Amy Winehouse is dead

[Rip Rokken]

On the other end of the spectrum though, you have people like Mother Teresa who did nothing to really help the plight of the poor by keeping them poor. Speaking of Mother Teresa, here is a great 3-part mini-documentary (expose) by Christopher Hitchens on her. What a fraud...

Hell's Angel Pt. 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WQ0i3nCx60

Hell's Angel Pt. 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKkcDgeYBdk

Hell's Angel Pt. 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pei8lSiv6s

Well, I'm not Catholic and don't agree with the teachings of that church and, in fact, find many of their teachings anti-Biblical. So I'm not really a bit interested in watching the documentary. That being said, 1) I'm sure that there's a rebuff to Hitchen's documentary out there somewhere. If so, have you listened to all sides? 2) Perhaps Hitchens doesn't exactly have his story straight? After all, from what I know of the guy, 3) it sure seems like he probably already had an agenda going into the making of that documentary.

Hahahahahahaha.... Dude! You just made 3 grand assumptions/judgments against a short film you agreed you have no interest in watching (I've numbered them for you). This is a shining example of the type of thinking that it also takes to keep faith intact.

BTW, Christopher Hitchens is my new superhero. The guy is so refreshingly candid, no matter who it offends, and he's funny as hell. I think I'm going to start a Chris Hitchens thread just for fun.

Watch the videos btw... not to prove my point, but just for a good watch.

P.S. - can someone change the name of this thread? It's misleading, because it really has nothing to do with Amy Winehouse.

[conversationpc]

Hahahahahahaha.... Dude! You just made 3 grand assumptions/judgments against a short film you agreed you have no interest in watching (I've numbered them for you). This is a shining example of the type of thinking that it also takes to keep faith intact.

I didn't make any assumptions against the film. I'm asking you that since you think it's gospel truth, have YOU searched to see if there are contradictory accounts? I'm not Catholic. Her faith or lack thereof doesn't have any bearing on whether I have faith or not. I don't have an opinion on the video itself.

If you're taking what he says for truth (I don't know if it is or not) then doesn't it, as someone who considers himself a moral person (I assume you do) to check out the other side of the argument?

BTW, Christopher Hitchens is my new superhero. The guy is so refreshingly candid, no matter who it offends, and he's funny as hell. I think I'm going to start a Chris Hitchens thread just for fun.

What you see as candid, I see as him being a jerk. It doesn't matter to me if he's an atheist because I know people who are that are fund, easy to get along with folks. But that's only judging from the few interviews I've seen of him. He may very well be a decent human being.

[conversationpc]

Just a few quick verses from Matthew:

Matthew 6:19-21 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys, and where thieves do not break in or steal; for where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Matthew 19:23-24 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

I know it relates to the love of money, but hey... doesn't it kinda take some love for money to get rich? Unless you inherit it, but even then, if God will always sustain your needs, why not give most everything to the poor and just trust God for the day to day needs?

Context, my friend. Context. Neither of those verses imply that it's wrong to be rich.

Did you ever play with toy guns when you were a kid, "Cowboys and Indians", etc., etc? Is that acceptable? After all, if we follow your line of thought above then shouldn't it follow that even pretend violence is bad? Come on, you're smarter than that.

Then shouldn't make-believe sex in the movies be ok, too? It's not the real thing.

Answering a question with a question?

All the Christians who have no clue what they are putting into their bodies and suffering for it, just like the unsaved. I do the work of the Holy Spirit in my house. Caught my little girl bringing home Icees from day care a few days in a row and had a chat with her. She's not even 8 and got her first cavity not long ago. I took over on nutrition and her diet changed immediately. Amazingly, she's actually enjoying eating healthy now.

Awesome. Good for you.

Good. They were offended because like many Christians today, the bulk of their beliefs or practices are comprised of human traditions and concepts, not scriptural teaching.

Exactly.

God's judgment comes to his own house first. These folks will get theirs at the time appointed. They always do.

But not in a time frame that matters. Not in a way that sends a message to saved and unsaved alike, thereby keeping his testimony intact. If you want to trust someone's word for the future, they better be showing a solid example here in the present -- otherwise, they are just empty promises. Anyway, I'm afraid it's never going to happen, just like the "Rapture". Justice has to come in this age or there's no justice at all.

I don't trust someone else's word for the future unless it already lines up with what I believe or know to be true.

[Rip Rokken]

Just a few quick verses from Matthew:

Matthew 6:19-21 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys, and where thieves do not break in or steal; for where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Matthew 19:23-24 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

I know it relates to the love of money, but hey... doesn't it kinda take some love for money to get rich? Unless you inherit it, but even then, if God will always sustain your needs, why not give most everything to the poor and just trust God for the day to day needs?

Context, my friend. Context. Neither of those verses imply that it's wrong to be rich.

