Here is the BC Mr Trump, you silly sack of shit! ;)

[Behshad]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110427/ap_ ... ertificate

[Jubilee]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110427/ap_on_el_ge/us_obama_birth_certificate

I love how The Donald takes full credit for having "forced" Obama to release his birth certificate. The man is a consumate showman. Ah, well...It won't make a bit of differenence anyhow. Some people are so emotionally invested in this foreign birth conspiracy theory that it doesn't matter what the truth is, it only matters what they believe the truth is.

[S2M]

Better get used to him...he's your next POTUS.

[Saint John]

Author Jack Cashill lays out eveidence to unpack the mystery with four speculations concerning junior's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, with her 'shadow' marriage, and the quicky birth of her only son:

1)Ann Dunham and unknown Seattle male.

"Although this theory would make sense of the family's abrupt move to Hawaii and Ann's seemingly sudden departure to Seattle after Obama's birth, it introduces too many variables I was unable to substantiate."

2)Barack Sr. and Ann Dunham

"A couple marries in a different county like Maui to keep the notification out of the local news. No one attended the wedding, not Abercrombie, not Ann's parents. In fact, no one in Barack Sr.'s clique seemed to know there was a relationship, let alone a wedding.

Neil Abercrombie's brother, Hal, never saw Ann and Barack Sr. together. Another clique member, Pake Zane, who had distinct memories of the outsized Barack Sr., could not recall Ann at all. If the young couple were making its home on Kalanianole Hwy. as the newspaper announcements claim, some friend should have at least remembered"

3)Stanley Dunham (ann's father) and unknown black woman

"This theory makes sense of the secret marriage in Maui, Stanley's enduring fondness for Barack Sr., the powerful resemblance between Stanley Dunham and Obama, and the Dunhams' apparent willingness to subsidize mother and baby in Seattle."

4)Ann Dunham and Frank Marshall Davis

"Were the married Davis the father, and had Dunham introduced his daughter to him, it may explain what Obama has described as "the complicated, unspoken transaction between the two men." In this scenario, both would have had a vested interest in finding someone else to take the paternity rap. By keeping the marriage secret, they would have allowed Barack Sr. to continue living the life of a single man."

[bluejeangirl76]

Some people are so emotionally invested in this foreign birth conspiracy theory that it doesn't matter what the truth is, it only matters what they believe the truth is.

Perception is reality. One of my all time favorite sayings.

Who cares. Is it all that far fetched that there are things about it that are unclear? It was 1961 and you had a white woman marrying and having a child with a black man... is it all that unreasonable to believe the mother would move away before the child comes? People kept that stuff quiet at that time and things like that tend to stay quiet within families either out of habit or eventually, apathy. Enough time passes, who gives a damn.

My sis and I are doing our ancestry and we found out that my dad's parents, even though they were married had and one child in 1929, one in 1930 and my dad in 1932, they were not living in same place in 1930 according to the census that year. Does it matter? Not really.

If the man has a b.c. stating he was born in a US state, that needs to be good enough until/unless someone ponies up concrete proof otherwise.

Hell, I have both a birth certificate and the original birth register from 1892 that says my grandfather's name was John, and I have a delayed record of birth filed when he was an adult that says he was born in 1983 and has different name (the one we know him by). Doesn't mean anything nefarious went on. I found out through all of this ancestry research that even the most vital stats like birth and death records and in the way old days, birth registers, don't always match up and in MANY cases, don't even exist. I have a birth register (no certificate even exists that I know of) for what would have been a great-great aunt that didn't even have a first name on it, and it was a fluke that I was ever even able to find out the name and sex of that person because in the database, it was someone else's info that was attached to it and I had to go backwards to find the right record (which was in turn attracted to someone else's name in said database).

[ebake02]

This won't satisfy these birther nut jobs. Now they're gonna start saying that it's fake or something.

[SusieP]

How can anyone take Donald Trump with THAT hair seriously?????

[ebake02]

This won't satisfy these birther nut jobs. Now they're gonna start saying that it's fake or something.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/bar ... ent-098513

You have got to be kidding...

