Eclipse Billboard - Flop

[Don]

Revised list


1.Lady Gaga 1,108,400
2 Brad Paisley 152,500
3 Adele 126,400
4 Glee Cast 79,800
5 Various 58,700
6 Various 45,000
7 NKOTBSB 39,500
8 Foster The People 33,300
9 Jason Aldean 32,600
10 Mumford & Sons 25,000
11 Seether 23,400
12 Scotty McCreery 23,100
13 Journey 21,400
14 Beastie Boys 19,500
15 Il Volo 19,200
16 Lady Gaga 19,200
17 Lemonade Mouth 19,000
18 Jennifer Lopez 18,000
19 Katy Perry 17,300
20 Bruno Mars 17,300

[Saint John]

If the Revelation formula holds true, they should report final numbers between 25-30k. Incredibly poor.

[Don]

If the Revelation formula holds true, they should report final numbers between 25-30k. Incredibly poor.

This is where things have changed a bit when predicting this kind of stuff. When Revelation came out, Wal-Mart was bigger than iTunes and Amazon. If they had a best seller, it was really a best seller. Now their music sales have plunged so much, when Wal-Mart tells you Richard Marx is their third biggest seller, you can't even find him on the Billboard 200.

That said, there has to be some final bump from when the digital downloads got up to speed on Wal-Mart's site near the end of the week.

Puts a huge damper on that Top 20 debut in the UK.

[jrny84]

Well my guess was #12 on bb, so I was pretty close.

When do the final numbers come out?

[Don]

Well my guess was #12 on bb, so I was pretty close.

When do the final numbers come out?

Either this afternoon or tomorrow, then Billboard will update on Thursday.

[Jubilee]

Number 11? Only 16,225?

Is it too soon to start mashing the panic button? I think it's time for the plokkers to start putting their money were their mouths are. After all, 'Nel is all but the second coming, and Journey is their favorite band, so, what gives? Must be waiting for Friday, when everybody gets paid.

[Don]

Jason Aldean was a big surprise. With him, Paisley And the Idol kid in the mix, it's become a country affair.

[DrFU]

:shock:

Number 11? Only 16,225?

Is it too soon to start mashing the panic button? I think it's time for the plokkers to start putting their money were their mouths are. After all, 'Nel is all but the second coming, and Journey is their favorite band, so, what gives? Must be waiting for Friday, when everybody gets paid.

And Rip accounts for nearly 1 percent of the total ...

[Eric]

Is #11 really that bad?

[conversationpc]

There's probably no way to tell for sure but I'm wondering how much of the sales decline has to do with lack of promotion and how much has to do with the decline of sales in albums in general? "Revelation" going platinum was kinda cool despite the additional GH CD and how that may have effected sales but honestly, it's only a mostly meaningless thing anyway.

[Don]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Didn't "Arrival" debut at #50 and "Generations" at, like, #113? If these figures are accurate, I'm more than impressed.

[conversationpc]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

There was all sorts of promotion for Petty's MOJO (which sucked, by the way).

[Don]

If an album can debut at #1 with 50k sold and yet, the following week another album doesn't make #1 despite selling 125,000, how can the rankings really have validity.

[Don]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

[jrny84]

#11 the ranking isnt bad at all, but only 16,000+ sold...still hard to believe. I was thinking at least 20,000 by today.

[Eric]

Didn't "Arrival" debut at #50 and "Generations" at, like, #113? If these figures are accurate, I'm more than impressed.

Yeah, I mean...I have a new Journey album I like and its #11. Cool. It will have a little staying power throughout the summer with touring and the Today show. My prediction of 250k - 500k seems too high now, but I'm not sure if it won't get to the lower end of that eventually.

[conversationpc]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

True...On another note, even though there was no visible promotion at my local Walmart, they did have between 60-70 copies of the album on hand when I was there yesterday. I was kinda surprised since I was only expecting to see maybe 5-10 or slightly more.

[Jana]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

Oh, I think they care if it sells. they probably never expected it to hit the numbers Revelation did, for all the reasons everyone has stated before: The Arnel story, more promotion and interviews, multi-disk package. And even back then Wal-Mart actually did better placing of the product. I stated not over 50,000 at most, and I think they would have been happy with that.

I still say the average casual Journey fans know nothing about the change in sound as far as more rocking because there's been no promo, so I don't see how that would affect first week sales in the U.S. I have friends who are casual Journey fans, don't follow what's going on, always hit a concert with they tour no matter the singer, and not one of them knew about a new album.

