MR

After reading many reviews for the European shows (UK, Germany, Switzerland, etc.) the consensus is clear.
Foreigner is bringing it, night in and night out.
Props for everything from their stage setup, Kelly's vocals and stage presence (as long as he doesn't hurt himself climbing the light scaffolding every other show) and just amping up the concerts in general with Urgent and Jukebox Hero.
Journey's continued sound problems and tinkering with the setlist has helped sway opinion towards Foreigner being the better act during the majority of the shows so far.

Jon mentioned their was a little competition in play during these multiple band gigs, seems that Foreigner has stepped up to the challenge.

Having caught a Foreigner concert last year, I'm happy to see the band getting some recognition. With NASCAR, Facebook, the first time shows in India and other promotional avenues, the band has worked hard on getting their brand name out there.

We'll have to see if Journey makes some adjustments when they hit stateside (cough, cough, soundman, cough, cough).

There were numerous reports of Journey having their asses handed to them during the 2003 Main Event tour as well. The band has never been all that animated to begin with. And Kelly is the quintessential frontman - stage presence, the voice, etc.

Don wrote:After reading many reviews for the European shows (UK, Germany, Switzerland, etc.) the consensus is clear.
Foreigner is bringing it, night in and night out.
Props for everything from their stage setup, Kelly's vocals and stage presence (as long as he doesn't hurt himself climbing the light scaffolding every other show) and just amping up the concerts in general with Urgent and Jukebox Hero.
Journey's continued sound problems and tinkering with the setlist has helped sway opinion towards Foreigner being the better act during the majority of the shows so far.

Jon mentioned their was a little competition in play during these multiple band gigs, seems that Foreigner has stepped up to the challenge.

Having caught a Foreigner concert last year, I'm happy to the band getting some recognition. With NASCAR, Facebook, and other promotional avenues, the band has worked hard for it.

We'll have to see if Journey makes some adjustments when they hit stateside (cough. cough, soundman, cough cough).

Journey, as we know, is very capable. I guess it's difficult to understand why they are a bit off their game this year. Some of the reviews I've
read cite a lot of different things, like the band seems too complacent, it's too Neal-centric, AP looks like a little boy, jumps around too much
and should be more focused on communication with the fans. Who knows???? I haven't been to a concert but I sure hope they get some of this
fixed when they start touring the states.

Don wrote:After reading many reviews for the European shows (UK, Germany, Switzerland, etc.) the consensus is clear.
Foreigner is bringing it, night in and night out.
Props for everything from their stage setup, Kelly's vocals and stage presence (as long as he doesn't hurt himself climbing the light scaffolding every other show) and just amping up the concerts in general with Urgent and Jukebox Hero.

Exactly as someone predicted 6 months ago down in the Foreigner forum. (Hint: It wasn't St. John!):lol:

http://forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/vie ... hp?t=49636

Other than the scaffolding incident, which I haven't seen yet, I don't think you can blame this on Arnel. The rest of the band just stands there, Jon in particular. They're not a "run around" type of band. Perry was. Jss was. Arnel is. But the rest of the band also needs to look like they're enjoying themselves and digging their own music.

brywool wrote:Other than the scaffolding incident, which I haven't seen yet, I don't think you can blame this on Arnel. The rest of the band just stands there, Jon in particular. They're not a "run around" type of band. Perry was. Jss was. Arnel is. But the rest of the band also needs to look like they're enjoying themselves and digging their own music.

There is this thing, during the beginning of Juke Box Hero were as the lyrics "He heard one guitar" are sang, Kelly, Mick and Pilson all rush to the front of the stage together. It's really cool and the crowd loves it, surging forward also but I just can't imagine Ross and Neal ever doing something like that.

Don wrote:

brywool wrote:Other than the scaffolding incident, which I haven't seen yet, I don't think you can blame this on Arnel. The rest of the band just stands there, Jon in particular. They're not a "run around" type of band. Perry was. Jss was. Arnel is. But the rest of the band also needs to look like they're enjoying themselves and digging their own music.

There is this thing, during the beginning of Juke Box Hero were as the lyrics "He heard one guitar" are sang, Kelly, Mick and Pilson all rush to the front of the stage together. It's really cool and the crowd loves it, surging forward also but I just can't imagine Ross and Neal ever doing something like that.

yeah, agreed. Neal has kind of been his own deal with solos and stuff and not one to kind of 'rock with the band'. Then you look at Styx and they're all about that kind of thing.

It isn't just jumping and running around ...AP did that his first year...egad!! It
was awful the way the other band members were constantly having to look
over their shoulders to avoid smashing into him. The next year was much better!!

It's more about connecting w/your audience and each frontman has his own
way of doing this!! Jon is no different than he ever was, mobility wise ...Neal could get
around a little more. They need to form a connection w/each other, as
well ...remember Neal and Steve?!?! That was beautiful to watch!!

Neal's more active on stage than he was during the Augeri years, I think. But Jon and Ross tend to huddle near the drums. Definitely have to work on that shit; Neal and Jon occasionally do a back-to-back guitar jam at the end of Keep On Runnin' that the crowd loves.