[bluejeangirl76]

This won't satisfy these birther nut jobs. Now they're gonna start saying that it's fake or something.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/bar ... ent-098513

You have got to be kidding...

Right?

"Why, if Obama was born on August 4, 1961, was the “Date Accepted by Local Reg.” four days later on August 8, 1961?"

Because things aren't always filed and recorded in a timely manner. The accepted/filed date on mine is a few days post also. p.s. - 8/4/61 was a FRIDAY and he was born at 7 pm(ish) - the registrar's office was closed. So it was filed monday and recorded tuesday. No mystery there!!

"David A. Sinclair, the M.D. who purportedly signed the document, died nearly eight years ago at age 81. So he is conveniently unavailable to answer questions about Obama’s reported birth."

Yeah they all made sure he died 8 years ago so he could keep the secret. How very convenient of him to die like that at the untimely age of 81. (Seriously?)

I know the smoking gun isn't serious with those questions and is poking fun at the conspirators, but these are things I've actually heard on the radio today that people are serious about. I mean come on.

[Ehwmatt]

Obama is a fucking failed president. I don't care if his white mom shot his 100% black ass (yeah, or at least black when it's convenient for him) out in Hawaii, Kenya, Indonesia or wherever the fuck else. That's the facts, man. He's an incompetent man who hates this country, hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood), never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head. But hey, that's nothing we didn't know back in 2008.

Congratulations to all you screwballs who voted for him. Even heartier congratulations to those of you who CONTINUE to support the buffoon. Shit's REALLY gotten better on his watch. I hope he gets another 4 years to punish all of you sad sap liberal fucks who cry about how poor you are all day long. I'm doing just fine anyway . But, it's just sad to see this buffoon embarrass our country to this extent

[ebake02]

hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood)

You really need to pull you head out of Glenn Beck's ass.

never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head

What politician has ever worked a day in their life or is in touch with reality,besides, we didn't really have a lot to choose from. I want you to explain to me how bimbo Palin and that senile old man would have been a better choice. I think my IQ drops 30 points every time I hear Palin speak.

Obama is a fucking failed president

You can't place the blame solely of Obama either. George made a mess of this country and Obama got stuck cleaning it up. You can't expect him to deal with two separate wars and fix the worst recession in decades overnight.

[Ehwmatt]

hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood)

You really need to pull you head out of Glenn Beck's ass.

never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head

What politician has ever worked a day in their life or is in touch with reality,besides, we didn't really have a lot to choose from. I want you to explain to me how bimbo Palin and that senile old man would have been a better choice. I think my IQ drops 30 points every time I hear Palin speak.

Obama is a fucking failed president

You can't place the blame solely of Obama either. George made a mess of this country and Obama got stuck cleaning it up. You can't expect him to deal with two separate wars and fix the worst recession in decades overnight.

It's been two and a half years you buffoon. You're gonna have to stop playing the Bush card at some point. I don't listen to Beck (or any talk radio for that matter) and I didn't vote for old balls McCain. No way in hell I was voting for that goof Obama though.

I don't even care about politics any more, but man, talk about choosing the worst of all alternatives. That's what you people who voted for Obumbler did. And I laugh at all of you who continue to cry about being broke and unemployed. Gimme a break. Like I said, I really hope the guy gets 8 years. I want to see each and every one of you suffer to the maximum possible extent because (1) you're retarded and (2) the country needs to learn to never vote for a Carter or Obama type ever again.

[Saint John]

hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood)

You really need to pull you head out of Glenn Beck's ass.

never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head

What politician has ever worked a day in their life or is in touch with reality,besides, we didn't really have a lot to choose from. I want you to explain to me how bimbo Palin and that senile old man would have been a better choice. I think my IQ drops 30 points every time I hear Palin speak.

Obama is a fucking failed president

You can't place the blame solely of Obama either. George made a mess of this country and Obama got stuck cleaning it up. You can't expect him to deal with two separate wars and fix the worst recession in decades overnight.

