OT: Creed to reunite?

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Postby wastingbeerz » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:02 am

stevew2 wrote:
Gunbot wrote:
Since 78 wrote:
Gunbot wrote:
Since 78 wrote:
Gunbot wrote:grunge sucks


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Come on, be honest!!

The first time I saw a Nirvana video, I wanted to go Columbine on their ass. Apparently, their singer felt the same way.


That, I agree with, Nirvana is way over rated.

It really sucked for groups like Winger who were just getting popular. Grunge hit them like a tsunami.
Fuck grunge, it is depressing winey yelling.Nothing but shit


The only "grunge" bands I really liked were Alice In Chains & Soundgarden... and AIC is more metal than grunge anyway... just happened to get lumped into that particular movement, unfortunately.
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Postby WIX » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:29 am

Look you guys are all clowns, Scott got a bad rap unfairly.

He was on top of his game until he got Stapp infection on tour the year before they called it quits.

They were Journey like in the sense of hits, and clean music.
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:31 am

Carlitto H@kk wrote:
skinsguy wrote:It's kind of funny that some here are taking up for Pearl Jam and dissing Creed when in fact bands like Pearl Jam and Nirvana were responsible for killing off melodic rock...

I think some of you guys should listen to Alterbridge's "Watch Over You". Excellent ballad!


Bands like PJ, Nirvana, AIC and all the other "Grunge" bands did melodic rock a favor back
in the early 90's if they "killed it off" because, by then, melodic rock had gotten to over-processed,
watered-down and had lost most of it's luster. There wasn't anything "genuine' or "honest" or "rebellious"
there anymore. It was all about who could play the most notes in an 8-bar stretch or
who could sing higher. "Grunge" brought things back to reality, stripped it back and put emotion, honesty
and grit back into the music.


I seriously don't think the grunge bands were any more emotive, honest, or gritty than anything that came before or after them. Some, yes, but for the most part, no.
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Postby WIX » Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:39 am

Grunge rock and generation X IN THE 90'S.

tHAT PRODUCED THE LAZIEST WORK FORCE IN AMERICA EVER.


yOU WORK AT A JOB FOR 20 YEARS AND get paid x amount of dollars for your years of service.

Generation x wanted to get paid that 20 year salary after 6 months of service ! :lol:
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Postby Sarah » Thu Dec 04, 2008 4:38 am

skinsguy wrote:It's kind of funny that some here are taking up for Pearl Jam and dissing Creed when in fact bands like Pearl Jam and Nirvana were responsible for killing off melodic rock,

Did you know Kurt Cobain HATED Pearl Jam because they weren't even grunge enough? Honestly after 1993 I'm not sure they were grunge at all. They have a ton of Who influence.

while bands like Creed, possibly indirectly, paved the way to bring some melody back into rock music!

HAHAHA

While I could listen to a couple of Pearl Jam's songs, I just hated the vocals. Storyteller or not, Eddie Vedder sounded like he tried to cram as many words into the verses that he possibly could!

Are you sure you listened to anything besides Even Flow?

BTW if you guys think they're all sad and emo, listen to Given To Fly...
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Postby Triple S » Thu Dec 04, 2008 4:54 am

Sarah wrote:
skinsguy wrote:It's kind of funny that some here are taking up for Pearl Jam and dissing Creed when in fact bands like Pearl Jam and Nirvana were responsible for killing off melodic rock,

Did you know Kurt Cobain HATED Pearl Jam because they weren't even grunge enough? Honestly after 1993 I'm not sure they were grunge at all. They have a ton of Who influence.

while bands like Creed, possibly indirectly, paved the way to bring some melody back into rock music!

HAHAHA

While I could listen to a couple of Pearl Jam's songs, I just hated the vocals. Storyteller or not, Eddie Vedder sounded like he tried to cram as many words into the verses that he possibly could!

Are you sure you listened to anything besides Even Flow?

BTW if you guys think they're all sad and emo, listen to Given To Fly...


I like that song! Check this out 8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8ByjoK3VVc
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Postby skinsguy » Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:04 am

Sarah wrote:Did you know Kurt Cobain HATED Pearl Jam because they weren't even grunge enough? Honestly after 1993 I'm not sure they were grunge at all. They have a ton of Who influence.


Doesn't really matter to me who Kurt Cobain hated and who he liked. If we're getting into an argument of degrees of grunge, then you're wasting your time. I'm not arguing who is more "grungier" than the other. Simply put, Whether if it was intended or not, grunge killed off melodic rock, and especially the hair bands. And that last statement was directed to Carlitto or X-Factor in clarification. No, I don't think all of these guys got together and said, "Let's kill off melodic rock music." Come on guys, I'm much more intelligent than that. I do agree in the fact that melodic rock music had gotten too manufactured, and there seemed to be no creativity in it. So, in all fairness, it probably didn't matter what type of "new rock" came into town, people would flock to something that sounds different. But, in my own personal taste, you'll only find me listening to maybe one or two Pearl Jam songs and probably no Nirvana whatsoever. I'm just not into it.

while bands like Creed, possibly indirectly, paved the way to bring some melody back into rock music!

