How to Deal With Difficult People

[scarygirl]

I am dealing with an antagonistic boss. Latest episode concerns vacation days. To the best of my knowledge, I have taken maybe 1/2 a day off in vacation days this year.

A couple days of ago, I asked my boss if I was still getting off for the July 4th holiday. I was concerned because this year it falls in the middle of the week, the day before a major deadline. I also mentioned the possibility of taking off Monday, July 2nd because my mother is coming to town.

FYI- I was fine either way. I would have given up one for the other if necessary. The crux of my email was to please let me know so I could plan accordingly.

He emailed me and said July 4th was fine because that was a company holiday. He also said July 2nd was fine so long as I have my work caught up. He then asked me if I had been keeping tracking of my vacation days and to please email him a list of vacation days I had taken this year as I only get five.

I emailed him saying to the best of my knowledge I had taken maybe half a day off this year, the Friday before the start of Memorial Day weekend. I also took Memorial Day Monday because that is considered to be a company holiday separate from vacation days.

He emailed me back stating that I must have a funny calendar because I also took half a day off Friday, May 11th and the whole day off Monday, May 14th, the equivalent of 3 days

Never mind that one of those supposed days was a company holiday separate from Vacation days, but whatever....

I worked both those days and told him so. He insists that I took those days off, but whatever, he will say for argument’s sake I took one and half a days off and that HE will keep better track of my days off to avoid such questions in the future. The snide insuation being that I don't keep track....

Now I have proof that I worked both of those days through saved emails, work logs etc. Do I email him proof or just let it lay?

BTW, how is my grammar in this post? I am trying hard to watch my grammar these days....

[scarygirl]

FYI- I am not one to ask for a lot of days off. I have not taken a real vacation in years. Most of my vacations have been three day weekends that fell around major holidays. Past sales reps have taken week long vacations within weeks of their start date. We also had a sales rep take a vacation in the middle of a deadline. Nothing was said.

[conversationpc]

Now I have proof that I worked both of those days through saved emails, work logs etc. Do I email him proof or just let it lay?

I would email him the proof and just try to put it as matter of factly as possible.

BTW, how is my grammar in this post? I am trying hard to watch my grammar these days....

There's no major mistakes there that I can see on just a quick read-through.

[conversationpc]

FYI- I am not one to ask for a lot of days off. I have not taken a real vacation in years. Most of my vacations have been three day weekends that fell around major holidays. Past sales reps have taken week long vacations within weeks of their start date. We also had a sales rep take a vacation in the middle of a work deadline. Nothing was said.

For your sanity, I would suggest definitely taking at least one whole week off a year. Just for myself, I really need that to stay grounded and avoid burnout.

[slucero]

focus on the topic, not the person...

provide him copies (keep the originals)... do it in person if you can, he'll appreciate it.. and it will force him speak to you more professionally than the impersonal nature of email allows..

At the same time let him know that you understand he's busy... and say "here's the information you asked for"... and let it lie for a week before revisiting it...

[Rick]

Make sure you reclaim those vacation days as you have earned them. If it was my supervisor, I'd kick him right in the shin bone.

I would go nuts without a vacation. I was off this past week, I have to work next week, then I'm off the week of the 4th. It's good to be away from the airport in the summer. That ramp gets HOT!

[Marabelle]

Hey ScarySpice!

I'd drop him an email with the words "for clarification purposes" and cite all correspondence of the day or days in question. People have given you some good advice. You've earned the time and should be able to use it! Either you are very good and he can't get the job done without you being there or he's cheap and doesn't want to pay for time off.
Good luck!

[Don]

I usually ask my payroll department to email my current vacation time accrued and remaining sick days for the calendar year at the end of every month. We use business Gmail so I keep all of those emails in a folder and forward to my personal non-company Gmail account also. I've never had a problem though but always better safe than sorry.
For me, I'm more concerned with vacation days as I am usually at my 18 day max and since we don't pay out for overages ( unless I'm terminated or resign) I don't want to automatically lose those days because of forgetting to take them.
One vacation day is a nice bit of money so I would ask the boss for a get together (not through email) so you could go over what days you have accrued. That's when you bring printed copies of your emails to dispute any days that he has already dinged you for.

[artist4perry]

If you get 5 a year then taking it away from you is shortchanging your pay.

If you have proof you worked, then say I was concerned that you might be right about me missing those two days in question. So I checked my records and here is the paperwork that shows I worked those days. I just wanted to be sure I did not make a mistake. Show it to him, then he cannot dispute the facts, and your not being a smart alleck.

