MR

A (younger) friend posted last night on Twitter that he thought a certain band has had the largest impact on rock music in history, "hands down." I laughed until I realized he was serious, then I told him which band I thought has had the biggest impact. (Apologies if this topic's been covered before/recently) So I ask you good people, which band do you think has "hands down" had the largest impact on rock-n-roll in history?

I, for one, do not buy into the whole single most influential band thing. If you had to pick one, then yes, the Beatles. But music is so much more than that and obviously the Beatles were inspired by others and so how far do you go back? Picking one seems to ignore too many others.

However, the answer is The Beatles. Any other answers are an attempt to push an agenda.

You could also argue that people who argue the Beatles are the most influential are pushing an agenda. How many times have you heard X drummer from some band that's been around only the last 15 years say "Ringo Starr is the best fucking drummer of all time, and if you don't believe that get the earwax outta yer ears!!"

It's definitely the Beatles. There are others that are close, i.e. Rolling Stones, Elvis, Led Zeppelin, The Who, Rush, KISS, and a couple of others.

verslibre wrote:You could also argue that people who argue the Beatles are the most influential are pushing an agenda. How many times have you heard X drummer some band that's been around only the last 15 years say "Ringo Starr is the best fucking drummer of all time, and if you don't believe that get the earwax outta yer ears!!"

The question isn't what band had the best musicians but what band has been the most influential. The Beatles have probably inspired tons of musicians who don't necessarily think the individual members of the Beatles are the best at their chosen instrument.

conversationpc wrote:

verslibre wrote:You could also argue that people who argue the Beatles are the most influential are pushing an agenda. How many times have you heard X drummer some band that's been around only the last 15 years say "Ringo Starr is the best fucking drummer of all time, and if you don't believe that get the earwax outta yer ears!!"

The question isn't what band had the best musicians but what band has been the most influential. The Beatles have probably inspired tons of musicians who don't necessarily think the individual members of the Beatles are the best at their chosen instrument.

Influential = inspired by. So if you put Ringo at the top of your list of drummer influences, he's the most influential, right?

Beatles.

The thing is, all these bands that cite the Beatles as most influential...I don't hear a lick of it in their music.

Now World Party, I understand...because that fool WANTED to channel the Beatles and the Beach Boys.

I think the Beatles influence was mostly songwriting and arranging...

Lennon & McCartney were really influenced by the songwriters they listened to as adolescents (songwriters of the 40's) and the music they grew up with as teens (Elvis and Black R&B) ... and that became the basis for their songwriting and arranging.

The Beatles largely invented the "B section" in pop music... and made really good musical use of use of irony, anticipation and suspense.. things that really hadn't been done before.

An example of "anticipation" is the 4 part vocal harmony buildup that occurs just before they launch back into "Shake it up baby now... shake it up baby".. in the song Twist and Shout...

All of this stuff hits a listener subliminally, but really does work.

There's a book called "The Songwriting Secrets of The Beatles" that I have that goes into it in pretty good detail, from a historical level (Lennon and McCartney's musical influences) and a music theory level.

verslibre wrote:The thing is, all these bands that cite the Beatles as most influential...I don't hear a lick of it in their music.

Now World Party, I understand...because that fool WANTED to channel the Beatles and the Beach Boys.

You must not have listened to any Oasis then.

UncleKG wrote:

verslibre wrote:The thing is, all these bands that cite the Beatles as most influential...I don't hear a lick of it in their music.

Now World Party, I understand...because that fool WANTED to channel the Beatles and the Beach Boys.

You must not have listened to any Oasis then.

You had to go and remind me. And I DID own a CD of theirs in the '90s!

I think Noel Gallagher was even more inspired by their fuckin' hairdos...

The bands/artists who had the biggest impact on rock are the ones who've done the most drugs, tattoos, plastic surgeries, etc. Popularity seems to revolve around the shit they do in their spare time, not necessarily just the music that they are involved in.

Someone mentioned the Beatles. They were quite an influence in the U.S. But look at what only five years of drug using did to them:

1964:



1969:

Through the years you hear various musicians tell you who or what style influenced them. "When I first seen the Beatles on the Ed Sullivan show I knew thats what I wanted to to." When I seen Led Zep playing at MSG I knew thats what I wanted to do." I have read where many musicians cite KISS as their #1 reason for getting into music and forming a band. I'm sure if you asked 100 of them what inspired them, they would give you 99 different reasons. Speaking of Oasis I remember reading where one of the Gallagher brothers stated "We're going to big bigger than the Beatles". BWHAAAAAAAAAA!

verslibre wrote:

conversationpc wrote:

verslibre wrote:You could also argue that people who argue the Beatles are the most influential are pushing an agenda. How many times have you heard X drummer some band that's been around only the last 15 years say "Ringo Starr is the best fucking drummer of all time, and if you don't believe that get the earwax outta yer ears!!"