HAHAHA


I guess we can agree to disagree, but I'm seeing more of an acceptance of bands that are melodic in nature than I did during the early to mid-90's. And, since Creed was one of those late 90's bands that seemed to be more melodic, at least to my ear, I found people softening up to the older melodic rock bands after the creation of Creed, Alterbridge, Nickelback, etc...
There could possibly be no correlation, but in my opinion, I think there is.



Are you sure you listened to anything besides Even Flow?/quote]

I am positive. In fact, I have listened to quite a bit of Pearl Jam thank you very much, and to this day, the only song I really enjoy listening to is the song "Black".

BTW if you guys think they're all sad and emo, listen to Given To Fly...


I don't believe from my standpoint the argument is about grunge being sad or emo. For me, half the time, the lyrics, when put to music, seemed so abstract. It was tough to listen to it to get any meaning because it sounded so drug induced to me. It's just my opinion though. I'm just relieved that the grunge scene came and went by the mid-90's. Now, I did like other bands from the 90's, such as Cowboy Mouth, Cake, or Matchbox 20. None of which fit the "grunge" movement, but more or less, the alternative route.

All in all, there are a lot of great qualities about Creed and Alterbridge, musically. I feel anybody who would like bands like Journey, Boston, or anybody else related would appreciate the music from guys like Mark Tremonti.
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Postby Sarah » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:52 am

skinsguy wrote:
BTW if you guys think they're all sad and emo, listen to Given To Fly...

I don't believe from my standpoint the argument is about grunge being sad or emo. For me, half the time, the lyrics, when put to music, seemed so abstract.

That statement was directed at the person who said PJ/grunge is all sad or something. :)
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Postby Sarah » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:53 am

Carlitto H@kk wrote:
conversationpc wrote:I agree with what I heard Yngwie say about Vedder's singing when he was played a clip of a Pearl Jam song...Something along the lines of "That sounds like someone sitting on the toilet pushing out a big one." :lol:


Dave, you want that visual, watch Springsteen during the "We are the World"
recording sessions... Dude looks like he's pushing out a Cadillac when he's singing
his lines :lol: :lol:

This reminds me... Bruce and Eddie together...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJM7xeSQEv4
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Postby skinsguy » Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:42 pm

Sarah wrote:
skinsguy wrote:
BTW if you guys think they're all sad and emo, listen to Given To Fly...

I don't believe from my standpoint the argument is about grunge being sad or emo. For me, half the time, the lyrics, when put to music, seemed so abstract.

That statement was directed at the person who said PJ/grunge is all sad or something. :)


Gotcha! :)
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Postby neoaquino » Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:01 pm

Sarah wrote:
Carlitto H@kk wrote:
conversationpc wrote:I agree with what I heard Yngwie say about Vedder's singing when he was played a clip of a Pearl Jam song...Something along the lines of "That sounds like someone sitting on the toilet pushing out a big one." :lol:


Dave, you want that visual, watch Springsteen during the "We are the World"
recording sessions... Dude looks like he's pushing out a Cadillac when he's singing
his lines :lol: :lol:

This reminds me... Bruce and Eddie together...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJM7xeSQEv4


wow that was a great performance
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Postby slucero » Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:42 pm

All this Creed talk reminds me of a hilarious article I read here: http://www.endino.com/archive/yarl.html

Part 1: VERB OF THE MONTH: "TO YARL"
(From "Backfire" 'Zine, summer 2000, also in JE Newsletter 5.2)


Recently I was in the studio working with a band from Portland, and we began making fun of commercial heavy rock bands and a certain singing style that has become prevalent. (Fish in a barrel, right?) "You mean 'yarling'," I explained, and gave examples. They laughed and said that was it exactly, but that they had always termed it "Seattle" singing. I have to give credit to my friends Josh and Alex of the Hot Rod Lunatics for coming up with this term.

To "yarl" is to sing melodramatically with a sort of barely suppressed letter "r" sound lurking beneath every other syllable. When I mention it, people always know exactly what I mean. Steve Turner describes it as singing as though your lower lip is stuck way out.

It's an annoying, exaggerated vocal affectation that some current heavy rock singers are using, thinking it is emotionally expressive, or bluesy, or something. "Hey, I'm singing soulfully, like Paul Rogers," they think. Paul Rogers did not yarl. Bob Halford did not, though he did other unspeakable things with his voice. Robert Plant (another style model that no one has successfully cloned) did not yarl. Ian Gillan did not yarl. Bon Scott did, somewhat, but to call his singing mere "yarling" is like calling WWII a "disagreement". Ditto for Iggy. Al Green did it, but he's Al Green and we're not.

