OT: Here's What's in the $825 Billion Stimulus Bill

[RocknRoll]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

[S2M]

If they want stimulus they should give the people an income tax break for 12 months. No taxes out of their pay. PLUS, they should give every american tax payer a nice fat check for 10,000. THAT would stimulate the fucking economy.

Stimulus packages like this shit in the article, the one for the banks, the one for the Big 3 are absolute fucking jokes......

[WIX]

can you say as long as fat politicians are running the show we are f'd

[Ehwmatt]

If they want stimulus they should give the people an income tax break for 12 months. No taxes out of their pay. PLUS, they should give every american tax payer a nice fat check for 10,000. THAT would stimulate the fucking economy.

Stimulus packages like this shit in the article, the one for the banks, the one for the Big 3 are absolute fucking jokes......

Even an income tax freeze for just 3 months, preferably during the summer, would stimulate the economy to a degree we can't even imagine. After that freeze, move to the fair or flat tax. Watch the economy grow. Also notice how the richest people pay more in taxes under either system.

[Rockindeano]

Here is the first paragraph from that WSJ article:

We've looked it over, and even we can't quite believe it. There's $1 billion for Amtrak, the federal railroad that hasn't turned a profit in 40 years; $2 billion for child-care subsidies; $50 million for that great engine of job creation, the National Endowment for the Arts; $400 million for global-warming research and another $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

Even we? You mean the far leaning righties at the WSJ? Go fuck yourselves.

I don't see a penny wasted in any of those programs.

1 Billion for Amtrak. Currently they receive 750 million. What is a 250 million raise going to hurt? You folks have short memories. 6 months ago, people couldn't drive anywhere without mortgaging their homes for gas. Amtrak if given a chance is the prime example of what program can really help out in America's oil crisis. And as for turning a profit? The writer of this article should do his or her homework-No rail system in the world turns a profit. And if not for countless airport and traffic controller subsidies from Uncle Sam, not a single airline would be close to turning a profit. In fact, this last year Amtrak did much better than any airline save Southwest. By the way, does any interstate highway in the land turn a profit?

2 -Billion for child care. Tell me how that is a bad thing? I want to hear especially from the republicans here who are adamantly against abortion. The point being that once born, the GOP turns it's back on people. Child care is never a bad subsidy.

3- $50 million National Endowment for the Arts. I am shocked that any here would bitch about this. The Arts are so important, and 50 million is a lost penny. Arts people. For Christs sake, you are on a music forum! Without Arts, we might not have our next Steve Perry, Mr Big or gasp, Arnel Pineda.

4- $400 million for global-warming research. Another worthwhile investment. We need to learn to live greener, might as well take this opportunity to do it right, and pay people along the way. It's going to happen folks, and frankly needs to happen- the need to live off other fuel sources than oil; wind, solar and hydro. Studying better ways is not money wasted.

5- $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.- Absolutely needed.

Are all these Democratic ideals and principals? Yep. They won, and they are in charge. Deal with it. Start writing Sarah some checks, so she can get ready to change us back to pure fucking misery.

[RobbieG]

Here is the first paragraph from that WSJ article:

We've looked it over, and even we can't quite believe it. There's $1 billion for Amtrak, the federal railroad that hasn't turned a profit in 40 years; $2 billion for child-care subsidies; $50 million for that great engine of job creation, the National Endowment for the Arts; $400 million for global-warming research and another $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

Even we? You mean the far leaning righties at the WSJ? Go fuck yourselves.

I don't see a penny wasted in any of those programs.

1 Billion for Amtrak. Currently they receive 750 million. What is a 250 million raise going to hurt? You folks have short memories. 6 months ago, people couldn't drive anywhere without mortgaging their homes for gas. Amtrak if given a chance is the prime example of what program can really help out in America's oil crisis. And as for turning a profit? The writer of this article should do his or her homework-No rail system in the world turns a profit. And if not for countless airport and traffic controller subsidies from Uncle Sam, not a single airline would be close to turning a profit. In fact, this last year Amtrak did much better than any airline save Southwest. By the way, does any interstate highway in the land turn a profit?

2 -Billion for child care. Tell me how that is a bad thing? I want to hear especially from the republicans here who are adamantly against abortion. The point being that once born, the GOP turns it's back on people. Child care is never a bad subsidy.

3- $50 million National Endowment for the Arts. I am shocked that any here would bitch about this./ The Arts are so important, and 50 million is a lost penny. Arts people. For Christs sake, you are on a music forum! Without Arts, we might not have our next Steve perry, Mr Big or gasp, Arnel Pineda.

