 4k RAW, but it also gave us the ability to ISO 10 cameras," said co-DP Champe Barton. "We shifted the critical decision making for edits, color and overall look to the post process where we have the luxury of more time."

MANUAL LENS FUNCTIONS

Two lens types covered the 4k frame: S35mm cine and 35mm stills. With 10 RED cameras used for coverage—some stationary and some very mobile (shoulder held, Steadicam)—we decided to use S35mm cine long zooms for the dolly and stationary cameras (multiple Optimo 24-290mm and Angenieux 25-250mm zooms). We adapted Nikon zooms for the shoulder held cameras and jib camera. The Nikon zooms are optically good, small and lightweight (for mobility), many have the longer zoom ratio we needed for this type of production, and the aperture range for the Nikon lenses fit our requirements. The external zoom motors we had for the Nikon lenses didn't work quite right on the shoulder-held rig cameras, so the camera operators performed all lens functions manually—definitely a challenge, but something we were able to do quite well.

All shoulder held cameras were mounted on Element Technica Mantis shoulder systems, which proved to be very comfortable. We modified the Mantis units, with only a right handle, and the operator's left hand worked the Nikon lens.

All cameras were set to shoot 4k HD. Since the band members were going to move around a lot, we used a frame rate of 29.97 fps, and a shutter speed of 1/100th second. Timecode was jam-synced to all cameras. Each camera was hard-lined to the control room via HD-SDI, which was live-switched throughout the concert for audience viewing on the huge IMag screen above the stage.

Since we needed to record for more than two continuous hours to the camera-mounted hard drives, we decided to use the 320 GB RED Drive, which records about 3 linear hours of 4k REDcode footage. To solve sound vibration problems on cameras close to speakers, we mounted the drives on Element Technica Shock Mounts—which worked well; there were no dropped frames on any hard drives. Overall, we experienced no problems of any kind with any of the RED cameras.

'A FLOWING CONNECTED SEQUENCE OF SHOTS'

"The DP positions are key to the success of this project," said Dan Barnett, executive producer, Wizard Entertainment. "We used no HDTV truck because we recorded RAW footage to each camera's onboard drive. Our two DPs delivered amazing footage."

Each RED camera acquired footage to its own drive in isolation from all the other cameras. But we also had the 720p outputs from our cameras going into a switcher, and monitor wall, so the director could call a "traditional" live show. Being able to call the show live allowed him to pace the shots to the music and allowed the cameramen to move according to his calls. Thus the core of the program was a flowing, connected sequence of shots, as opposed to a bunch of shots just put together in post. "Everyone involved with the show could see immediately what it looked like and how it flowed," said Director Eli Tishberg.

Two lighting directors worked on the project—Jeff Ravitz from Visual Terrain oversaw TV and audience lighting, and Kevin Christopher adapted the live show as Journey's LD. The results were stunning. "The best way to accurately experience this collaboration will be to watch the DVD, which will be in stores in fall of 2009," said Barnett.

Barnett and Tishberg added a 24-foot-long, four-foot high thrust, which allowed band members to walk out into the audience. We also used neutral colored, hanging "soft-goods" which were hit by a constantly changing palette of colors as the background. Since they were fabric, they were easily shipped and set up on site, which allowed us to shoot from every direction.

A FUSION OF CINE STYLE TECHNIQUES

The production featured a fusion of cine-style techniques used with the RED cameras with multi-camera television production techniques. This put more pressure on the DPs and LDs to ensure consistent lighting—extremely difficult in a live rock concert situation.

Recording in the camera, as opposed to external decks, makes the production simpler. But the cameras still have to be wired for audio, video, communications, timecode, etc., and these signals are all on different connectors. You still have all the same signal distribution to the router/switchers/monitors. This solution also puts the responsibility on camera operators to monitor the amount of drive space remaining and to do drive swaps.

A key element to any production is capable on-location support and dependable equipment rentals. Our Manila support was top-drawer.

"Oli Laperal Jr., of RSVP Films [Manila], and all his personnel were fantastic," said Engineer Mike Noles. "The RSVP facility in Manila provided us with top-quality equipment on site."

A 6-channel RTS system provided two production channels, an IMag channel, lighting, dolly operator, and jib operator channels.

In retrospect, Journey seriously dazzled their fans with a dynamic performance—and our crew captured every exciting minute of it—in 4k.

"Both the hardware and the crew were much better than I ever thought possible," said Tishberg. "I can't wait to see the finished, color-corrected show."

There were technical and operational challenges to overcome to integrate a digital cinema camera like RED One into what has traditionally been an EFP camera production, but we accepted those challenges, and the results were very encouraging.

"Using the RED camera allowed us to create a top-quality production at an affordable price, recorded in stunning 4k resolution, which I believe will become the acquisition format of choice for this type of project," said Barnett. "This Journey production was a great example of having the right people and equipment on a project. We'll definitely champion RED cameras to other major music artists for our future HDTV and DVD productions."

Steve Gibby is an Emmy-winning producer, director, DP, and cinematographer. He's a veteran of several hundred international and national television programs. He can be reached at steve@cut4.tv.

[stevew2]

Journey board? Not anymore. But a new one might be in the works, so hang in there.

i love your new Avatar GB what a hottie

[jrnyjetster]

steveo, I'm aware of the big budget production, but we still haven't gotten an answer as to whether we'll see this innovative technology in all it's glory on a $10.00 DVD.