The question isn't what band had the best musicians but what band has been the most influential. The Beatles have probably inspired tons of musicians who don't necessarily think the individual members of the Beatles are the best at their chosen instrument.

Influential = inspired by. So if you put Ringo at the top of your list of drummer influences, he's the most influential, right?

But that doesn't mean they think that person is the best musician at their respective instrument. I've heard tons of guitarists list Ace Frehley as a major influence but I don't know anyone who would say that guy is a technically brilliant guitarist.

conversationpc wrote:

verslibre wrote:

conversationpc wrote:The question isn't what band had the best musicians but what band has been the most influential. The Beatles have probably inspired tons of musicians who don't necessarily think the individual members of the Beatles are the best at their chosen instrument.

Influential = inspired by. So if you put Ringo at the top of your list of drummer influences, he's the most influential, right?

But that doesn't mean they think that person is the best musician at their respective instrument. I've heard tons of guitarists list Ace Frehley as a major influence but I don't know anyone who would say that guy is a technically brilliant guitarist.

That's why I said influences, since we're not talking about technical virtuosity. Jimmy Page would no doubt be ranked a more influential guitarist than Joe Satriani, who no doubt is far and away a technically superior guitar player.

Fact Finder wrote:Beatles, followed closely by the Stones, no question about it.

Agreed.

Black Sabbath, Rush, Metallica, KISS, Van Halen

I hate The Beatles. Such stupid, simple, mundane, "safe" songs. They're not scary to old ladies or little girls so they got huge. All there is to it.

The Bay City Rollers. Yeah, definitely, The Bay City Rollers!

Journey/Survivor wrote:The Bay City Rollers. Yeah, definitely, The Bay City Rollers!

I have their greatest hits, I dont have any Beatles albums, but that wasnt the question.......

The Beatles

It cannot be questioned. It cannot be argued. They were not technical virtuosos. They were not gifted with brilliant voices. They were certainly influenced out of the gate by what came before them.

BUT -

Every, single thing in modern pop, rock and even country music can be traced back to something they did first. Once they stopped playing live and became a studio band, they were the most diverse, prolific, and daring "rock" bands on the planet...bar none. They did things with music, and recording, and structure, and melody that people have been copying and replicating ever since. The question is not "who is the best guitar player"...the question is "what single band had THE biggest impact on Rock music?" The answer to that question is absolutely The Beatles.

Were it not The Beatles, would it have been a differet band? Of course. But it wasn't...it was The Beatles.

Is IS The Beatles.

Styx

Pelata wrote:The Beatles

It cannot be questioned. It cannot be argued. They were not technical virtuosos. They were not gifted with brilliant voices. They were certainly influenced out of the gate by what came before them.

BUT -

Every, single thing in modern pop, rock and even country music can be traced back to something they did first. Once they stopped playing live and became a studio band, they were the most diverse, prolific, and daring "rock" bands on the planet...bar none. They did things with music, and recording, and structure, and melody that people have been copying and replicating ever since. The question is not "who is the best guitar player"...the question is "what single band had THE biggest impact on Rock music?" The answer to that question is absolutely The Beatles.

Were it not The Beatles, would it have been a differet band? Of course. But it wasn't...it was The Beatles.

Is IS The Beatles.

Did The Who copy The Beatles?

Pelata wrote:The Beatles

It cannot be questioned. It cannot be argued. They were not technical virtuosos. They were not gifted with brilliant voices. They were certainly influenced out of the gate by what came before them.

BUT -

Every, single thing in modern pop, rock and even country music can be traced back to something they did first. Once they stopped playing live and became a studio band, they were the most diverse, prolific, and daring "rock" bands on the planet...bar none. They did things with music, and recording, and structure, and melody that people have been copying and replicating ever since. The question is not "who is the best guitar player"...the question is "what single band had THE biggest impact on Rock music?" The answer to that question is absolutely The Beatles.

Were it not The Beatles, would it have been a differet band? Of course. But it wasn't...it was The Beatles.

Is IS The Beatles.

The very interesting thing about the Beatles is the producer who did much of their record producing. Over the years I got a hold of this really incredible documentary on the Beatles which I think was produced sometime in the late 70s and then converted to Beta in the 80's. It's about two hours long and has intense interviews with George Martin, the producer who worked on most of their albums. After watching this documentary, you can see that a lot of the Beatles success from their work was because of George Martin. It was he who was able to harvest the messages and material from each of the members and put it all together in song form. At least that's the feeling I got after viewing this documentary. A lot of sound effects on some of their later albums was Martin piecing together various recordings that were previously recorded of the Beatles in the studio.

