President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[The_Noble_Cause]

Laughable that you fire a shot into the 'opinionator' battle, with a link from mediamatters. Hardly objective sourcing, eh?

I really don't get the problem with MM.
Newsbusters has been doing the same thing on the right for years.
Neither watchdog site alters the audio or the footage.

[Monker]

Can't have it both ways...bitch about GW going off on his own and then discredit UN and the multiple, and that is MULTIPLE, violations Iraq committed. I can 't believe how many people have selective memory.

I have very good memory from that time. I was one of the few people who spoke against the decision to invade Iraq....and did so from the start. It was a bad decision - the worst decision of any president in my lifetime.

Those that use terms like calling the decision to go to war based on "lies", it is mass murder, etc. have no sense and should just simply be ignored.

No. Those words, and many others, should have been used BEFORE THE WAR even happened.

If they truly believe this shit, why DID GW invade Iraq

Cuz he's an idiot doing what the neo-conservatives around him were advising him to do.

and why did Congress, including the Democrats that want to re-write history, approve it?

Because they were idiots more worried about reelected and being 'unpatriotic' then they were about this country making correct decisions. As far as I'm concerned, NOBODY in congress who voted for this war should ever hold public office again.

[Monker]

No, I get a good laugh from those people. And, you should get a laugh from FOX and their opinionators...since they are really only 'opoinion' programming and not news - ACCORDING TO FOX:

http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/200910290044

Laughable that you fire a shot into the 'opinionator' battle, with a link from mediamatters. Hardly objective sourcing, eh?

Don't care where it was from...I did a search on for the clip, cuz I knew exactly what I was looking for, and they had it available. What, you are saying they edited to make it biased or something, LOL.

[strangegrey]

You should care about your sources....ask Dan Rather about that mistake...

Regardless, take a look at who's bankrolled Media Maters and then get back to us....
there's enough independence there to make Vince Foster look like Roger Clinton...

Regardless, last I checked, dissent != opinion

It's OK for MSNBC to run smear campaigns on GOP party members, but as soon as Fox questions the judgment of someone in this administration, they're opinionating?

Rediculous...and the fact that you support such an objective opinion with support from Mediamaters takes whatever platform you think you may have been firing from, and turns it into a ride at disney land.....

[The_Noble_Cause]

Regardless, take a look at who's bankrolled Media Maters and then get back to us....
there's enough independence there to make Vince Foster look like Roger Clinton...

It's funded by leftists, ranging from George Soros to Rob Reiner.
I fail to see how a progressive website being funded by like-minded progressives should come as a surpise to anyone.
The partisan likes of Richard Mellon Scaife and Rupert Murdoch have been bankrolling right wing media ventures for years now.
Big deal.

[Monker]

You should care about your sources....ask Dan Rather about that mistake...

No I shouldn't. I'm not a journalist, just a nobody poster on an internet forum. If you think you are more then that, then you have a head that needs deflating.

It's OK for MSNBC to run smear campaigns on GOP party members, but as soon as Fox questions the judgment of someone in this administration, they're opinionating?

Oh, please....FOX SAYS THEY ARE OPINIONATING. That is the whole point. What a hypocrisy they are for going on against Obama and then when the administration fires back, FOX's OFFICAL response is that they should know the difference between news and an editorial...and then go on to detail their 'news' hours...which does NOT include "FOX and friends", O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck...According to *FOX*, THEY ARE INFOTAINMENT. How hillarious.

Rediculous...and the fact that you support such an objective opinion with support from Mediamaters takes whatever platform you think you may have been firing from, and turns it into a ride at disney land.....

LOL...I support replying to what I said instead of making up stuff as you are doing above. As I said, I was looking for the Daily Show clip...II don't care who is hosting it. Of course, you don't want to reply to that...cuz it makes fun of FOX. Instead you would rather switch that out for the crap you are spoewing now.

[hoagiepete]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

Nobody said regime change was new to Washington.
Before they were even in the Bush White House, many of the same NeoCons wrote to Clinton to get Saddam out. (http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm)
Clinton went the sanctions/bombing route, not invasion.
To act as if Bush was carrying out the legacy of Clinton and not his own is pretty lame.
If that were truly the case, why did Bush pull the WMD Inspectors out after they reported finding nothing?

[Rockindeano]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

That is a spin on a spin. The Bush Admin went to Iraq for what reason? WMD's? Oops. Capitalism in the Middle East? Yeah ok. End the dictatorship of Saddam? Well, that's a .333 Batting average, good in baseball but not in political warfare. They threw Iraq in during the muddied waters of Afghanistan, people were still wrapping themselves in red, white and blue flags and Bush knew he had the majority of the nation behind him. He had Powell lie, which ended Powell's political career, and off we went, on a poorly planned mission. Wait, I thought that mission was accomplished? Oops again.