To counter your first point, he sat contently in a church listening to a man that railed against whitey day in and day out, and did so for years. Seems to me that if you go there on your own, you probably condone what's being said.


To counter your second point, John McCain was easily a better choice. No sketchy past, a military record of honorable service and a person that we know loves this country. Obama's upbringing, circle of acquaintances and "spiritual adviser" all pointed to a guy that harbored animosity toward America.


Lastly, George Bush was handed 9-11 and the dot com bubble bursting, but we conveniently forget that. Clinton fucked around and did NOTHING when the WTC was attacked the first time, when the USS Cole was attacked, the embassy bombings, the Mogadishu debacle and the flight training and "dry runs" all took place under his nose. The attack took years to plan, but George gets the blame because it was "on his watch" and they "told him Bin Laden" was their "top priority." Good thing they did something about it when they could. The dt com bubble, chock full of cooked books, was also under his watch. He filled the balloon and George Bush cleaned up the mess after it popped. So, before you go running for excuses 2+ years deep into a presidency, realize that the last president wasn't afforded any of the excuses you're now conveniently lobbying for.

And whether Iraq was right or wrong, it led to Libya laying down their WMDs because Ghaddafi saw what happened to Hussein, and the world's probably a little safer for it. I suspect that the chain reaction will eventually lead to that nut in Iran being ousted, as well as a few other tyrants.

In short, the only thing Obama "inherited" was a whore mother and the penchant from his father to never have to work. He's taken Affirmative Action to the highest office and it's sickening. The guy is clueless.

[ebake02]

hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood)

You really need to pull you head out of Glenn Beck's ass.

never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head

What politician has ever worked a day in their life or is in touch with reality,besides, we didn't really have a lot to choose from. I want you to explain to me how bimbo Palin and that senile old man would have been a better choice. I think my IQ drops 30 points every time I hear Palin speak.

Obama is a fucking failed president

You can't place the blame solely of Obama either. George made a mess of this country and Obama got stuck cleaning it up. You can't expect him to deal with two separate wars and fix the worst recession in decades overnight.

I don't even care about politics any more, but man, talk about choosing the worst of all alternatives. That's what you people who voted for Obumbler did. And I laugh at all of you who continue to cry about being broke and unemployed. Gimme a break. Like I said, I really hope the guy gets 8 years. I want to see each and every one of you suffer to the maximum possible extent because (1) you're retarded and (2) the country needs to learn to never vote for a Carter or Obama type ever again.

The biggest problem right now isn't the president, it's those idiots that we all elected to congress. They're too busy with their little playground fight to accomplish anything.

[Behshad]

You're clueless Matt. What Bush did to this country is what set us back tremendously and we will pay the price for years to come. It's not a card. It's the truth.
And you say you're doing fine , then quit your bitching. I'm certain your buddy McCain would've screwed us over even worse.
Those who complain about being unemployed , would complain no matter who was in charge. You're as bad as them cause your totally brainwashed by Beck

[Ehwmatt]

You're clueless Matt. What Bush did to this country is what set us back tremendously and we will pay the price for years to come. It's not a card. It's the truth.
And you say you're doing fine , then quit your bitching. I'm certain your buddy McCain would've screwed us over even worse.
Those who complain about being unemployed , would complain no matter who was in charge. You're as bad as them cause your totally brainwashed by Beck

Keep blaming Bush, I'll keep laughing all the way to the bank. I'm not bitching at all. It would be nice to see some of my friends who aren't as fortunate as I am to get some help. But as a whole, I don't even follow politics any more. I just don't have the time for it and both sides are miserably corrupt. Kasich, for example, is a vindictive cock and a complete moron. I can't stand him, regardless of his being a member of the Republican party. I just have seen enough of Obama's idiocy to know he's an embarrassment to this country, and I love that he hasn't improved things one iota for anyone who voted for him.

I know it hurts to know you voted for an imbecile, but don't worry man, we all make mistakes

And for the second time, I do not listen to Beck or any talk radio. Limbaugh is definitely entertaining at times, but Beck is just an idiot whose shtick gets old REAL quick from what I've heard and read.