You ducked my points completely, lol! I think you're checkmated on this one when it comes to motive. Now I'm personally not saying it's wrong to be rich, not at all, and I don't know anyone who pursues riches above all else to be happy people (case in point, Jennings Osborne, the "Christmas Lights Guy" from my home town, who just passed away two days ago. I read an article about him several years back where he talked about the 40-something exotic cars in his garage and how they never satisfied him.

But... Find me one wealthy Christian who doesn't pay close attention to his stock portfolio and investments, and tell me how that's not a love for money (even if not on an obsessive level). And the Parable of the Talents can't be used to validate this, because it's talking about spiritual gifts, not earthly one.

Did you ever play with toy guns when you were a kid, "Cowboys and Indians", etc., etc? Is that acceptable? After all, if we follow your line of thought above then shouldn't it follow that even pretend violence is bad? Come on, you're smarter than that.

Then shouldn't make-believe sex in the movies be ok, too? It's not the real thing.

Answering a question with a question?

It was kinda rhetorical, a point based on the logical progression of the conversation. But ok, to answer your previous question directly, any time some kid storms into a high school with a gun in each hand and starts shooting up teachers and students, I don't think there is any reasonable argument that can be made that the "pretend violence" of video games and movies doesn't have some influence on how they act.

Now, what about my question? It's an easy one, can't duck it without conceding the point.

I don't trust someone else's word for the future unless it already lines up with what I believe or know to be true.

Hate to tell ya, but this is the very definition of "Truthines"s - truth which comes from the heart, not from the head. Radical Muslims also have absolute conviction in their beliefs - they "know" them to be true. No difference.

[SusieP]

RIP Amy ... sometimes the demons just ... win

So true.
I've been looking at the youtube clips of her final performance.
Not happy viewing, and yet compelling.

What a waste of a young life.

And her band are now unemployed, too.

[conversationpc]

Just a few quick verses from Matthew:

Matthew 6:19-21 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys, and where thieves do not break in or steal; for where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Matthew 19:23-24 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

I know it relates to the love of money, but hey... doesn't it kinda take some love for money to get rich? Unless you inherit it, but even then, if God will always sustain your needs, why not give most everything to the poor and just trust God for the day to day needs?

Context, my friend. Context. Neither of those verses imply that it's wrong to be rich.

You ducked my points completely, lol! I think you're checkmated on this one when it comes to motive.

I didn't duck anything, at least not on purpose. BTW...He who claims victory usually has no clear view of the finish line.

Now I'm personally not saying it's wrong to be rich, not at all, and I don't know anyone who pursues riches above all else to be happy people...

Find me one wealthy Christian who doesn't pay close attention to his stock portfolio and investments, and tell me how that's not a love for money (even if not on an obsessive level).

I don't understand how it's a love of money to pay even some attention to your investments. Please enlighten me.

It was kinda rhetorical, a point based on the logical progression of the conversation. But ok, to answer your previous question directly, any time some kid storms into a high school with a gun in each hand and starts shooting up teachers and students, I don't think there is any reasonable argument that can be made that the "pretend violence" of video games and movies doesn't have some influence on how they act.

I never indicated it doesn't have an effect on some people. I believe it does but that doesn't make violence in movies, books, etc., wrong in and of itself.

Now, what about my question? It's an easy one, can't duck it without conceding the point.

Which question was that now? I've ever deleted in while editing the comments here or lost track of what one of your questions was.

Hate to tell ya, but this is the very definition of "Truthines"s - truth which comes from the heart, not from the head. Radical Muslims also have absolute conviction in their beliefs - they "know" them to be true. No difference.

If all truth came from the head of mankind, truth would be quite elusive, wouldn't it?

[Rip Rokken]

Now, what about my question? It's an easy one, can't duck it without conceding the point.

Which question was that now? I've ever deleted in while editing the comments here or lost track of what one of your questions was.

If movies with make-believe violence are ok with God, then how about movies with make-believe sex? Again, in the eyes of God... By the way, the point I'm trying to make is how all Christians compromise with God, usually subconsciously, on the the line between holiness and worldly creature comforts. The bible calls believers to not be of the world, but to be holy (separate, called out from the world). But who can do that? Can you imagine being on a strict spiritual diet of God all the time? Reading the bible, praying, singing hymns and praising for the bulk of your entertainment, enjoyment, whatever? Very few people can do that, and it's because they are wired for it. For the rest of us, we simply can't - because having a make-believe, intangible friend only goes so far before it gets boring. If we could literally spend real, physical time with the God who created the Universe, it would be the furthest thing from boring. But our imaginations can only take us so far.

Hate to tell ya, but this is the very definition of "Truthiness" - truth which comes from the heart, not from the head. Radical Muslims also have absolute conviction in their beliefs - they "know" them to be true. No difference.

If all truth came from the head of mankind, truth would be quite elusive, wouldn't it?

I should have said, truth that comes from the gut, not from books. Feeling the truth and knowing the truth based on factual evidence are two different things.