MR

I know this has been mentioned before, but it bears repeating and further consideration:

Fire Ross and replace him with Jack Blades.

You instantly get the 3rd writer many of us have been looking for with the last couple of releases. You get a guy who can (presumably) play bass on the ALBUMS (Neal has been playing them..lame). And you instantly get a HUGE shot in the arm for the stage show. Jack is a consummate showman, but he also knows how to play sideman and let Arnel make the frontman moves. Finally, you get a legitimate 3rd backing vocalist who can help contribute to LIVE backing vocals (we all know NR's harmonies are no slouch).

Ross does little to nothing nowadays and I'll assume he's got plenty of money by this point. So why not try it?

I'm not much of an Arnel guy and I'm certainly no fan of these anemic 3-band bill setlists, but this could be a positive step in the right direction because things are getting stale quick with these guys.

Ehwmatt wrote:I know this has been mentioned before, but it bears repeating and further consideration:

Fire Ross and replace him with Jack Blades.

You instantly get the 3rd writer many of us have been looking for with the last couple of releases. You get a guy who can (presumably) play bass on the ALBUMS (Neal has been playing them..lame). And you instantly get a HUGE shot in the arm for the stage show. Jack is a consummate showman, but he also knows how to play sideman and let Arnel make the frontman moves. Finally, you get a legitimate 3rd backing vocalist who can help contribute to LIVE backing vocals (we all know NR's harmonies are no slouch).

Ross does little to nothing nowadays and I'll assume he's got plenty of money by this point. So why not try it?

I'm not much of an Arnel guy and I'm certainly no fan of these anemic 3-band bill setlists, but this could be a positive step in the right direction because things are getting stale quick with these guys.

Many of us have been hoping for this since Arrival....

I've been listening to Jack's solo album, Rock And Roll Ride the last few days. Blades might be too much of a rocker for these guys. I think if there is another album, Cain will feel it's his turn to lead in the direction of it and that would be somewhere different from Where Blades might want to go as an artist and writer.

That Ross is a.) a founding member which lends some credibility and b.) probably very passive to the point of being easily controlled artistically makes him appealing for Neal and Jon.

Do you think Jack would leave Night Ranger for Journey?

Gideon wrote:That Ross is a.) a founding member which lends some credibility and b.) probably very passive to the point of being easily controlled artistically makes him appealing for Neal and Jon.

Do you think Jack would leave Night Ranger for Journey?

Nobody cares about Ross being there. Hell, I'd argue most don't care if Schon or Cain are there, either. People either get appalled that Perry isn't there or don't mind and go to the shows anyway.

As far as Jack leaving NR, I don't think he'd have to leave Night Ranger. As far as I know, Night Ranger wasn't exactly touring up a storm the last several years. I'm sure he could do both, just as all the guys in Chickenfoot (for example) do both. Hell, he could even pull double duty on a double billed tour if they wanted to tour at the same time.

And I'm going to guess that the money would be pretty good playing with Journey, too.

Gideon wrote:That Ross is a.) a founding member which lends some credibility and b.) probably very passive to the point of being easily controlled artistically makes him appealing for Neal and Jon.

Do you think Jack would leave Night Ranger for Journey?

Which is why you will never see Jack Blades in Journey.

Jack Blades would go the route of Jeff Scott Soto if he joined Journey. Neal and Jonathan like having almost full creative power.

At this point creatively, Night Ranger > Journey. Not even close.

Jack writes good with just about anybody!

as its been said before , VALORY brings credibility.....and without STEVE PERRY they NEED credibility !.......

Would love to see Schon write with Blades again. That collaboration resulted in Arrival's best tracks. Was it at Kalodner's urging that the guys seek outside help? I wouldn't change the band lineup at this point.

BARON BLOOD wrote:as its been said before , VALORY brings credibility.....and without STEVE PERRY they NEED credibility !.......

No, no he doesn't. Few bass players "add credibility" to their respective bands (at least for their bass playing/status as an original or pivotal member in the band and not counting possible bassist+vocalists), and Ross ain't one of 'em:

1. Paul McCartney
2. Flea
3. John Myung
4. Geddy Lee
5. John Entwistle
6. (MAYBE) Roger Waters (as status)

I can't think of a single 80s AOR band whose bass player's absence would be noticed by even more-than-casual fans.

