President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[slucero]

lmao... this is all moot....

if the Dems lose congress in 2010... and the White House in 2012... the bill will be repealed.... unless of course, the lobby figures out how to use the bill to fleece the average American, then they'll lobby the Republicans to keep it...


"say hello to the new boss, same as the old boss"

[Rockindeano]

Basically Fact Finder, you are betting that Pelosi can't get the 216 votes. She may be the toughest bitch to ever sit on the perch in the House. She rarely, rarely loses..I would never bet against her, especially on this one.

Obama just cut his Asian trip short, and is not taking the family- a point where this is going to either get done or be a huge fucking explosion. This is on the edge of being historic...and of course the right wants no part of it, because, well, it helps all Americans. Go figure.

[Rockindeano]

lmao... this is all moot....

if the Dems lose congress in 2010... and the White House in 2012... the bill will be repealed.... unless of course, the lobby figures out how to use the bill to fleece the average American, then they'll lobby the Republicans to keep it...


"say hello to the new boss, same as the old boss"

The Dems are not going to lose Congree or the White House...relax. They'll lose some seats...seats that were GOP which they stole last cycle. What you want, the Dems to carry every single district in the nation? Seriously, the GOP is acting as if they are on the move, taking away traditional Democratic seats when that's not the case at all- they are trying to get back the seats they lost so embarrassingly last year.

And you can forget the White House. Obama, while down to 50% approval rating, is still miles ahead of those buffoons like Romney and that twit Palin. Good luck with that race Pubbies. You'll need a miracle to win that one. The troops will be home from the war, the economy will be strong again, and all will be fine- not a recipe for a takeover.

[conversationpc]

The Dems are not going to lose Congree or the White House...relax. They'll lose some seats...seats that were GOP which they stole last cycle. What you want, the Dems to carry every single district in the nation? Seriously, the GOP is acting as if they are on the move, taking away traditional Democratic seats when that's not the case at all- they are trying to get back the seats they lost so embarrassingly last year.

And you can forget the White House. Obama, while down to 50% approval rating, is still miles ahead of those buffoons like Romney and that twit Palin. Good luck with that race Pubbies. You'll need a miracle to win that one. The troops will be home from the war, the economy will be strong again, and all will be fine- not a recipe for a takeover.

Most of the stimulus money has been held back. I'm expecting it to be released in time to help their election chances. Yet another type of move Pelosi said wouldn't happen under her watch.

[Rockindeano]

The Dems are not going to lose Congree or the White House...relax. They'll lose some seats...seats that were GOP which they stole last cycle. What you want, the Dems to carry every single district in the nation? Seriously, the GOP is acting as if they are on the move, taking away traditional Democratic seats when that's not the case at all- they are trying to get back the seats they lost so embarrassingly last year.

And you can forget the White House. Obama, while down to 50% approval rating, is still miles ahead of those buffoons like Romney and that twit Palin. Good luck with that race Pubbies. You'll need a miracle to win that one. The troops will be home from the war, the economy will be strong again, and all will be fine- not a recipe for a takeover.

Most of the stimulus money has been held back. I'm expecting it to be released in time to help their election chances. Yet another type of move Pelosi said wouldn't happen under her watch.

Whatever it takes. It's a bloody game. Turn about is fair play. You had 8 of the most corrupt years ever. Now you get to watch as karma comes back to bite your asses. Pelosi will get her votes.

[7 Wishes]

Tort reform should be a part of any legislation ultimately signed into law.

However, attempting to help 40 million uninsured Americans get health care is NOT a bad thing. It's good.

And if the GOP manages to gain control by 2014, this plan will be far too popular for them to repeal it.

[7 Wishes]

Incidentally, the biggest reasons the defecit is so huge this year is because, UNLIKE DUBBYA, Obama's budget actually includes the TWO WARS Bush started (although I have always supported Afghanistan at 100%) AND the stimulus bill AND the Bush-caused bank bailout.

