MR

I have been thinking a long time about what the deal is with these shows in Nevada this month. It makes no sense to me why they are doing them and the manner in which they are doing them. Here is my thought process and my resolution. Any thoughts?

My initial thought was that they are using them as warm-up dates for the overseas tours. I thought they might announce some Japanese dates before their European tours. This has not happened so these dates are not warm up dates for Europe. It is too far off.

These dates in Nevada are expensive for the band as you have to rehearse with the crew and hire tractor trailers just for these two shows and they have picked two dates that are not going to draw maximum fans. They could do the shows the weekend before which is President’s Day weekend and would be able to draw more fans to both shows. Why are these shows on Wednesday and Friday? It doesn’t make financial sense. So these shows are not about earning money.

Another thought is that they are filming a DVD to include in the packaging of the new record. The problem is that they did this with the last record and had most of the greatest hit on that DVD. Then they did “Live in Manila” which was a full-fledged show and had all the hits and more. So they are not filming a greatest hits DVD to include with the new album.

That leaves only two plausible scenarios. One of which I think is more likely. Here they are.

1. They are filming a Live DVD at the Reno show and using the Las Vegas show as a warm up. The content of the Live DVD will be the new album from beginning to end. They have stated that this is a concept/theme record and playing it in full to be included with the new album would be a logical thing. Let’s assume that the new record is awesome, because that is what the band is thinking. All bands think there new record is the best ever. So assuming that the new record is awesome it will make the package nice and a good value.

Here are the negatives, nobody is going to know the material at these shows and it will bore the casual fans and if it is really different or far out it could anger the crowds and result in disgruntled and booing fans. Plus, it’s not like they are giving a discount for these show and in fact the Vegas show top ticket is $45 more than the Journey/Heart/Cheap Trick show in 2008. Additionally, they are not giving the fans any advance warning of what they are doing. I am worried it could be a trainwreck.

2. Less likely is that they are recording a live CD of the complete new album which would cost less in production. They would record both shows and take the best of both worlds to create the album.

Anybody have any other ideas?

My thoughts.
They are doing these shows as a warm up as Arnel hasn't had t o a Journey setlist for a long time and they probably want to see how the new material will sound stepped down. They have shows starting in March in S. America so they need some kind of dry run before hand. Neal looks like he is taking care of some solo stuff that month also, so a busy schedule already. Looking at the Euro dates this year, they have some three in a row runs which they didn't have last tour so I am definitely thinking they will be detuning this summer and need to get everyone in sync with that.

I don't think they are doing a DVD. With Shirley so busy and this album not even having a release date yet, I think that won't happen.

Don wrote:My thoughts.
They are doing these shows as a warm up as Arnel hasn't had t o a Journey setlist for a long time and they probably want to see how the new material will sound stepped down. They have shows starting in March in S. America so they need some kind of dry run before hand. Neal looks like he is taking care of some solo stuff that month also, so a busy schedule already. Looking at the Euro dates this year, they have some three in a row runs which they didn't have last tour so I am definitely thinking they will be detuning this summer and need to get everyone in sync with that.

I don't think they are doing a DVD. With Shirley so busy and this album not even having a release date yet, I think that won't happen.

I doubt this is correct. What would be the point in writing new material in a key that would need to be stepped down? Doesn't make sense, Don.

steveo777 wrote:

Don wrote:My thoughts.
They are doing these shows as a warm up as Arnel hasn't had t o a Journey setlist for a long time and they probably want to see how the new material will sound stepped down. They have shows starting in March in S. America so they need some kind of dry run before hand. Neal looks like he is taking care of some solo stuff that month also, so a busy schedule already. Looking at the Euro dates this year, they have some three in a row runs which they didn't have last tour so I am definitely thinking they will be detuning this summer and need to get everyone in sync with that.

I don't think they are doing a DVD. With Shirley so busy and this album not even having a release date yet, I think that won't happen.

