MR

Personally, I think the lowest kick in the nuts that bands could do to their former singers such as Steve Perry and Dennis DeYoung is to re-record their classics with tribute singers. It's not like the fans are beating down their doors saying, "Please re-record the classics with a YouTube tribute singer as soon as possible!" It's purely a revenge-driven act to punt the former singers in the nuts as hard as possible, and also to inflate the ego of the replacement singer/musician.

What if Keith Richards, Ron Wood, and Charlie Watts kicked Mick Jagger out tomorrow and hired a YouTube tribute singer... do you think Stones fans would be begging the guys to re-record Sympathy For The Devil? What the hell are these people smoking?

This shit is pure musical blasphemy, and makes me sick. The re-records have no fan value or entertainment value whatsoever in my opinion. It's nothing but a revenge maneuver against the former hit-making singers. The re-records become a platform for the remaining band members to say, "Hey look at us - we have a guy who can sing Steve Perry karaoke... we are the ones who made the hits, not Steve Perry... we don't need him to be successful." Bullshit. Just like Elvis tribute singers didn't need Elvis to be successful.

Just my humble opinion. What's yours?

A lot of big name bands have switched lead singers such as AC/DC, Judas Priest, and Van Halen. But they didn't waste their time re-recording their former singer's hits. How much respect would fans have had for Sammy Hagar if he would have joined Van Halen and re-recorded Running With The Devil, Ice Cream Man, and Jump? They would have lost respect for him, just as I have for these tribute singers.

Sammy focused his energy on singing NEW SONGS and made hits of his own instead of trying to become a professional impersonator of someone else's hit songs. That is the difference between hit singers and YouTube tribute singers. (Nothing against tribute singers, as long as they don't conspire to sabotage the legacy of the person they are singing tribute to.) Sammy even sang some of DLR's hits in concert, but he never re-recorded them. He didn't need to, because he had goods of his own! Instead of focusing all of the band's energy to erasing David Lee Roth's legacy, Sammy created his own.

By all means... record new albums... go on tour... sing the big hits on tour with the new YouTube tribute singer... just don't re-record them for a non-existent market. I'll have to agree with Froy from the Styx forum on this issue:

froy wrote:

ChicagoSTYX wrote:STYX is currently putting the finishing touches on REGENERATION, VOLUME 2, the follow-up to 2010’s seven-song EP, REGENERATION, VOLUME 1, which contains six newly re-recorded classics--"Come Sail Away,” "Crystal Ball," "Fooling Yourself (The Angry Young Man),” “Lorelei,” “The Grand Illusion” and “Sing For The Day”—and a brand new track, “Difference In The World.” The track listing for REGENERATION, VOLUME 2 is: “Renegade,” “Blue Collar Man,” “Too Much Time On My Hands,” “Queen of Spades,” “Coming Of Age” (Damn Yankees), “High Enough” (Damn Yankees), “Snowblind,” “Miss America.” Both volumes will be available for sale at every stop along the tour route.

anyone who buys this is an idiot

Voyager wrote:A lot of big name bands have switched lead singers such as Aerosmith, Judas Priest, and Van Halen. But they didn't waste their time re-recording their former singer's hits. How much respect would fans have had for Sammy Hagar if he would have joined Van Halen and re-recorded Running With The Devil, Ice Cream Man, and Jump? They would have lost respect for him, just as I have for these tribute singers.

Sammy focused his energy on singing NEW SONGS and made hits of his own instead of trying to become a professional impersonator of someone else's hit songs. That is the difference between hit singers and YouTube tribute singers. (Nothing against tribute singers, as long as they don't try to sabotage the legacy of the person they are singing tribute to.)

By all means... record new albums... go on tour... sing the big hits on tour with the new YouTube tribute singer... just don't re-record them for a non-existent market. I'll have to agree with Froy from the Styx forum on this issue:

froy wrote:

ChicagoSTYX wrote:STYX is currently putting the finishing touches on REGENERATION, VOLUME 2, the follow-up to 2010’s seven-song EP, REGENERATION, VOLUME 1, which contains six newly re-recorded classics--"Come Sail Away,” "Crystal Ball," "Fooling Yourself (The Angry Young Man),” “Lorelei,” “The Grand Illusion” and “Sing For The Day”—and a brand new track, “Difference In The World.” The track listing for REGENERATION, VOLUME 2 is: “Renegade,” “Blue Collar Man,” “Too Much Time On My Hands,” “Queen of Spades,” “Coming Of Age” (Damn Yankees), “High Enough” (Damn Yankees), “Snowblind,” “Miss America.” Both volumes will be available for sale at every stop along the tour route.

anyone who buys this is an idiot

Aerosmith did this?

