MR

Cirque de Soleil, country and legacy acts dominate the list.

How to train your dragon outsold Journey?

Wow, all the shit talk about how bad the Madonna shows were (and I am not disputing the critics) but she was No. 1...good thing that won't go to her head...

Happy to see Scorpions on the list. I still feel that they co-headlining with Journey could have been a top ten touring package in 2011.

This list if wrong. Journey out grossed several of those acts. I can't find proof yet, but I did read higher numbers than many of those on the list.

From Billboard:

Billboards Top 40 Money Makers of 2012
http://www.billboard.com/news/top-40-mo ... ory?page=4
Rank: 12
Journey: $12,313,822

Through the revival of 1981 anthem "Don't Stop Believin'" on "Glee" and "Big Brother," combined with the arrival of vocalist Arnel Pineda, 2011 proved another stellar year as Journey toured Latin and South America and played 50 shows in the United States. The latter concerts represented a step up in venue size to include arenas and the Hollywood Bowl along with the traditional amphitheaters, fairgrounds and casinos. Touring in support of Eclipse, the band netted $9.9 million from domestic dates while continuing to be a significant player at retail with sales of 703,000 physical albums. Recognizing the group's longevity on the concert stage, band founder Neal Schon and longtime members Jonathan Cain, Ross Valory and Deen Castronovo were honored with the Legend of Live Award at the Billboard Touring Awards in November.

Journey: $12,313,822

Journey didn't out gross any of the acts in the Pollstar list..

steveo777 wrote:This list if wrong. Journey out grossed several of those acts. I can't find proof yet, but I did read higher numbers than many of those on the list.

Here is Billboard's list. Journey MIA here also.

http://www.billboard.com/#/news/top-25- ... 1082.story

People may have gotten fooled when they saw Journey in the top 10 on Billboard's hot tours at various times this past summer. What you have to remember is that is only a snapshot of select periods of the year in general and only ranks based on who is actually touring that particular week or month.

Journey was playing a lot of venues that they hit back in 2009 with only one opening act but now in 2012 they were carrying two, even with some of the dates playing places with only 10,000 seats. That didn't bode well for a start.
Obviously if you tour continuously without letup, your returns will start to diminish, especially if you aren't offering anything different from the last concert season.

Don wrote:

steveo777 wrote:This list if wrong. Journey out grossed several of those acts. I can't find proof yet, but I did read higher numbers than many of those on the list.

Here is Billboard's list. Journey MIA here also.

http://www.billboard.com/#/news/top-25- ... 1082.story

People may have gotten fooled when they saw Journey in the top 10 on Billboard's hot tours at various times this past summer. What you have to remember is that is only a snapshot of select periods of the year in general and only ranks based on who is actually touring that particular week or month.

Journey was playing a lot of venues that they hit back in 2009 with only one opening act but now in 2012 they were carrying two, even with some of the dates playing places with only 10,000 seats. That didn't bode well for a start.
Obviously if you tour continuously without letup, your returns will start to diminish, especially if you aren't offering anything different from the last concert season.

OK, guys. Maybe I was thinking of another year. Sure seems like they were busy, but didn't make all that much money then. Neal spent his paycheck on a ring.

slucero wrote:From Billboard:

Billboards Top 40 Money Makers of 2012
http://www.billboard.com/news/top-40-mo ... ory?page=4
Rank: 12
Journey: $12,313,822

Through the revival of 1981 anthem "Don't Stop Believin'" on "Glee" and "Big Brother," combined with the arrival of vocalist Arnel Pineda, 2011 proved another stellar year as Journey toured Latin and South America and played 50 shows in the United States. The latter concerts represented a step up in venue size to include arenas and the Hollywood Bowl along with the traditional amphitheaters, fairgrounds and casinos. Touring in support of Eclipse, the band netted $9.9 million from domestic dates while continuing to be a significant player at retail with sales of 703,000 physical albums. Recognizing the group's longevity on the concert stage, band founder Neal Schon and longtime members Jonathan Cain, Ross Valory and Deen Castronovo were honored with the Legend of Live Award at the Billboard Touring Awards in November.

Journey: $12,313,822

Journey didn't out gross any of the acts in the Pollstar list..

That article was from March 2012 and was tallying numbers from 2011. The telling part being the 700k albums sold. After a great 3 year run on the Billboard 200, Journey's Greatest Hits has finally departed that chart in the last quarter of 2012.

