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Escape in, Eclipse out
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:05 amby Don
Escape re-enters the Billboard chart at #158.
The Greatest Hits returns to it's usual mid-chart selling zone at #115.
Eclipse departs Billboard after five weeks.
As Escape is the album that really got me moving on the Journey train, I love seeing it making an appearance back on the charts again, even if for a moment only.
My first stadium show was seeing Journey, Foreigner and George Thorogood open for the Rolling Stones at JFK. Escape and Foreigner 4 were the albums being toured at that time.
A lot of great music at that show.
Long Live Classic Journey.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:05 amby Greg
Wow, that's some awesome news for Escape and certainly for Journey; members past and present!
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:06 amby steveo777
The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:26 amby Don
steveo777 wrote:The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
They get to tour at least.
Perry did over 500 shows with Journey. Deen's probably hit that number or surpassed it but Arnel's not even half way there yet, so he's still got some shows to go (as far as their Journey career numbers).
It all evens out in the end.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:32 amby Arkansas
Don wrote:steveo777 wrote:The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
They get to tour at least.
Perry did over 500 shows with Journey. Deen's probably hit that number or surpassed it but Arnel's not even half way there yet, so he's still got some shows to go (as far as their Journey career numbers).
It all evens out in the end.
Probably not many singers and/or drummers that wouldn't take $500k/yr + T&E. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if their pay was even higher than that. I'd call that a decent 'money train'.
later~
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:34 amby steveo777
Arkansas wrote:Don wrote:steveo777 wrote:The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
They get to tour at least.
Perry did over 500 shows with Journey. Deen's probably hit that number or surpassed it but Arnel's not even half way there yet, so he's still got some shows to go (as far as their Journey career numbers).
It all evens out in the end.
Probably not many singers and/or drummers that wouldn't take $500k/yr + T&E. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if their pay was even higher than that. I'd call that a decent 'money train'.
later~
Yeah, but nowhere near what Neal, Jon, Ross & Perry make off the residual income, right?
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:55 amby Saint John
Don wrote:Perry did over 500 shows with Journey.
I read not too long ago that Robin Zander and Cheap Trick just played their
5,000th show together.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:30 amby Don
steveo777 wrote:Arkansas wrote:Don wrote:steveo777 wrote:The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
They get to tour at least.
Perry did over 500 shows with Journey. Deen's probably hit that number or surpassed it but Arnel's not even half way there yet, so he's still got some shows to go (as far as their Journey career numbers).
It all evens out in the end.
Probably not many singers and/or drummers that wouldn't take $500k/yr + T&E. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if their pay was even higher than that. I'd call that a decent 'money train'.
later~
Yeah, but nowhere near what Neal, Jon, Ross & Perry make off the residual income, right?
I think you are referring to licensing. Honestly, Deen and Arnel don't deserve anything from something that was accomplished 30 years ago. If the new lineup was responsible for the back catalog's recent success, Eclipse would be the benefactor and that just isn't it the case.
Even Cain has said that all the reward they are reaping now stemmed from DSB being used during the Chi-Sox run and the Sopranos. Neal and Jon have never publicly equated the back catalog success with what the band is doing now days; only certain segments of the fan base have been trying to paint that picture.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:14 amby steveo777
Don wrote:steveo777 wrote:Arkansas wrote:Don wrote:steveo777 wrote:The money train keeps cruising for the legacy members. Sorry Deen and Arnel.
They get to tour at least.
Perry did over 500 shows with Journey. Deen's probably hit that number or surpassed it but Arnel's not even half way there yet, so he's still got some shows to go (as far as their Journey career numbers).
It all evens out in the end.
Probably not many singers and/or drummers that wouldn't take $500k/yr + T&E. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if their pay was even higher than that. I'd call that a decent 'money train'.
later~
Yeah, but nowhere near what Neal, Jon, Ross & Perry make off the residual income, right?