Rick wrote:Aerosmith did this?

Didn't Aerosmith part ways with Steven Tyler for a few years and get a different singer? Maybe I was thinking about when Joe Perry left for a while to do a solo project. Okay scratch that one... but it doesn't change the argument. There are many other examples of bands who have changed lead singers and gone on to become successful without resorting to wasting energy on re-recording former hits... Genesis... AC/DC... Survivor... Rainbow...

Rick wrote:

Voyager wrote:A lot of big name bands have switched lead singers such as Aerosmith, Judas Priest, and Van Halen. But they didn't waste their time re-recording their former singer's hits. How much respect would fans have had for Sammy Hagar if he would have joined Van Halen and re-recorded Running With The Devil, Ice Cream Man, and Jump? They would have lost respect for him, just as I have for these tribute singers.

Sammy focused his energy on singing NEW SONGS and made hits of his own instead of trying to become a professional impersonator of someone else's hit songs. That is the difference between hit singers and YouTube tribute singers. (Nothing against tribute singers, as long as they don't try to sabotage the legacy of the person they are singing tribute to.)

By all means... record new albums... go on tour... sing the big hits on tour with the new YouTube tribute singer... just don't re-record them for a non-existent market. I'll have to agree with Froy from the Styx forum on this issue:

froy wrote:

ChicagoSTYX wrote:STYX is currently putting the finishing touches on REGENERATION, VOLUME 2, the follow-up to 2010’s seven-song EP, REGENERATION, VOLUME 1, which contains six newly re-recorded classics--"Come Sail Away,” "Crystal Ball," "Fooling Yourself (The Angry Young Man),” “Lorelei,” “The Grand Illusion” and “Sing For The Day”—and a brand new track, “Difference In The World.” The track listing for REGENERATION, VOLUME 2 is: “Renegade,” “Blue Collar Man,” “Too Much Time On My Hands,” “Queen of Spades,” “Coming Of Age” (Damn Yankees), “High Enough” (Damn Yankees), “Snowblind,” “Miss America.” Both volumes will be available for sale at every stop along the tour route.

anyone who buys this is an idiot

I have part 1 by Styx why not get part 2.I make no bones about it i like "Gowan" with Styx.And he is super great solo.Just saying

Someone must've watched That Metal Show this past Saturday. Eddie, Jim, and Don touched on this very topic. Eddie called it a cash grab. I agree.

Voyager wrote:

Rick wrote:Aerosmith did this?

Didn't Aerosmith part ways with Steven Tyler for a few years and get a different singer? Maybe I was thinking about when Joe Perry left for a while to do a solo project. Okay scratch that one... but it doesn't change the argument. There are many other examples of bands who have changed lead singers and gone on to become successful without resorting to wasting energy on re-recording former hits... Genesis... AC/DC... Survivor... Rainbow...

Rainbow? RJD to Graham Bonnet to Joe Lynn Turner to Doogie White.

Raibow was never successful after Dio left. They had a couple of commercial sounding tunes with Bonnet, and 3 decent songs with JLT. Stranger in Us All (1995) with White on vocals was a disgrace, and basically a springboard to Blackmore's Night

S2M wrote:Someone must've watched That Metal Show this past Saturday. Eddie, Jim, and Don touched on this very topic. Eddie called it a cash grab. I agree.

Me too!!! The folks who do this care more about money than
they care about their legacy ...CASH~ PERIOD!!

So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?


later~

Arkansas wrote:So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?

Duh, of course!

A band re-recording their own hits with a tribute singer, I find a money grab & waste of time. But I do find tribute albums interesting to listen to though. Different well known singers covering a certain band's hits, like Mickey Thomas covering MB's 'Just Take My Heart'. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arKjKhOMySs or JSS covering Aerosmith's 'Crying'. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIj9wcVuSe0

All bands do this sooner or later. It's a quick money maker.

where is the "doesn't really matter to me one way or the other as long as the original recordings are still available" option?


As long as you still have the original recordings available for purchase, who cares if they re-record it with some band member replaced? Replacing a bass player alters the integrity of the recording just as much as replacing a singer. Is it a cash grab? Sure, it is....but so are the umpteen versions of the greatest hits that are released every year by the label. If Walmart is going to offer a very good royalty rate on re-recording the material, it's easy money with minimal effort put forth by the band. More often than not, you already have the hits re-recorded for radio spots to advertise the upcoming tour. It's a business in the end, and it's stupid to turn down easy money. Doesn't mean I have any interest in buying them, but the band can release whatever they want whenever they want.