Don wrote:

slucero wrote:From Billboard:

Billboards Top 40 Money Makers of 2012
http://www.billboard.com/news/top-40-mo ... ory?page=4
Rank: 12
Journey: $12,313,822

Through the revival of 1981 anthem "Don't Stop Believin'" on "Glee" and "Big Brother," combined with the arrival of vocalist Arnel Pineda, 2011 proved another stellar year as Journey toured Latin and South America and played 50 shows in the United States. The latter concerts represented a step up in venue size to include arenas and the Hollywood Bowl along with the traditional amphitheaters, fairgrounds and casinos. Touring in support of Eclipse, the band netted $9.9 million from domestic dates while continuing to be a significant player at retail with sales of 703,000 physical albums. Recognizing the group's longevity on the concert stage, band founder Neal Schon and longtime members Jonathan Cain, Ross Valory and Deen Castronovo were honored with the Legend of Live Award at the Billboard Touring Awards in November.

Journey: $12,313,822

Journey didn't out gross any of the acts in the Pollstar list..

That article was from March 2012 and was tallying numbers from 2011. The telling part being the 700k albums sold. After a great 3 year run on the Billboard 200, Journey's Greatest Hits has finally departed that chart in the last quarter of 2012.

My bad.

scarab wrote:How to train your dragon outsold Journey?

That show rocked!

What is this list?

http://music.yahoo.com/news/top-20-conc ... 45584.html

TOP 20 CONCERT TOURS

1. (1) Barbra Streisand; $4,065,743; $263.52.

2. (2) Madonna; $3,950,309; $172.03.

3. (3) Bruce Springsteen & The E Street Band; $1,362,627; $93.95.

4. (4) Justin Bieber; $1,217,217; $75.72.

5. (New) Neil Young & Crazy Horse; $855,928; $91.59.

6. (6) The Who; $845,015; $85.86.

7. (5) Rush; $822,004; $82.09.

8. (8) Leonard Cohen; $804,309; $100.16.

9. (7) Peter Gabriel; $729,147; $96.03.

10. (9) Red Hot Chili Peppers; $715,544; $57.10.

11. (11) Zac Brown Band; $662,842; $48.23.

12. (13) Trans-Siberian Orchestra; $547,517; $51.54.

13. (14) Journey; $530,582; $71.90.

14. (15) Carrie Underwood; $529,297; $58.84.

15. (17) Bob Dylan; $457,533; $78.73.

16. (19) Eric Church; $319,402; $40.43.

17. (New) Jeff Dunham; $250,250; $58.49.

18. (New) Wiz Khalifa; $152,511; $41.00.

19. (New) Tobymac; $146,499; $29.91.

20. (New) Metric; $144,604; $40.78.

steveo777 wrote:What is this list?

http://music.yahoo.com/news/top-20-conc ... 45584.html

TOP 20 CONCERT TOURS

1. (1) Barbra Streisand; $4,065,743; $263.52.

2. (2) Madonna; $3,950,309; $172.03.

3. (3) Bruce Springsteen & The E Street Band; $1,362,627; $93.95.

4. (4) Justin Bieber; $1,217,217; $75.72.

5. (New) Neil Young & Crazy Horse; $855,928; $91.59.

6. (6) The Who; $845,015; $85.86.

7. (5) Rush; $822,004; $82.09.

8. (8) Leonard Cohen; $804,309; $100.16.

9. (7) Peter Gabriel; $729,147; $96.03.

10. (9) Red Hot Chili Peppers; $715,544; $57.10.

11. (11) Zac Brown Band; $662,842; $48.23.

12. (13) Trans-Siberian Orchestra; $547,517; $51.54.

13. (14) Journey; $530,582; $71.90.

14. (15) Carrie Underwood; $529,297; $58.84.

15. (17) Bob Dylan; $457,533; $78.73.

16. (19) Eric Church; $319,402; $40.43.

17. (New) Jeff Dunham; $250,250; $58.49.

18. (New) Wiz Khalifa; $152,511; $41.00.

19. (New) Tobymac; $146,499; $29.91.

20. (New) Metric; $144,604; $40.78.

It's Pollstar's snapshot list. It shows who is performing during a week or month and how much they have made over that particular period. As you can see, Journey made 500k during that week. If Journey made that amount every week for five months of their tour, that would be what, 13 million dollars?

Don wrote:

steveo777 wrote:What is this list?

http://music.yahoo.com/news/top-20-conc ... 45584.html

TOP 20 CONCERT TOURS

1. (1) Barbra Streisand; $4,065,743; $263.52.

2. (2) Madonna; $3,950,309; $172.03.

3. (3) Bruce Springsteen & The E Street Band; $1,362,627; $93.95.

