How EGOS & MANAGEMENT DESTROYED Bad English

[Memorex]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvFfg2_aDrw

[Monker]

He skipped a lot...and he exaggerates what the Babys were....they obviously were never close to what Journey was...no comparison.

Jonathan was not very happy at all with "When I See You Smile". He wanted "Ghost In Your Heart" included on the debut and it was originally cut. A deal was made with the label that Jon would not complain about "When I See You Smile" if they also included "Ghost In Your Heart". The entire idea of bringing in outside writers was something he did not like, "Jonathan Cain, Neal Schon, and John Waite can't write songs good enough for the album?" He was right, "When I See You Smile" and "Price of Love" are pretty close to the same level. He also accused John Waite of wanting to use Bad English to be a "rock star", and the label decided to make Waite the face of the band...which Jonathan did not like. He said BE was supposed to have a "Black Crowes" attitude and not be a kiss ass corporate rock band, but that is what they became. He also mentioned that Backlash became VERY expensive to make and it took longer than everybody wanted. But, he trudged on...when you do such things there are all these people who are relying on you to get paid and make a living and it creates an enormous amount of pressure. It seems like that is what motivated him to finish the album....but the band had obviously broke up during the recording. Waite wanted to go in a completely different direction. He wanted a sorta dark and moody album and not happy pop songs...nobody else liked that direction but the label was all in with Waite. So, that is what caused a lot of the friction and eventually broke the band up.

I remember when Backlash was released. It seemed like it was released and then a few weeks later Neal announced Hardline. That was the end of BE. The label cut their losses and stopped doing any promotion for the album and the band faded away into history.

This is a band that should have been huge and is an example of why a label should sometimes just get out of the way and let the band figure things out and write and record....and the label concentrate on releasing and promoting the album. Too much label control. Too much John Waite trying to be a rock star and the label propping him up over the other members. Not enough of a shared vision for the band and staying true to that.

[Memorex]

I got to see them live twice. Was glad for that.

[Journey/Survivor]

I saw them 3 times. Twice they were the headliners, and once they were opening for Whitesnake.

Saw Hardline twice. Once they were the headliners, and once they were playing a show that had Mr. Big and Eddie Money and a few other big names on the bill. Hardline played in the middle of the show.

Saw Neal Schon, Deen Castronovo and Todd Jensen performing with Paul Rodgers twice. Once they were the headliners and once they were opening for Steve Miller.

In the 1990s I went to too many concerts by too many bands to remember all of them. I rarely get to concerts anymore cause they're too damn expensive. Plus back in the 90s it was easy for me to get friends to go to concerts with me. They don't want to go to concerts anymore.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I think I prefer the sophomore album by a hair.

Of both albums, the most Journeyish track is The Restless Ones (Waite, Cain, Phillips)

https://youtu.be/pMqlnZrI1Nc?si=2I0dOMf8X8ch3eEf

[Arkansas]

I rarely get to concerts anymore cause they're too damn expensive.

Bad English, Omni New Daisy Theater, Memphis, August 1989.
$15 at the door.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VnZe9jj5Xk


later~

[Journey/Survivor]

I rarely get to concerts anymore cause they're too damn expensive.

Bad English, Omni New Daisy Theater, Memphis, August 1989.
$15 at the door.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VnZe9jj5Xk


later~

Ironically, I just downloaded that exact show a couple of weeks ago.

[Abitaman]

I saw them once and Waite as a solo artist once a few years later.

[Journey/Survivor]

I saw them once and Waite as a solo artist once a few years later.

I also saw Waite solo in the late 1990s. I briefly spoke with him after the show. I asked him what he thought about a Bad English reunion. He sarcastically laughed and said "no."

[Loneman1]

I saw them once and Waite as a solo artist once a few years later.

I also saw Waite solo in the late 1990s. I briefly spoke with him after the show. I asked him what he thought about a Bad English reunion. He sarcastically laughed and said "no."

Yeah he was on the '99 tour with Journey right? Like many others at the time I was thinking "hey, we have everyone here except Ricky Phillips, so maybe they'll pull out "When I See You Smile" altogether as an encore or something?"........of course that never happened. The bad blood is strong with damn near everyone in Journey's orbit they've ever worked with.

