MR

I think one of my problems with Eclipse is the background vocals. Where are the deep classic Journey harmonies? Background vocals on this album are just that - very much in the background. Can you really listen to this and say this is the same band that did Feeling That Way/Anytime, Just The Same Way, Lovin Touchin Squeezin, Anyway You Want It, Who's Crying Now, After The Fall, Girl Can't Help It...etc,etc.? That to me is one of the biggest shortcomings of the CD

True

Better invest in a new pair of earbuds...Resonate, Someone, AIP, EOTM, Ritual, all feature BG vocals. Like WCN, the BG vocals mostly don't come in until the main chorus. I never noticed any layered BG vocals on JTSW or LTS (until the end "Nah Nah Nah" part).

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Better invest in a new pair of earbuds...Resonate, Someone, AIP, EOTM, Ritual, all feature BG vocals. Like WCN, the BG vocals mostly don't come in until the main chorus. I never noticed any layered BG vocals on JTSW or LTS (until the end "Nah Nah Nah" part).

Yep....EOTM has some great background vocals..

One of the Eclipse songs seems like it pulled the backing vocals straight from Red13's The Time. They're kinda wavy and a little under-powered. I too wish there were more of a vocal 'wall of sound', and more crescendos to fill certain places. And interesting about AP, if he used more echo (ala Daryl Hall), would he sound stronger, or would it amplify his accent? I'd like to be in a studio to play with that a bit.


later~

Arkansas wrote:One of the Eclipse songs seems like it pulled the backing vocals straight from Red13's The Time. They're kinda wavy and a little under-powered. I too wish there were more of a vocal 'wall of sound', and more crescendos to fill certain places.

I agree with this.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Better invest in a new pair of earbuds...Resonate, Someone, AIP, EOTM, Ritual, all feature BG vocals. Like WCN, the BG vocals mostly don't come in until the main chorus. I never noticed any layered BG vocals on JTSW or LTS (until the end "Nah Nah Nah" part).

I dont know about you, but I rarely listen to music through earbuds. If you cant hear the background vocals, when youre blasting a song through a stereo system, then there arent any real background vocals. My guess is Neal wanted them way way way back in the background , right next to the keys

Behshad wrote:I dont know about you, but I rarely listen to music through earbuds. If you cant hear the background vocals, when youre blasting a song through a stereo system, then there arent any real background vocals. My guess is Neal wanted them way way way back in the background , right next to the keys

You're being too literal. I don't use ear buds either ( i actually hate my ipod). Have only listened to Eclipse in my car. I hear the BG vox.

Quick comment about earbuds.
I've got some made with mahogany called Timbers by Maxell.
Rich warm sound, and deep bass...best earbuds I've ever used.
As you were...


later~

Arkansas wrote:Quick comment about earbuds.
I've got some made with mahogany called Timbers by Maxell.
Rich warm sound, and deep bass...best earbuds I've ever used.
As you were...


later~

I've got a set of JVC Extreme Xplosives XX. The earpieces themselves have a tiny "amp" built into them, so they're slight larger than a normal pair of earbuds but they put out more bass and seal off the ear better so the actual quality of the sound is better also, other than the increased bass response.

http://www.hhgregg.com/ProductDetail.as ... ctID=73560

Arkansas wrote:One of the Eclipse songs seems like it pulled the backing vocals straight from Red13's The Time. They're kinda wavy and a little under-powered. I too wish there were more of a vocal 'wall of sound', and more crescendos to fill certain places. And interesting about AP, if he used more echo (ala Daryl Hall), would he sound stronger, or would it amplify his accent? I'd like to be in a studio to play with that a bit.


later~

I definitely hear more background vocals when listening to Eclipse through headphones. There's lots about this album that demands close listening to peel away the layers. I think they could have been a bit more direct with them in the mix.

They were going for a harder rock feel. Harmonies being pulled back in the mix is a natural evolution if that's the direction they're going.

brywool wrote:They were going for a harder rock feel. Harmonies being pulled back in the mix is a natural evolution if that's the direction they're going.

Thanks. Not sure I intuitively understand why the songs can't combine the harder feel created by the riffs and guitar-centricity with the accessibility that comes with choruses being pulled a bit more forward.

Thought they were too far back as well. Couple of times (sorry no time to refer back) it was very noticable.

Harmonies and background vocals is one of the traits of Journey I enjoyed. Just one piece of many when put together made them one of my favorites.

koberry wrote:

brywool wrote:They were going for a harder rock feel. Harmonies being pulled back in the mix is a natural evolution if that's the direction they're going.

Thanks. Not sure I intuitively understand why the songs can't combine the harder feel created by the riffs and guitar-centricity with the accessibility that comes with choruses being pulled a bit more forward.

I need more space in the sounds to become emotionally involved with the music. The layer after layer issue is not working for any bonding with the album. I want to love this, but I need dynamics, silence and space to connect. Give my mind room to interact with the melody, extend my aural senses and "hear" it, please.

ETA: i.e. I have no problem connecting with The Who's Baba O'Riley. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKUBTX9kKEo both live and on the album. http://youtu.be/x2KRpRMSu4g

Argus wrote:

koberry wrote:

brywool wrote:They were going for a harder rock feel. Harmonies being pulled back in the mix is a natural evolution if that's the direction they're going.

Thanks. Not sure I intuitively understand why the songs can't combine the harder feel created by the riffs and guitar-centricity with the accessibility that comes with choruses being pulled a bit more forward.

I need more space in the sounds to become emotionally involved with the music. The layer after layer issue is not working for any bonding with the album. I want to love this, but I need dynamics, silence and space to connect. Give my mind room to interact with the melody, extend my aural senses and "hear" it, please.

ETA: i.e. I have no problem connecting with The Who's Baba O'Riley. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKUBTX9kKEo both live and on the album. http://youtu.be/x2KRpRMSu4g

That makes sense to me. Much of Eclipse sounds huge - sonically like a shovel in the face

The background vocals are evident here; the same cannot be said of Revelation, which utterly and irretrievably fumbled the ball.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Arkansas wrote:One of the Eclipse songs seems like it pulled the backing vocals straight from Red13's The Time. They're kinda wavy and a little under-powered. I too wish there were more of a vocal 'wall of sound', and more crescendos to fill certain places.

I agree with this.

This album is pushing Arnel and Neal out front as if to feature. We have all noted that Arnels vox are very upfront in the mix. I love it personally. Kind of bearing it all without a wall of reverb to cover it up. Only thing I have against Perry was the overuse of reverb. Frontiers was the worst example of this with ROR next in line. Reverb helps hides rasp ya know. Can you imagine TBF vox with no echo/reverb. Really now..

This is a very honest mix. The wall of vox has always been a great thing I agree. I like that they are more implied on this album. Too much backing vox walks on about the same eq spectrum as guitar and would kind of compete. Sometimes that is ok but we know what Neal wanted. The lower backing vox helps makes that guitars stand out more without having to turn them up in the mix. Intentional and I understand from a mixing perspective.

I Just listened through a bunch of the CD, and I can hear a TON of back ground vocals all over the place. I think they are just as big as any past journey, the real difference in this recording is Neal's guitars.

I think if you took away these big stacked effected raging guitars, I'd be willing to bet the back ground vocals are the next biggest thing on this record, theres just alot of sound to compete with.