I think you are referring to licensing. Honestly, Deen and Arnel don't deserve anything from something that was accomplished 30 years ago. If the new lineup was responsible for the back catalog's recent success, Eclipse would be the benefactor and that just isn't it the case.
Even Cain has said that all the reward they are reaping now stemmed from DSB being used during the Chi-Sox run and the Sopranos. Neal and Jon have never publicly equated the back catalog success with what the band is doing now days; only certain segments of the fan base have been trying to paint that picture.
All I wanted to know is if Neal, Jon and Ross still make a butt load of money from record sales of the back catalog. That was all I was wondering, not arguing that AP and Deen should be making money from those. I never expected they would.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:44 amby yandtguy
It would be cool if the band received another diamond award...Escape should be really close.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:46 amby yandtguy
Depends on how the royalties are split up. Each member gets performance and songwriting royalties, but the percentages vary as to the contracts signed for each recording.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:35 amby Don
yandtguy wrote:Depends on how the royalties are split up. Each member gets performance and songwriting royalties, but the percentages vary as to the contracts signed for each recording.
I think licensing pays the most as there is no payment ceiling as there is with royalties, you actually get to negotiate how much you want to get paid. Of course licensing your music to a movie lets you get both as you get paid upfront for allowing the use of song and later you get royalties for DVD sales, TV syndication etc.
There were over 20 million Disney DVDs sold over the last two years with Journey music on them. No new album can even touch those numbers and there is the licensing on top of that to boot. Very lucrative. Journey has also been careful not to saturate the market either. No Journey tunes in whiffer commercials like a lot of bands.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:37 amby Don
steveo777 wrote:
All I wanted to know is if Neal, Jon and Ross still make a butt load of money from record sales of the back catalog. That was all I was wondering, not arguing that AP and Deen should be making money from those. I never expected they would.
There are people that think differently though, and seeing how many lurkers are out there (numbers of views tell that tale), my response was written with them in mind.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:43 amby Tito
Neal, Jon, (and Perry) are making boatloads off the old songs. Ross and Smith are doing ok off the catalog but aren't even close to what Cain, Schon, and Perry -the songwriters- make. Everytime there is a licensing deal, it's those three that have to make the decision. Valory and Smith have no say, although they may get a few pennies from those deals for performing on the songs. Valory gets paid for Wheel in the Sky though. Someone should help a brother out and start pushing that song for him.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:46 amby Tito
Also, why did Escape re-chart? Did someone wake up in marketing and figured out that it's the 30th anniversary and came up with something.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:38 pmby Don
Tito wrote:Also, why did Escape re-chart? Did someone wake up in marketing and figured out that it's the 30th anniversary and came up with something.
Probably in Columbia's marketing Department.
Maybe the same person who suggested to drop the price a dollar on iTune for the Greatest Hits and advertise it on Father's Day.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:26 pmby slucero
JOURNEY Passing On Performing 'Escape' For 30th Anniversary - July 6, 2011
According to The Pulse Of Radio, JOURNEY co-founder and guitarist Neal Schon says that the band is too busy touring behind new music to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their mega-platinum "Escape" album.
The Pulse Of Radio asked Schon point blank if, with such a momentous anniversary happening this summer, he even considered touring behind "Escape"'s 30th birthday. "No," he said. "I've seen what's been going on at some concerts with some bands and they're playing the whole record — I mean surely, we could do that at some point, but that's not happening this year or next year, 'cause we're here to support our new record. And, y'know, play bits and pieces from 'Escape', and all the other records that, y'know, that we're playing."
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:08 pmby RedWingFan
slucero wrote:JOURNEY Passing On Performing 'Escape' For 30th Anniversary - July 6, 2011
According to The Pulse Of Radio, JOURNEY co-founder and guitarist Neal Schon says that the band is too busy touring behind new music to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their mega-platinum "Escape" album.