Journey doesn't need to run around on the stage like chickens with their heads cut off. They've got the songs to entertain. I've seen Journey several times. In the old days, I would get seats, but now, I just get lawn tickets, because they're not the most exciting band to watch, but they still sound great. I would even say they sound better live than on the last tour with Perry. Sound is always better on the lawn anyway. The only time I wished I had gotten seats was when Cheap Trick opened up, because they are fun to watch, but their sound was off. I saw Journey tour with Foreigner (with Lou Gramm) years ago, and there was no contest. Journey blew them away. I wouldn't be concerned with the US tour. Unlike with Heart, most of the crowd will be there for Journey, with Foreigner and Night Ranger being an added bonus. I would say that a significant number of people left the venue I was at after Heart which surprised me to be honest. I knew they had a dedicated fan base, but I didn't know it was quite so large.

Greg

Michigan Girl wrote:It isn't just jumping and running around ...AP did that his first year...egad!! It
was awful the way the other band members were constantly having to look
over their shoulders to avoid smashing into him. The next year was much better!!

It's more about connecting w/your audience and each frontman has his own
way of doing this!! Jon is no different than he ever was, mobility wise ...Neal could get
around a little more. They need to form a connection w/each other, as
well ...remember Neal and Steve?!?! That was beautiful to watch!!

Better than wiggling like a chick. Always thought Augeri's presence was really dull and way feminine. I don't get why people dog Arnel for putting life into his performance. To just stand there is stupid. They didn't smash into him, he didn't smash into them. That's part of how cool it is. Arnel and Neal have plenty of connection. They need really do need to pull the audience into their show. Perry was the king of that. Arnel seems fine in that way. Speaking of Foreigner, Lou Gramm used to just stand there. Great singer, terrible front guy.

The only thing that really bugged me about Augeri was the rodeo thing he did during "Wheel In The Sky." It was like he was trying to lassoo something.

Greg

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:It isn't just jumping and running around ...AP did that his first year...egad!! It
was awful the way the other band members were constantly having to look
over their shoulders to avoid smashing into him. The next year was much better!!

It's more about connecting w/your audience and each frontman has his own
way of doing this!! Jon is no different than he ever was, mobility wise ...Neal could get
around a little more. They need to form a connection w/each other, as
well ...remember Neal and Steve?!?! That was beautiful to watch!!

Better than wiggling like a chick. Always thought Augeri's presence was really dull and way feminine. I don't get why people dog Arnel for putting life into his performance. To just stand there is stupid. They didn't smash into him, he didn't smash into them. That's part of how cool it is. Arnel and Neal have plenty of connection. They need really do need to pull the audience into their show. Perry was the king of that. Arnel seems fine in that way. Speaking of Foreigner, Lou Gramm used to just stand there. Great singer, terrible front guy.

You and I agree on nothing ...ZERO, ZILCH, ZIP!!! Glad you enjoyed it, I thought it was awful
...but you're right if you can't connect, do the next best thing ...run like an effin' mad man!!
Nerves?!?! Who knows, but the next tour, MAJOR improvement, imo!!

Michigan Girl wrote:You and I agree on nothing ...ZERO, ZILCH, ZIP!!!

I know, isn't it awesome!?

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:You and I agree on nothing ...ZERO, ZILCH, ZIP!!!

I know, isn't it awesome!?

I think you seek me out just to disagree
w/me ...yeah, who wouldn't love that!!

The_Noble_Cause wrote:There were numerous reports of Journey having their asses handed to them during the 2003 Main Event tour as well. The band has never been all that animated to begin with. And Kelly is the quintessential frontman - stage presence, the voice, etc.

It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I disagree with all that say they don't need a cool stage, extensive light show, modern use of video boards or more energy on stage, as their "music" will do the entertaining. BS. Don't put them in an arena or amphitheater then. Just play a cd. A concert is a multi-sensory experience.

I miss the days of the wall of bright lights and the adreniline rush when the flash pots explode ala Line of Fire.

hoagiepete wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:There were numerous reports of Journey having their asses handed to them during the 2003 Main Event tour as well. The band has never been all that animated to begin with. And Kelly is the quintessential frontman - stage presence, the voice, etc.

It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I disagree with all that say they don't need a cool stage, extensive light show, modern use of video boards or more energy on stage, as their "music" will do the entertaining. BS. Don't put them in an arena or amphitheater then. Just play a cd. A concert is a multi-sensory experience.

I miss the days of the wall of bright lights and the adreniline rush when the flash pots explode ala Line of Fire.

Absolutely, it's more than a monkey show!!

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:It isn't just jumping and running around ...AP did that his first year...egad!! It
was awful the way the other band members were constantly having to look
over their shoulders to avoid smashing into him. The next year was much better!!

It's more about connecting w/your audience and each frontman has his own
way of doing this!! Jon is no different than he ever was, mobility wise ...Neal could get
around a little more. They need to form a connection w/each other, as
well ...remember Neal and Steve?!?! That was beautiful to watch!!