Dubbya NEVER ONCE allowed the wars to be included in the budget nor its projections. That is Andersonesque accounting if I ever heard it.

[RedWingFan]

Tort reform should be a part of any legislation ultimately signed into law.

However, attempting to help 40 million uninsured Americans get health care is NOT a bad thing. It's good.

And if the GOP manages to gain control by 2014, this plan will be far too popular for them to repeal it.

This isn't about insuring 1 damn person. It's about getting the American people on their knees grabbing the pantleg of Senate and House members, "Please allow this procedure for my child, I'll vote, campaign do whatever you need. Just help my child." It's about the further enslavement of the American people. Is this really how you want to live you life? Not me.

[hoagiepete]

Tort reform should be a part of any legislation ultimately signed into law.

However, attempting to help 40 million uninsured Americans get health care is NOT a bad thing. It's good.

And if the GOP manages to gain control by 2014, this plan will be far too popular for them to repeal it.

How many of the 40 million want insurance? How many could have it right now, but don't want to pay for it? How many of the 40 million are taking advantage of community health or similar charitable services? How many are 20 somethings and would rather have the money on their check instead of paying for insurance? How many Americans actually are ok with their insurance?

I don't have the answer, but it would be interesting to know.

You're smokin something if you think the health plan if passed will be popular in 2014. If people are, that means we'll be paying the tab for it in later years. Nothing is free and someone eventually has to pay for it.

[7 Wishes]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

[Rick]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

+1

[RedWingFan]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

Illegal? UN resolution violations made it legal. Why can't you comprehend that? Running my insurance company out of business will benefit me how? So I can have the pleasure of standing in line with you? No thanks!

[hoagiepete]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

Since you didn't answer my questions and instead did the ol switcheroo...

I found the following from a variety of sources, none being Fox...

Per the CBO, 45 percent of the uninsured are uninsured for four months or less.

CBO estimates that as many as 15 percent of the chronically uninsured are already eligible for help.

The Urban Institute found that 25 percent of the uninsured qualify for some program.

Stanford economists say, "Based on a plausible range of definitions and assumptions … health insurance is affordable for between one quarter and three quarters of adults who are not insured."

[conversationpc]

Whatever it takes. It's a bloody game. Turn about is fair play. You had 8 of the most corrupt years ever. Now you get to watch as karma comes back to bite your asses. Pelosi will get her votes.

If this is really the way you feel then you are truly a disgusting person. I'm not proud of the corruption during the Bush administration and I'm certainly not proud of what's going on now. If it was wrong then, it's wrong now also. The ends do not justify the means.

[7 Wishes]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

Illegal? UN resolution violations made it legal. Why can't you comprehend that? Running my insurance company out of business will benefit me how? So I can have the pleasure of standing in line with you? No thanks!

You're a very smart guy, dude. Don't even act as though you don't know that the entire war was a house of lies, and that Dubbya had every intention of invading Iraq before 9/11. It's proven beyond any shadow of a doubt. The Congress wasn't conned - it was deliberately lied to. Just wait to see what happens to Blair in Britain - if he gets charged, and I believe he will, Dubbya will be next...and he should.

[Monker]

Whatever it takes. It's a bloody game. Turn about is fair play. You had 8 of the most corrupt years ever. Now you get to watch as karma comes back to bite your asses. Pelosi will get her votes.

If this is really the way you feel then you are truly a disgusting person.

Why? It's politics. Obama should have never thrown the bone to congress to let them lead and deal with it...it was HIS issue and he should have shown leadership at the start - not the end. The Democrats should have never assumed it would pass and should have rammed it down the Republicans throats in the same way that Bush did for things he felt needed to pass...the Patriot act, the various budgets turning into 'against the war' votes, for example. The Democrats should have never dismissed 'reconciliation' and went for 60 votes. They should have used the legislative tools at their disposal and got this thing passed MONTHS ago.

