MR

I was listening to Augeri's latest album and although he is more restricted these days, in terms of range, I still found it refreshing to hear that old familiar voice singing melodic rock without an accent.

Arnel too has a voice of his own, and although I don't think he's as good as Perry was in his prime (who is?), I can appreciate his qualities. What I find hard to swallow is his accent, getting in the way of the delivery of the lyrics. Lyrics which are quite cliche filled to begin with ever since Cain took over duties.

Arnel's accent makes it sound like he's singering gibberish most of the time and for me, it makes the band sound diluted and shallow. Especially since Perry was the king of conveying lyrics. For this reason alone, it's hard for me to rate the Arnel era albums as proper Journey albums.

It would have been fine if he was still singing Journey in a Manila nightclub but not when he's fronting the supposed real thing.

Sometimes I agree, but when I hear him sing songs like Tantra I think he’s very emotive

In fact, I’m not even going to blame Arnel, the lyrics on Freedom just aren’t good enough. His best delivery is on Eclipse which also happens to have the best lyrics overall out of the 3 albums

Regarding Augeri....on some tracks (ex. the Cain co-write Never Far From Home), he sounds as good as ever. On others, he has that falsetto Mickey Mouse quality he uses in live shows. However, I think the album is great and I've been playing it often. Vocally, he is a master of emotive delivery and phrasing. A lot of soul too. As I've said before, he was never really a Perry clone like Hugo.

As for Arnel.....I don't have any issues really. On the Shirley-produced cds (Revelation Disc 1 and Eclipse), I don't hear a accent. I think they worked very hard on that. I don't hear it on Freedom either. I know Walden produced his vox. Some Freedom songs I can't make out the lyrics simply because the production is rough!

Also, sometimes I couldn't make out what Perry was saying either!

I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C. The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.

https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0

Even that one section of You Got The Best of Me switches to way someone not familiar w English would speak.

" You Got Best of Me". Huh ??! What ? It is annoying .

JohnH wrote:Even that one section of You Got The Best of Me switches to way someone not familiar w English would speak.

" You Got Best of Me". Huh ??! What ? It is annoying .

Honestly, I thought that was an intentional choice. Almost like he is scatting the lyrics.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C.
The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.
https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0

+1 !

later~

I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C. The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.

https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0[/quote]

Couldn't agree more!!

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Regarding Augeri....on some tracks (ex. the Cain co-write Never Far From Home), he sounds as good as ever. On others, he has that falsetto Mickey Mouse quality he uses in live shows. However, I think the album is great and I've been playing it often. Vocally, he is a master of emotive delivery and phrasing. A lot of soul too. As I've said before, he was never really a Perry clone like Hugo.

As for Arnel.....I don't have any issues really. On the Shirley-produced cds (Revelation Disc 1 and Eclipse), I don't hear a accent. I think they worked very hard on that. I don't hear it on Freedom either. I know Walden produced his vox. Some Freedom songs I can't make out the lyrics simply because the production is rough!

Also, sometimes I couldn't make out what Perry was saying either!

I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C. The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.

https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0

I have this on VHS somewhere. I bought it from an ad in Goldmine shortly after they performed it. Brilliant concert and it shows what Journey could have been, and why I really wanted the KC version of Journey to happen. But, in the end, I'm glad it didn't. Kevin would probably disagree...but I doubt the experience would have been as good as people think. He gave us some great music with the two Storm albums, and the Two Fires albums, "Running With the Wind". and the Journey covers album. I think he was the right choice in 1995...but not 1998 to replace Perry after TBF.

The thing that I'm the pickiest about of all when I listen to a band is the singer. If I don't like the singing I pretty much can't listen to the band.

I love Arnel's singing and think that the claims of an accent problem with his singing is massively exaggerated.

It would have made the most sense if Kevin Chalfant had been the new singer in Journey back in 1995. He would have been the best singer that they could have gotten for Journey at that time.

But the odds are that Chalfant would have destroyed his singing voice years ago if he had joined Journey.

The biggest gripe I’ve had since Arnel joined the band is that he seems like he over sings on the songs. Seems like he goes for the higher notes instead of settling in on a more soulful lower octave. This part of the Journey vocals is something I’ve missed since Augeri left the band. Steve’s vocals weren’t as strong as Perry’s or Arnel’s, but he had a soulful voice and didn’t overdo the high parts. Just my opinion. I haven’t noticed the accent much (haven’t seen them live since Augeri was there.)

Are we really having this same tired discussion again for the millionth time? At this point, complaining about Arnel's accent is just an bad as the crazy loons saying it's not Journey without Perry.

ebake02 wrote:Are we really having this same tired discussion again for the millionth time? At this point, complaining about Arnel's accent is just an bad as the crazy loons saying it's not Journey without Perry.

"It's not Journey without Steve Perry" made national news last year.

Last time I saw Journey, you couldn't understand anything Arnel said between songs. Not sure if it was the accent, or the mix. But, it was "just shut up and sing".

Monker wrote:Last time I saw Journey, you couldn't understand anything Arnel said between songs. Not sure if it was the accent, or the mix. But, it was "just shut up and sing".

In my experience, this largely remains the case. That's why I've always said he's a great technical singer for Journey. As far as actual engaging frontmen go, both Augeri and JSS did it way better.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Last time I saw Journey, you couldn't understand anything Arnel said between songs. Not sure if it was the accent, or the mix. But, it was "just shut up and sing".

