MR

As many of you, who listened to the broadcast (or read about it) know, Arnel's voice did not seem at it's best. Sure, that was the raw feed, but it said a lot.

The more I think about this, the more I have concluded, they HAVE TO LET UP ON THE SCHEDULE! Yes, I know they are tuning down. BUT STILL. That is only half a step for songs that are vocalist murder. They HAVE to give the guy more consideration during the touring schedule. And this includes TV appearances between shows.

In 2009, didn't they make much more of an effort to give him multiple days off for rest/limits on how many shows they consecutively could play? And that tour had them doing 17-20 songs a night as part of a HEADLINING tour. I know the schedule is what it is, but the guy should be in much better shape after a year off!

COME ON JOURNEY! ARNEL IS YOUR FUTURE. RESPECT IT & PROTECT IT!

I have this theory that maybe knowing with a triple bill, their set list would be half the size, that they thought maybe it wouldn't be that big of a toll? Could be wrong though!

RumTumJM wrote:As many of you, who listened to the broadcast (or read about it) know, Arnel's voice did not seem at it's best. Sure, that was the raw feed, but it said a lot.

The more I think about this, the more I have concluded, they HAVE TO LET UP ON THE SCHEDULE! Yes, I know they are tuning down. BUT STILL. That is only half a step for songs that are vocalist murder. They HAVE to give the guy more consideration during the touring schedule. And this includes TV appearances between shows.

In 2009, didn't they make much more of an effort to give him multiple days off for rest/limits on how many shows they consecutively could play? And that tour had them doing 17-20 songs a night as part of a HEADLINING tour. I know the schedule is what it is, but the guy should be in much better shape after a year off!

COME ON JOURNEY! ARNEL IS YOUR FUTURE. RESPECT IT & PROTECT IT!

I agree.

I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Neal's been the driving force behind the band for much of their success. Only when someone else took the reigns for a bit
did some aspects of Journey begin to suck. Good Neal has his band back!

One thing I have noticed about Arnel is that he brings it all to the stage 24/7. Bless his heart but that might not be good long-term.

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Seven Wishes wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Too bad. Lots of us like it. Actually, this is not really a casual fan album and I'm fine with that. Some of you guys don't
get it. You can still have your ballads and your dirty dozen. Nothing wrong with the band branching out artistically.
Eclipse is not a POS just because YOU don't happen to like it. Sure it's not 100% but they can make another similar
one, AFAIC.

steveo777 wrote:

Seven Wishes wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Too bad. Lots of us like it.

Dude, if Neil blew his nose in your presence, you'd dig the tissue out of the trash and have it framed for your bedroom wall.

RedWingFan wrote:

steveo777 wrote:

Seven Wishes wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Too bad. Lots of us like it.

Dude, if Neil blew his nose in your presence, you'd dig the tissue out of the trash and have it framed for your bedroom wall.

Maybe.
But then again, Neil could write and produce a masterpiece and you'd ejaculate as much of the usual vitriol as your heart and balls could produce, "dude."

RedWingFan wrote:

steveo777 wrote:

Seven Wishes wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Too bad. Lots of us like it.

Dude, if Neil blew his nose in your presence, you'd dig the tissue out of the trash and have it framed for your bedroom wall.

I'm a fan of Journey, always have been. Band has always come first and it's always been about the music for me, including all their
past and present excellent singers. My liking of the band's music is not gonna change, no matter what some of you Fagulas say.
I'm not a Perry ball licking sycophant like some of ya all.

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Gideon wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:

steveo777 wrote:

Seven Wishes wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:I don't think the fragility of Arnel's voice is the biggest threat to the band.

Neil being the driving force in the band is about as productive as Obama's "laser-like focus on jobs".

Holy shit, I actually agree with you.

One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Too bad. Lots of us like it.

Dude, if Neil blew his nose in your presence, you'd dig the tissue out of the trash and have it framed for your bedroom wall.

Maybe.
But then again, Neil could write and produce a masterpiece and you'd ejaculate as much of the usual vitriol as your heart and balls could produce, "dude."

I'd make an effort for a witty response, but this post doesn't even make sense.