Say that you were wanting to make sure the records were clear on how many days you have taken off. Be sweet and matter of factly.

I would be mad if I had proof and he still shortchanged you. Does he do this to all the employees? Both male and female? Some bosses just hate giving holidays to anyone. That means they have to make up for the loss of that person, or get a temp to fill in for them. Don't take it too personally.

[artist4perry]

P.S. I can see why your interviewing for a new job . Hang in there.

[ebake02]

I would try to handle it between the two of you then go to HR your still gives you grief.

[yulog]

I would try to handle it between the two of you then go to HR your still gives you grief.

I'm curious, if she only gets 5 days off a year if there is a HR department , she may be just working in a small office with this guy who has control over everything.......if thats the case get a new job, 5 days off a year is a horrible benefits plan, you should be able to do better than that pretty much anywhere else

[DrFU]

Too girly and apologetic, Scary. "to the best of my knowledge" gives him permission to walk over you like a doormat. This is a business relationship, and it is not fine for him to take away two vacation days you have earned.

As the others have suggested, put your documentation together and give it to him for clarification.

[Peartree12249]

Send him a clarifying e-mail then look for another job. Your benefits suck!

[Andrew]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

[Liam]

'Drew...buy me concert tix to write you reviews, and I'll work for ya.

[Rip Rokken]

Scary, plenty of good advice, and I like Ginger's take. The approach ideally gets the point across without seeming challenging, and may get a better response. For the future, I highly recommend the book "Toxic Coworkers" - you'll find him in
there somewhere, and it has great advice for dealing with several difficult personality types from the perspectives of a co-worker, employee, or boss. Very cheap on Amazon. Good luck!

[conversationpc]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

Must be nice but I don't want government mandating what my employer has to do because we get compensated in other ways for it. That being said, I just got my third week of vacation last year and I have been with my company now for going on 14 years.

[yulog]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

Must be nice but I don't want government mandating what my employer has to do because we get compensated in other ways for it. That being said, I just got my third week of vacation last year and I have been with my company now for going on 14 years.

Those govt jobs are the best for PTO. I believe they start at 4-5 weeks off per year plus they usually have 10- 14 paid holidays off per year
I know people are pissed how our govt. wastes money(and this will probably never change), I just think its a case of "if you can't beat them , join them"

[ebake02]

I would try to handle it between the two of you then go to HR your still gives you grief.

I'm curious, if she only gets 5 days off a year if there is a HR department , she may be just working in a small office with this guy who has control over everything.......if thats the case get a new job, 5 days off a year is a horrible benefits plan, you should be able to do better than that pretty much anywhere else

At the last place I worked, you were only given 3 paid days off per year. On the other hand, you could also take up to 7 unexcused, unpaid days if you needed too.

[Ehwmatt]

If you know vacation days are a sticking point with this guy, my biggest piece of advice would be to discuss these things face-to-face and not via e-mail. I've talked to some business owners who get really angry when an employee lamely e-mails them asking (or worse, TELLING) the employer she will be absent.

Put yourself in his shoes. If he's an owner of the company or otherwise just a manager who gets grief if his department doesn't meet deadlines, finish projects etc., you have to remember that employers have to comply with a LOT of laws governing disabled and sick employees (the most significant laws being worker's comp [any employer], the Americans with Disabilities Act (15+ employees), and the Family Medical Leave Act [50+ employees]). Unfortunately, a lot of lazy employees use these laws to clothe their laziness with legal protection.

I know from talking with several business owners and executives that they get particularly frustrated with the FMLA because you pretty much have to deal with employees lying to you about needing "FMLA leave" (or dealing with the enormous burden of verifying each request for leave by requesting a doctor's certification, which employers are loathe to do for morale AND cost reasons) and you HAVE to grant them the allotted leave (again, you can try and verify their reasons, but particularly in a large company, trying to do so is risky and time-consuming business). It's frustrating, and you have to tread lightly in dealing with an employee you suspect is lying to you because there are anti-retaliation provisions in all these laws too.

Maybe he is rightly or wrongly suspicious of days you've taken off before; maybe he just has to deal with a lot of crap as far as employees gaming the FMLA/ADA or the leave policy. Or maybe he's just downright hostile to the idea of taking "vacation days" because he himself doesn't take many.

Whatever the case may be, it seems vacation days and time off are sticking points for him. Deal with it face-to-face. That will enable you to (1) stand your ground and assert facts surrounding your vacation time and clear up any misconceptions on his part, (2) show him you are asking for the vacation day in good faith, and (3) most of all, not risk him construing one of these back-and-forth e-mail exchanges about vacation day discrepancies as your getting flippant with or incredulous at his requests for information/clarification.