4- $400 million for global-warming research. Another worthwhile investment. We need to learn to live greener, might as well take this opportunity to do it right, and pay people along the way. It's going to happen folks, and frankly needs to happen- the need to live off other fuel sources than oil; wind, solar and hydro. Studying better ways is not money wasted.

5- $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.- Absolutely needed.

Are all these Democratic ideals and principals? Yep. They won, and they are in charge. Deal with it. Start writing Sarah some checks, so she can get ready to change us back to pure fucking misery.

Why the "Go fuck yourself" statement? I thought he ran on change, looks like the same spend spend.

[S2M]

Here is the first paragraph from that WSJ article:

We've looked it over, and even we can't quite believe it. There's $1 billion for Amtrak, the federal railroad that hasn't turned a profit in 40 years; $2 billion for child-care subsidies; $50 million for that great engine of job creation, the National Endowment for the Arts; $400 million for global-warming research and another $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

Even we? You mean the far leaning righties at the WSJ? Go fuck yourselves.

I don't see a penny wasted in any of those programs.

1 Billion for Amtrak. Currently they receive 750 million. What is a 250 million raise going to hurt? You folks have short memories. 6 months ago, people couldn't drive anywhere without mortgaging their homes for gas. Amtrak if given a chance is the prime example of what program can really help out in America's oil crisis. And as for turning a profit? The writer of this article should do his or her homework-No rail system in the world turns a profit. And if not for countless airport and traffic controller subsidies from Uncle Sam, not a single airline would be close to turning a profit. In fact, this last year Amtrak did much better than any airline save Southwest. By the way, does any interstate highway in the land turn a profit?

2 -Billion for child care. Tell me how that is a bad thing? I want to hear especially from the republicans here who are adamantly against abortion. The point being that once born, the GOP turns it's back on people. Child care is never a bad subsidy.

3- $50 million National Endowment for the Arts. I am shocked that any here would bitch about this./ The Arts are so important, and 50 million is a lost penny. Arts people. For Christs sake, you are on a music forum! Without Arts, we might not have our next Steve perry, Mr Big or gasp, Arnel Pineda.

4- $400 million for global-warming research. Another worthwhile investment. We need to learn to live greener, might as well take this opportunity to do it right, and pay people along the way. It's going to happen folks, and frankly needs to happen- the need to live off other fuel sources than oil; wind, solar and hydro. Studying better ways is not money wasted.

5- $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.- Absolutely needed.

Are all these Democratic ideals and principals? Yep. They won, and they are in charge. Deal with it. Start writing Sarah some checks, so she can get ready to change us back to pure fucking misery.

All those things you mentioned are, indeed, things that need addressing....HOWEVER. In the meantime, while Joe and Jennifer are struggling to pay their mortgage because Circuit City is going under - where Joe is the manager of store #567, and Jennifer lost her job because she used to work for the local heating and plumbing store, which had to close because health care costs have risen so high - the owners couldn't afford coverage.

How does this bailout help Joe and Jennifer again?

[ScarabGator]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

Yeah, this is a GREAT fucking plan. We are so fucked.

[RobbieG]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

Yeah, this is a GREAT fucking plan. We are so fucked.

Hey Gator long time. Congrats. Something we both agree on but the left wing nuts are so blinded.

[Rockindeano]

All those things you mentioned are, indeed, things that need addressing....HOWEVER. In the meantime, while Joe and Jennifer are struggling to pay their mortgage because Circuit City is going under - where Joe is the manager of store #567, and Jennifer lost her job because she used to work for the local heating and plumbing store, which had to close because health care costs have risen so high - the owners couldn't afford coverage.

How does this bailout help Joe and Jennifer again?

Did someone say Health Care? Just imagine, if we had a universal health care system in place, Joe and Jennifer could actually stay in business, and remain healthy at the same time.

To answer your question, the stimulus and the money for these projects creates jobs- jobs create taxation for the government to operate on, and thus be able to offer programs such as FEMA for natural disasters, Amtrak for people in the 200-500 mile corridors who can't fly or can't afford gas, child care assistance for the people who go to work each and every day and play by the rules, but have difficulty paying for decent child care, and lastly, for health care subsidies.