RumTumJM wrote:As many of you, who listened to the broadcast (or read about it) know, Arnel's voice did not seem at it's best. Sure, that was the raw feed, but it said a lot.

The more I think about this, the more I have concluded, they HAVE TO LET UP ON THE SCHEDULE! Yes, I know they are tuning down. BUT STILL. That is only half a step for songs that are vocalist murder. They HAVE to give the guy more consideration during the touring schedule. And this includes TV appearances between shows.

In 2009, didn't they make much more of an effort to give him multiple days off for rest/limits on how many shows they consecutively could play? And that tour had them doing 17-20 songs a night as part of a HEADLINING tour. I know the schedule is what it is, but the guy should be in much better shape after a year off!

COME ON JOURNEY! ARNEL IS YOUR FUTURE. RESPECT IT & PROTECT IT!

Which broadcast are we talking about? TODAY show? There's no pulling back when you have the opportunity to be on the No. 1 morning show. That's a to-die-for booking. They had no choice. Even if Matt Lauer didn't know Neal from Jonathan....

RedWingFan wrote:I'd make an effort for a witty response,

It's probably best that you pace yourself.

RedWingFan wrote:but this post doesn't even make sense.

It's not hard, dude.
You accuse Steveo of being a Journey sycophant, yes? I'm pointing out that one could very easily (and with equal success) argue that you're the consummate Journey naysayer, equally biased, just in a different direction.

Just keeping things fair and in perspective here.

FamilyMan wrote:

RumTumJM wrote:As many of you, who listened to the broadcast (or read about it) know, Arnel's voice did not seem at it's best. Sure, that was the raw feed, but it said a lot.

The more I think about this, the more I have concluded, they HAVE TO LET UP ON THE SCHEDULE! Yes, I know they are tuning down. BUT STILL. That is only half a step for songs that are vocalist murder. They HAVE to give the guy more consideration during the touring schedule. And this includes TV appearances between shows.

In 2009, didn't they make much more of an effort to give him multiple days off for rest/limits on how many shows they consecutively could play? And that tour had them doing 17-20 songs a night as part of a HEADLINING tour. I know the schedule is what it is, but the guy should be in much better shape after a year off!

COME ON JOURNEY! ARNEL IS YOUR FUTURE. RESPECT IT & PROTECT IT!

Which broadcast are we talking about? TODAY show? There's no pulling back when you have the opportunity to be on the No. 1 morning show. That's a to-die-for booking. They had no choice. Even if Matt Lauer didn't know Neal from Jonathan....

Yes, the Today show. I am just saying more could have been done for Arnel, to assure his health/stamina for the sake of the tour/Today show appearance.

Let me add too, that although from a distance, I saw part of the Today show performance LIVE. I work in Manhattan, and after my boss saw I had it on the TV (I work in radio), she set me free to go. I heard Dont Stop (2x) and City Of Hope.

Gideon wrote:

RedWingFan wrote:but this post doesn't even make sense.

It's not hard, dude.
You accuse Steveo of being a Journey sycophant, yes? I'm pointing out that one could very easily (and with equal success) argue that you're the consummate Journey naysayer, equally biased, just in a different direction.

Just keeping things fair and in perspective here.

Well the reason it doesn't make sense is because, I'm on record as saying Cain and Neil seemed to have a balanced approach on Arrival (which was pretty damned great) and Revelation (which I consider very good with a few brilliant songs).

I'm on record as saying Arnel sounded pretty damned good on the uptempo stuff @ the Detroit show.

Neil, Cain, and Shirley all have said Neil got his way on Eclipse. I think it blows as a result of it. Neil got what he wanted along with the risk of alienating longtime fans. I happen to be one, it's not my fault, it's Neil's. Just calling it like I hear it. It's also not my fault the thing has only sold nearly 70,000 copies. Is it?

RumTumJM wrote:

FamilyMan wrote:

RumTumJM wrote:As many of you, who listened to the broadcast (or read about it) know, Arnel's voice did not seem at it's best. Sure, that was the raw feed, but it said a lot.