[Monker]

Yeah he was on the '99 tour with Journey right? Like many others at the time I was thinking "hey, we have everyone here except Ricky Phillips, so maybe they'll pull out "When I See You Smile" altogether as an encore or something?"........of course that never happened. The bad blood is strong with damn near everyone in Journey's orbit they've ever worked with.

Also, none of them really liked "When I See You Smile"...and that was their #1 song.

But, they could and should have done something...Waite has covered "Whole Lotta Love" decently. They could have done something like that....maybe moving into "Forget Me Not" or "Heaven is a Four Letter Word", or something else from BE. And, they could have done it between sets, instead of as an encore...in case Waite is one of those who likes to get out of the arena early.

[Journey/Survivor]

I saw them once and Waite as a solo artist once a few years later.

I also saw Waite solo in the late 1990s. I briefly spoke with him after the show. I asked him what he thought about a Bad English reunion. He sarcastically laughed and said "no."

Yeah he was on the '99 tour with Journey right? Like many others at the time I was thinking "hey, we have everyone here except Ricky Phillips, so maybe they'll pull out "When I See You Smile" altogether as an encore or something?"........of course that never happened. The bad blood is strong with damn near everyone in Journey's orbit they've ever worked with.

I did see all of them on that tour. But it was at least a year or two before that that I spoke to Waite after one of his shows.

But yeah, I remember thinking that at least Neal and Deen would join Waite on stage to play WISYS when Waite was opening for Journey on that tour.

[19td73]

I'm sorry if I'm wrong here but wasn't it Journey/Foreigner in 1999? Then in 2001 Journey/Peter Frampton with Waite opening up? I saw them in Pittsburgh then and Neal came out and jammed "Head First" with Waite and his band to end Waite's set.

[Journey/Survivor]

I'm sorry if I'm wrong here but wasn't it Journey/Foreigner in 1999? Then in 2001 Journey/Peter Frampton with Waite opening up? I saw them in Pittsburgh then and Neal came out and jammed "Head First" with Waite and his band to end Waite's set.

I don't remember the year. But I did see Journey, Frampton and Waite together in Cleveland one tour. That's cool that you at least saw Schon play Head First with Waite. He didn't play anything with Waite at the Cleveland show that I recall.

[Journey/Survivor]

I'm sorry if I'm wrong here but wasn't it Journey/Foreigner in 1999? Then in 2001 Journey/Peter Frampton with Waite opening up? I saw them in Pittsburgh then and Neal came out and jammed "Head First" with Waite and his band to end Waite's set.

I don't remember the year. But I did see Journey, Frampton and Waite together in Cleveland one tour. That's cool that you at least saw Schon play Head First with Waite. He didn't play anything with Waite at the Cleveland show that I recall.

I've also saw Journey with Foreigner on two different tours, but I can't remember the years. The one tour it was just Journey and Foreigner. The other tour it was Journey, Foreigner and Night Ranger.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I've also saw Journey with Foreigner on two different tours, but I can't remember the years. The one tour it was just Journey and Foreigner. The other tour it was Journey, Foreigner and Night Ranger.

The triple bill was the Eclipse tour. I remember it well because Foreigner blew Journey off the stage.

[Loneman1]

Also, none of them really liked "When I See You Smile"...and that was their #1 song.

But, they could and should have done something...Waite has covered "Whole Lotta Love" decently. They could have done something like that....maybe moving into "Forget Me Not" or "Heaven is a Four Letter Word", or something else from BE. And, they could have done it between sets, instead of as an encore...in case Waite is one of those who likes to get out of the arena early.

Yeah, if it wasn't their biggest hit they could have and should have played SOMETHING at some point acknowledging the fact that 4/5 members were there in the building and could have done a jam if nothing else for the fans but all the bullshit got in the way as usual with those kinds of things.

I'm sorry if I'm wrong here but wasn't it Journey/Foreigner in 1999? Then in 2001 Journey/Peter Frampton with Waite opening up? I saw them in Pittsburgh then and Neal came out and jammed "Head First" with Waite and his band to end Waite's set.

I don't remember the year. But I did see Journey, Frampton and Waite together in Cleveland one tour. That's cool that you at least saw Schon play Head First with Waite. He didn't play anything with Waite at the Cleveland show that I recall.

Yeah '01 is probably right, I tend to get the '99-'01 tours screwed up in my head for whatever reason nowadays. I gotta echo the fact that its pretty awesome you at least saw the two of them jam on something! Thats all I was hoping for, something to represent Bad English on stage since the major players were there. Good on 'em for doing it at least for that show!