This stimulus has a ton of money ready to go out to "shovel ready" infrastructure programs, meaning that they are already through the environmental steps and are ready to break ground. These programs will do a couple things concurrently. In no particular order, rebuilding America's crumbling infrastructure (which just received a grade of D from engineers), ie, dams, bridges, road and railways, will create a huge number of jobs, employing millions of new workers who in turn will make good money, in yet another turn, can go buy that new TV, stereo or computer.

Give Joe and Jen a call, and tell them that we just endured the longest fucking nightmare in world history (8 years of Bush/Cheney), but we, and they alike, survived it, and we will be ok in due time. And while you're at it, try to get Joe out of the house so you can go over and bang the living shit out of Jennifer. She probably needs it following this economic meltdown; Joe probably is on day 68 of a bender to end all benders since dude lost his job.

[Rockindeano]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

Yeah, this is a GREAT fucking plan. We are so fucked.

Let me guess, you prefer the do nothing mentality, of letting it all play out, right? "The fundamentals of the economy are strong." Sound familiar? "Tax cuts." Sound familiar. Failure mass proportions. Ever heard of republican rule? Yeah, it's that economy you now live in.

Enjoy it, you voted for this, so stop bitching at Obama for fixing it.

[ScarabGator]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

Yeah, this is a GREAT fucking plan. We are so fucked.

Hey Gator long time. Congrats. Something we both agree on but the left wing nuts are so blinded.

Thanks Robbie!!! Yes, I am definetly in your club with this subject.

[ScarabGator]

This will probably get passed tonight. Where are all those jobs? I think we are in trouble


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

Yeah, this is a GREAT fucking plan. We are so fucked.

Let me guess, you prefer the do nothing mentality, of letting it all play out, right? "The fundamentals of the economy are strong." Sound familiar? "Tax cuts." Sound familiar. Failure mass proportions. Ever heard of republican rule? Yeah, it's that economy you now live in.

Enjoy it, you voted for this, so stop bitching at Obama for fixing it.

No, I dont prefer that but I also do NOT see this plan o-shit-bama's come up with as helping us any better.

[Uno_up]

Let's not forget more of this "quick fix" also includes:

~ the $246m tax break to the movie industry.

~ that voter fraud shit groups like ACORN will now be eligible for a part of the $4.19B in neighborhood stimulization activities.

~ 400M for chlamydia and HIV testing.

~ Great for atv OWNERS...$25m for recreation maintenance, especially for rehabilitation of off-road vehicle routes, and $20m for trail maintenance and restoration.

~ $200m for DepT. of Defense to acquire alternative energy vehicles.

~ $1.5B FOR A CARBON-CAPTURING CONTEST.

~ $200m for DoD plug-in car stations

~ $335m FOR STD EDUCATION.

I'm not making this shit up. Only 8% of this $800B package will end up back into the economy this year. Yeah...you voted for "change" alright.

[hoagiepete]

All those things you mentioned are, indeed, things that need addressing....HOWEVER. In the meantime, while Joe and Jennifer are struggling to pay their mortgage because Circuit City is going under - where Joe is the manager of store #567, and Jennifer lost her job because she used to work for the local heating and plumbing store, which had to close because health care costs have risen so high - the owners couldn't afford coverage.

How does this bailout help Joe and Jennifer again?

Did someone say Health Care? Just imagine, if we had a universal health care system in place, Joe and Jennifer could actually stay in business, and remain healthy at the same time.

To answer your question, the stimulus and the money for these projects creates jobs- jobs create taxation for the government to operate on, and thus be able to offer programs such as FEMA for natural disasters, Amtrak for people in the 200-500 mile corridors who can't fly or can't afford gas, child care assistance for the people who go to work each and every day and play by the rules, but have difficulty paying for decent child care, and lastly, for health care subsidies.

This stimulus has a ton of money ready to go out to "shovel ready" infrastructure programs, meaning that they are already through the environmental steps and are ready to break ground. These programs will do a couple things concurrently. In no particular order, rebuilding America's crumbling infrastructure (which just received a grade of D from engineers), ie, dams, bridges, road and railways, will create a huge number of jobs, employing millions of new workers who in turn will make good money, in yet another turn, can go buy that new TV, stereo or computer.

Give Joe and Jen a call, and tell them that we just endured the longest fucking nightmare in world history (8 years of Bush/Cheney), but we, and they alike, survived it, and we will be ok in due time. And while you're at it, try to get Joe out of the house so you can go over and bang the living shit out of Jennifer. She probably needs it following this economic meltdown; Joe probably is on day 68 of a bender to end all benders since dude lost his job.