If your interested, the documentary I have on Beta is the same one on the ebay auction listed below. This documentary is for those of you who consider yourselves serious Beatle fans. I loved the Beatles music when I was a kid, they were the very first band I became a fan of and that was something like 10 years after the fact (since they had broken up. I actually became a fan of them within a few months of Lennon being shot. It was at that point when I became a collector of Beatles albums and merchandise. And I was very intrigued with this documentary. It's a must have for those of you who really get into the Beatles. You could probably find it on youtube as well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-COMPLEAT-BE ... 898wt_1141

Fact Finder wrote:

Journey/Survivor wrote:The Bay City Rollers. Yeah, definitely, The Bay City Rollers!

Paul Revere and the Raiders, Bobby Sherman, Donny Osmond, and Leif Garrett. Oh, and Josie and the Pussy Cats.

I remember in '76 one of my favorite tunes was by the Bay City Rollers, "I only want to be with you" and I also loved the Monkeys music too, all when I was single digit age.

The Beatles documentary I was mentioning previously, it is on youtube but in many parts.

Here's the first part which you can watch and may get you interested enough to watch all the parts. I think it was done very well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RBEFKNvWC4

verslibre wrote:

Pelata wrote:The Beatles

It cannot be questioned. It cannot be argued. They were not technical virtuosos. They were not gifted with brilliant voices. They were certainly influenced out of the gate by what came before them.

BUT -

Every, single thing in modern pop, rock and even country music can be traced back to something they did first. Once they stopped playing live and became a studio band, they were the most diverse, prolific, and daring "rock" bands on the planet...bar none. They did things with music, and recording, and structure, and melody that people have been copying and replicating ever since. The question is not "who is the best guitar player"...the question is "what single band had THE biggest impact on Rock music?" The answer to that question is absolutely The Beatles.

Were it not The Beatles, would it have been a differet band? Of course. But it wasn't...it was The Beatles.

Is IS The Beatles.

Did The Who copy The Beatles?

What does The Who (amazing band) have to do with anything I said?

Definitely the Beatles. There are so many great rock musicians who were inspired to pick up a guitar because of the Beatles. These musicians then in turn inspired the next generation and so on. But it all began with the Fab Four.

Poison, hands down.

Peartree12249 wrote:Definitely the Beatles. There are so many great rock musicians who were inspired to pick up a guitar because of the Beatles. These musicians then in turn inspired the next generation and so on. But it all began with the Fab Four.

Absolutely no doubt about it....and world wide at that. It wasn't just the music that got them so famous either. There were also other factors at play such as the conspiracy theory that Paul McCartney had died and a look-alike such as his secret twin brother or other had taken his place. Also at one point one of the beatles, I think it was Lennon, had commented that they were more popluar than Jesus Christ himself, which from that comment came a huge anti-Beatles movement but in the end seemed to benefit them more than damage them. And then there were all the drugs and Lennon joining up with Yoko and both becoming protestors of various causes. So there were other factors involved in them that got them recognition and attention outside of the music itself. I personally believe that it was the Beatles influence that created the hippy movement, but I could be wrong.

In regards to the Beatles providing world wide music influences, there were several bands in Japan who mimicked the Beatles style both musically and appearance wise. I'm sure there were bands around the world to do the same as well. Specifically in Japan the two bands that come to mind are Carol and The Golden Cups. Even as current as the 80's, there was a subculture in Japan who continued to act out the styles of the late 50's and early 60's, such style as what the Beatles were known for in the at that same timeframe in Liverpool England. I personnally knew some which if I went to their homes, they always had some type of Beatle memorabilia such as original albums, ticket stubs, original Beatle merchandise, etc. in their rooms. That I am aware of, I'd say the Japanese were the ones that held onto the Beatles era longer than any other culture ever did. This could be in part because of Yoko Ono's affiliation with the Beatles. Yoko Ono came from a very wealthy family and who's grandfather on her mother's side of the family was royalty in Japan. This I'm sure had influence on how the Japanese viewed the Beatles after Yoko became involved wth Lennon.

conversationpc wrote:It's definitely the Beatles. There are others that are close, i.e. Rolling Stones, Elvis, Led Zeppelin, The Who, Rush, KISS, and a couple of others.

Summed up nicely. Add in Beach Boys, Deep Purple, Pink Floyd...

But Beatles by a million miles overall. Their appearance on US TV - Ed Sullivan show - alone was the catalyst for the launching of 1000 careers.

I know it doesn't fit the label 'Band', but an artist that in my eyes shaped how rock SINGERS sing was Little Richard.
Lennon and McCartney (particularly Lennon) express the opinion that he influenced their 'Rocky' edge to their vocals.
Bowie also said that when he heard Little Richard, he 'Heard God' and that is started off what later became Rock. Jimmi Hendrix was also Little Richards' Guitar player, James Brown his backing vocalist and Billy Preston was his organ player! That sounds very much like somebody who shaped rock music.
Elvis may have had more of the 'look', but I personally feel that Richard had the sound to mould what later became rock music.
Then again, Hendrix, Prince etc. did completely steal his look, so he influenced there too!