4. (4) Justin Bieber; $1,217,217; $75.72.

5. (New) Neil Young & Crazy Horse; $855,928; $91.59.

6. (6) The Who; $845,015; $85.86.

7. (5) Rush; $822,004; $82.09.

8. (8) Leonard Cohen; $804,309; $100.16.

9. (7) Peter Gabriel; $729,147; $96.03.

10. (9) Red Hot Chili Peppers; $715,544; $57.10.

11. (11) Zac Brown Band; $662,842; $48.23.

12. (13) Trans-Siberian Orchestra; $547,517; $51.54.

13. (14) Journey; $530,582; $71.90.

14. (15) Carrie Underwood; $529,297; $58.84.

15. (17) Bob Dylan; $457,533; $78.73.

16. (19) Eric Church; $319,402; $40.43.

17. (New) Jeff Dunham; $250,250; $58.49.

18. (New) Wiz Khalifa; $152,511; $41.00.

19. (New) Tobymac; $146,499; $29.91.

20. (New) Metric; $144,604; $40.78.

It's Pollstar's snapshot list. It shows who is performing during a week or month and how much they have made over that particular period. As you can see, Journey made 500k during that week. If Journey made that amount every week for five months of their tour, that would be what, 13 million dollars?

They filled The Gorge last summer and it holds 23k. I heard the actual number was somewhere around 21k. I was there and it was full. It took over an hour to get out of the parking lot.

steveo777 wrote:

Don wrote:It's Pollstar's snapshot list. It shows who is performing during a week or month and how much they have made over that particular period. As you can see, Journey made 500k during that week. If Journey made that amount every week for five months of their tour, that would be what, 13 million dollars?

They filled The Gorge last summer and it holds 23k. I heard the actual number was somewhere around 21k. I was there and it was full. It took over an hour to get out of the parking lot.

They also played the Lyric Opera House (capacity 2,900), Ted Constant Convocation Center (10k), Oak Mountain Amphitheater {10k), at least six casino dates {less than 10k each in seats) and you have quite a few dates that should have been one or two band shows due to their size. Add in 8 state fair dates {which don't pay anything at all near what regular venues do) and you use that to offset what Journey did at the two dozen other dates in the bigger venues and you can easily see why they finished up where they did in the rankings.

Pollstar will be releasing their Top 200 North American tours list in a couple days. We'll have a better idea on how Journey fared after seeing that. My rough math shows them pulling in at least 12 million between July and beginning of December. but to think they were out there just selling out everywhere is not logical.
They only sold out 17 of 71 shows in 2011 and that was in support of a new album. This 2nd part of the Eclipse tour totally abandoned that release after the first few shows.

If I recall correctly, they ended up ranked #56 for the 2009 tour so this shouldn't be totally unexpected considering they lost a week of shows too (because of Arnel's sickness).

How does Van Halen make this or any list when they played like 10 shows?

FamilyMan wrote:How does Van Halen make this or any list when they played like 10 shows?

Van Halen played 50 shows before they canceled the remaining dates.

They also didn't play the dozen or so 10k seats or less venues Journey did.

Don wrote:

FamilyMan wrote:How does Van Halen make this or any list when they played like 10 shows?

Van Halen played 50 shows before they canceled the remaining dates.

They also didn't play the dozen or so 10k seats or less venues Journey did.

Journey played right at about 50 shows as well, but like you said... smaller venues.

Rick wrote:

Don wrote:

FamilyMan wrote:How does Van Halen make this or any list when they played like 10 shows?

Van Halen played 50 shows before they canceled the remaining dates.

They also didn't play the dozen or so 10k seats or less venues Journey did.

Journey played right at about 50 shows as well, but like you said... smaller venues.

Journey really should have only had one opener this year considering the size of some of those venues.
They could have had longer setlists too (VH averaged 22 songs a night) though I'm not sure if they could have managed it with Pineda's vocal problems. Deen and Jon can only help so much.

For North America only tours, Journey came in at #36 with 25.8 million

Journey is just below McCartney and above Kiss. Not a bad showing, IMO.

steveo777 wrote:Journey is just below McCartney and above Kiss. Not a bad showing, IMO.

In McCartney's case, he made half of his money overseas thus the $56 million total on the overall world list in the first post.

Journey avg 469k a show, Kiss 465k so not bad there.

57 shows even with the cancellations for Journey. The lost dates will be made up in Feb so very short downtime for the gang.

Journey has 28 shows scheduled before June this year so they may be going for 80 overall this time out. If there are South American dates thrown in, possibly 90.