And, most importantly, the Democrats - especially Obama - should have NEVER let the Republicans demonize the issue and make the process itself a 'ramming down our throats' BS cause. Republicans are the minority and the Democrats should treat them that way and not cower to their every word.

[Monker]

Right. Something like two wars (one of them illegal) is what people want to pay for, not something that will benefit them.

Illegal? UN resolution violations made it legal.

I find it ironic how Republicans say in one breath that the UN should not dictate our foreign policy...but in the other use the UN as justification for war...when only congress can declare war regardless of what the UN resolutely says.

[Monker]

You're smokin something if you think the health plan if passed will be popular in 2014. If people are, that means we'll be paying the tab for it in later years. Nothing is free and someone eventually has to pay for it.

And, you are smoking something if you think you can predict four years into the future how people are going to react to such a complex issue.

[Rockindeano]

Whatever it takes. It's a bloody game. Turn about is fair play. You had 8 of the most corrupt years ever. Now you get to watch as karma comes back to bite your asses. Pelosi will get her votes.

If this is really the way you feel then you are truly a disgusting person. I'm not proud of the corruption during the Bush administration and I'm certainly not proud of what's going on now. If it was wrong then, it's wrong now also. The ends do not justify the means.

I am a disgusting person? Ok, thank you. Politics are for keeps dude. I would do anything I had to do to win; meaning that if I thought a bill was good for the American people, and that is was being falsly demonized and skewed, you damned right I would ram it down the minorities throat. Absolutely and I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it. It's called conviction. This bill, is decent, better than no bill, but could be so much better. Monker was right, Obama should have led like he is leading now- months ago..this should have never had a chance to be scrutinized unfairly and unjust by the republican scum. Deliberately shouting down speakers and lying about something called "death panels"...remember that doozy? I am sure you do. The GOP hated it, because it provides a great deed for the country, on a Democrats watch, and their name will be nowhere associated with it. Sooner or later, they will get what they have coming to them- obscurity. I cannot wait until the Tea Party breaks the GOP into two.

Sorry I disgust you Dave, but your party is much more disgusting than I ever could be.

[Rockindeano]

You're smokin something if you think the health plan if passed will be popular in 2014. If people are, that means we'll be paying the tab for it in later years. Nothing is free and someone eventually has to pay for it.

And, you are smoking something if you think you can predict four years into the future how people are going to react to such a complex issue.

I'll react to it right now.

#1 Taxes to fund health care go into effect immediately.

#2 Health care does not go into effect until 2014.

#2a It can't and wont be popular in 2014 because people wont even know how it works for them yet.

Ok Nostradamus. God forbid you ever need heath care when and if you need it...and don't say you won't ever need it either. You nor anyone can predict the future.

I guess paying a tax for a worthwhile cause is that upsetting to you.

Bring on the tax and the savings this bill generate.

As much I don't really care for Pelosi, I am pulling for her hard here--to stick it you liars.

[conversationpc]

I am a disgusting person? Ok, thank you. Politics are for keeps dude. I would do anything I had to do to win; meaning that if I thought a bill was good for the American people, and that is was being falsly demonized and skewed, you damned right I would ram it down the minorities throat. Absolutely and I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it. It's called conviction.

You're part of the problem if that's the way you think.

Sorry I disgust you Dave, but your party is much more disgusting than I ever could be.

My party? I haven't been a Republican nor even want to be associated with them in several years now and you're a tool if you want to be associated with the Democrats.

Part of the reason we are in the mess we're in is because both parties have played the kind of politics that you're advocating, i.e., the "politics are for keeps" game.

[Rockindeano]

I am a disgusting person? Ok, thank you. Politics are for keeps dude. I would do anything I had to do to win; meaning that if I thought a bill was good for the American people, and that is was being falsly demonized and skewed, you damned right I would ram it down the minorities throat. Absolutely and I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it. It's called conviction.