[Don]

steveo, I'm aware of the big budget production, but we still haven't gotten an answer as to whether we'll see this innovative technology in all it's glory on a $10.00 DVD.

NO.

The reason you go Blue-Ray on concert videos is to get the true fidelity of the sound. Being about music, the sound should be as close to the original performance as possible. Blue-Ray allows you to replicate the audio EXACTLY. The eight channels of lossless audio takes a lot of space on the disk which Blue-Ray gives you. Standard DVD can't do that because of size constraints and ends up compressing the audio. Much the same way a CD sounds better than MP3 because of the massive compression required to bring a 44 meg file down to 5 meg.

The only reason you record the way Journey did is to futureproof for the foreseeable future as far as new media formats that are or will be available. This concert has to come out on Blu-Ray or it will be the equivalent of lighting a birthday candle with a blow torch, just propagandic overkill.

[stevew2]

steveo, I'm aware of the big budget production, but we still haven't gotten an answer as to whether we'll see this innovative technology in all it's glory on a $10.00 DVD.

NO.

The reason you go Blue-Ray on concert videos is to get the true fidelity of the sound. Being about music, the sound should be as close to the original performance as possible. Blue-Ray allows you to replicate the audio EXACTLY. The eight channels of lossless audio takes a lot of space on the disk which Blue-Ray gives you. Standard DVD can't do that because of size constraints and ends up compressing the audio. Much the same way a CD sounds better than MP3 because of the massive compression required to bring a 44 meg file down to 5 meg.

The only reason you record the way Journey did is to futureproof for the foreseeable future as far as new media formats that are or will be available. This concert has to come out on Blu-Ray or it will be the equivalent of lighting a birthday candle with a blow torch, just propagandic overkill.

where to you find them girls?

[steveo777]

steveo, I'm aware of the big budget production, but we still haven't gotten an answer as to whether we'll see this innovative technology in all it's glory on a $10.00 DVD.

NO.

The reason you go Blue-Ray on concert videos is to get the true fidelity of the sound. Being about music, the sound should be as close to the original performance as possible. Blue-Ray allows you to replicate the audio EXACTLY. The eight channels of lossless audio takes a lot of space on the disk which Blue-Ray gives you. Standard DVD can't do that because of size constraints and ends up compressing the audio. Much the same way a CD sounds better than MP3 because of the massive compression required to bring a 44 meg file down to 5 meg.

The only reason you record the way Journey did is to futureproof for the foreseeable future as far as new media formats that are or will be available. This concert has to come out on Blu-Ray or it will be the equivalent of lighting a birthday candle with a blow torch, just propagandic overkill.

Who's the liittle girl in your av? How much candy?

[The Sushi Hunter]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

I'd rather pay $50 and have it on Blu-ray to be honest

I've watched stuff on blu-ray and on DVD and I really don't see much of a difference. Is it really that big of a difference between the two media formats?

[Don]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

I'd rather pay $50 and have it on Blu-ray to be honest

+

Wal-Mart sells AC/DC's BluRay for 20 bucks, so it's not that expensive.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Journey board? Not anymore. But a new one might be in the works, so hang in there.

i love your new Avatar GB what a hottie

I'd drink her bath water like champaign.

[steveo777]

Journey board? Not anymore. But a new one might be in the works, so hang in there.

i love your new Avatar GB what a hottie

I'd drink her bath water like champaign.

Let's not start this. It will get Stevew off on a tangen of lewd thoughts

[Don]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

I'd rather pay $50 and have it on Blu-ray to be honest

I've watched stuff on blu-ray and on DVD and I really don't see much of a difference. Is it really that big of a difference between the two media formats?

When it comes to musical performances, yes. Unless you're the type that can't tell the difference between an mp3 and a CD. If you fit that profile, then it probably won't matter to you.
A concert transferred to blue ray can bring you the sound the exact way it was recorded, as if you're there. A DVD can't.
The point here is, the show was filmed for HI-DEF. Why spend that kind of money to put the show out on an inferior format only?

[Don]

No one would be asking about BluRay if the 4XHD hadn't been brought up continuously.
If your gonna brag about your new BMW, don't be rolling up to the party in your Honda.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Will there be 2 versions released, standard and BLURAY?

I only see the standard version mentioned. Wish it were Blu Ray, but ain't arguing with the $10 price tag either... LOL! It will make it much easier to buy a bunch to give away.

I'd rather pay $50 and have it on Blu-ray to be honest

I've watched stuff on blu-ray and on DVD and I really don't see much of a difference. Is it really that big of a difference between the two media formats?

When it comes to musical performances, yes. Unless you're the type that can't tell the difference between an mp3 and a CD. If you fit that profile, then it probably won't matter to you.
A concert transferred to blue ray can bring you the sound the exact way it was recorded, as if you're there. A DVD can't.
The point here is, the show was filmed for HI-DEF. Why spend that kind of money to put the show out on an inferior format only?

From what I'm understanding about it now, it's primarily the sound quality and the amount of data that makes the biggest difference, not necessarily the video, yes? My hearing is almost shot anyways, starting with that damn rockman I got in Japan when I used to wail on the guitar and then from the years in bands. So I guess if I can hear it, that's all that really matters to me now. And yes, due to this, I'm sure I wouldn't be able to tell the difference between MP3 and CD.