The more I think about this, the more I have concluded, they HAVE TO LET UP ON THE SCHEDULE! Yes, I know they are tuning down. BUT STILL. That is only half a step for songs that are vocalist murder. They HAVE to give the guy more consideration during the touring schedule. And this includes TV appearances between shows.

In 2009, didn't they make much more of an effort to give him multiple days off for rest/limits on how many shows they consecutively could play? And that tour had them doing 17-20 songs a night as part of a HEADLINING tour. I know the schedule is what it is, but the guy should be in much better shape after a year off!

COME ON JOURNEY! ARNEL IS YOUR FUTURE. RESPECT IT & PROTECT IT!

Which broadcast are we talking about? TODAY show? There's no pulling back when you have the opportunity to be on the No. 1 morning show. That's a to-die-for booking. They had no choice. Even if Matt Lauer didn't know Neal from Jonathan....

Yes, the Today show. I am just saying more could have been done for Arnel, to assure his health/stamina for the sake of the tour/Today show appearance.

Let me add too, that although from a distance, I saw part of the Today show performance LIVE. I work in Manhattan, and after my boss saw I had it on the TV (I work in radio), she set me free to go. I heard Dont Stop (2x) and City Of Hope.

I think it's hard to sound good on TODAY. It's early -- and these are night owls. And besides ... it's a makeshift mix ... they get in at 5am ... barely have time to sound check. Usually, a NYC Today show appearance is built into the tour routing - of you're Bon Jovi or Lady Gaga. But a band like Journey needs to seize it when they can.

Summertime in The United States should be 50 shows, at the most, in the original key. Period. That's 50 shows in about 13 weeks. For instance, you perform on Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Saturday. Why is that so hard to figure out?

RedWingFan wrote:Well the reason it doesn't make sense is because, I'm on record as saying Cain and Neil seemed to have a balanced approach on Arrival (which was pretty damned great) and Revelation (which I consider very good with a few brilliant songs).

So you weren't trashing Neil and co. before Eclipse?

RedWingFan wrote:I'm on record as saying Arnel sounded pretty damned good on the uptempo stuff @ the Detroit show.

I'm aware of that.
But so too has Steveo made comments and offered opinions that would be out of place with the Journey party line.

RedWingFan wrote:Neil, Cain, and Shirley all have said Neil got his way on Eclipse. I think it blows as a result of it. Neil got what he wanted along with the risk of alienating longtime fans. I happen to be one, it's not my fault, it's Neil's. Just calling it like I hear it. It's also not my fault the thing has only sold nearly 70,000 copies. Is it?

No, it's absolutely not your fault that Eclipse was a commercial failure. What I'm trying to get at though is just because Steveo likes the album doesn't mean he's a true Journey sycophant anymore than you're a disgruntled contrarian.

Saint John wrote:Summertime in The United States should be 50 shows, at the most, in the original key. Period. That's 50 shows in about 13 weeks. For instance, you perform on Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Saturday. Why is that so hard to figure out?

Even Perry complained about the tour routing back in the day.... wanting to protect his "instrument," which was "not like a guitar." If they didn't figure it out when they were selling out stadiums, they're not going to bail now -- right SJ?

Did you watch the interview segment on the website? The band performed with no sleep. Neal explained that. I don't think he sounded bad at all considering. He's not 25. Those of you who want your singers to sound live like they did in their 20's are going to be continually disappointed, unless you start listening to younger bands. A lot of you know the world these guys live in...the cigarette smoke, the alcohol, the crappy food, the lack of time or facilities for exercise. It all leads to deteriorating vocals. If you want an example of a guy Arnel's age whose voice is going, check out Ray Alder of Fates Warning. The guy had a beautiful tenor voice in the late 80' through the mid 90's, but it's merely a shadow of what it once was thanks to his constant smoking and all the touring he's done in the past 20 years. We're lucky Arnel hasn't had much touring experience, and he lives a healthy lifestyle, but his voice will eventually go the way of every other tenor eventually with the touring that Journey does.

FamilyMan wrote:

Saint John wrote:Summertime in The United States should be 50 shows, at the most, in the original key. Period. That's 50 shows in about 13 weeks. For instance, you perform on Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Saturday. Why is that so hard to figure out?