You're part of the problem if that's the way you think.

Really? So if I was White House Chief of Staff or Rahm Emanuel for that matter, I should sit back, be passive and let the republican party tear up a well intentioned compassionate piece of legislation, based on blatant lies and deceit? I should just say, "well, I guess the American people must not want it. Just look at all those Tea parties. That must mean something." Uh, no, screw that. Rahm Emanuel was chosen because he is a tough sonofabitch and he finally is showing some of the mettle. He should have flexed his pipes a year ago on this. Well, truth be told, trying to pass this health care issue was a bad idea in the first year of office, but that's a different discussion for another thread.

Sorry Dave, I know you are devout Christian who tries to be the best person he can be, but the dirty world doesn't work like that. The real world, and that of politics takes a inner driven compassionate soul, someone with fire and a gumption to kick ass on the things he/she believes in. So I guess I am a disgusting person to you. I wouldn't play it any other way. I would stick it to the GOP each and every time they pulled this shit- the just say no stuff, the lying, the false bullshit..yep, each and every time, until they were serious about partnering for a good cause. Their sole purpose is to control DC, the Country, and ultimately the World and even Cyberspace as well. The right is scary, real scary.

My party? I haven't been a Republican nor even want to be associated with them in several years now and you're a tool if you want to be associated with the Democrats.

Please expound on this. Are you saying the republicans aren't conservative enough?

[conversationpc]

Sorry Dave, I know you are devout Christian who tries to be the best person he can be, but the dirty world doesn't work like that.

Just because the dirty world doesn't work like that doesn't mean you should be like the world.

The real world, and that of politics takes a inner driven compassionate soul, someone with fire and a gumption to kick ass on the things he/she believes in. So I guess I am a disgusting person to you. I wouldn't play it any other way. I would stick it to the GOP each and every time they pulled this shit- the just say no stuff, the lying, the false bullshit..yep, each and every time, until they were serious about partnering for a good cause. Their sole purpose is to control DC, the Country, and ultimately the World and even Cyberspace as well. The right is scary, real scary.

And the left isn't? Open your eyes, for crying out loud! You're as blind to your party's shortcomings as you claim Republicans are to theirs.

Please expound on this. Are you saying the republicans aren't conservative enough?

I'm saying they'll be "conservative" when it suits them. They'll be just conservative enough to get in power and then do the same damn thing they did the last time. Just like the Democrats did before taking power back in 2006.

Look, I don't really think you're an evil person. I know you're passionate but you have a blind spot for what the Democrats are doing to this country, just like the Republicans did before 2006. This country will be a mere shell of itself because of both major parties and we'll all be the worse for it.

[conversationpc]

7...Where are the links to these polls that show people really like the healthcare "reform" bill when they know what's in it?

[Rockindeano]

Sorry Dave, I know you are devout Christian who tries to be the best person he can be, but the dirty world doesn't work like that.

Just because the dirty world doesn't work like that doesn't mean you should be like the world.

The real world, and that of politics takes a inner driven compassionate soul, someone with fire and a gumption to kick ass on the things he/she believes in. So I guess I am a disgusting person to you. I wouldn't play it any other way. I would stick it to the GOP each and every time they pulled this shit- the just say no stuff, the lying, the false bullshit..yep, each and every time, until they were serious about partnering for a good cause. Their sole purpose is to control DC, the Country, and ultimately the World and even Cyberspace as well. The right is scary, real scary.

And the left isn't? Open your eyes, for crying out loud! You're as blind to your party's shortcomings as you claim Republicans are to theirs.

Please expound on this. Are you saying the republicans aren't conservative enough?

I'm saying they'll be "conservative" when it suits them. They'll be just conservative enough to get in power and then do the same damn thing they did the last time. Just like the Democrats did before taking power back in 2006.

Look, I don't really think you're an evil person. I know you're passionate but you have a blind spot for what the Democrats are doing to this country, just like the Republicans did before 2006. This country will be a mere shell of itself because of both major parties and we'll all be the worse for it.