[hoagiepete]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

That is a spin on a spin. The Bush Admin went to Iraq for what reason? WMD's? Oops. Capitalism in the Middle East? Yeah ok. End the dictatorship of Saddam? Well, that's a .333 Batting average, good in baseball but not in political warfare. They threw Iraq in during the muddied waters of Afghanistan, people were still wrapping themselves in red, white and blue flags and Bush knew he had the majority of the nation behind him. He had Powell lie, which ended Powell's political career, and off we went, on a poorly planned mission. Wait, I thought that mission was accomplished? Oops again.

Sorry. There was no spin in my comments. Just facts. Someone care to prove me wrong? Why would I make that shit up?

I am not a supporter of the war or its outcome. I just do not believe it was made up to give GW his jollies or whatever. Again...why would they do it?

With this...I am done. Reason, facts and common sense gets lost in this debate.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I just do not believe it was made up to give GW his jollies or whatever. Again...why would they do it?

Plenty of Bush officials have already peeled off and and squealed.
I've listed a few of them here already.
Believe them or not, but don't pretend they don't exist.

[hoagiepete]

I just do not believe it was made up to give GW his jollies or whatever. Again...why would they do it?

Plenty of Bush officials have already peeled off and and squealed.
I've listed a few of them here already.
Believe them or not, but don't pretend they don't exist.

One last plea...why? Did he believe it was for the good of the country or not?

[Rockindeano]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

That is a spin on a spin. The Bush Admin went to Iraq for what reason? WMD's? Oops. Capitalism in the Middle East? Yeah ok. End the dictatorship of Saddam? Well, that's a .333 Batting average, good in baseball but not in political warfare. They threw Iraq in during the muddied waters of Afghanistan, people were still wrapping themselves in red, white and blue flags and Bush knew he had the majority of the nation behind him. He had Powell lie, which ended Powell's political career, and off we went, on a poorly planned mission. Wait, I thought that mission was accomplished? Oops again.

Sorry. There was no spin in my comments. Just facts. Someone care to prove me wrong? Why would I make that shit up?

I am not a supporter of the war or its outcome. I just do not believe it was made up to give GW his jollies or whatever. Again...why would they do it?

With this...I am done. Reason, facts and common sense gets lost in this debate.

Aww don't be done Pete. Just debating here.

One reason Bush wanted into Iraq is Saddam. I am sure he wanted his ass for the reason hussein launched a scud and almost killed his dad. Bush said this once on a televised press conference in his early years as president. Something to the fact, " well, he did almost kill my dad."

Also, the Iraqi job was supposed to be easy. Clinton said it was, as well as a majority of military brass. Go watch Blackhawk Down. That was an accurate depiction and the verbiage in that movie is fully factual. One on the the ground commanding General said to the effect about Somalia, "This isn't Iraq you know" meaning, this(Somalia), is a bit more complicated, versus Iraq being swift and decisive. Hell, the Surge worked. That proves right there that the original planning was subpar or basically poor. Rumsfeld does not look good here. He along with Wolfowitz were the architects of the Iraqi war.

[hoagiepete]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

[Rockindeano]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

Well let's face it. Had he been honest and told the nation he wanted to go into Iraq for retribution against Saddam, you think the country would back that shit? Hell no they wouldn't. They backed Res 1441, the WMD myth. The admin knew there was enough blurred vision regarding proof wmd's were there, but they wouldn't possibly send in their own kids based on that weak intel.

[Behshad]

I just do not believe it was made up to give GW his jollies or whatever. Again...why would they do it?

Plenty of Bush officials have already peeled off and and squealed.
I've listed a few of them here already.
Believe them or not, but don't pretend they don't exist.

One last plea...why? Did he believe it was for the good of the country or not?

Did he care if it was the good for the country or not is the question that most of us can answer

[lights1961]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

Well let's face it. Had he been honest and told the nation he wanted to go into Iraq for retribution against Saddam, you think the country would back that shit? Hell no they wouldn't. They backed Res 1441, the WMD myth. The admin knew there was enough blurred vision regarding proof wmd's were there, but they wouldn't possibly send in their own kids based on that weak intel.

EVERYONE incld KERRY CLINTON and REID backed the WMD RES 1441... I still wonder where the WMD's went? my opinion was that the WMDS were there... we just fooled around so much for YEARS before any action was done... and the WMDS would have been easily moved to another country... Syra to Iran maybe??? just asking...

[Rockindeano]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

Well let's face it. Had he been honest and told the nation he wanted to go into Iraq for retribution against Saddam, you think the country would back that shit? Hell no they wouldn't. They backed Res 1441, the WMD myth. The admin knew there was enough blurred vision regarding proof wmd's were there, but they wouldn't possibly send in their own kids based on that weak intel.