[brywool]

#11 is pretty cool. 16k, not so much.
There MUST be something between Walmart and Journey about Journey not being able to mention the Amazon.com download. It seems they'd be all over that in their interviews, but it appears mum's the word.
Neal knew it wouldn't sell big. I could care less. It's still a brilliant album.
However, I do hope it doesn't affect their future marketability, it probably will if it doesn't sell.
I remember when Def Leppard's Hysteria came out. It stiffed.
Then all the sudden, there was this huge surge in sales that kept on going.
If the fans and Journey themselves turn the promotion thrusters up to full, you never know.

However, this is probably pretty unlikely.

They REALLY need to get some TV time not playing Don't Stop Believing, but doing the new stuff.

[Don]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

True...On another note, even though there was no visible promotion at my local Walmart, they did have between 60-70 copies of the album on hand when I was there yesterday. I was kinda surprised since I was only expecting to see maybe 5-10 or slightly more.

Yeah, in some cases it looked like there were more copies of Eclipse then Born This Way. It sure seemed like Wal-Mart was expecting something a little closer to Revelation's numbers.

[Don]

Is #11 really that bad?

It's not the ranking that is the issue. When one of their peers, Tom Petty moves 125k on his debut only 10 months earlier, you sort of expect Journey to at least get half of that. Revelation was a surprise with it's 105k on debut, this was supposed to be next step forward.

Did the band indicate it was the next step forward, though? I thought I heard they weren't expecting it to sell as well? I would guess from the major change in direction stylistically, they probably didn't expect anything earth-shattering in the sales department regardless.

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

Oh, I think they care if it sells. they probably never expected it to hit the numbers Revelation did, for all the reasons everyone has stated before: The Arnel story, more promotion and interviews, multi-disk package. And even back then Wal-Mart actually did better placing of the product. I stated not over 50,000 at most, and I think they would have been happy with that.

I still say the average casual Journey fans know nothing about the change in sound as far as more rocking because there's been no promo, so I don't see how that would affect first week sales in the U.S. I have friends who are casual Journey fans, don't follow what's going on, always hit a concert with they tour no matter the singer, and not one of them knew about a new album.

Oh, I believe the promo is the biggest issue here. How could fans even hear the album when there were no snippets available on Wal-Mart's own website until Thursday?

I still think it might be in the top 10 this week, when all is said and done.

Looking at Gaga's numbers, there are still a lot of sales to tally.

[Jubilee]

If that is truly the case, then I can't see Wal-Mart continuing on with them. What good is a loss leader product if the artist doesn't care if it sells or not? The idea is to get people into the store.

This movie plot sounds all too familiar. Now, is this the part where the bands' management throws up a Hail Mary pass, recruits some long-haired, big nosed Portuguese guy who has all but given up on his musical career?? Hey, I'm just sayin'

In that case, Journey's next album should be title: "Coda"

[Don]

[Don]

Is anyone willing to say that Journey won't care about this? That's over an 80% drop from Revelation's debut numbers.

[brywool]

Is anyone willing to say that Journey won't care about this? That's over an 80% drop from Revelation's debut numbers.

I'm sure they'll care. I know I don't. It'd be nice to see them at number 1, but it doesn't change how good the album is. The bad part is that when they play Eclipse songs live, nobody will know them. By the time they get to Seattle, they probably won't be playing anything off of it (unless sales improve). That's a drag. I know I bought mine!

[Don]

Is anyone willing to say that Journey won't care about this? That's over an 80% drop from Revelation's debut numbers.

I'm sure they'll care. I know I don't. It'd be nice to see them at number 1, but it doesn't change how good the album is. The bad part is that when they play Eclipse songs live, nobody will know them. By the time they get to Seattle, they probably won't be playing anything off of it (unless sales improve). That's a drag. I know I bought mine!

I bought mine too, from their secret store on Amazon.

Album sales do matter when it comes to who will pay for the next album release.

[Archetype]

Not too bad considering that the only promotion for Eclipse came from a few of us here on the site I've talked to a number of pretty passionate Journey fans at work, etc. and none of them had any idea that this was coming out.

[ebake02]

I still call bullshit on Lady Gaga's numbers, there is no way in hell she can out sell a country artist by that much. Country fans are a huge force to be reckoned with and when an artist as big as Brad Paisley releases an album, country fans turn out in droves to buy it.