I doubt this is correct. What would be the point in writing new material in a key that would need to be stepped down? Doesn't make sense, Don.

They're not going to record new stuff in Eb, (they're not Coldplay) but when they're in concert they can't go up down, up down. Either the whole show is detuned or it's not. As JSS said, it's not easy and Journey abandoned it when they tried with Jeff but Arnel did it in 2009 and is going to need it for sure if they plan on being out for 18 months

I have a feeling that these shows WON'T be stepped down. It's a chance to hear the new songs as they really are and the 2 shows in the original keys won't do any harm to Arnel. Perhaps they'll throw a couple of live versions of the new songs on the new CD. That would be cool.

Saint John wrote:I have a feeling that these shows WON'T be stepped down. It's a chance to hear the new songs as they really are and the 2 shows in the original keys won't do any harm to Arnel. Perhaps they'll throw a couple of live versions of the new songs on the new CD. That would be cool.

Yeah, that's a probable too but I think just these shows only. No way they will go back to a normal key this tour if they didn't think Arnel could handle it last time.

Saint John wrote:I have a feeling that these shows WON'T be stepped down. It's a chance to hear the new songs as they really are and the 2 shows in the original keys won't do any harm to Arnel. Perhaps they'll throw a couple of live versions of the new songs on the new CD. That would be cool.

No, Don is correct. They record the album in regular tune....these shows i would bet are definitelty tuned down, or at least the second show is. They could very well play the first regular and step down the second show. Like Don said, no way can Pineda do 18 months w/o stepping down.

Don wrote:

Saint John wrote:I have a feeling that these shows WON'T be stepped down. It's a chance to hear the new songs as they really are and the 2 shows in the original keys won't do any harm to Arnel. Perhaps they'll throw a couple of live versions of the new songs on the new CD. That would be cool.

Yeah, that's a probable too but I think just these shows only. No way they will go back to a normal key this tour if they didn't think Arnel could handle it last time.

The tour itself will definitely be tuned down a half step when the bulk load of it begins. I'm just thinking that they're going to want to hear at least once what the songs sound like live in the same key as was recorded on the album. This is really the only chance to do so. And throwing a live version on the CD would be killer. That is, of course, assuming that the songs are good!

Saint John wrote:

Don wrote:

Saint John wrote:I have a feeling that these shows WON'T be stepped down. It's a chance to hear the new songs as they really are and the 2 shows in the original keys won't do any harm to Arnel. Perhaps they'll throw a couple of live versions of the new songs on the new CD. That would be cool.

Yeah, that's a probable too but I think just these shows only. No way they will go back to a normal key this tour if they didn't think Arnel could handle it last time.

The tour itself will definitely be tuned down a half step when the bulk load of it begins. I'm just thinking that they're going to want to hear at least once what the songs sound like live in the same key as was recorded on the album. This is really the only chance to do so. And throwing a live version on the CD would be killer. That is, of course, assuming that the songs are good!

Dan, they have no doubt played trhe album live about 20 times already in the warehouse. They know what it sounds like. You don't need 6,000 people sitting on their hands in Vegas to know what it's going to sound like. Recording this thing live in Vegas could very well be a trainwreck, like the OP said. However, if the crowd interaction is not great, they can either A) enhance that with magic mixing, or B) just not release it.

Rockindeano wrote:
Dan, they have no doubt played trhe album live about 20 times already in the warehouse. They know what it sounds like. You don't need 6,000 people sitting on their hands in Vegas to know what it's going to sound like.

Playing in the warehouse and playing a live show in front of people is like comparing Roseanne's ass to Jessica Simpson's charge bucket!

... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

the light show is not "sync'd to Cains laptop"...

Cains laptop most likely only receives sync from the FOH board... as does the light rig controller... just like Dean would get a sync generated click in his in-ears...

Cains laptop probably has editing software for him to make custom synth patches..

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

the light show is not "sync'd to Cains laptop"...