The hypocrisy is somewhat astounding at times. If Journey were to release versions of Perry singing the pre-Infinity material (as was done a little on the early tours), everyone here would be going ballistic with anticipation. If Perry were to re-join the band, there would be a thread here the very next day about which post-Perry songs could be improved with a Perry vocal to bring fans back into the fold.

btw, for what it's worth, Survivor HAS re-recorded a few songs in one fashion or another. Jimi Jamison recorded a solo version of Ever Since the World Began, and there is a studio version of Eye of the Tiger (I think with the band) floating around somewhere. There are also a few studio versions of Robin McAuley singing a few songs, although not officially available for purchase.

Once you cross the line and start replacing the original versions of the songs with re-recorded versions a la Ozzy, I start to have a problem with this. As long as the originals are still out there however, I don't see where it makes people go crazy about it.

Froy wrote:
i'm an idiot

Yeah we already knew that bud

Arkansas wrote:So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?


later~

I think that's what most people latch onto, but it really is the same situation if you re-record the hits and change the bass player or the drummer. It's just that the singer is what most people listen to first, and the rest (for a lot) is simply background music.

Arkansas wrote:So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?


later~

Good point. If Journey hired a new keyboardist or guitarist, would they re-record the classics just to 1. prove that the new player is capable, or 2. to piss the former player off?

kgdjpubs wrote:btw, for what it's worth, Survivor HAS re-recorded a few songs in one fashion or another. Jimi Jamison recorded a solo version of Ever Since the World Began, and there is a studio version of Eye of the Tiger (I think with the band) floating around somewhere. There are also a few studio versions of Robin McAuley singing a few songs, although not officially available for purchase.

Just don't touch this one. Not much of a Survivor fan, really don't know much about the band.........but this one is an all-time favorite. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e98UOB0etdo

Deb wrote:

kgdjpubs wrote:btw, for what it's worth, Survivor HAS re-recorded a few songs in one fashion or another. Jimi Jamison recorded a solo version of Ever Since the World Began, and there is a studio version of Eye of the Tiger (I think with the band) floating around somewhere. There are also a few studio versions of Robin McAuley singing a few songs, although not officially available for purchase.

Just don't touch this one. Not much of a Survivor fan, really don't know much about the band.........but this one is an all-time favorite. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e98UOB0etdo

well, you really need an education here... I honestly think Survivor has a stronger overall back catalog than Journey does, and 2 very good, albeit very different, singers in Bickler and Jamison. Don't think they have touched that one, but Dave Bickler did a pretty good version of it live when he came back in the 90s.

Voyager wrote:

Arkansas wrote:So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?


later~

Good point. If Journey hired a new keyboardist or guitarist, would they re-record the classics just to 1. prove that the new player is capable, or 2. to piss the former player off?

lol ...mmmhmm, you didn't see them redoing all Gregg's stuff when he left ...then all Smitty's stuff
after he refused to come back ...yep, it's about the SINGER!!

Michigan Girl wrote:

Voyager wrote:

Arkansas wrote:So I guess the real argument here is whether or not a band can cover themselves with anyone other than the original lineup for that particular record. In other words, isn't it just as bad to do this with another keyboard player, or drummer? Or, is it always only about a lead singer?


later~

Good point. If Journey hired a new keyboardist or guitarist, would they re-record the classics just to 1. prove that the new player is capable, or 2. to piss the former player off?

lol ...mmmhmm, you didn't see them redoing all Gregg's stuff when he left ...then all Smitty's stuff
after he refused to come back ...yep, it's about the SINGER!!

Can't say I've heard Randy-Dawg playing Wheel In The Sky either.

I prefer no, even with the same singer and even if the arrangements are changed. Unless maybe if the song is buried 10ft

What's worse:

Re-recording your own songs with one or more replacement members (particularly singers) OR

Doing a covers album.

There have been a few pretty decent covers albums (esp the Shaw/Blades effort), but man that rash of cover albums in a 3-year window got REALLY tired REALLY quick.

Ehwmatt wrote:What's worse:

Re-recording your own songs with one or more replacement members (particularly singers) OR

Doing a covers album.

There have been a few pretty decent covers albums (esp the Shaw/Blades effort), but man that rash of cover albums in a 3-year window got REALLY tired REALLY quick.

I don't really have a problem with covers albums as long as they are a stop-gap between new material. I do tend to have an issue when they become the only thing that is released (ie recent Rod Stewart).

What about if they only have to use the newer vocalist for a few songs because of legals reasons? I think the only songs Pure Prairie Leauge re-recorded with Vince Gill so they could include them in one their greatest hits packages was Amie and Two Lane Highway but those where such big hits for the band how could they not include them?