No Dave, I am not a blind Democrat follower. They definitely have their issues and they too piss me off, however, that being said, their core beliefs are to me much closer to what America should be. Compassion, a second chance, a helping hand when needed and an all for one, one for all attitude. The GOP on the other hand is a selfish entity of filthy rich assholes who care nothing about their fellow man. I can't really cite one fucking thing that the GOP does that is good for the country. The Dems are far from perfect, and can improve significantly, but a bad Democrat is always better than any republican.

[7 Wishes]

Well, here's yet ANOTHER one proving Fox viewers are the LEAST well-informed and LEAST knowledgeable - and easily misled into believing lies.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/michaeltomasky/2009/aug/19/healthcare-fox-news-viewers

With respect to people SUPPORTING reform once they are TRUTHFULLY informed about it, there are many polls reflecting that trend. Here's the most recent:

In the latest NEWSWEEK Poll, the majority of Americans are opposed to President Obama's health-care reform plan—until they learn the details.

When asked about Obama's plan (without being given any details about what the legislation includes), 49 percent opposed it and 40 percent were in favor. But after hearing key features of the legislation described, 48 percent supported the plan and 43 percent remained opposed.

[7 Wishes]

Here's more proof most Americans aren't buying the usual GOP bait-and-switch, party-of-no-and-no-policies hoodwinking...

Forty-six percent of Americans prefer Obama's handling of the economy, compared to 30 percent who say the Republicans have a better approach. Similar gaps persist on job creation, tax policy, the federal budget deficit, and the handling of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. The only issue where Americans say Republicans in Congress are doing better than the president is on the use of military courts vs. civilian trials for terrorism suspects. Thirty-eight percent prefer the GOP approach while 34 percent prefer Obama's.

[Saint John]

Ever since the democrats gained control of congress in early 2007 this country has gone straight into the shitter. I remember Dean and 7 Whiskies jumping up and down about how "things were gonna change." I should go pull up the posts to emabarrass you two fuckers. Because, boy, were you right! Bush had the Dow at its historic high of 14,000 and it's nose-dived ever since congress changed hands. They demokunts regained congress in January of 2007 and that year saw the Dow have its worst one year plunge in history. Way to go, guys!

[Rockindeano]

Ever since the democrats gained control of congress in early 2007 this country has gone straight into the shitter. I remember Dean and 7 Whiskies jumping up and down about how "things were gonna change." I should go pull up the posts to emabarrass you two fuckers. Because, boy, were you right! Bush had the Dow at its historic high of 14,000 and it's nose-dived ever since congress changed hands. They demokunts regained congress in January of 2007 and that year saw the Dow have its worst one year plunge in history. Way to go, guys!

You can't be fucking serious. You aren't that stupid. You own this abysmal economy and two wars, one of which is illegal. Congratulations. Yeah dude, the country went into the shitter because of the Dems....ok. Are you drinking tonight? I am.

[Saint John]

Ever since the democrats gained control of congress in early 2007 this country has gone straight into the shitter. I remember Dean and 7 Whiskies jumping up and down about how "things were gonna change." I should go pull up the posts to emabarrass you two fuckers. Because, boy, were you right! Bush had the Dow at its historic high of 14,000 and it's nose-dived ever since congress changed hands. They demokunts regained congress in January of 2007 and that year saw the Dow have its worst one year plunge in history. Way to go, guys!

You can't be fucking serious. You aren't that stupid. You own this abysmal economy and two wars, one of which is illegal. Congratulations. Yeah dude, the country went into the shitter because of the Dems....ok. Are you drinking tonight? I am.

The war started in 2003 and the Dow was at 14,000 when there was a changing of the guard in 2007. Things were going great. Since then it's been pure shit. Obama promised how many jobs in the first 6 months? It's been 14 months and there's no end in sight for the economic woes.