Even Perry complained about the tour routing back in the day.... wanting to protect his "instrument," which was "not like a guitar." If they didn't figure it out when they were selling out stadiums, they're not going to bail now -- right SJ?

I'd give Perry the benefit of the doubt with that statement, but he did play the following dates at age 43-44 without Journey, so I simply can't. Does it appear that he had any respect for what little voice he had left? Notice that, from November 14th-November 25th, he played 10 shows in 12 nights. Goodbye voice ... never to be heard from again after this tour. But, you're right, they should have learned from it.

Tour dates

Oct. 22, 1994 Minneapolis, MN Sass Jordan
Oct 24, 1994 St. Louis, MO Sass Jordan
Oct. 28, 1994 Taft Theater. Cincinnati, OH Sass Jordan
Oct. 29, 1994 Music Hall. Cleveland, OH Sass Jordan
Oct. 30, 1994 Arie Crown Theater. Chicago, IL Sass Jordan
Nov. 1, 1994 A.J. Palumbo Auditorium. Pittsburgh, PA Sass Jordan
Nov. 2, 1994 Fox Theater. Detroit ,MI Sass Jordan
Nov. 5, 1994 Stabler Arena. Lehigh Campus. Bethleham, PA Sass Jordan
Nov. 7, 1994 DAR Constitution Hall. D.C. Sass Jordan
Nov. 10, 1994 A.J. Palumbo Center. Pittsburgh, PA Sass Jordan
Nov. 14, 1994 Albany, NY Sass Jordan
Nov. 15, 1994 Massey Hall, Toronto, ONT Sass Jordan
Nov. 16, 1994 Tower Theater, Philadelphia Upper Darby, PA Sass Jordan
Nov. 17, 1994 Central Maine Civic Center. Lewiston, ME Sass Jordan
Nov. 18, 1994 Orpheum Theater. Boston, Ma Sass Jordan
Nov. 20, 1994 Hershey Park Arena. Hershey, PA Sass Jordan
Nov. 22, 1994 Fox Theater. Atlanta, GA Sass Jordan
Nov. 23, 1994 Jacksonville, FL Sass Jordan
Nov. 24, 1994 Bob Carr Performing Arts Center. Orlando, FL Sass Jordan
Nov. 25, 1994 Sunrise Musical Theater. Sunrise, FL Sass Jordan
Nov. 27, 1994 Mahaffey Theater. St. Petersburg, FL Sass Jordan
Dec. 2, 1994 Municipal Auditorium. San Antonio, TX Sass Jordan
Dec. 3, 1994 Will Rogers Memorial. Forth Worth, TX Sass Jordan
Dec. 7, 1994 Aladdin Theater, Las Vegas, NV Sass Jordan
Dec. 9, 1994 Fort Worth, TX Sass Jordan
Dec. 10, 1994 Warner's Theater. Fresno, CA Sass Jordan
Dec. 12, 1994 Speckles Theater .San Diego, CA Sass Jordan
Dec. 16, 1994 Pantages Theater. Los Angeles, CA Sass Jordan
Dec. 17, 1994 Pantages Theater . Los Angeles, CA Sass Jordan
Dec. 18, 1994 Pantages Theater . Los Angeles, CA Sass Jordan
Jan. 11, 1995 Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall Portland, OR Sass Jordan
Jan. 13, 1995 Seattle, Washington
Jan. 15, 1995 Abravanel Hall. Salt Lake City, Utah Sass Jordan
Jan. 19, 1995 Memorial Auditorium.. Burlington, IW Sass Jordan
Jan. 20, 1995 Memorial Hall . Kansas City, Kansas Sass Jordan
Jan. 22, 1995 Veterans Memorial. Columbus, OH Sass Jordan
Jan. 25, 1995 Wings Stadium. Kalamazoo, MI Sass Jordan
Jan. 27, 1995 Shea's Performing Arts Center. Buffalo NY Sass Jordan
Jan. 28, 1995 Rochester Auditorium Center, Rochester, NY Sass Jordan
Feb. 2, 1995 Washington, DC Sass Jordan
Feb. 13, 1995 State Theater, New Brunswick, NJ.
Mar. 10, 1995 Abraham Chavez Theater. El Paso, TX Bone Pony
Mar. 11, 1995 Mesa Amphitheater. Mesa, AZ
Mar. 13, 1995 Bren Events Center. University of California. Irvine, CA Bone Pony
Mar. 14, 1995 Santa Barbara, CA Bone Pony
Mar. 16, 1995 San Francisco, CA
Mar. 18, 1995 Warnors Theater. Fresno, CA
Mar. 22, 1995 San Juan, Puerto Rico

