President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[Eric]

torture is not okay and it is important to me that the president does not back down and allow crimes of the prior administration to go unchecked.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090421/ap_ ... tion_memos

Choose:

Waterboard 1,000 terror suspects and from the information gathered you are able stop a terror attack in LA killing 5,000 people

OR

Don't waterboard anyone, therefore don't get any info and allow 5,000 people to die

[Rockindeano]

torture is not okay and it is important to me that the president does not back down and allow crimes of the prior administration to go unchecked.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090421/ap_ ... tion_memos

Choose:

Waterboard 1,000 terror suspects and from the information gathered you are able stop a terror attack in LA killing 5,000 people

OR

Don't waterboard anyone, therefore don't get any info and allow 5,000 people to die

What a short sighted ridiculous fucking train of thought..if you can call it thought. Who are you, Dick Cheney?

There are ways to get information without torturing people. Fuck me, do Americans really think this way? If so, I am embarrassed to have ever fought for you in uniform. The United States does not do the animalistic shit that other states do. Fuck!!

[Lula]

hey if you want to be cruel to others you go right ahead. i think it is wrong. i don't think the information gathered, whatever it may have been if any, required torture. some argue for torture, but i am steadfast against it. if the u.s. condones torture of others then our men and women in uniform will also be tortured. there is no room for such barbaric tactics.

[treetopovskaya]

cruel? i think it was pretty damn cruel to hijack planes & crash them into buildings. if anyone thinks this could never happen again you're a fool.

torture should only be used as a last resort imo. no i don't like it... but i'm really not going to worry much about the feelings of suspected terrorist. sorry. i care more for the real victims & for the lives that could be saved.

hey if you want to be cruel to others you go right ahead. i think it is wrong. i don't think the information gathered, whatever it may have been if any, required torture. some argue for torture, but i am steadfast against it. if the u.s. condones torture of others then our men and women in uniform will also be tortured. there is no room for such barbaric tactics.

[treetopovskaya]

how anyone can be against torture but ok with abortion amazes me really.

[treetopovskaya]

if obama thinks by us not torturing will make others stop he is dumber than he appears to be.

[treetopovskaya]

obama ordered the shooting of the pirates and the bombing of terrorists in afghanistan and pakistan... is this not worse than torture?

[Lula]

i'm against torture.
i'm against abortion, however, i am pro choice.
i don't think obama thinks that if the u.s. is not torturing captives other countries will follow. i do think obama has a higher standard for the inited states as have presidents of days gone by. the bush/cheney admin was wrong to do it and i hope the appropriate individuals are held accountable.

[treetopovskaya]

the congress authorized these methods including any democrats on the security and intelligence committees of which i think hillary clinton and john kerry were a part.

i'm against torture.
i'm against abortion, however, i am pro choice.
i don't think obama thinks that if the u.s. is not torturing captives other countries will follow. i do think obama has a higher standard for the inited states as have presidents of days gone by. the bush/cheney admin was wrong to do it and i hope the appropriate individuals are held accountable.

[Lula]

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

[donnaplease]

obama ordered the shooting of the pirates and the bombing of terrorists in afghanistan and pakistan... is this not worse than torture?

I guess, using the logic of the past here, that BO could be considered a 'murderer', just as W was. I personally don't believe this, but I don't like the hypocrisy of giving one a pass while the other is deemed a hero. I have kept pretty silent about BO so far, but I am not pleased with his behavior on his various trips around the world. He should hold his head high and be proud to be the leader of the greatest country in the world, not falling all over himself apologizing for what he sees as our shortcomings. I think it weakens our security. I hope I'm wrong, though.

[treetopovskaya]

and assassination?

cuz i would think that KILLING people would be worse.

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

[treetopovskaya]

i'm more worried about how animals are tortured than i am some piece of shit. sorry.

[treetopovskaya]

bingo!!

obama ordered the shooting of the pirates and the bombing of terrorists in afghanistan and pakistan... is this not worse than torture?

I guess, using the logic of the past here, that BO could be considered a 'murderer', just as W was. I personally don't believe this, but I don't like the hypocrisy of giving one a pass while the other is deemed a hero. I have kept pretty silent about BO so far, but I am not pleased with his behavior on his various trips around the world. He should hold his head high and be proud to be the leader of the greatest country in the world, not falling all over himself apologizing for what he sees as our shortcomings. I think it weakens our security. I hope I'm wrong, though.

[RedWingFan]

i'm against abortion, however, i am pro choice.

That'd be like me saying, "I'm against cruelty to animals, but I think Michael Vick should be able to do whatever the hell he wants in his own back yard!"
Yup, I'm against beating, drowning and electricuting dogs to death, but I support peoples right to do it!
I guess some people have the courage to stand up AGAINST what they know is wrong and some don't. [Rant over]

[RedWingFan]

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

[donnaplease]

i'm against abortion, however, i am pro choice.

That'd be like me saying, "I'm against cruelty to animals, but I think Michael Vick should be able to do whatever the hell he wants in his own back yard!"
Yup, I'm against beating, drowning and electricuting dogs to death, but I support peoples right to do it!
I guess some people have the courage to stand up AGAINST what they know is wrong and some don't. [Rant over]

IDK, it's a little different if you a woman. I'm not for abortion, but under certain circumstances I believe it is justifiable. In Vick's case, there was never any justifiable reason to do what he did. Abortion should never be used for birth control, and that's what bugs me about the far left of the 'pro-choice' movement, but I don't believe Lula fits there. It's like many of the liberal ways of thinking... they will do something controversial just because they can. Examples that come to mind are abortion, taking "merry christmas", prayer and God out of schools, and removing references to the ten commandments and other christian beliefs from government property, even though our country - and therefore our government - were based on those principals. For those of you in southern CA... is the cross still standing at Mt. Soledad? It would be such a shame if the atheists get their way finally with that one.