Nonetheless, as far as annoying white rock singers go, we have the late seventies to blame for this phenomenon. I think the original criminal was Ronnie Dio. Listen to the way he sings "Man on the Silver Mountain" or "Heaven and Hell" like there's hidden, extra letter "r"s in every other word. The other culprits at the time were Glenn Hughes and David Coverdale on Deep Purple's "Burn" album, as well as all their subsequent efforts in other bands. Dio was kind of the archetype though, and as such could get away with it (for awhile).

Disclosure: In 1995 I produced a Bruce Dickenson solo album. You can't find it anywhere, because the record company folded soon after. Those record companies are such cards. Ha, ha. Anyway, on his first album with Iron Maiden, in 1981 or so, he yarled a little bit like Dio. We joked plenty about this in the studio. He later found his own style, becoming known as "The Air Raid Siren", and left the yarling to others. (But seriously, Bruce is a great guy.)

Who can we point the finger at today? The singer for Creed is the current expert. "Crahn yrou trake mree higharr" he yarls in their big radio song. Days of the New come to mind. Godsmack. There are plenty of others. The problem is that the current crop of yarlers are copping their shtick from our homeboys Layne and Eddie V, who are actually quite restrained at yarling; Eddie hardly did it at all after the first PJ album. Chris Cornell never did it, nor Arm. Lanegan and Cobain sure as hell didn't need to. Nonetheless, it's now "Seattle Singing" to some people. Sigh.

Friends don't let friends yarl. Please, stop the madness.
Part 2: YARL UPDATE
(From "Backfire" 'Zine, winter 2000)


My article on "yarling" a while back struck a nerve; plenty of people thanked me for giving them a word to describe the offending vocal style. It was pointed out that earlier yarlers included the Guess Who's Burton Cummings (not entirely fair, but true at times), David Clayton Thomas of Blood, Sweat and Tears, and Uriah Heep's David Byron. Someone else suggested Al Green, but I'm sorry, you don't mess with Al.

Some Creed fans and record company people were less amused however. I recently got a package from BMG distribution. How did they get my home address? Inside was the new Creed single, "With Awms Wahd O-pawn." It has a hideous "strings" version, a hideous "acoustic" version, and the slightly-less-hideous "rock" version of the song. It says prominently that $3 from the "sale" of this LIMITED-EDITION single (sent to me, and who knows how many others on the promo list, for free) will go to a "charitable foundation" set up by singer Scott Stapp to aid "children and families" called "The With Arms Wide Open Foundation." (www.witharmswideopen.org, currently no info on the site.) The flyer enclosed with the single says "Help for Children. Hope for Families" but gives no details.

The guy has the promotional knack of a televangelist: he creates and names a charitable foundation after the song that is being promoted as his current single! (Why didn't Mudhoney think of this? "The Touch Me, I'm Sick Foundation: Reach out and touch someone...") On the other hand, at least he's not putting all his money up his nose; you gotta give him that... even though his band is sorta Whitesnake without the snake.

(BACKFIRE is a quarterly rock 'zine, distributed free since 1998 in clubs and record stores in the Seattle and Portland areas.)

© 2000 Jack Endino

2003 Postscript... someone just pointed out to me another possible forefather of Yarling. It may have been Iron Butterfly, on "In-a-Gadda-Da-Vida" (1967?), who started the whole odious trend! (Note: title derived from "In a garden of Eden"... now ya know!)

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.


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Postby jrnychick » Fri Dec 05, 2008 12:02 am

mikemarrs wrote:well i think everyone knows that one of the big reasons creed broke up is scott stapp was real doped up on pain pills and drinking and did some real off the wall stuff at a concert in chicago back in 2003 and the audience actually sued the band for refunds because stapp was so fucked up and incoherent.i also think stapp developed an ego the size of the grand canyon and that plus other factors lead to the group splitting up.i think right before this incident someone in another car slammed into the back of him at a stop sign and he was injured.then he ballooned to around 250 pounds and then his wife left him so that whole period was fucked up for the band.from 1997-2003 when they were active they sold a shitload of albums.about 30 million sold plus every album hit number one so they'll be a shitload of sellouts if they have a reunion as long as stapp doesn't start pulling an axl rose.......



I was at that Chicago show, and was just going to post about it. I loved Creed's first album, but I will never give Scott Stapp another dollar. What could have been a great show turned out to be a train wreck.
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Postby skinsguy » Fri Dec 05, 2008 12:32 am

Ya know...Stapp's an idiot! I would be hard pressed to find anyone who can prove me wrong on that! With all the stuff he's done, the man deserves to never have anymore success in the music biz.

