Employers taking out insurance policies on their employees..

[S2M]

huh? what?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4ZdgIk8f_o&feature=channel

[Babyblue]

I saw that on GMA the other morning.Was not to happy hearing about it.

[Peartree12249]

As Mr. Potter said to George Bailey "Look at you, you're worth more dead than alive."

[Rhiannon]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.
I can't wait until I can hire minions.

[Rick]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.
I can't wait until I can hire minions.

I suggest you fire yourself, then realize the error of your ways and rehire yourself at a huge wage increase.

[Rhiannon]

I suggest you fire yourself, then realize the error of your ways and rehire yourself at a huge wage increase.

Do you know what it costs to fire somebody these days?! I'd end up breaking even. Sigh...

[bluejeangirl76]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

[Rhiannon]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

I'm gonna threaten myself to stay silent or else I'll never work in this town again!

[bluejeangirl76]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

I'm gonna threaten myself to stay silent or else I'll never work in this town again!

Careful. You might make your self do it again if you scare yourself into keeping silent.
That's how people like you are.
I'd report you for you but there are already too many people involved.

[Rhiannon]

Careful. You might make your self do it again if you scare yourself into keeping silent.
That's how people like you are.
I'd report you for you but there are already too many people involved.

You couldn't help me anyway. You're too close of a party to me, and I would have my lawyers use that against me saying I was conspiring with you against me. And you might wanna stay out of my way. I appreciate you trying to help save me from me though.

[bluejeangirl76]

Careful. You might make your self do it again if you scare yourself into keeping silent.
That's how people like you are.
I'd report you for you but there are already too many people involved.

You couldn't help me anyway. You're too close of a party to me, and I would have my lawyers use that against me saying I was conspiring with you against me. And you might wanna stay out of my way. I appreciate you trying to help save me from me though.

Ok. Now I have a nosebleed.

[Rick]

This practice should be illegal. It's most definitely a conflict of interest.

[T-Bone]

I guess it's just time to fake your own death and make out a letter clipping suicide note for ransom. Wait to see how long it is before anyone figures you out.

[stevew2]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

I often sexually harrase myself,Can a sue myself and win?

[T-Bone]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I often sexually harrase myself,Can a sue myself and win?

No... But you can sexually harrass yourself and fail!

[strangegrey]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

I'm gonna threaten myself to stay silent or else I'll never work in this town again!

You might as well just give in, keep your mouth shut and go fuck yourself for a while. Plenty a woman got to the top in the corporate world on their backs...

[strangegrey]

BTW, let me add a serious tone to this.


This is VERY common in corporate america.

However, the practice of employers insuring lower or even mid level employees is NOT pervasive in corporate america, as Michael Moore charges....another one of Moore's invented wrongs in order to sell movie tickets.


It is VERY common to insure executive level employees of companies. Members of boards and officers are often integral to operations and it is not a very bad way to protect the company's investment in the manager.

Also, keep in mind corporate execs often have pension and retirement agreements that are fairly long term and binding....often the insurance plans are there to provide protection for pension plan funding to comply with ERISA standards. Just in case the retired or still working manager dies before an actuary determines his/her day of rekoning.

The tax benefit is also worthwhile, especially on higher salaried personnel.

Regardless, Moore's charges are absolutely and categorically idiotic....and the poorly researched news media that ran this story comes off looking like a bunch of buffoons....


He's trying to undermine a very normal and functioning capitalist system, thanks to the current political climate....but there's nothing sinister about these insurance plans...

[Ehwmatt]

BTW, let me add a serious tone to this.


This is VERY common in corporate america.

However, the practice of employers insuring lower or even mid level employees is NOT pervasive in corporate america, as Michael Moore charges....another one of Moore's invented wrongs in order to sell movie tickets.


It is VERY common to insure executive level employees of companies. Members of boards and officers are often integral to operations and it is not a very bad way to protect the company's investment in the manager.

Also, keep in mind corporate execs often have pension and retirement agreements that are fairly long term and binding....often the insurance plans are there to provide protection for pension plan funding to comply with ERISA standards. Just in case the retired or still working manager dies before an actuary determines his/her day of rekoning.