It just seems to me that our society is becoming so generic out of the need to be politically correct that anything goes and the lines of decency and morality are quickly becoming non-existent. I'm afraid BO and his liberal ways will just allow that all the more.

[donnaplease]

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

[treetopovskaya]

... and how do we know it hasn't?

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

[donnaplease]

... and how do we know it hasn't?

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

So far it's been pretty good. RWF has been a little hard on Lula, but she's tough and can handle him I think. I think his point is valid, and would like to see folks talk about it without throwing out insults to intelligence to those that don't agree with someone's POV. This stuff is much more interesting, IMO, than talk about taxes and all that other crap.

[Rockindeano]

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

Lib mantra. Make love, not War. Abort the unwanted fetus'.

After going through the past 10 or so ridiculous postings, all by Cons, I just have to get this out there.

Con mantra. Force the birth, turn your back on the family. No help whatsoever because you know, 'taxes are evil."

[Rockindeano]

Why do people actually think Polls mean shit as far as it indicates a President is doing good or bad?

Polls do mean something. Polls equate to public perception, which translates to votes or prospective votes, which then translate into political capital, which President Obama has a ton of now.

You're welcome for the session Stuey.

[treetopovskaya]

i'm not a conservative or a republican... not a dem or a lib.

i'm not bias to any party.

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

Lib mantra. Make love, not War. Abort the unwanted fetus'.

After going through the past 10 or so ridiculous postings, all by Cons, I just have to get this out there.

Con mantra. Force the birth, turn your back on the family. No help whatsoever because you know, 'taxes are evil."

[treetopovskaya]

i don't go to church

[Rockindeano]

... and how do we know it hasn't?

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

So far it's been pretty good. RWF has been a little hard on Lula, but she's tough and can handle him I think. I think his point is valid, and would like to see folks talk about it without throwing out insults to intelligence to those that don't agree with someone's POV. This stuff is much more interesting, IMO, than talk about taxes and all that other crap.

Well I promise to keep it civil, mainly because I have no interest talking about a personal issue such as abortion. it is a personal issue that includes a person's private possession: her body. You, me, nor anyone else, Uncle Sam included, cannot tell anyone else what to do with their body. End of story.

You Cons want no abortion, then try winning a few elections and get a republican president and hope Ginsburg and Souter pass away so Gingrich can make the appropriate nomination. Like any of what I just mentioned will happen any time soon, with your party being so far removed from anything remotely relevant.

[Jana]

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

Lib mantra. Make love, not War. Abort the unwanted fetus'.

My whole life I've been surrounded by Republicans, (I was one), and every single one of them was pro choice, but on a personal level would not do it. Many said if it was their daughter and she was fourteen or fifteen they would probably want them to have an abortion, though. As far as voting Republican and the issue of abortion, they never saw Roe v. Wade being overturned, and that there were more pressing issues to worry about and believed the GOP were more fiscally responsible and would always vote for them. I don't know one Democrat that personally would have an abortion unless a rape occurred, but still believes in the right to choose. Many Dems are totally against abortion, but are voting based on other issues also. It's really not such a clearcut Lib vs. Con issue as you seem to believe.

[Rockindeano]

i'm not a conservative or a republican... not a dem or a lib.

i'm not bias to any party.

You watch the Morelli and Ness video I sent you.

[treetopovskaya]

i was watchin & my computer took a pooh. i'll have to re-watch. }:C)

mike ness is one awesome guy. }=C)

i'm not a conservative or a republican... not a dem or a lib.

i'm not bias to any party.

You watch the Morelli and Ness video I sent you.

[Ehwmatt]

Roe v. Wade and its successors will never be overturned in any substantive way. Don't know why anyone wastes the breath.

[donnaplease]

... and how do we know it hasn't?

any person in our government that authorized torture of another human being should be held accountable.

Couldn't you just say you're against torture, but support it when it would save the life of the mother....er, I mean thousands of innocent men, women and CHILDREN???

Wow... that's deep. If folks keep it civil, this could be a REALLY good debate.

So far it's been pretty good. RWF has been a little hard on Lula, but she's tough and can handle him I think. I think his point is valid, and would like to see folks talk about it without throwing out insults to intelligence to those that don't agree with someone's POV. This stuff is much more interesting, IMO, than talk about taxes and all that other crap.

Well I promise to keep it civil, mainly because I have no interest talking about a personal issue such as abortion. it is a personal issue that includes a person's private possession: her body. You, me, nor anyone else, Uncle Sam included, cannot tell anyone else what to do with their body. End of story.

You Cons want no abortion, then try winning a few elections and get a republican president and hope Ginsburg and Souter pass away so Gingrich can make the appropriate nomination. Like any of what I just mentioned will happen any time soon, with your party being so far removed from anything remotely relevant.

It's only personal when it suits the situation. It's not so personal when women are shouting out loud for the right to have one. I have never said I want no abortion, I just don't want it to be used for birth control due to lack of personal responsibility. Roe v. Wade will never be overturned by any supreme court, so that is a moot point. As for being relevant, I agree with that somewhat, but not for the reason that you do. I believe that too many of us have remained quiet and allowed the wacky end of the liberal spectrum to run roughshod over us by screaming that their rights are being violated, and we're too dumb or too weak or too afraid to stand up and say we won't tolerate it. We get bullied into compliance, and it's a shame.

But Dean, since you responded, you would be a great one to start off. Can you compare and contrast the use of 'torture' vs a woman's right to kill her unborn child? I'd like to know your thoughts on it, as well as those of Stu, Dave, TNC, Tree, Lula and anyone else who wants to weigh in.