The Pulse Of Radio asked Schon point blank if, with such a momentous anniversary happening this summer, he even considered touring behind "Escape"'s 30th birthday. "No," he said. "I've seen what's been going on at some concerts with some bands and they're playing the whole record — I mean surely, we could do that at some point, but that's not happening this year or next year, 'cause we're here to support our new record. And, y'know, play bits and pieces from 'Escape', and all the other records that, y'know, that we're playing."
And thousands upon thousands of bladders across the country will be thankful for it.
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:00 pmby onmyjrny
slucero wrote:JOURNEY Passing On Performing 'Escape' For 30th Anniversary - July 6, 2011
According to The Pulse Of Radio, JOURNEY co-founder and guitarist Neal Schon says that the band is too busy touring behind new music to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their mega-platinum "Escape" album.
The Pulse Of Radio asked Schon point blank if, with such a momentous anniversary happening this summer, he even considered touring behind "Escape"'s 30th birthday. "No," he said. "I've seen what's been going on at some concerts with some bands and they're playing the whole record — I mean surely, we could do that at some point, but that's not happening this year or next year, 'cause we're here to support our new record. And, y'know, play bits and pieces from 'Escape', and all the other records that, y'know, that we're playing."
Does this man have no common sense? It seems like they are missing out on a golden opportunity...
Posted:
Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:22 pmby Greg
slucero wrote:JOURNEY Passing On Performing 'Escape' For 30th Anniversary - July 6, 2011
According to The Pulse Of Radio, JOURNEY co-founder and guitarist Neal Schon says that the band is too busy touring behind new music to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their mega-platinum "Escape" album.
The Pulse Of Radio asked Schon point blank if, with such a momentous anniversary happening this summer, he even considered touring behind "Escape"'s 30th birthday. "No," he said. "I've seen what's been going on at some concerts with some bands and they're playing the whole record — I mean surely, we could do that at some point, but that's not happening this year or next year, 'cause we're here to support our new record. And, y'know, play bits and pieces from 'Escape', and all the other records that, y'know, that we're playing."
Stupid, stupid move.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 12:35 amby Tito
I like Neal, but I think even Herbie admitted, he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 1:08 amby SF-Dano
The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 1:40 amby Greg
SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 1:54 amby SF-Dano
Greg wrote:SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between
just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
You seriously think this band is going to be selling out STADIUMS? Without Perry in the lineup? In this day and age...no way, no how. They will do very well on the amphitheater, arena, smaller venue circuit as they always do regardless of what the tour is billed as. The days of stadium shows (unless it is a festival with other big bands) for this band are long, long gone. People talk about getting Perry back and doing farewell shows in stadiums. I don't believe they would fill a stadium even if those circumstances came to pass.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 2:05 amby Rick
Greg wrote:SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
I don't think they're going to risk booking stadiums nowadays, even for a 30th anniversary tour. If the tour flops, then it's going to flop really hard that way. They're going to err on the side of caution. I think pushing the new album is the way to go. A whole lot of Journey fans have a copy of Escape, so they're not going to go buy another one, but they may very well go pick up a copy of Eclipse and spread the word if they like it.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:09 amby Greg
SF-Dano wrote:Greg wrote:SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between
just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
You seriously think this band is going to be selling out STADIUMS? Without Perry in the lineup? In this day and age...no way, no how. They will do very well on the amphitheater, arena, smaller venue circuit as they always do regardless of what the tour is billed as. The days of stadium shows (unless it is a festival with other big bands) for this band are long, long gone. People talk about getting Perry back and doing farewell shows in stadiums. I don't believe they would fill a stadium even if those circumstances came to pass.
What my point is that when you have a product that is selling, you push that product and you keep it selling as long as possible. Schon is trying to hang his hat on Eclipse, that is an epic fail commercially, when he needs to take advantage of the resurgence of Escape. But, I'm not sure why I'm not surprised, since they failed to do so with Don't stop Believing a couple years back.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:15 amby Greg
Rick wrote:Greg wrote:SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
I don't think they're going to risk booking stadiums nowadays, even for a 30th anniversary tour. If the tour flops, then it's going to flop really hard that way. They're going to err on the side of caution. I think pushing the new album is the way to go. A whole lot of Journey fans have a copy of Escape, so they're not going to go buy another one, but they may very well go pick up a copy of Eclipse and spread the word if they like it.