Totally agree with the author of this thread. But I think it is just common sense what Voyager said, it's blatantly obvious.

Personally I believe because the original classics/hits real hits, are so good it doesn't mater if they rerecord the songs 50 times, they will never touch the original legacy, it's all a bit of fun really, I don't see how it has any true effect on their original recordings. It not like everyone is lining up to buy the retreads, most people said they sucked anyway.

kgdjpubs wrote:where is the "doesn't really matter to me one way or the other as long as the original recordings are still available" option?


As long as you still have the original recordings available for purchase, who cares if they re-record it with some band member replaced? Replacing a bass player alters the integrity of the recording just as much as replacing a singer. Is it a cash grab? Sure, it is....but so are the umpteen versions of the greatest hits that are released every year by the label. If Walmart is going to offer a very good royalty rate on re-recording the material, it's easy money with minimal effort put forth by the band. More often than not, you already have the hits re-recorded for radio spots to advertise the upcoming tour. It's a business in the end, and it's stupid to turn down easy money. Doesn't mean I have any interest in buying them, but the band can release whatever they want whenever they want.

The hypocrisy is somewhat astounding at times. If Journey were to release versions of Perry singing the pre-Infinity material (as was done a little on the early tours), everyone here would be going ballistic with anticipation. If Perry were to
re-join the band, there would be a thread here the very next day about which post-Perry songs could be improved with a Perry vocal to bring fans back into the fold.

btw, for what it's worth, Survivor HAS re-recorded a few songs in one fashion or another. Jimi Jamison recorded a solo version of Ever Since the World Began, and there is a studio version of Eye of the Tiger (I think with the band) floating around somewhere. There are also a few studio versions of Robin McAuley singing a few songs, although not officially available for purchase.

Once you cross the line and start replacing the original versions of the songs with re-recorded versions a la Ozzy, I start to
have a problem with this. As long as the originals are still out there however, I don't see where it makes people go crazy about it.

Not much to ad here but, I agree with your post.

There is also another thing that goes on with record companies.....alot of times if a company approaches wanting to use a song in a commercial, and the record company owns the rights to the song - they re-record the song to stiff the original artist(s).....how ya like me now?

I don't know if the Sammy/VH situation is comparable...they were immediately successful right out of the gate since VH were on top when DLR was ousted. Sammy didn't need to do it and VH didn't need the attention.

Journey, Foreigner, Styx, etc didn't switch singers at the height of their careers (imagine having to replace Perry immediately after Escape??)...they were already over the "biggest band in the world" hump and their time was considered "over" when they made their switches.

This concept does nothing but piss me off. I can accept (and even enjoy) the replacement singer in concert and maybe even a live "in concert" CD, but studio re-recording of the classics is pure BS.

I really don't have any problem with bands re-recording their past hits.

Now, if Journey had re-recorded their hits and released them without releasing the Revelation album, then i would have been pissed. IMO bands should never re-record their past hits in place of new material. But as long as it's in addition to new material, I don't have any problem with it.

Regarding Survivor: As was mentioned, they have re-recorded "Eye Of The Tiger" with Jimi Jamison on lead vocals. Dave Bickler was the original lead vocalist on EOTT. However, the Survivor remake of EOTT was never released on a Survivor album.

Survivor also re-recorded their song "Rebel Girl." But it was with Dave Bickler on vocals in both cases.

And as was mentioned, Survivor have recorded new vocals of Robin McAuley singing their past songs "Eye Of The Tiger" "Reach" and "Fire Makes Steel."

If people don't want to hear the re-recorded versions of songs, then they don't have to listen to them. Jimi Jamison, Steve Perry and Lou Gramm are my 3 favorite singers of all time. It doesn't bother me if those bands (Survivor, Journey, Foreigner) re-record hits of theirs with different vocalists. Although, I'll never like the remakes as well as the originals.

But again, bands should only re-record songs in addition to new material, not in place of new material.

Deb wrote:

kgdjpubs wrote:btw, for what it's worth, Survivor HAS re-recorded a few songs in one fashion or another. Jimi Jamison recorded a solo version of Ever Since the World Began, and there is a studio version of Eye of the Tiger (I think with the band) floating around somewhere. There are also a few studio versions of Robin McAuley singing a few songs, although not officially available for purchase.

Just don't touch this one. Not much of a Survivor fan, really don't know much about the band.........but this one is an all-time favorite. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e98UOB0etdo

If you like "I Can't Hold Back," I think you would like a lot of their songs.

Are you familiar with Survivor's songs "High On You" "The Search Is Over" "Is This Love" "Didn't Know It Was Love?"