Who would have the best chance at a top 40 hit?

[AR]

I'm sure you are hardcore on this topic...the "times have changed" argument excuses the failure of the Steve Augeri era...and keeps the denial going strong no matter far Journey travel downhill.

You say "Arrival" was a commercial disappointment in 2001 because "times have changed". Well, "Crush" by Bon Jovi sold 7.5 million albums wordwide in 2001 and it went double-platium in the US...whereas "Arrival" sold 250,000.

I noticed you dodged my TBF example...the mid-1990s was a diastrrous time for the classic rock/AOR scene because alternative/complaint rock was at it's height...and 80s nostalgia hadn't yet kicked in. Despite this Journey - as we all know - sold one million albums (750,000 more than "Arrival" did) and were nominated for as Grammy...

As for Soundscan....well, this applies to pretty pop acts and rap stars too. It's easier to chart high with a low-selling release for any act of any age in any genre.

Let's not forget about DVD sales...the KISS Second Coming DVD went double platinum in the late 1990s (twenty years after the band's commercial peak) and the Journey Greatest Hits DVD went platinum...

How many did the 2001 Vegas DVD sell? I suspect that it was considerably lower...which again was surely a reflection of the weakness of the Augeri line-up rather than "the times".

Your ignoring that the Vegas DVD did VERY well.

TBF was a failure compared to previous Journey sales. WOW a whole million. (I suspect it did better than that, but I really have no idea honestly) So if that one (the big reunion) with Perry sold a whopping million, one in 2006 is going to break the bank? Puh-lease. Grammy? Well Jethro Tull won a heavy metal one over Metallica. See what I'm getting at?

Arrival is a better album than Trial By Fire. PERIOD. Now we can disagree there and that is fair, but I will have that bias, and I freely admit that. In the end we are all fans of this type of music, so I have be honest on that, ok?

Arrival failed commercially more for no push from the record company, but yes times had changed. Times changing affected TBF as well. 1 million? That is nothing. Arrival did not fail as an enjoyable piece of work though IMO.

By the way, Neil Schon hates TBF album and told me that it just doesn't go anywhere. (Wilmington, DE 8/25/01. )

As for Soundscan....well, this applies to pretty pop acts and rap stars too. It's easier to chart high with a low-selling release for any act of any age in any genre.

I agree with that statement. However you used the chart positions of Leppard & Co. as successful releases when they really were not.

It's all cool. I like talking about this stuff.

[AR]

Just to add, as much as I think "Arrival" is just a fantastic album...... I really do not care for Red 13, and only like 4 or 5 off of Generations.

I wanted Journey to paint it by the numbers, and Arrival did that for the most part. There is some filler on it too, but overall it was the direction I was hoping for. TBF was a funeral dirge (minus Message of Love - which was very good). Arrival rocks more, and TBF is just plodding, save for a moment or two here and there.

All opinion of course. Just wanted to make it clear how I feal about the post Perry material.

"To Be Alive Again" would have fit nicely on "Escape"

[Matthew]

I'm sure you are hardcore on this topic...the "times have changed" argument excuses the failure of the Steve Augeri era...and keeps the denial going strong no matter far Journey travel downhill.

You say "Arrival" was a commercial disappointment in 2001 because "times have changed". Well, "Crush" by Bon Jovi sold 7.5 million albums wordwide in 2001 and it went double-platium in the US...whereas "Arrival" sold 250,000.

I noticed you dodged my TBF example...the mid-1990s was a diastrrous time for the classic rock/AOR scene because alternative/complaint rock was at it's height...and 80s nostalgia hadn't yet kicked in. Despite this Journey - as we all know - sold one million albums (750,000 more than "Arrival" did) and were nominated for as Grammy...

As for Soundscan....well, this applies to pretty pop acts and rap stars too. It's easier to chart high with a low-selling release for any act of any age in any genre.

Let's not forget about DVD sales...the KISS Second Coming DVD went double platinum in the late 1990s (twenty years after the band's commercial peak) and the Journey Greatest Hits DVD went platinum...

How many did the 2001 Vegas DVD sell? I suspect that it was considerably lower...which again was surely a reflection of the weakness of the Augeri line-up rather than "the times".

Your ignoring that the Vegas DVD did VERY well.

TBF was a failure compared to previous Journey sales. WOW a whole million. (I suspect it did better than that, but I really have no idea honestly) So if that one (the big reunion) with Perry sold a whopping million, one in 2006 is going to break the bank? Puh-lease. Grammy? Well Jethro Tull won a heavy metal one over Metallica. See what I'm getting at?