The tax benefit is also worthwhile, especially on higher salaried personnel.

Regardless, Moore's charges are absolutely and categorically idiotic....and the poorly researched news media that ran this story comes off looking like a bunch of buffoons....


He's trying to undermine a very normal and functioning capitalist system, thanks to the current political climate....but there's nothing sinister about these insurance plans...

Thank you, jesus what a buncha nitwits we have here sometimes.

I pissed in Michael Moore's mouth. That was the best dream I ever had. Second best was dreaming I was in a resort hotel under attack by terrorists and my buddy and I were hammered, got into a pickup truck with a sentry gun mounted on the back like somethin out of fuckin Terminator 2, and mowed terrorists down. I was on the sentry, my buddy was driving and firing an AK out the window. I woke up after the kill count was like 6. Still vividly remember that shit.

[Peartree12249]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.
I can't wait until I can hire minions.

I suggest you fire yourself, then realize the error of your ways and rehire yourself at a huge wage increase.

Nyuk Nyuk Nyuk

[RossValoryRocks]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.
I can't wait until I can hire minions.

I thought prostitution was illegal??? Getting some A.C.O.R.N. advice there in Chicago?

[The_Noble_Cause]

BTW, let me add a serious tone to this.

This is VERY common in corporate america.

However, the practice of employers insuring lower or even mid level employees is NOT pervasive in corporate america, as Michael Moore charges....another one of Moore's invented wrongs in order to sell movie tickets.

It is VERY common to insure executive level employees of companies. Members of boards and officers are often integral to operations and it is not a very bad way to protect the company's investment in the manager.

Also, keep in mind corporate execs often have pension and retirement agreements that are fairly long term and binding....often the insurance plans are there to provide protection for pension plan funding to comply with ERISA standards. Just in case the retired or still working manager dies before an actuary determines his/her day of rekoning.

The tax benefit is also worthwhile, especially on higher salaried personnel.

Regardless, Moore's charges are absolutely and categorically idiotic....and the poorly researched news media that ran this story comes off looking like a bunch of buffoons....


He's trying to undermine a very normal and functioning capitalist system, thanks to the current political climate....but there's nothing sinister about these insurance plans...

Thank you, jesus what a buncha nitwits we have here sometimes.

Moore, (who admittedly can play fast and loose with the facts), specifically focuses on "dead peasant" policies a.k.a "dead janitor" polices in his film.
These are NOT the same as insurance policies taken out on execs; these are on rank-and-file employees ONLY.
Since some of the companies buy them in secret, there's no way of knowing just how many there are.
Companies ranging from Wal-Mart to Winn-Dixie to even Enron took them out on lower level workers.
As the Wall St. Journal says, "The practice is as widespread as it is little-known."

http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Ins ... P64954.asp
http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/ ... ril_19.htm
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/spe ... 89781.html
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/666837/posts
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124277653430137033.html

[steveo777]

Michael Moore is a fraudster

He makes his living off of conspiracy bullshit. We live in a country where it's ok to be a loon, but making a living
off of bullshit......well, is just that.

[stevew2]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I often sexually harrase myself,Can a sue myself and win?

No... But you can sexually harrass yourself and fail!

i never fail at harresing myself

[S2M]

Michael Moore is a fraudster

He makes his living off of conspiracy bullshit. We live in a country where it's ok to be a loon, but making a living
off of bullshit......well, is just that.

Journey's been doing it since '96...

[steveo777]

Michael Moore is a fraudster

He makes his living off of conspiracy bullshit. We live in a country where it's ok to be a loon, but making a living
off of bullshit......well, is just that.

Journey's been doing it since '96...

Hey, Neal Schon has played on every Journey album....so put a rag in it.

[strangegrey]

Moore, (who admittedly can play fast and loose with the facts), specifically focuses on "dead peasant" policies a.k.a "dead janitor" polices in his film.
These are NOT the same as insurance policies taken out on execs; these are on rank-and-file employees ONLY.
Since some of the companies buy them in secret, there's no way of knowing just how many there are.
Companies ranging from Wal-Mart to Winn-Dixie to even Enron took them out on lower level workers.
As the Wall St. Journal says, "The practice is as widespread as it is little-known."