Oh boy...I hate to enter the fray...but...Deano...do you really think the government should run our health care system? They fuck things up way more than the private sector, and that ain't good. And who is going to pay for it?? Someone will and it will be way more expensive than what we see today. Nothing is free...contrary to many beliefs that if it is a handout from Big Brother...it's free. On second thought, the way they are printing money these days...maybe it is. Who knew?

I am not suggesting there isn't work to be done to make health care more available and affordable, but giving it to the government to run...oh sheeeiiitttt.

I thought this was supposed to be an "Economic Stimulus" package. Not saying it is all bad, and I see plenty being stimulated, but not the economy. They need to create jobs. Private sector jobs. Not sure how they are trying to do that with much of what is being proposed. Most of the money SHOULD be going to infrastructure. Construction creates many good paying jobs most often with benefits. Put it all there and let's get workin.

The way its going Joe and Jennifer's only future job opportunities will be working for the government. They are going to own everything before long. Iran may be right...Capitalism is gasping for breath.

[Rockindeano]

I'm not making this shit up. Only 8% of this $800B package will end up back into the economy this year. Yeah...you voted for "change" alright.

Yeah, I wish I could vote again, dammit! 4 more years of the worst 8 years in US history. My bad, sorry.

[RobbieG]

I'm not making this shit up. Only 8% of this $800B package will end up back into the economy this year. Yeah...you voted for "change" alright.

Yeah, I wish I could vote again, dammit! 4 more years of the worst 8 years in US history. My bad, sorry.

What a comment!!! Again do your research. You are as bad as the right wing nuts. Blaming one party when both parties are to blame for this mess. Who was in control of congress the last 2 years????

[bluejeangirl76]

If they want stimulus they should give the people an income tax break for 12 months. No taxes out of their pay. PLUS, they should give every american tax payer a nice fat check for 10,000. THAT would stimulate the fucking economy.

Great. Hey, do me a favor... run for president there for me, would ya?

Meanwhile, we're still effed in the A without K-Y.

[Melissa]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

[ScarabGator]

I'm not making this shit up. Only 8% of this $800B package will end up back into the economy this year. Yeah...you voted for "change" alright.

Yeah, I wish I could vote again, dammit! 4 more years of the worst 8 years in US history. My bad, sorry.

What a comment!!! Again do your research. You are as bad as the right wing nuts. Blaming one party when both parties are to blame for this mess. Who was in control of congress the last 2 years????

BOOM!!!! What ya say to that Demo-no???????

[S2M]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Yeah, because they won't be able to dictate what they charge for services.....what a fucking crock. Bunch of fucking crybabies, just like teachers. Only difference is that teachers don't go into the profession looking to get rich. That is a trait they develop once they are entrenched in the field. The kids come first until they are tenured. Doctors, on the other hand, expect to get rich.....

[Ehwmatt]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

It's hilarious, everybody wants to talk about the big bad health insurance companies and the evil hospital systems. No one ever stops to think that people might stop being doctors, dentists, nurses etc if they can't make a living, let alone repay their debts. I've never heard potential compensation for physicians and other professionals being discussed anywhere. I can't imagine it'd be good if Uncle Sam is cutting the checks.

Medical/dental school gives barely any merit-based scholarship money - for example, Case Western Dental School in Cleveland costs 47 grand a year in tuition ALONE. Rarely do they give out merit-based scholarships, if ever. They just figure students can afford to take out massive loans and pay them back no problem with fat medical salaries. That's barely the case as it is now anymore with tuition spiraling out of control, malpractice/liability costs, etc etc. It'll get downright catastrophic if the government is playing the role of insurance man.

Employer mandates blow nuts too

[Ehwmatt]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Yeah, because they won't be able to dictate what they charge for services.....what a fucking crock. Bunch of fucking crybabies, just like teachers. Only difference is that teachers don't go into the profession looking to get rich. That is a trait they develop once they are entrenched in the field. The kids come first until they are tenured. Doctors, on the other hand, expect to get rich.....

Let's see, they go to school for eight years working their ASSES off in the hardest possible science/medical classes, incur AT LEAST $280,000 in loans between undergrad and med school (or costs if they are rich to begin with I guess), residency requirements, and they have to put up with ambulance chasers and malpractice worries while performing the most delicate of human services. Yeah, pardon them for wanting to "get rich"

[Melissa]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Yeah, because they won't be able to dictate what they charge for services.....what a fucking crock. Bunch of fucking crybabies, just like teachers. Only difference is that teachers don't go into the profession looking to get rich. That is a trait they develop once they are entrenched in the field. The kids come first until they are tenured. Doctors, on the other hand, expect to get rich.....