[ebake02]

For me McCain was way too old, if he was 10-15 years younger and had a better running mate, I may have voted for him. Nothing against Sarah Palin personally but she has no business being in politics, I watched her stick her foot in her mouth too many times. Now back to Trump, I liked what he had to say until he jumped on the "birther" bandwagon. Any politician who starts catering to the extremist minority is an automatic no for me.

[Behshad]

I know it hurts to know you voted for an imbecile, but don't worry man, we all make mistakes

It would hurt but I didn't vote for Bush

And you are bitching. no one will listen though .

[Seven Wishes2]

Obama is a fucking failed president. I don't care if his white mom shot his 100% black ass (yeah, or at least black when it's convenient for him) out in Hawaii, Kenya, Indonesia or wherever the fuck else. That's the facts, man. He's an incompetent man who hates this country, hates whites (50% of which runs through his own blood), never worked a day in his life, and is completely out of touch with reality and in over his head. But hey, that's nothing we didn't know back in 2008.

Congratulations to all you screwballs who voted for him. Even heartier congratulations to those of you who CONTINUE to support the buffoon. Shit's REALLY gotten better on his watch. I hope he gets another 4 years to punish all of you sad sap liberal fucks who cry about how poor you are all day long. I'm doing just fine anyway . But, it's just sad to see this buffoon embarrass our country to this extent

So much for the "independent" subterfuge, eh? A vast majority of things are MUCH better off than they were when Dumbya left office. Suck on it.

[Seven Wishes2]

In short, the only thing Obama "inherited" was a whore mother and the penchant from his father to never have to work. He's taken Affirmative Action to the highest office and it's sickening. The guy is clueless.

Come on, Dan. The guy got straight A's and worked his ass off for his education, and had to hold down part time jobs to subsist. Bush took more days off his first four months in office than Obama has in over two years.

Anyway, are you coming to the Charlotte show?

[SF-Dano]

. And I laugh at all of you who continue to cry about being broke and unemployed. Gimme a break. Like I said, I really hope the guy gets 8 years. I want to see each and every one of you suffer to the maximum possible extent because (1) you're retarded and (2) the country needs to learn to never vote for a Carter or Obama type ever again.

You know what man, I am no liberal and did not vote for Obama, but this attitude of fuck my countrymen is part of the problem. The "I got mine, so screw the rest of you" attitude has to stop. This is exactly what the governement (both parties) and corporate america are doing. They and their family are secure (at least for a generation or two), so screw the rest of the people in this country. There are a ton of unemployed that have nothing to do with Obama. I am employed today, will I be tomorrow? - I don't know. But I at least have compassion for those who are putting forth an effort in these trying times.

[Behshad]

. And I laugh at all of you who continue to cry about being broke and unemployed. Gimme a break. Like I said, I really hope the guy gets 8 years. I want to see each and every one of you suffer to the maximum possible extent because (1) you're retarded and (2) the country needs to learn to never vote for a Carter or Obama type ever again.

You know what man, I am no liberal and did not vote for Obama, but this attitude of fuck my countrymen is part of the problem. The "I got mine, so screw the rest of you" attitude has to stop. This is exactly what the governement (both parties) and corporate america are doing. They and their family are secure (at least for a generation or two), so screw the rest of the people in this country. There are a ton of unemployed that have nothing to do with Obama. I am employed today, will I be tomorrow? - I don't know. But I at least have compassion for those who are putting forth an effort in these trying times.

Well said !

[Melissa]

+1 B. I have family and friends who have had to face unemployment completely unexpectedly, and it's rough. Sure hope people who find it funny or whining don't end up in the same boat. Some have a hard time finding more work too due to being overqualified, too old maybe, etc. And I know plenty of others who have had hours cut either minimally (myself included) or a LOT. All of this can happen to anyone, anytime.

[Saint John]

An interesting take:

So is BO a natural born citizen? And remember, it's not enough to be [i]just a citizen as defined under the 14th Amendment, which is what BO claimed he was during his campaign. Maybe he is an American citizen, but that's not the issue. No, to be president, one has to be a "natural born citizen".