In my experience, this largely remains the case. That's why I've always said he's a great technical singer for Journey. As far as actual engaging frontmen go, both Augeri and JSS did it way better.

I don’t disagree - but the folks love Arnel. Huge draw.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Regarding Augeri....on some tracks (ex. the Cain co-write Never Far From Home), he sounds as good as ever. On others, he has that falsetto Mickey Mouse quality he uses in live shows. However, I think the album is great and I've been playing it often. Vocally, he is a master of emotive delivery and phrasing. A lot of soul too. As I've said before, he was never really a Perry clone like Hugo.

As for Arnel.....I don't have any issues really. On the Shirley-produced cds (Revelation Disc 1 and Eclipse), I don't hear a accent. I think they worked very hard on that. I don't hear it on Freedom either. I know Walden produced his vox. Some Freedom songs I can't make out the lyrics simply because the production is rough!

Also, sometimes I couldn't make out what Perry was saying either!

I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C. The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.

https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0

After reading Castles Burning several years ago and then listening to Mickey Thomas’ Over the Edge album filled with Arrival cuts - I still say Mickey in ‘84 would have been the best move.

Eric wrote:I don’t disagree - but the folks love Arnel. Huge draw.

Wasn't it John Baruck who said it didn't matter who is singing these songs? Arnel certainly has a higher profile than SA or JSS. His rags-to-riches Cinderella story got alot of traction. Either way, Augeri and JSS are 10x the frontman.

The folks love the songs. Augeri and particularly JSS are both way better frontmen. If only Journey had been bold enough to go with JSS instead. They would have avoided the karaoke route, and possibly found a new direction, similar to what Van Halen did with Hagar.

Arnel doesn't look very natural onstage.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Monker wrote:Last time I saw Journey, you couldn't understand anything Arnel said between songs. Not sure if it was the accent, or the mix. But, it was "just shut up and sing".

In my experience, this largely remains the case. That's why I've always said he's a great technical singer for Journey. As far as actual engaging frontmen go, both Augeri and JSS did it way better.

You raise a good point. In one of their latest videos on YT, and in several other performances I've seen, Arnel spends almost two full songs standing at a angle rocking back and forth with this back to 1/3 of the audience. Accent issues aside, I'm dumbfounded that as long as he's been fronting the band, things like that aren't fixed.

I never saw SA perform with the band, but JSS was probably the most engaging singer I've seen them with. And that included Perry.

Onestepper wrote:

I never saw SA perform with the band, but JSS was probably the most engaging singer I've seen them with. And that included Perry.

Never saw JSS. His run was too brief. Last summer I saw Journey twice in arenas and Augeri once at an outdoor winery. Augeri reminded me how good a Journey front man can be.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Regarding Augeri....on some tracks (ex. the Cain co-write Never Far From Home), he sounds as good as ever. On others, he has that falsetto Mickey Mouse quality he uses in live shows. However, I think the album is great and I've been playing it often. Vocally, he is a master of emotive delivery and phrasing. A lot of soul too. As I've said before, he was never really a Perry clone like Hugo.

As for Arnel.....I don't have any issues really. On the Shirley-produced cds (Revelation Disc 1 and Eclipse), I don't hear a accent. I think they worked very hard on that. I don't hear it on Freedom either. I know Walden produced his vox. Some Freedom songs I can't make out the lyrics simply because the production is rough!

Also, sometimes I couldn't make out what Perry was saying either!

I like both of these guys - SA and AP - but still think the job should have went to Kevin C. The Storm bootlegs have been popping up on YT and it's just killer stuff.

https://youtu.be/osx0WtWevT0

Totally agree with all your comments. With Perry, there are times I have heard the lyrics different that what they. Same with the other two.

AND YES Kevin Chalfant should have been the one to replace Perry or Augeri. Nothing against Arnel, he has done a super job, but KC was then one that should have had the job.

danielb wrote:The folks love the songs. Augeri and particularly JSS are both way better frontmen. If only Journey had been bold enough to go with JSS instead. They would have avoided the karaoke route, and possibly found a new direction, similar to what Van Halen did with Hagar.

Arnel doesn't look very natural onstage.

The Van Halen/Hagar thing was always a comparison. I don't think it would have ever happened. When Sammy replaced Dave, VH were at a high point in their career and popularity. Sammy was already a star dating way back to the 70's and Montrose. Sammy was also at the peak of his solo popularity. So, combining them together was much more likely to have some success at some level, then fail.

In contrast, Journey was in a very low position following the scandal of tapegate and the way Augeri left the band. Journey was CLEARLY opening for Def Leppard on that tour...despite the spin. JSS was no where near what Sammy Hagar was in the late 80's. He had some name recognition, but not like Sammy did back then.

So, IMO, even if they recorded an album like the W.E.T. debut, I doubt it would have been as successful as Revelation.

danielb wrote:The folks love the songs. Augeri and particularly JSS are both way better frontmen. If only Journey had been bold enough to go with JSS instead. They would have avoided the karaoke route, and possibly found a new direction, similar to what Van Halen did with Hagar.

Arnel doesn't look very natural onstage.

Arnel seems to only play to the first few rows. Yeah, Arnel high fives and all that and give those people attention and once in a while he'll play to the crowd, like he did with "Who's Cryin' Now" in the video that was posted. But, it SHOULD be the reverse, where he knows the guy in the back row matters just as much, if not more, than the girl in the front row....that is the biggest difference, IMO, between Arnel and Augeri, Perry, and JSS. Those other guys played to the entire audience almost the entire time.