Arrival is a better album than Trial By Fire. PERIOD. Now we can disagree there and that is fair, but I will have that bias, and I freely admit that. In the end we are all fans of this type of music, so I have be honest on that, ok?

Arrival failed more for no push from the record company, but yes times had changed. Times changing affected TBF as well. 1 million? That is nothing.

By the way, Neil Schon hates TBF album and told me that it just doesn't go anywhere. Wilmington, DE 8/25/01.

As for Soundscan....well, this applies to pretty pop acts and rap stars too. It's easier to chart high with a low-selling release for any act of any age in any genre.

I agree with that statement. However you used the chart positions of Leppard & Co. as successful releases when they really were not.

It's all cool. I like talking about this stuff.

Oh...I wasn't ignoring that The Vegas DVD had done well...I was just assuming that it hadn't done well.

Yes, TBF sold 1.5 million less than ROR...which is why I said that the "times have changed" argument has some validity. I guess my point is that it doesn't entirely explain why "Arrival" sold 750,000 less than TBF...and why the sales of new Journey releases have fallen still further since then.

You say one million sales is "nothing". Well, given that there wasn't a tour...limited publicity...and a single video which was shot late in the process...I reckon it isn't too bad. No, it's not good enough for a band like Journey...but it seems like a golden age next to the last eight years of the band's history.

Actually I think 2006 is a much better time to release a Journey album with Perry. The nostalgia market is much stronger now than it was ten years ago....a whole generation of 80s teenagers are now in early middle-age...which is usually the time people lose interest in new music and revert back to artists they were originally into. This is true of me, anyway....

Schon doesn't like TBF? Is this yet another example of how some members of the current line-up whine about past recordings and decisions...which they allowed to happen out of passivity and greed at the time?

"Arrival" failed because of the "times"...because of the "record company"...well, maybe...but ever wondered why the record company didn't promote it? Or why the million CD buying Journey fans who were left largely ignored it too? Might it possibly be because it was a mediocre record? Because the vocals were 'second best'? My own opinion is that Journey's career went into a sharp decline because of the times...because of a crap record company...AND because the record was tame, badly produced and lacking an outstanding frontman.

But maybe let's agree to differ on this point?

[AR]

But maybe let's agree to differ on this point?

Of course.

My own opinion is that Journey's career went into a sharp decline because of the times...because of a crap record company...AND because the record was tame, badly produced and lacking an outstanding frontman.

Arrival was "tame"? Then WTF was Trial By Fire?

There ain't no good guy, there ain't no bad guy. there is just you and me and we just disagree.

[Matthew]

But maybe let's agree to differ on this point?

Of course.

My own opinion is that Journey's career went into a sharp decline because of the times...because of a crap record company...AND because the record was tame, badly produced and lacking an outstanding frontman.

Arrival was "tame"? Then WTF was Trial By Fire?

There ain't no good guy, there ain't no bad guy. there is just you and me and we just disagree.

Well, the presence of Perry's voice immediately lifts the record out of the ordinary...plus the production was much more expensive and lush...and there are fewer ballads on TBF than there are on Arrival (no, I don't include "It's Just the Rain" and "TBF" in the ballad count)...

Arrival has a better album cover though....

Anyway...again...I agree up to a point...TBF was slightly disappointing...but "Infinity", "Evolution" and "Departure" have some lame moments too...not least the dodgy drum production.

But "Escape", "Frontiers" and "ROR" (plus "Only The Young" and "Ask The Lonely") are the greatest albums of all-time...in my house, anyway...and matching the quality of the 1981-1986 glory days was - and is - an impossible task.

Why is why I would rather Journey had called it a day in 1998....but let's agree to differ on that one as well?

[Matthew]

Just to add, as much as I think "Arrival" is just a fantastic album...... I really do not care for Red 13, and only like 4 or 5 off of Generations.

I wanted Journey to paint it by the numbers, and Arrival did that for the most part. There is some filler on it too, but overall it was the direction I was hoping for. TBF was a funeral dirge (minus Message of Love - which was very good). Arrival rocks more, and TBF is just plodding, save for a moment or two here and there.

All opinion of course. Just wanted to make it clear how I feal about the post Perry material.

"To Be Alive Again" would have fit nicely on "Escape"

"Generations" rocks more than "Arrival", I reckon. Plus...it has "A Better Life"...by miles the best post-Perry song....