[yulog]

I would try to handle it between the two of you then go to HR your still gives you grief.

I'm curious, if she only gets 5 days off a year if there is a HR department , she may be just working in a small office with this guy who has control over everything.......if thats the case get a new job, 5 days off a year is a horrible benefits plan, you should be able to do better than that pretty much anywhere else

At the last place I worked, you were only given 3 paid days off per year. On the other hand, you could also take up to 7 unexcused, unpaid days if you needed too.

What kind of a job was this?

[ebake02]

I would try to handle it between the two of you then go to HR your still gives you grief.

I'm curious, if she only gets 5 days off a year if there is a HR department , she may be just working in a small office with this guy who has control over everything.......if thats the case get a new job, 5 days off a year is a horrible benefits plan, you should be able to do better than that pretty much anywhere else

At the last place I worked, you were only given 3 paid days off per year. On the other hand, you could also take up to 7 unexcused, unpaid days if you needed too.

What kind of a job was this?

Factory

[The Sushi Hunter]

Re: How to Deal With Difficult People....

For sure it is best to discuss this type of issue face to face if possible. If he's got an agenda, he will take you walking in with copies of documents as a threat. If you do go in and talk with him, yeah, bring in your original documents as reference materials to support your side of it, if he wants a copy, he will ask.

Also in regards to HR, he's the middle man between you and the company, in regards to reporting to HR your paid holidays, PTO, floater holidays, sick time, etc. If he still give you issues, you can always talk with HR and provide them with your documents in regards to proof of how much time off you did and did not use.

But again, if this guy or the company as a whole, has some type of agenda which is not in your best interests, demonstrating that you have documentation will only piss him and/or the company off since it's showing that he and/or the company is up to something and that your documenting it. But the best way to handle it is to talk face to face with him. If that doesn't remedy the issue, go to HR about it. Plus document all of these meetings, because this issue may be revisited in the future and having documentation in regards to the problem and documentation that you had discussions about it and with whom will benefit you. Also document what the outcome of each meeting that you had was.

[scarygirl]

Re: How to Deal With Difficult People....

For sure it is best to discuss this type of issue face to face if possible. If he's got an agenda, he will take you walking in with copies of documents as a threat. If you do go in and talk with him, yeah, bring in your original documents as reference materials to support your side of it, if he wants a copy, he will ask.

Also in regards to HR, he's the middle man between you and the company, in regards to reporting to HR your paid holidays, PTO, floater holidays, sick time, etc. If he still give you issues, you can always talk with HR and provide them with your documents in regards to proof of how much time off you did and did not use.

But again, if this guy or the company as a whole, has some type of agenda which is not in your best interests, demonstrating that you have documentation will only piss him and/or the company off since it's showing that he and/or the company is up to something and that your documenting it. But the best way to handle it is to talk face to face with him. If that doesn't remedy the issue, go to HR about it. Plus document all of these meetings, because this issue may be revisited in the future and having documentation in regards to the problem and documentation that you had discussions about it and with whom will benefit you. Also document what the outcome of each meeting that you had was.

The name of the company is "Me, Myself, and my Boss Inc." It is just the two of us. No HR. I started to email him Sunday night, but thought the better of it. Knowing him, he would twist my words and use them against me.

I am actively seeking another job. I am really bummed though because it has been two weeks since my supposed sure "we'll interview you" email. I sent a follow-up email yesterday and so far, nothing.

[scarygirl]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

I will take your job offer under advisement. Can one of my non-paid perks be listening to Steve's more recent demos?

[Andrew]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

I will take your job offer under advisement. Can one of my non-paid perks be listening to Steve's more recent demos?

LOL

[steveo777]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

I will take your job offer under advisement. Can one of my non-paid perks be listening to Steve's more recent demos?

You realize that anything "recent" from Steve is probably fairly old and might smell like socks, right?

[tater1977]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

I will take your job offer under advisement. Can one of my non-paid perks be listening to Steve's more recent demos?

You realize that anything "recent" from Steve is probably fairly old and might smell like socks, right?

What are you doing in SPs dirty sock hamper?

[steveo777]

Full time Aussie workers get 4 weeks paid leave per year. Screw 5 days! Come work for me....I can't pay you, but you can have 8 weeks off per year.

I will take your job offer under advisement. Can one of my non-paid perks be listening to Steve's more recent demos?

You realize that anything "recent" from Steve is probably fairly old and might smell like socks, right?

What are you doing in SPs dirty sock hamper?

At least I'm not in his sewer pipe gleaning corn from shit.