Stadiums was definitely the wrong word to say. I was just trying to make it a point that Journey has yet another opportunity to capitalize on something that can push them a long ways and Schon seems to not even care. If this was Gene Simmons, he'd already made a million dollars off of the opportunity in the last five minutes. These classic rock bands don't have much opportunity to cash in nowadays, you gotta take advantage of golden opportunities like this.
I mean, who would have ever thought Escape would be back on the charts 30 years later out of nowhere?
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:30 amby steveo777
I understand why Schon is doing what he's doing. They are always going to be able to sell shows on their name, but I also notice the audiences are responding
well to the new music they are playing, in some cases very enthusiastically. He wants Arnel to be his own person, on new music, not be just a cover singer of
the back catalog. I've gotta give kudos to the band for having the guts to bring out new music, instead of resting on their laurels as most of the classic bands
do these days. I can't understand why people have a problem with it.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:31 amby Rick
Greg wrote:Rick wrote:Greg wrote:SF-Dano wrote:The concert tickets are selling regardless of it being billed as the Escape 30th tour or the Eclipse tour. Are they not? What opportunity are they missing out on exactly? (Forgive me if I am missing something, it is still early in the morn.
)
Concert tickets will sell just on the name "Journey" alone. But, it could possibly mean the difference between just merely selling concert tickets and selling out stadiums. Let's face it, Escape put Journey on the map more or less. For a 30 year old album to reenter the charts is amazing, which means there is a market for that album. Any business person will tell you support what sells. It's bad luck that Eclipse has flopped, but why force that album if it's not selling? It's a dumb move on Neal Schon's part. I'd guarantee Herbie Herbert would agree.
I don't think they're going to risk booking stadiums nowadays, even for a 30th anniversary tour. If the tour flops, then it's going to flop really hard that way. They're going to err on the side of caution. I think pushing the new album is the way to go. A whole lot of Journey fans have a copy of Escape, so they're not going to go buy another one, but they may very well go pick up a copy of Eclipse and spread the word if they like it.
Stadiums was definitely the wrong word to say. I was just trying to make it a point that Journey has yet another opportunity to capitalize on something that can push them a long ways and Schon seems to not even care. If this was Gene Simmons, he'd already made a million dollars off of the opportunity in the last five minutes. These classic rock bands don't have much opportunity to cash in nowadays, you gotta take advantage of golden opportunities like this.
I mean, who would have ever thought Escape would be back on the charts 30 years later out of nowhere?
Gene Simmons seems to be a very shrewd business man. He and Perry should hang out.
I agree though Greg. They should be capitalizing as much as they can on whatever they can, and it just doesn't seem like they're trying very hard, if at all.
Posted:
Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:42 amby Greg
steveo777 wrote:I understand why Schon is doing what he's doing. They are always going to be able to sell shows on their name, but I also notice the audiences are responding
well to the new music they are playing, in some cases very enthusiastically. He wants Arnel to be his own person, on new music, not be just a cover singer of
the back catalog. I've gotta give kudos to the band for having the guts to bring out new music, instead of resting on their laurels as most of the classic bands
do these days. I can't understand why people have a problem with it.
It's not that anybody has any problems with classic rock bands trying to push their new music, I certainly don't mind that at all. But, let's be realistic. I seriously doubt in large, audiences are really responding that well to the new music in concert. If this was true, Eclipse would be selling like hot cakes.
But, Escape IS selling pretty well - capitalize on that before the opportunity is gone. This doesn't hurt Arnel in any way directly. The classics is probably the only reason why the majority goes to the concerts at all. That and a chance at being drunk in public.