[AR]

Well, the presence of Perry's voice immediately lifts the record out of the ordinary...plus the production was much more expensive and lush...and there are fewer ballads on TBF than there are on Arrival (no, I don't include "It's Just the Rain" and "TBF" in the ballad count)...

Arrival has a better album cover though....

Anyway...again...I agree up to a point...TBF was slightly disappointing...but "Infinity", "Evolution" and "Departure" have some lame moments too...not least the dodgy drum production.

But "Escape", "Frontiers" and "ROR" (plus "Only The Young" and "Ask The Lonely") are the greatest albums of all-time...in my house, anyway...and matching the quality of the 1981-1986 glory days was - and is - an impossible task.

Why is why I would rather Journey had called it a day in 1998....but let's agree to differ on that one as well?

We're fine. My favorite Journey albums are Infinity, Departure, ESCAPE, and Frontiers. (and Arrival, LOL)

Like a couple off of the Perry solo album known as ROR, and don't like TBF.

We're only about an album and a half off or so from agreement.

I was just happy that they "continued" and got to see them some more. The Augeri shows (minus the Generations tape gate atrocity) were fun. Like I said, we all have different tastes, but are on THIS forum for a reason.

[AR]

"A Better Life"...by miles the best post-Perry song....

Hazard - Richard Marks.

Give it a listen and see why I posted that......

[Matthew]

Well, the presence of Perry's voice immediately lifts the record out of the ordinary...plus the production was much more expensive and lush...and there are fewer ballads on TBF than there are on Arrival (no, I don't include "It's Just the Rain" and "TBF" in the ballad count)...

Arrival has a better album cover though....

Anyway...again...I agree up to a point...TBF was slightly disappointing...but "Infinity", "Evolution" and "Departure" have some lame moments too...not least the dodgy drum production.

But "Escape", "Frontiers" and "ROR" (plus "Only The Young" and "Ask The Lonely") are the greatest albums of all-time...in my house, anyway...and matching the quality of the 1981-1986 glory days was - and is - an impossible task.

Why is why I would rather Journey had called it a day in 1998....but let's agree to differ on that one as well?

We're fine. My favorite Journey albums are Infinity, Departure, ESCAPE, and Frontiers. (and Arrival, LOL)

Like a couple off of the Perry solo album known as ROR, and don't like TBF.

We're only about an album and a half off or so from agreement.

I was just happy that they "continued" and got to see them some more. The Augeri shows (minus the Generations tape gate atrocity) were fun. Like I said, we all have different tastes, but are on THIS forum for a reason.

Yes! We are only an album and a half from agreement. I guess ROR is my equivalent of Arrival...you know...the album that comes in for a lot of crap...most unfairly, of course...

I know what you mean about the "Perry solo album known as ROR"...but Cain has such a dominant role on the record...and although Neal's rhythm guitar barely features...his solos are brilliant on that record.

In fact...there are only three songs which sound like a Perry solo album..."Positive Touch", "Once You Love Somebody" and "It Could Have Been You"...all the others sound like classic Journey to me.

[Matthew]

"A Better Life"...by miles the best post-Perry song....

Hazard - Richard Marks.

Give it a listen and see why I posted that......

I love Hazard...but I'd never noticed that it might have influenced "A Better Life"...seems so obvious now you point it out.

[AR]

I love Hazard...but I'd never noticed that it might have influenced "A Better Life"...seems so obvious now you point it out.

I like "Better Life" a lot myself. Reminds me of "Hazard" and that is ok in my book. Many songs have common sounding riffs.

[Chakra]

ANYTHING new from Perry would blow the roof off the charts and/or concert tickets. He won't put something out unless it's exceptional and extraordinary.

[AR]

ANYTHING new from Perry would blow the roof off the charts and/or concert tickets. He won't put something out unless it's exceptional and extraordinary.

Or if he was actually capable of doing it........

Not saying he isn't either, but you opened the door..........

Dreaming, I'm only dreaming.

Those who can do - DO. Those who can't teach or are Steve Perry.

I kid.

[johnroxx]

The question was who WOULD have the best chance, not who WILL bust into the top forty. It is a fun poll. No one is expecting to hear new stuff on the radio.


Also, as I stated above, You Better Wait got airplay when FLOSM came out both here (Knoxville) and in Chattanooga. Not sure about other areas, but since DJs don't pick their songs I am sure it did as well. I never said it was a hit, but it did get radio time in regular circulation for a while. I never heard anything off Arrival.

In that case, I still stand by the very last poll option.