yandtguy wrote:Did you watch the interview segment on the website? The band performed with no sleep. Neal explained that. I don't think he sounded bad at all considering. He's not 25. Those of you who want your singers to sound live like they did in their 20's are going to be continually disappointed, unless you start listening to younger bands. A lot of you know the world these guys live in...the cigarette smoke, the alcohol, the crappy food, the lack of time or facilities for exercise. It all leads to deteriorating vocals. If you want an example of a guy Arnel's age whose voice is going, check out Ray Alder of Fates Warning. The guy had a beautiful tenor voice in the late 80' through the mid 90's, but it's merely a shadow of what it once was thanks to his constant smoking and all the touring he's done in the past 20 years. We're lucky Arnel hasn't had much touring experience, and he lives a healthy lifestyle, but his voice will eventually go the way of every other tenor eventually with the touring that Journey does.

Arnel doesn't smoke either, but I wonder if Neal still does. I think Neal, Ross and Deen smoke and JC and AP don't. Is that right?

steveo777 wrote:

yandtguy wrote:Did you watch the interview segment on the website? The band performed with no sleep. Neal explained that. I don't think he sounded bad at all considering. He's not 25. Those of you who want your singers to sound live like they did in their 20's are going to be continually disappointed, unless you start listening to younger bands. A lot of you know the world these guys live in...the cigarette smoke, the alcohol, the crappy food, the lack of time or facilities for exercise. It all leads to deteriorating vocals. If you want an example of a guy Arnel's age whose voice is going, check out Ray Alder of Fates Warning. The guy had a beautiful tenor voice in the late 80' through the mid 90's, but it's merely a shadow of what it once was thanks to his constant smoking and all the touring he's done in the past 20 years. We're lucky Arnel hasn't had much touring experience, and he lives a healthy lifestyle, but his voice will eventually go the way of every other tenor eventually with the touring that Journey does.

Arnel doesn't smoke either, but I wonder if Neal still does. I think Neal, Ross and Deen smoke and JC and AP don't. Is that right?

Spent hours with these guys and never saw any of them smoke.

Meanwhile -- this is why Michael Jackson is no longer with us. Someone tells you -- you have to do x number of shows... you don't have a choice... and you agree......

Seven Wishes wrote:One more piece of shit like "Eclipse" and I won't be buying any more Journey albums.

Eclipse rules.

I guess what I was simply getting at is I think they'd be better off going overboard with "protecting" Arnel than abusing him too much.

Tito wrote:NEAL

It's Niel or something until they produce another album worthy of the Journey name.

steveo777 wrote:

yandtguy wrote:Did you watch the interview segment on the website? The band performed with no sleep. Neal explained that. I don't think he sounded bad at all considering. He's not 25. Those of you who want your singers to sound live like they did in their 20's are going to be continually disappointed, unless you start listening to younger bands. A lot of you know the world these guys live in...the cigarette smoke, the alcohol, the crappy food, the lack of time or facilities for exercise. It all leads to deteriorating vocals. If you want an example of a guy Arnel's age whose voice is going, check out Ray Alder of Fates Warning. The guy had a beautiful tenor voice in the late 80' through the mid 90's, but it's merely a shadow of what it once was thanks to his constant smoking and all the touring he's done in the past 20 years. We're lucky Arnel hasn't had much touring experience, and he lives a healthy lifestyle, but his voice will eventually go the way of every other tenor eventually with the touring that Journey does.

Arnel doesn't smoke either, but I wonder if Neal still does. I think Neal, Ross and Deen smoke and JC and AP don't. Is that right?

Ross smokes? Get the fuck outta here!