Better than wiggling like a chick. Always thought Augeri's presence was really dull and way feminine. I don't get why people dog Arnel for putting life into his performance. To just stand there is stupid. They didn't smash into him, he didn't smash into them. That's part of how cool it is. Arnel and Neal have plenty of connection. They need really do need to pull the audience into their show. Perry was the king of that. Arnel seems fine in that way. Speaking of Foreigner, Lou Gramm used to just stand there. Great singer, terrible front guy.

I have to agree, he was a bit too effeminate for me with the wiggle, as well as not being strong enough for Journey, vocally. He can sound good on his own stuff, though....especially now as long as he doesn't try to go very much over his natural range. His voice is cooked for high notes.
With that said, Perry was effiminate too, especially in the beginning...much more than Augeri. I overlooked it back then with Perry because, wow, that voice, but looking too girlish with the satin pants and shirt tied up..um, no...wasn't a look I dug on a man. Oh yeah...I recall Rolie with the tied shirt too. That didn't work for me either. but hey, it was the 70's..and the 80's styles didn't get much better. A lot of musicians wore them and some still do but skin tight satin pants should have only been worn by females, imo. Not a manly look at all.

Much of the criticism I've read about the tour so far is the very poor sound engineering for Journey. Reviewers for almost every venue in Europe so far have commented that Neal's guitar is too loud, you can't hear Arnel and the piano sounds bad. No complaints about sound for the other groups. That combined with the fact that fans are not familiar with many of the new songs, no wonder Foreigner is taking them to school.

hoagiepete wrote:It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I skipped that tour, so for me, it was just second hand reports.

Michigan Girl wrote:

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:You and I agree on nothing ...ZERO, ZILCH, ZIP!!!

I know, isn't it awesome!?

I think you seek me out just to disagree
w/me ...yeah, who wouldn't love that!!

No, that'd be Portland.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

hoagiepete wrote:It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I skipped that tour, so for me, it was just second hand reports.

Think about it, Augeri was the front guy. Wasn't the most energetic guy and Styx was really pumped that tour.

brywool wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

hoagiepete wrote:It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I skipped that tour, so for me, it was just second hand reports.

Think about it, Augeri was the front guy. Wasn't the most energetic guy and Styx was really pumped that tour.

Styx was the best band on that tour...lots of energy and new songs. "Ass handed to them" is s stretch, but Styx was definitely the best. REO was a bore with Cronin's talking on and on. Usually after seeing a band live you like them more - opposite is true with REO.

I don't get the whole thing with having to be animated on state. Honestly, it's not like moving around makes the music any better. Truth be told, with guys in their 50s and, in some cases, in their 60s, having them a little too animated is a big turn-off to me. That doesn't mean they should stand there like a statue with no facial expressions but Arnel's movements onstage seem a little overboard to me.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

hoagiepete wrote:It wasn't just reports. They DID get their asses handed to them.

I skipped that tour, so for me, it was just second hand reports.

I saw that show in Indianapolis and all three bands were fairly good...That's not to mention that Journey was closing and I was feeling kinda tired by the end of it, so if others in the audience were feeling the same way, I'm sure that had something to do with it. That was a long time to sit through three concerts.

For me Styx and Foreigner were superior to Journey on the UK tour by far. Arnel in my opinion is the best singer since Perry to front the band but the worse frontman!
His lack of communication and the fact he just does not look right does not work for me live, his work on the new cd is great though.
Journey are a very different band live these days, the band have found a singer who can do the songs justice,but lacks the presence that Perry had or the songwriting skills.So in all there sound and stage presance has changed a great deal.
With respect Arnel does his very best and you can ask no more, but for me the band dont project well from the stage..and i am quite tired of Ross doing little else than pull faces like a clown for the show

Peartree12249 wrote:Much of the criticism I've read about the tour so far is the very poor sound engineering for Journey. Reviewers for almost every venue in Europe so far have commented that Neal's guitar is too loud, you can't hear Arnel and the piano sounds bad. No complaints about sound for the other groups. That combined with the fact that fans are not familiar with many of the new songs, no wonder Foreigner is taking them to school.

This was my issue the backing tapes on City of Hope were so loud Arnel could hardly be heard! he may as well have done nothing,the bands use of backing tapes and playing to a PC do the band an injustice live. In all it just seems plain lazy especially compared to the band's 70's live performances!

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:

brywool wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:You and I agree on nothing ...ZERO, ZILCH, ZIP!!!

I know, isn't it awesome!?

I think you seek me out just to disagree
w/me ...yeah, who wouldn't love that!!

No, that'd be Portland.

Ha ~ I think I have mellowed out quite a bit these days.....

People being a bit harsh I think. Musically Journey were amazing as always... just was difficult to hear, that's the negative

Having seen Foreigner with Kelly, they are a band that is hot. To bad this isn't 20 years ago. Both bands would still be selling cds. But everytime I have seen Foreigner, with Lou or Kelly they ahve been a powerhouse.