EVERYONE incld KERRY CLINTON and REID backed the WMD RES 1441

Doesn't make it right now does it?

Obama didn't back it.

[Monker]

I've said it before here...I had buddies and son's of friends stationed in Kuwait during the Clinton administration. There were plans to invade Iraq back then, but for what ever reason, Clinton didn't pull the trigger. GW didn't just make this all up to be "his war."

Again...selective memories forget this and the fact that Iraq continued to thumb their nose at the UN.

That is such a BS argument. Having a 'plan' and actually doing it are two different things. It's Bush's "war", like it or not.

[Monker]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

If he's president, it's his responsibilty. If he refuses to take responsibility, then he's not much of a president.

[Monker]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

Well let's face it. Had he been honest and told the nation he wanted to go into Iraq for retribution against Saddam, you think the country would back that shit? Hell no they wouldn't. They backed Res 1441, the WMD myth. The admin knew there was enough blurred vision regarding proof wmd's were there, but they wouldn't possibly send in their own kids based on that weak intel.

EVERYONE incld KERRY CLINTON and REID backed the WMD RES 1441... I still wonder where the WMD's went? my opinion was that the WMDS were there... we just fooled around so much for YEARS before any action was done... and the WMDS would have been easily moved to another country... Syra to Iran maybe??? just asking...

Any WMD's that existed were either used against other Iraqi's or the Iran war. The guy was a dictator at war with Islamic fundamentalism. This guesswork of 'where did they go?' is just stupid.

[Monker]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

Well let's face it. Had he been honest and told the nation he wanted to go into Iraq for retribution against Saddam, you think the country would back that shit? Hell no they wouldn't. They backed Res 1441, the WMD myth. The admin knew there was enough blurred vision regarding proof wmd's were there, but they wouldn't possibly send in their own kids based on that weak intel.

EVERYONE incld KERRY CLINTON and REID backed the WMD RES 1441

Doesn't make it right now does it?

Obama didn't back it.

EXACTLY...and that is why I would support him over any of the above.

[artist4perry]

You know this thread doesn't change much from day to day. Libs hate conservs......Coserves bash libs...........

I think the only thing I would every be shocked by is if I came on here and saw RockingDeano in a pic hugging Rush Limbagh...........you know you love him ........secretly of course.............

[RedWingFan]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

If he's president, it's his responsibilty. If he refuses to take responsibility, then he's not much of a president.

You mean like Obama's AG saying he made the call to bring Gitmo detainees to NY and put them on trial here? Giving terrorists access to a buffet of government information.

The AG laid down the law at told Obama how it was going to be. Right!!!

[The_Noble_Cause]

You mean like Obama's AG saying he made the call to bring Gitmo detainees to NY and put them on trial here? Giving terrorists access to a buffet of government information.

The AG laid down the law at told Obama how it was going to be. Right!!!

Alot of constitutional lawyers (some that supported Clinton's impeachment) said the same thing, even before Obama ran for President.
I'm sure Obama agrees with Holder's decision, but there's no proof he influenced his judicial interpretation.
Now the American Conservative Union, Americans for Tax Reform, and former Libertarian candidate Bob Barr, have come out to back the NY decision too.

http://washingtonindependent.com/67881/ ... a-on-gitmo

[JasonD]

Morality Based Political Test:

http://www.moral-politics.com/xpolitics ... hoice=Long

[treetopovskaya]

Morality Based Political Test:

http://www.moral-politics.com/xpolitics ... hoice=Long

omigawd i voted for kerry!! }:C)

[JasonD]

Morality Based Political Test:

http://www.moral-politics.com/xpolitics ... hoice=Long

omigawd i voted for kerry!! }:C)

I fall into the Socialism category, but that's probably no surprise to anyone except myself. I always thought of myself as a liberal.

[Lula]

here is my breakdown

1. System: Liberalism, Socialism
2. Ideology: Capital Democratism, Social Democratism
3. Party: Democratic Party
4. Presidents: Jimmy Carter
5. 04' Election: John Kerry
6. 08' Election: Barrack Obama

Of the 577,455 respondents (10,344 on Facebook):

1. 8% are close to you.
2. 31% are more conservative.
3. 18% are more liberal.
4. 28% are more socialist.
5. 11% are more authoritarian.

[Monker]

I just grow weary of the blame and terms like "lied", "murder", etc heeped on one guy.

If he's president, it's his responsibilty. If he refuses to take responsibility, then he's not much of a president.

You mean like Obama's AG saying he made the call to bring Gitmo detainees to NY and put them on trial here? Giving terrorists access to a buffet of government information.

The AG laid down the law at told Obama how it was going to be. Right!!!

Again, a bunch of hocus pocus BS from Republicans who have to offer this country other then 'be afraid'. Yeah, the US prison system is just full of 'government information'. What an idiotic comment.