However, on the other hand, I do believe in second chances, and maybe the guy is clean now? Who knows? I do know that if Creed reforming is all about the money, then it won't last. Especially if Stapp is still the same Stapp that caused the band to split in the first place.

Again, Creed wrote some great songs! Absolutely fantastic songs, but I always felt they could have used a better singer to sing those songs. If Creed had been created around Myles Kennedy instead of Stapp, then I believe everybody's tune probably would be different.
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Postby conversationpc » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:28 am

skinsguy wrote:Ya know...Stapp's an idiot! I would be hard pressed to find anyone who can prove me wrong on that! With all the stuff he's done, the man deserves to never have anymore success in the music biz.

However, on the other hand, I do believe in second chances, and maybe the guy is clean now? Who knows? I do know that if Creed reforming is all about the money, then it won't last. Especially if Stapp is still the same Stapp that caused the band to split in the first place.

Again, Creed wrote some great songs! Absolutely fantastic songs, but I always felt they could have used a better singer to sing those songs. If Creed had been created around Myles Kennedy instead of Stapp, then I believe everybody's tune probably would be different.


I read an interview a year or two ago where he admitted that he had been an ass, due much to his alcohol problem. Not sure if he's changed since then. That being said, there are still several Creed songs I like.
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Postby Rick » Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:32 am

conversationpc wrote:
skinsguy wrote:Ya know...Stapp's an idiot! I would be hard pressed to find anyone who can prove me wrong on that! With all the stuff he's done, the man deserves to never have anymore success in the music biz.

However, on the other hand, I do believe in second chances, and maybe the guy is clean now? Who knows? I do know that if Creed reforming is all about the money, then it won't last. Especially if Stapp is still the same Stapp that caused the band to split in the first place.

Again, Creed wrote some great songs! Absolutely fantastic songs, but I always felt they could have used a better singer to sing those songs. If Creed had been created around Myles Kennedy instead of Stapp, then I believe everybody's tune probably would be different.


I read an interview a year or two ago where he admitted that he had been an ass, due much to his alcohol problem. Not sure if he's changed since then. That being said, there are still several Creed songs I like.


Me too.
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Postby bru87tr » Thu Dec 11, 2008 12:46 pm

I wasn't listening to them.

besides, its their turn. its only fair and it happens every decade. those bands found it fun to rip on the 80's. oh how the tables turned.

its fair!!!
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Postby livin2do » Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:38 am

I'll try to restrain my rampant euphoria.
:roll:
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Postby Blueskies » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:10 am

Rick wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
skinsguy wrote:Ya know...Stapp's an idiot! I would be hard pressed to find anyone who can prove me wrong on that! With all the stuff he's done, the man deserves to never have anymore success in the music biz.

However, on the other hand, I do believe in second chances, and maybe the guy is clean now? Who knows? I do know that if Creed reforming is all about the money, then it won't last. Especially if Stapp is still the same Stapp that caused the band to split in the first place.

Again, Creed wrote some great songs! Absolutely fantastic songs, but I always felt they could have used a better singer to sing those songs. If Creed had been created around Myles Kennedy instead of Stapp, then I believe everybody's tune probably would be different.


I read an interview a year or two ago where he admitted that he had been an ass, due much to his alcohol problem. Not sure if he's changed since then. That being said, there are still several Creed songs I like.


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Postby Blueskies » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:12 am

bru87tr wrote:I wasn't listening to them.

besides, its their turn. its only fair and it happens every decade. those bands found it fun to rip on the 80's. oh how the tables turned.

its fair!!!
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Postby Arkansas » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:20 am

conversationpc wrote:It's kinda funny how now it seems the be the "in" thing to rip on Creed but most of the people doing it now were listening to them back then and probably still do.


Exactly. I also wonder if it's the hip thing to rip on people or bands, no matter who it is. Quite often there's such a gang mentality here. :roll:


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Postby Blueskies » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:51 am

Arkansas wrote:
conversationpc wrote:It's kinda funny how now it seems the be the "in" thing to rip on Creed but most of the people doing it now were listening to them back then and probably still do.


Exactly. I also wonder if it's the hip thing to rip on people or bands, no matter who it is. Quite often there's such a gang mentality here. :roll:


later~
On one point..speaking for myself, I don't join in for the sake of joining in and don't "target" anyone..have never had the intention to "target" anyone...I just pretty much say what I think to anyone and everyone....agree with me or not I just give my opinion. On the second point...I went to a Creed concert once in Atlanta..was on the floor between the catwalk and the stage and have to say it was one of the best concerts I've been to..Stapp gave a great performance that night and the audience sang along to every song. I've been to many shows and sporting events in the ATL where the crowd is pretty laid back and nonchalant about the whole thing but the energy and enthusiasm at that show was amazing.
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