I also think, with the exception of a few clunkers on "Generations", the band's post-Perry musical output has been beyond decent. Way better and more prolific than most dinosaur rock acts. A key ingredient is missing w/out Perry, but the guys haven't completely lost it either. Soto, more than Blades, probably could've lit a renewed creative fire under their ass. What Blades brought to the table on "Arrival", and what is so sorely missing on "Eclipse", are those big fist-pumping arena hooks (ex. Higher Place, World Gone Wild, Never Too Late, I Got a Reason, Remember Me etc). Still, lots of great material on "Eclipse". Gotta remember, before Cain, not every album was centered around the hook. For those with an appreciation for the earlier albums, the leisurely-paced "She's a Mystery" should be right up their alley. Not sure who "City of Hope" appeals to. That song's just retarded.

They would have to convince Valory to retire/bow out on his own. At least publicly. At this point, however, how much new music do you really expect Journey to put out? One cd, two tops, I would say. Blades may improve new music to more your taste, but in the big picture, it really would not increase sales of new Journey music. Without promotion and getting the new music out there and played in regular rotation on the radio/TV, big sales numbers are just not going to happen for this band.

Journey lost all credibilty when they fired JSS,
after tape gate he would have been a great addition,
He can sing Steves classics, and has his own sound, he can write and has great stage presence.

Arnel is a good guy, but not right for Journey. Neal figured he would bring them some media coverage and he did.
But really he is just a really good Karaoke singer.

The only thing that will some of it back, is them doing a few show with Steve, and retire.
But I know Steve wants nothing to do with this Circus.

Well, having seen them with Perry, I can't say that a reunion would bring them back very far beyond where they are now anyways.
Stadium shows? Multi-platinum records? The record sales won't happen as everyone is struggling with that and the stadium shows are only working for a select few bands now days. I don't see Journey pulling that off when they are playing the same venues this year that their opening acts could have played by themselves a few years ago. Journey defied the odds in the 80s, largely because Sony made sure they were one of the first artists to get heavy exposure on MTV.
While the publicity around Arnel has helped tremendously, it's not the same type of catalyst that Music Television was back in its infancy.

Gotta disagree with ya Matt....it all comes down to songwriting, nothing more, nothing less....

Ross is exactly where he needs to be. I'm not sure credibility is the reason....but there isn't a chance in hell of replacing him with blades, without a) interrupting the power monopoly nick schlong has b)integrally changing the rhythm sound of the band (like it or not, Ross *does* bring something to the table there) c) creating the potential for more personnel upheaval with jacks very predictable ouster as soon as he challenges aforementioned power monopoly in point a

They either need to lie in the bed they made with arnel or reunite with perry....or quit!

Seeing as they've invested long and hard into presenting arnel to the world as some sob story manila homeless guy that won the lottery by getting the call from schlong....I think what sympathy/empathy they garner (from vacant idiots who would fall for such bs) would instantly turn to contempt the very microsecond they jettison the kid back to the streets of Manila.

That would force a return to perry as the only remaining option, after jettisoning arnel....and we all know perry has zero interest in going back to work to put food on nick schlong's ex-wives tables.....

So in the end, They're stuck with arnel....there really isn't any other option....since Arnels diction issues have all been worked our between Regurgitation and Eclipse.....that leaves songwriting, which was horridly absent on Eclipse...I suspect if Schlong concentrated on that instead of emailing pics of his junk to the ex's of his ex's (future or not) it'd work itself out....

But in the end' the only bridge left is better songwriting...every other bridge has been burned....

If they write good songs again, they can release an admirable final album or two....or just quit. Either works for me.....

strangegrey wrote:Gotta disagree with ya Matt....it all comes down to songwriting, nothing more, nothing less....

Ross is exactly where he needs to be. I'm not sure credibility is the reason....but there isn't a chance in hell of replacing him with blades, without a) interrupting the power monopoly nick schlong has b)integrally changing the rhythm sound of the band (like it or not, Ross *does* bring something to the table there) c) creating the potential for more personnel upheaval with jacks very predictable ouster as soon as he challenges aforementioned power monopoly in point a

They either need to lie in the bed they made with arnel or reunite with perry....or quit!

Seeing as they've invested long and hard into presenting arnel to the world as some sob story manila homeless guy that won the lottery by getting the call from schlong....I think what sympathy/empathy they garner (from vacant idiots who would fall for such bs) would instantly turn to contempt the very microsecond they jettison the kid back to the streets of Manila.

That would force a return to perry as the only remaining option, after jettisoning arnel....and we all know perry has zero interest in going back to work to put food on nick schlong's ex-wives tables.....