Yeeeeeah, ok

[Jubilee]

Here is the first paragraph from that WSJ article:

We've looked it over, and even we can't quite believe it. There's $1 billion for Amtrak, the federal railroad that hasn't turned a profit in 40 years; $2 billion for child-care subsidies; $50 million for that great engine of job creation, the National Endowment for the Arts; $400 million for global-warming research and another $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

Even we? You mean the far leaning righties at the WSJ? Go fuck yourselves.

I don't see a penny wasted in any of those programs.

1 Billion for Amtrak. Currently they receive 750 million. What is a 250 million raise going to hurt? You folks have short memories. 6 months ago, people couldn't drive anywhere without mortgaging their homes for gas. Amtrak if given a chance is the prime example of what program can really help out in America's oil crisis. And as for turning a profit? The writer of this article should do his or her homework-No rail system in the world turns a profit. And if not for countless airport and traffic controller subsidies from Uncle Sam, not a single airline would be close to turning a profit. In fact, this last year Amtrak did much better than any airline save Southwest. By the way, does any interstate highway in the land turn a profit?

2 -Billion for child care. Tell me how that is a bad thing? I want to hear especially from the republicans here who are adamantly against abortion. The point being that once born, the GOP turns it's back on people. Child care is never a bad subsidy.

3- $50 million National Endowment for the Arts. I am shocked that any here would bitch about this. The Arts are so important, and 50 million is a lost penny. Arts people. For Christs sake, you are on a music forum! Without Arts, we might not have our next Steve Perry, Mr Big or gasp, Arnel Pineda.

4- $400 million for global-warming research. Another worthwhile investment. We need to learn to live greener, might as well take this opportunity to do it right, and pay people along the way. It's going to happen folks, and frankly needs to happen- the need to live off other fuel sources than oil; wind, solar and hydro. Studying better ways is not money wasted.

5- $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.- Absolutely needed.

Are all these Democratic ideals and principals? Yep. They won, and they are in charge. Deal with it. Start writing Sarah some checks, so she can get ready to change us back to pure fucking misery.

The first time I read this I thought you were kidding, but you're dead serious, aren't you?!? I don't even know where to begin...

1 - Amtrak has been missmanaged from the start. With the exception of the eastern corridor, Amtrak really doesn't even serve most of the country. Unless they're going to use this infusion to start laying new tracks to serve new markets, I don't see the cost benefit.

2 - Billion for child care? Seriously. That's part of raising kids. No place for government intervention.

3 - 50b for National Endowment for the Arts. Sorry, let the artsy-fartsy crowd buy their own pink tights. How much does it really cost to create a jar full of urine with various things suspended in it?

4 - 400m on global warming research? Here, I'll help you out on this one. In the summer it gets hot. Sometimes really hot. In the winter, it gets cold. Sometimes really cold. The planet is 4 billion years old. At times the planet has been covered in ice, at other times there has been very little glaciation. All of human existence has occured between these two extremes. Cleaner air is a good thing, but let's not start thinking we can control things we have no control over. Keep your money. That one's on me.

5 - What?!?

And as for these so called "shovel-ready" projects - don't you believe it. By the time they go through the process of deciding how much money to allocate to which project, going through the bidding process, and the unions trying to get their piece of the action, these projects won't be off the ground for at least a year - and they'll already be over budget.

Woooo. That was a mouth full. End of rant.... carry on...

[NealIsGod]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Yeah, because they won't be able to dictate what they charge for services.....what a fucking crock. Bunch of fucking crybabies, just like teachers. Only difference is that teachers don't go into the profession looking to get rich. That is a trait they develop once they are entrenched in the field. The kids come first until they are tenured. Doctors, on the other hand, expect to get rich.....

Doctors and nurses deserve to make good money. Teachers only need a 4-year degree, get summer months off, holidays off, and are home by 4:00.

[S2M]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Grab a copy of 'Sicko'.....

My guess is you'll see a Doctor from the UK, who practices under a universal healthcare system. Owns a nice home, and has a couple of luxury cars.....wants for NOTHING. Biggest misconception is that they can't continue their elitist lifestyle....

[Ehwmatt]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

Grab a copy of 'Sicko'.....

My guess is you'll see a Doctor from the UK, who practices under a universal healthcare system. Owns a nice home, and has a couple of luxury cars.....wants for NOTHING. Biggest misconception is that they can't continue their elitist lifestyle....