So what is a "natural born citizen"?

Rep. John Bingham (the "father of the 14th Amendment"), defined it in open session of the Congress in 1862 as-

"...persons born within the Republic, of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty, are natural born citizens."

This definition was never contested, and it was therefore accepted by the people of the land via their elected representatives.

It's all out in plain sight, for all to see. BO may be a citizen, but he is not a "natural born citizen", as required by the Constitution, because he was not born of two US-citizen parents. (His father was a Kenyan national, and a British subject, who never swore allegiance to the United States.)

Sorry all you Constitution haters... That's the law. You may not like it, but there it is. He's ineligible to be president. End of story. [/i]

Thoughts?

[Seven Wishes2]

Come on, Dan. You're obviously an extremely intelligent guy. Then you pipe this smelly shit though the sewer pipe.

The far-right fringe will stop at nothing at this point.

[Behshad]

Way off Saint John

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html

[ebake02]

An interesting take:

So is BO a natural born citizen? And remember, it's not enough to be [i]just a citizen as defined under the 14th Amendment, which is what BO claimed he was during his campaign. Maybe he is an American citizen, but that's not the issue. No, to be president, one has to be a "natural born citizen".

So what is a "natural born citizen"?

Rep. John Bingham (the "father of the 14th Amendment"), defined it in open session of the Congress in 1862 as-

"...persons born within the Republic, of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty, are natural born citizens."

This definition was never contested, and it was therefore accepted by the people of the land via their elected representatives.

It's all out in plain sight, for all to see. BO may be a citizen, but he is not a "natural born citizen", as required by the Constitution, because he was not born of two US-citizen parents. (His father was a Kenyan national, and a British subject, who never swore allegiance to the United States.)

Sorry all you Constitution haters... That's the law. You may not like it, but there it is. He's ineligible to be president. End of story. [/i]

Thoughts?

Section 1 of the 14th amendment says the following:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. "

Here's a link if you don't believe me --------> http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/amendmentxiv

As for the presidential requirement let me refer you to Article II Section 1:

"No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States."

http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articleii

[Saint John]

Way off Saint John

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html

"To be President, not only must you be a citizen, but you must also be natural-born."

Natural-born ... The Founders knew what it meant, and you can see that by reading their letters from the time. And the concept of "Hereditary Allegiance" (vs. what was being practiced in England, "Territorial Allegiance") was put forth by de Vattel in his book The Law of Nations in the 1750's, and from which the Founders are said to have drawn.

All of this serves to paint a picture and/or establishes precedent for understanding the basic tenets upon which the Constitution was framed, including the definition of "natural born citizen" as the Founders knew and intended it to be applied.

[Seven Wishes2]

The neo-conservative movement is a thinly veiled and only somewhat secular contemporary version of the Council of Nicaea. Those who align themselves with the Tea Party lunatic finge right to any extent are inherently racist and un-American.

[Saint John]

As for the presidential requirement let me refer you to Article II Section 1:

"No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States."

I see you highlighted the word "or." Are you seriously trying to argue that he was a citizen "at the time of the adoption of this Constitution"? Because that's what's being said in what you quoted.

There is scant primary source material attesting to the 1787 Constitutional debate over Article II, Section I, which contains the "natural born" provision. The potential scourge of foreign influence, however, is mentioned several times in the Federalist Papers. And in a letter dated July 25, 1787, John Jay, the future first Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, wrote to George Washington:

Permit me to hint, whether it would not be wise & seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of Foreigners into the administration of our national Government; and to declare expressly that the Command in chief of the American army shall not be given to, nor devolve on, any but a natural born Citizen.

The Constitution does include an exemption for "a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of this Constitution," as the framers themselves had been born subjects of the British crown. Also, the founding document doesn't include a definition of "natural born." The formal definition is now covered by Title 8, Section 1401 of the United States Code and includes not just citizens born on American soil, but also those born outside the nation to parents who are citizens—an exception that covers, for example, the children of military personnel serving overseas.