MR

Since Eclipse is a little on the dark side, would WAFTE have been a great bonus track to give the album one bona fide ballad or is the song just too un-Journey like and depressing even for Eclipse?
The more I listen to this song, the more I believe it to be one of the band's best tracks ever. Despite not writing it, Augeri is really in his element here.

State of Grace, The Time and Walking Away From the Edge are really good songs. Unlike Generations, the production is bad, but I would see thoses song better on Generations than on Eclipse.

It sounds like a drug or alcohol recovery song. It's pretty dark but it has a good message. Most people would probably not get the song at all.

steveo777 wrote:It sounds like a drug or alcohol recovery song. It's pretty dark but it has a good message. Most people would probably not get the song at all.

That is exactly what it is, Deen's recovery song.

Any of the songs on Red 13 would fit on Eclipse...cuz that is the same attitude that made Red13...moving even further away from the Perry era and doing something new. And, like you said, most people didn't get it. Funny thought that this would have changed today.

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

Don wrote:Since Eclipse is a little on the dark side, would WAFTE have been a great bonus track to give the album one bona fide ballad or is the song just too un-Journey like and depressing even for Eclipse?
The more I listen to this song, the more I believe it to be one of the band's best tracks ever. Despite not writing it, Augeri is really in his element here.

On the dark side?? Maybe if you are looking at it in terms of being more of a rocker and a rocker in your definition is "dark" but otherwise this album is all about light. Depressing even for Eclipse?? There is nothing gloomy, down, dark or depressing about it, if anything it's upbeat and positive for the most part, save maybe a line or two IF taken out of context. Are you sure it's Eclipse you've been listening to?

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

Who forgot to shut the barn door?

steveo777 wrote:Who forgot to shut the barn door?

I'm here to discuss this album so go fish somewhere else with your little tiny dead worm because you are not going to get anywhere with this. I wish you luck on all of your future endeavours elsewhere, though...you're going to need it. Adios.

Blueskies wrote:

steveo777 wrote:Who forgot to shut the barn door?

Go fish somewhere else with your little tiny dead worm because you are not going to get anywhere with this. I wish you luck on all of your future endevours elsewhere, though...you're going to need it. Adios.

Welcome back. Game on! Elsewhere? The biggest troll on MR is gonna tell me what my destiny will be.....got it.

steveo777 wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

steveo777 wrote:Who forgot to shut the barn door?

Go fish somewhere else with your little tiny dead worm because you are not going to get anywhere with this. I wish you luck on all of your future endevours elsewhere, though...you're going to need it. Adios.

Welcome back. Game on! Elsewhere?

Thanks for the welcome. Elsewhere? I'm sure you'll find someone somewhere that will play with you. Maybe. Maybe not.

edit* the only one trolling here is you. I wasn't addressing you so who are you trying to kid?

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

steveo777 wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

steveo777 wrote:Who forgot to shut the barn door?

Go fish somewhere else with your little tiny dead worm because you are not going to get anywhere with this. I wish you luck on all of your future endevours elsewhere, though...you're going to need it. Adios.

Welcome back. Game on! Elsewhere? The biggest troll on MR is gonna tell me what my destiny will be.....got it.

No, no, no, the biggest troll on MR is Toph, don't feed the troll.

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

I'm down with this.....

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

The bottom line is, whether you like it or not, nobody is buying a "new direction" from Journey any longer. They havent from Arrival on. That is just the way it is.

Maui Tom wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

I'm down with this.....

And, I'm not saying it's a bad album...in fact, I have said it is a pretty good album.

What I am also saying is the masses that bought into Revelation do not want a 'new' style from Journey. In fact, since they were buying into nostalgia, I don't think they really want Journey at all any longer.

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

I agree with you...but the proper phrase is "could NOT care less".

I absolutely love Walking Away From The Edge. Excellent song in my opinion. If this had been a bonus on Eclipse and they had re-recorded it, I think it would have meant more for Deen to have sang lead on it, but Augeri sounded excellent on this song.

Blueskies wrote:

Don wrote:Since Eclipse is a little on the dark side, would WAFTE have been a great bonus track to give the album one bona fide ballad or is the song just too un-Journey like and depressing even for Eclipse?
The more I listen to this song, the more I believe it to be one of the band's best tracks ever. Despite not writing it, Augeri is really in his element here.

On the dark side?? Maybe if you are looking at it in terms of being more of a rocker and a rocker in your definition is "dark" but otherwise this album is all about light. Depressing even for Eclipse?? There is nothing gloomy, down, dark or depressing about it, if anything it's upbeat and positive for the most part, save maybe a line or two IF taken out of context. Are you sure it's Eclipse you've been listening to?

I'm slapping a ditto on this!

Eric wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Don wrote:Since Eclipse is a little on the dark side, would WAFTE have been a great bonus track to give the album one bona fide ballad or is the song just too un-Journey like and depressing even for Eclipse?
The more I listen to this song, the more I believe it to be one of the band's best tracks ever. Despite not writing it, Augeri is really in his element here.