[Journey/Survivor]

I've also saw Journey with Foreigner on two different tours, but I can't remember the years. The one tour it was just Journey and Foreigner. The other tour it was Journey, Foreigner and Night Ranger.

The triple bill was the Eclipse tour. I remember it well because Foreigner blew Journey off the stage.

Foreigner are my third favorite band. Night Ranger are my fourth favorite. But I was disappointed that Foreigner literally only played hits at that particular show that I was at for that tour. At least Journey threw in a couple of deep cuts.

[Eric]

Also, none of them really liked "When I See You Smile"...and that was their #1 song.

But, they could and should have done something...Waite has covered "Whole Lotta Love" decently. They could have done something like that....maybe moving into "Forget Me Not" or "Heaven is a Four Letter Word", or something else from BE. And, they could have done it between sets, instead of as an encore...in case Waite is one of those who likes to get out of the arena early.

Yeah, if it wasn't their biggest hit they could have and should have played SOMETHING at some point acknowledging the fact that 4/5 members were there in the building and could have done a jam if nothing else for the fans but all the bullshit got in the way as usual with those kinds of things.

I'm sorry if I'm wrong here but wasn't it Journey/Foreigner in 1999? Then in 2001 Journey/Peter Frampton with Waite opening up? I saw them in Pittsburgh then and Neal came out and jammed "Head First" with Waite and his band to end Waite's set.

I don't remember the year. But I did see Journey, Frampton and Waite together in Cleveland one tour. That's cool that you at least saw Schon play Head First with Waite. He didn't play anything with Waite at the Cleveland show that I recall.

Yeah '01 is probably right, I tend to get the '99-'01 tours screwed up in my head for whatever reason nowadays. I gotta echo the fact that its pretty awesome you at least saw the two of them jam on something! Thats all I was hoping for, something to represent Bad English on stage since the major players were there. Good on 'em for doing it at least for that show!

Yup... 2001. That Frampton set was still the most surprised (pleasantly) I've ever been at a show.

Schon came out to do Head First with Waite that tour. Don't know how often, though.

[Eric]

I've also saw Journey with Foreigner on two different tours, but I can't remember the years. The one tour it was just Journey and Foreigner. The other tour it was Journey, Foreigner and Night Ranger.

The triple bill was the Eclipse tour. I remember it well because Foreigner blew Journey off the stage.

Foreigner are my third favorite band. Night Ranger are my fourth favorite. But I was disappointed that Foreigner literally only played hits at that particular show that I was at for that tour. At least Journey threw in a couple of deep cuts.

Yeah. Bonham/Pilson made for a great rhythm section... but it was a 10 song greatest hits set without Mick Jones for some shows even.

[yulog]

Also, none of them really liked "When I See You Smile"...and that was their #1 song.

But, they could and should have done something...Waite has covered "Whole Lotta Love" decently. They could have done something like that....maybe moving into "Forget Me Not" or "Heaven is a Four Letter Word", or something else from BE. And, they could have done it between sets, instead of as an encore...in case Waite is one of those who likes to get out of the arena early.

Yeah, if it wasn't their biggest hit they could have and should have played SOMETHING at some point acknowledging the fact that 4/5 members were there in the building and could have done a jam if nothing else for the fans but all the bullshit got in the way as usual with those kinds of things.


I don't remember the year. But I did see Journey, Frampton and Waite together in Cleveland one tour. That's cool that you at least saw Schon play Head First with Waite. He didn't play anything with Waite at the Cleveland show that I recall.

Yeah '01 is probably right, I tend to get the '99-'01 tours screwed up in my head for whatever reason nowadays. I gotta echo the fact that its pretty awesome you at least saw the two of them jam on something! Thats all I was hoping for, something to represent Bad English on stage since the major players were there. Good on 'em for doing it at least for that show!

Yup... 2001. That Frampton set was still the most surprised (pleasantly) I've ever been at a show.

Schon came out to do Head First with Waite that tour. Don't know how often, though.[/quote]



I saw them at the Greek Theater that year. Schon made a headfirst appearance, and I thought Frampton was great as well (it was my first time seeing him).

[TageRyche]

I saw them once and Waite as a solo artist once a few years later.

I never saw Bad English album but I have seen John Waite solo twice in concert. He was damn good both times.