Given your statement that "there's no way of knowing just how many there are"....
It kinda makes it hard for you to stand behind a statement of "the practice is as widespread as it is little-known"

One thing I'll say....I do not agree with the tax shelter motivations behind such policies....But the IRS has been trying to shore up loop holes on attempted tax avoidance since the Internal Revenue Act of 1934. They're going to continue to do so long after we're all dead, unless the government closes down the IRS or rewrites the IRC to such significance that the IRS is no longer needed. Given the current political climate, if that happens, we'll have far worse problems to worry about.

Regardless, the fact of the matter is that if any of these so-called "dead janitor" personnel are vested in a pension benefit plan, the company absolutely maintains an insurable interest in the insured. In order to comply with ERISA standards, corporations need to fund their pension benefit plans in such a way that the plan will remain funded if contributors suddenly stop contributing for one way or another. This is most likely what the case was with the Enron sub, PGE, who likely did this before Enron even purchased the company. But, hey....let's blame Enron so we can tug at the heart strings a little more. Who cares if we leave out important facts, right?

Stories about corporations taking out insurance policies and then putting circumstances in place that would result in the employee's death (like the convenience store clerk) are laughably such a minority compared to the above erisa-compliance reasons that anyone clicking through to your decade old links should seriously consider discrediting them.

You lefties are funny. You want rank and file workers to have pension plans and retirement benefits...yet you get all vag-flappy at something like an insurance policy so that corporations can comply with a law that lefties pushed into place to begin with. I suspect the corporation should grow a farm of money trees right? Oh wait...they'lll print it!!! Obama can do it, so can you!

[S2M]

All you Michael Moore haters are indeed funny.....

There are alot of inconsistencies in this country. Moore and Gore choose to bring light to these FACTS, but everyone would rather live under veils of stupidity. The guy may not have all his figures correct. Who cares is Cuba spends $211 dollars a year on patient care, when Moore stated they spend $190. Way to split hairs!! Congrats.

The guy basically gets things right, and he has good intentions. When O'Reilly was digging at him for ragging on Capitalism (and raping the point about how Moore himself is a multi-millionaire) I wanted to jump through the screen and choke Bill.

All you Neo-cons just hate the fact that Moore exposed 9/11.

But keep on keeping on folks....this shite is too funny.

[Ehwmatt]

All you Michael Moore haters are indeed funny.....

There are alot of inconsistencies in this country. Moore and Gore choose to bring light to these FACTS, but everyone would rather live under veils of stupidity. The guy may not have all his figures correct. Who cares is Cuba spends $211 dollars a year on patient care, when Moore stated they spend $190. Way to split hairs!! Congrats.

The guy basically gets things right, and he has good intentions. When O'Reilly was digging at him for ragging on Capitalism (and raping the point about how Moore himself is a multi-millionaire) I wanted to jump through the screen and choke Bill.

All you Neo-cons just hate the fact that Moore exposed 9/11.

But keep on keeping on folks....this shite is too funny.

I got a nice room in my garage, it's got padded walls. You need to get into this weird jacket-type device though before you go in and it can only be unlocked from the outside. But trust me, you'll have a good time in there

[Lula]

haven't seen the film. thought his first film, roger and me, was brilliant. don't know about these policies, but my initial thought is that something is there that is not right. as much as moore might blur the facts or stretch the truth for dramatic purpose, i believe he does have the foundation to make the claim and it is worth exploring.

[The Sushi Hunter]

I'm my own boss... it's a lose/lose.

I saw you sexually harass yourself. Do you plan to sue yourself, or will you blackmail yourself for a raise?

I'm gonna threaten myself to stay silent or else I'll never work in this town again!

You might as well just give in, keep your mouth shut and go fuck yourself for a while. Plenty a woman got to the top in the corporate world on their backs...

And once they get on the top that way, they make sure that they practice pay-back methods of management. You get a woman boss who's gone through that and as a guy you'll be forever on her shit list and the only reason you were hired by her in the first place was cause she needed a work place punching bag.