On the dark side?? Maybe if you are looking at it in terms of being more of a rocker and a rocker in your definition is "dark" but otherwise this album is all about light. Depressing even for Eclipse?? There is nothing gloomy, down, dark or depressing about it, if anything it's upbeat and positive for the most part, save maybe a line or two IF taken out of context. Are you sure it's Eclipse you've been listening to?

I'm slapping a ditto on this!

Yep..."Edge of the Moment" feels a little dark but, other than that, this is a fairly positive album.

The lyrics/message may be light and positive, but the music is dark ...it's a dark
sounding LP! Why?!? perhaps the Hindu vibe ...I'm w/G~boy, dark is
what I hear, nothing light and airy about it!!

Hey, BS, welcome back!!

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

Blueskies wrote:

Monker wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Funny thought that this would have changed today.

The different direction has nothing to do with lackluster sales. Eclipse could be another case of "same songs, different chords" and it still will not sell. Without the hits, they can't move new product. Same goes for Foreigner and the limited success of their last album. The Journey name alone is not enough.

Yep.,..exactly what I have been saying.

Some people here predicted 100,000 + in sales the first week...and continued stating this and that may keep the sales alive.

People don't want a new Journey sound...and the masses who wanted the nostalgia have moved on...;and Journey and other 'fans' have dissed all Perry 'loons', Aigeri fans, and JSS fans...so they are left with an even smaller core fan base then they had with Red13. Smart, very smart.

"People don't want a new Journey sound"

Good to know we can come to you to find out what the "people" want.

You don't. Just look at Billboard...Eclipse dropped from the charts because people don't want it. Others can point out where Red 13 and Generations were.

Journey going in a completely new direction doesn't sell...and it hasn't since Infinity. It's like Elvis going to metal in the 70's. Like people would have wanted that. The masses already have it set in their head what Journey is...and Journey solidified that when the hired Arnel and released Revelation. Blah, blah, blah. This is common sense and is sitting right in front of you. Stop being so myopic, people.

I could care less about where an album charts on billboard or any other statistic. I don't look at statistics to tell me what I should like or not. I don't care what is popular or what popular opinion says. I go by my ears alone and I love this album. Music, as all art, is subjective. A lot of great stuff gets missed by the "masses" and sometimes the "masses" embrace total crap, so why should I bother with that? I know I have something that the "masses" are missing out on and I'm enjoying the heck out of it.

The bottom line is, whether you like it or not, nobody is buying a "new direction" from Journey any longer. They havent from Arrival on. That is just the way it is.

Well, I guess Andrew, many other reviewers, myself and others here and elsewhere are nobody's then. It's all a matter of who you are talking to and when. Personally, I didn't buy into the Augeri era. I like some of the songs on Arrival now, but SA's vocal has never fit Journey music for me. Too weak from the start. Not saying he was a bad singer, just that he didn't have the power needed for Journey music, imo.

Michigan Girl wrote:The lyrics/message may be light and positive, but the music is dark ...it's a dark
sounding LP! Why?!? perhaps the Hindu vibe ...I'm w/G~boy, dark is
what I hear, nothing light and airy about it!!

Hey, BS, welcome back!!

Toss me some examples....

Michigan Girl wrote:The lyrics/message may be light and positive, but the music is dark ...it's a dark
sounding LP! Why?!? perhaps the Hindu vibe ...I'm w/G~boy, dark is
what I hear, nothing light and airy about it!!

Hey, BS, welcome back!!

Okay, if thats how you hear it. To me dark sounding is Black Sabbath, Iron maiden, Metallica, Motorhead, Megadeth, etc..

Hi, MG! Thanks for the welcome!

conversationpc wrote:Yep..."Edge of the Moment" feels a little dark but, other than that, this is a fairly positive album.

"Chain of Love" and "Resonate" are all dark songs. Even ballads like Tantra and TWITMC are a little more thoughtful and moodier than usual.

Eric wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:The lyrics/message may be light and positive, but the music is dark ...it's a dark
sounding LP! Why?!? perhaps the Hindu vibe ...I'm w/G~boy, dark is
what I hear, nothing light and airy about it!!

Hey, BS, welcome back!!

Toss me some examples....

Chain, Chain ...dark
Resonate …dark
Edge of The Moment …dark

*Edit* See what TNC is saying up there ...^^^^^^^^^^^^^I agree!!

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

conversationpc wrote:Yep..."Edge of the Moment" feels a little dark but, other than that, this is a fairly positive album.

"Chain of Love" and "Resonate" are all dark songs. Even ballads like Tantra and TWITMC are a little more thoughtful and moodier than usual.

I see this album as heavier instrumentally and deeper lyrically in comparison to some previous albums, but not dark.

Michigan Girl wrote:The lyrics/message may be light and positive, but the music is dark ...it's a dark
sounding LP! Why?!? perhaps the Hindu vibe ...I'm w/G~boy, dark is
what I hear, nothing light and airy about it!!

Hey, BS, welcome back!!

I can agree with that, as far as the overall album goes. But wouldn't you say that City Of Hope (even though I don't really care for it), Anything Is Possible, She's A Mystery and Someone have cool, positive music?