Vladan, I've been meaning to say how much I appreciate your avitar. I got to see the lady beat Kim Clijsters at La Costa two weeks ago today, a fine birthday present from my best friend and his girlfriend.

Only bad thing was the short match brought about by Maria's straight-sets win...

;^)

[The_Noble_Cause]

Any hits off "For the Love of Strange Medicine"? Nope, I don't think so.

Well, for what it's worth, the album went gold.
Can't recall if "You Better Wait" charted, too lazy to look it up.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Any hits off "For the Love of Strange Medicine"? Nope, I don't think so.

Well, for what it's worth, the album went gold.
Can't recall if "You Better Wait" charted, too lazy to look it up.

I don't know how acurate Wikipedia is but here you go:

Discography
Street Talk (1984) #12 US
For The Love Of Strange Medicine (1994) #15 US
Greatest Hits Plus Five Unreleased (1998)

Singles
"Oh Sherrie" (1984) #3 US
"Foolish Heart" (1984) #18 US
"She's Mine" (1984) #21 US
"Strung Out" (1984) #40 US
"You Better Wait" (1994) #29 US
"Missing You" (1994) #74 US

[Vladan]

The question was who WOULD have the best chance, not who WILL bust into the top forty. It is a fun poll. No one is expecting to hear new stuff on the radio.


Also, as I stated above, You Better Wait got airplay when FLOSM came out both here (Knoxville) and in Chattanooga. Not sure about other areas, but since DJs don't pick their songs I am sure it did as well. I never said it was a hit, but it did get radio time in regular circulation for a while. I never heard anything off Arrival.

In that case, I still stand by the very last poll option.

Vladan, I've been meaning to say how much I appreciate your avitar. I got to see the lady beat Kim Clijsters at La Costa two weeks ago today, a fine birthday present from my best friend and his girlfriend.

Only bad thing was the short match brought about by Maria's straight-sets win...

;^)

Hey mate, thats awesome. She looks great, does she really sound loud still? I heard she gets warnings alot because she is too loud on the court - and one can only imagine what she would sound like at home in bed.

I was lucky enough to see her play the Semi final at the 100th Aussie Open in 2005 against Serena, Maria had 3 match points, but somehow managed to still lose to match. I had pretty close seats, and Serena is a big girl. Serena bent over to tie her shoes and... like I said, close seats lol.

[Chakra]

ANYTHING new from Perry would blow the roof off the charts and/or concert tickets. He won't put something out unless it's exceptional and extraordinary.

Or if he was actually capable of doing it........

Not saying he isn't either, but you opened the door..........

Dreaming, I'm only dreaming.

Those who can do - DO. Those who can't teach or are Steve Perry.

I kid.

He doesn't have to DO anything, unless he chooses to. He has already DONE it.

[PROPERRY]

ANYTHING new from Perry would blow the roof off the charts and/or concert tickets. He won't put something out unless it's exceptional and extraordinary.

Or if he was actually capable of doing it........

Not saying he isn't either, but you opened the door..........

Dreaming, I'm only dreaming.

Those who can do - DO. Those who can't teach or are Steve Perry.

I kid.

He doesn't have to DO anything, unless he chooses to. He has already DONE it.

So very true Italia!

Perry's already accomplished SO MUCH in his music career, he can be VERY PROUD of ALL he has done & accomplished , so IF HE CHOSE not to want to do anything else that would be his right.

I bet there are alot of singers out there that would love to have just HALF of Perry's singing abilities & talents, and would like to be able to say they had accomplished the kind of "great success" that Perry has done, in THEIR OWN music careers.

As for ME though , I'll ALWAYS be WANTING Perry's music, so I'll keep hoping HE wants and chooses to do more, than not, and NOT because I feel he has to prove himself to ANYONE, I just LOVE his voice & music!!! Perry will always remain the best singer, as far as I'm concerned!!!

Lori

[The_Noble_Cause]

Any hits off "For the Love of Strange Medicine"? Nope, I don't think so.

Well, for what it's worth, the album went gold.
Can't recall if "You Better Wait" charted, too lazy to look it up.

I don't know how acurate Wikipedia is but here you go:

Discography
Street Talk (1984) #12 US
For The Love Of Strange Medicine (1994) #15 US
Greatest Hits Plus Five Unreleased (1998)

Singles
"Oh Sherrie" (1984) #3 US
"Foolish Heart" (1984) #18 US
"She's Mine" (1984) #21 US
"Strung Out" (1984) #40 US
"You Better Wait" (1994) #29 US
"Missing You" (1994) #74 US

Thanks.
I knew it wasn't a total dud.