So in the end, They're stuck with arnel....there really isn't any other option....since Arnels diction issues have all been worked our between Regurgitation and Eclipse.....that leaves songwriting, which was horridly absent on Eclipse...I suspect if Schlong concentrated on that instead of emailing pics of his junk to the ex's of his ex's (future or not) it'd work itself out....

But in the end' the only bridge left is better songwriting...every other bridge has been burned....

If they write good songs again, they can release an admirable final album or two....or just quit. Either works for me.....

But Frank... wouldn't Blades help in the songwriting department? See Higher Place.

Yes, but he can help in the songwriting dept without replacing ross.....

Ross does what he's told. Jack might not....then jack gets fired, we get all upset,I start posting pictures of nick schlong in napoleon outfits, and schlong starts sending pictures of his disgusting cock to blades, it's a fucking mess none of us need, including nick schlong himself.

My laundry list:

-Keep Schlong away from reality show whores.
-No more videos like Resonate
-No more appearances on Ellen, Oprah or anything like that
-Stop with the "rags to riches" story with Arnel. Cain wanted to do the same angle with Jeremey
-Play theaters on their own so deeper cuts can be performed and not the same old shit
-For once use a real stage show - something Journey has always lacked in

strangegrey wrote:Yes, but he can help in the songwriting dept without replacing ross.....

Ross does what he's told. Jack might not....then jack gets fired, we get all upset,I start posting pictures of nick schlong in napoleon outfits, and schlong starts sending pictures of his disgusting cock to blades, it's a fucking mess none of us need, including nick schlong himself.

Shit...way to project! Nice road map.

Why didn't they try the rags to riches story with SA back in the late 90s?

AR wrote:My laundry list:

-Keep Schlong away from reality show whores.
-No more videos like Resonate
-No more appearances on Ellen, Oprah or anything like that
-Stop with the "rags to riches" story with Arnel. Cain wanted to do the same angle with Jeremey
-Play theaters on their own so deeper cuts can be performed and not the same old shit
-For once use a real stage show - something Journey has always lacked in

Navarro wrote:Why didn't they try the rags to riches story with SA back in the late 90s?

They did. See the VH1 BTM. The whole "went from being a GAP janitor to performing in front of thousands" got old quickly.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Navarro wrote:Why didn't they try the rags to riches story with SA back in the late 90s?

They did. See the VH1 BTM. The whole "went from being a GAP janitor to performing in front of thousands" got old quickly.

Ya, I'd imagine the "success" of the Arnel story comes much more from his unusual heritage (for a rock star), just like Jeremey Lin in the NBA this year. You just don't see Asians excelling in the NBA and in rock music every day, so that substantially ups the novelty factor.

This thread is utter foolishness. I had no idea Ross hasn't been playing bass on the albums, but I have it on very good authority that Bruce Kulick has been handling all the 6-strings...

Rip Rokken wrote:This thread is utter foolishness. I had no idea Ross hasn't been playing bass on the albums, but I have it on very good authority that Bruce Kulick has been handling all the 6-strings...

Why? What is Ross contributing, a squirt toy on his mic stand? This band clearly needs a shot in the arm based on that haggard ass tour last year.

Ehwmatt wrote:I know this has been mentioned before, but it bears repeating and further consideration:

Fire Ross and replace him with Jack Blades.

You instantly get the 3rd writer many of us have been looking for with the last couple of releases. You get a guy who can (presumably) play bass on the ALBUMS (Neal has been playing them..lame). And you instantly get a HUGE shot in the arm for the stage show. Jack is a consummate showman, but he also knows how to play sideman and let Arnel make the frontman moves. Finally, you get a legitimate 3rd backing vocalist who can help contribute to LIVE backing vocals (we all know NR's harmonies are no slouch).

My name is YoungJRNY, and I approve this message.

Ehwmatt wrote:This band clearly needs a shot in the arm based on that haggard ass tour last year.

The energy was dismal. Arnel tried to get the audience involved. The rest of the band seemed downright pissed off.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Ehwmatt wrote:This band clearly needs a shot in the arm based on that haggard ass tour last year.

The energy was dismal. Arnel tried to get the audience involved. The rest of the band seemed downright pissed off.

It was one of the saddest concerts I've ever been at. I've seen worse performances (though not many), but between that and the fact that this was once one of my favorite bands... just sad.

That being said, vocally, Arnel impressed the shit out of me. Just a huge set of lungs.