Don wrote:

steveo777 wrote:Journey is just below McCartney and above Kiss. Not a bad showing, IMO.

In McCartney's case, he made half of his money overseas thus the $56 million total on the overall world list in the first post.

Journey avg 469k a show, Kiss 465k so not bad there.

57 shows even with the cancellations for Journey. The lost dates will be made up in Feb so very short downtime for the gang.

Journey has 28 shows scheduled before June this year so they may be going for 80 overall this time out. If there are South American dates thrown in, possibly 90.

80+ shows? I wonder what the Vegas odds are on Pineda's voice surviving that heavy of a schedule.

slucero wrote:

Don wrote:

steveo777 wrote:Journey is just below McCartney and above Kiss. Not a bad showing, IMO.

In McCartney's case, he made half of his money overseas thus the $56 million total on the overall world list in the first post.

Journey avg 469k a show, Kiss 465k so not bad there.

57 shows even with the cancellations for Journey. The lost dates will be made up in Feb so very short downtime for the gang.

Journey has 28 shows scheduled before June this year so they may be going for 80 overall this time out. If there are South American dates thrown in, possibly 90.

80+ shows? I wonder what the Vegas odds are on Pineda's voice surviving that heavy of a schedule.

Maybe he got a tune up, ala, Lance Armstrong.

Not bad at all for small venue sizes. I think though they should drop the 3 package deal and just do one special guest or one opening act.

steveo777 wrote:

Don wrote:

steveo777 wrote:What is this list?

http://music.yahoo.com/news/top-20-conc ... 45584.html

TOP 20 CONCERT TOURS

1. (1) Barbra Streisand; $4,065,743; $263.52.

2. (2) Madonna; $3,950,309; $172.03.

3. (3) Bruce Springsteen & The E Street Band; $1,362,627; $93.95.

4. (4) Justin Bieber; $1,217,217; $75.72.

5. (New) Neil Young & Crazy Horse; $855,928; $91.59.

6. (6) The Who; $845,015; $85.86.

7. (5) Rush; $822,004; $82.09.

8. (8) Leonard Cohen; $804,309; $100.16.

9. (7) Peter Gabriel; $729,147; $96.03.

10. (9) Red Hot Chili Peppers; $715,544; $57.10.

11. (11) Zac Brown Band; $662,842; $48.23.

12. (13) Trans-Siberian Orchestra; $547,517; $51.54.

13. (14) Journey; $530,582; $71.90.

14. (15) Carrie Underwood; $529,297; $58.84.

15. (17) Bob Dylan; $457,533; $78.73.

16. (19) Eric Church; $319,402; $40.43.

17. (New) Jeff Dunham; $250,250; $58.49.

18. (New) Wiz Khalifa; $152,511; $41.00.

19. (New) Tobymac; $146,499; $29.91.

20. (New) Metric; $144,604; $40.78.

It's Pollstar's snapshot list. It shows who is performing during a week or month and how much they have made over that particular period. As you can see, Journey made 500k during that week. If Journey made that amount every week for five months of their tour, that would be what, 13 million dollars?

They filled The Gorge last summer and it holds 23k. I heard the actual number was somewhere around 21k. I was there and it was full. It took over an hour to get out of the parking lot.

Not quite, if this is "The Gorge" of which you speak.


27 Journey, Pat Benatar, Loverboy The Gorge
George, Wash.
July 28, 2012
$663,694
10,618 /
11,816
1 /
0
$131, $31
Live Nation

Kor'n wrote:

steveo777 wrote:
They filled The Gorge last summer and it holds 23k. I heard the actual number was somewhere around 21k. I was there and it was full. It took over an hour to get out of the parking lot.

Not quite, if this is "The Gorge" of which you speak.


27 Journey, Pat Benatar, Loverboy The Gorge
George, Wash.
July 28, 2012
$663,694
10,618 /
11,816
1 /
0
$131, $31
Live Nation

Maybe this is an example of that "Journey" math that we have heard about?

Don wrote:

Kor'n wrote:

steveo777 wrote:
They filled The Gorge last summer and it holds 23k. I heard the actual number was somewhere around 21k. I was there and it was full. It took over an hour to get out of the parking lot.

Not quite, if this is "The Gorge" of which you speak.


27 Journey, Pat Benatar, Loverboy The Gorge
George, Wash.
July 28, 2012
$663,694
10,618 /
11,816
1 /
0
$131, $31
Live Nation

Maybe this is an example of that "Journey" math that we have heard about?

The figure was given to me by someone with supposed knowlege. Just multiply everything x 2 and you get that "Journey math".