Cains laptop most likely only receives sync from the FOH board... as does the light rig controller... just like Dean would get a sync generated click in his in-ears...

Cains laptop probably has editing software for him to make custom synth patches..

The light show IS linked to Cains laptop. EVERYTHING is. I heard this first hand from the band themselves. Cain can in effect shut the show down with a pushof the button. Of course the lights are linked to Cains lapper, however the main connection like you say is FOH....to que backing vox and pre recorded music.

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

the light show is not "sync'd to Cains laptop"...

Cains laptop most likely only receives sync from the FOH board... as does the light rig controller... just like Dean would get a sync generated click in his in-ears...

Cains laptop probably has editing software for him to make custom synth patches..

The light show IS linked to Cains laptop. EVERYTHING is. I heard this first hand from the band themselves. Cain can in effect shut the show down with a pushof the button. Of course the lights are linked to Cains lapper, however the main connection like you say is FOH....to que backing vox and pre recorded music.

Sorry dude... not believing that...

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

the light show is not "sync'd to Cains laptop"...

Cains laptop most likely only receives sync from the FOH board... as does the light rig controller... just like Dean would get a sync generated click in his in-ears...

Cains laptop probably has editing software for him to make custom synth patches..

The light show IS linked to Cains laptop. EVERYTHING is. I heard this first hand from the band themselves. Cain can in effect shut the show down with a pushof the button. Of course the lights are linked to Cains lapper, however the main connection like you say is FOH....to que backing vox and pre recorded music.

Sorry dude... not believing that...

You're right, I just made all that up. I guess Neal and Ross just fed me that bullshit. Believe what you want. I forgot you talked to them all the time, my bad.

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:

Rockindeano wrote:

slucero wrote:... actually you never really see the audience... full stage lighting pretty much guarantees it... mostly you just hear them (the audience)...

At this level they are running the show (lights included) in rehearsal - because much of the lighting is automated and synced to the songs... so regardless of the song order the band needs to know where their "spots" are and have to practice hitting them without thinking about it..

Also - any "flown-in" things, back vocals, etc... will also have the bugs worked out...

Exactly my point Sluce...that's why they rehearse at the Warehouse...in order to get everything computerized and synched up on Cains laptop, and then they can take those rehearsals over the mountain to northern Nevada. Whomever said they wouldn't make money on this may be wrong. It's only 7 hours from the Bay Area to Reno by truck. And to play two shows there, with a "built in" audience, thus ensuring the place will be full is a smart move. I suppose they could have done the 2 shows in San Francisco and sold out too, so the trip over Donner is mysterious.

Although I am not going to any of their shows anylonger, I still would like the band to finally think outside the box for ONCE in their careers. To play new songs, ALL of them in fact, would be a welcome sight.

the light show is not "sync'd to Cains laptop"...

Cains laptop most likely only receives sync from the FOH board... as does the light rig controller... just like Dean would get a sync generated click in his in-ears...

Cains laptop probably has editing software for him to make custom synth patches..

The light show IS linked to Cains laptop. EVERYTHING is. I heard this first hand from the band themselves. Cain can in effect shut the show down with a pushof the button. Of course the lights are linked to Cains lapper, however the main connection like you say is FOH....to que backing vox and pre recorded music.

Sorry dude... not believing that...

You're right, I just made all that up. I guess Neal and Ross just fed me that bullshit. Believe what you want. I forgot you talked to them all the time, my bad.

Don't you guys sleep??

I'm thinking that unless they are actually going to record these Nevada shows for a DVD/CD, I wouldn't count on hearing much NEW material. They'll throw a couple of songs in I'm sure, but you can probably bet it'll be mostly a greatest hits show. I could be wrong however and they'll end up playing the new album in full and just a few hits, but I doubt that will happen

They probably also want to study the tapes to hear AP's diction throughout, and determine if (how much?) they still need his English coach.


later~