Is there a puke emoticon on here anywhere?

[Onestepper]

Here is the first paragraph from that WSJ article:

We've looked it over, and even we can't quite believe it. There's $1 billion for Amtrak, the federal railroad that hasn't turned a profit in 40 years; $2 billion for child-care subsidies; $50 million for that great engine of job creation, the National Endowment for the Arts; $400 million for global-warming research and another $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

Even we? You mean the far leaning righties at the WSJ? Go fuck yourselves.

I don't see a penny wasted in any of those programs.

1 Billion for Amtrak. Currently they receive 750 million. What is a 250 million raise going to hurt? You folks have short memories. 6 months ago, people couldn't drive anywhere without mortgaging their homes for gas. Amtrak if given a chance is the prime example of what program can really help out in America's oil crisis. And as for turning a profit? The writer of this article should do his or her homework-No rail system in the world turns a profit. And if not for countless airport and traffic controller subsidies from Uncle Sam, not a single airline would be close to turning a profit. In fact, this last year Amtrak did much better than any airline save Southwest. By the way, does any interstate highway in the land turn a profit?

2 -Billion for child care. Tell me how that is a bad thing? I want to hear especially from the republicans here who are adamantly against abortion. The point being that once born, the GOP turns it's back on people. Child care is never a bad subsidy.

3- $50 million National Endowment for the Arts. I am shocked that any here would bitch about this. The Arts are so important, and 50 million is a lost penny. Arts people. For Christs sake, you are on a music forum! Without Arts, we might not have our next Steve Perry, Mr Big or gasp, Arnel Pineda.

4- $400 million for global-warming research. Another worthwhile investment. We need to learn to live greener, might as well take this opportunity to do it right, and pay people along the way. It's going to happen folks, and frankly needs to happen- the need to live off other fuel sources than oil; wind, solar and hydro. Studying better ways is not money wasted.

5- $2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.- Absolutely needed.

Are all these Democratic ideals and principals? Yep. They won, and they are in charge. Deal with it. Start writing Sarah some checks, so she can get ready to change us back to pure fucking misery.

The first time I read this I thought you were kidding, but you're dead serious, aren't you?!? I don't even know where to begin...

1 - Amtrak has been missmanaged from the start. With the exception of the eastern corridor, Amtrak really doesn't even serve most of the country. Unless they're going to use this infusion to start laying new tracks to serve new markets, I don't see the cost benefit.

2 - Billion for child care? Seriously. That's part of raising kids. No place for government intervention.

3 - 50b for National Endowment for the Arts. Sorry, let the artsy-fartsy crowd buy their own pink tights. How much does it really cost to create a jar full of urine with various things suspended in it?

4 - 400m on global warming research? Here, I'll help you out on this one. In the summer it gets hot. Sometimes really hot. In the winter, it gets cold. Sometimes really cold. The planet is 4 billion years old. At times the planet has been covered in ice, at other times there has been very little glaciation. All of human existence has occured between these two extremes. Cleaner air is a good thing, but let's not start thinking we can control things we have no control over. Keep your money. That one's on me.

5 - What?!?

And as for these so called "shovel-ready" projects - don't you believe it. By the time they go through the process of deciding how much money to allocate to which project, going through the bidding process, and the unions trying to get their piece of the action, these projects won't be off the ground for at least a year - and they'll already be over budget.

Woooo. That was a mouth full. End of rant.... carry on...

I'm just trying to figure out which art endowment helped HH discover Steve Perry, or which $50B grant helped NS watch Arnel on YouTube?? Ahh the mysteries of the unknown....

[Melissa]

Interesting article in my latest nursing magazine: 20% of American physicians may stop praticing if universal health care is implemented, and the nursing shortage will grow to over 1 million short in just 10 years.

It's hilarious, everybody wants to talk about the big bad health insurance companies and the evil hospital systems. No one ever stops to think that people might stop being doctors, dentists, nurses etc if they can't make a living, let alone repay their debts. I've never heard potential compensation for physicians and other professionals being discussed anywhere. I can't imagine it'd be good if Uncle Sam is cutting the checks.

Medical/dental school gives barely any merit-based scholarship money - for example, Case Western Dental School in Cleveland costs 47 grand a year in tuition ALONE. Rarely do they give out merit-based scholarships, if ever. They just figure students can afford to take out massive loans and pay them back no problem with fat medical salaries. That's barely the case as it is now anymore with tuition spiraling out of control, malpractice/liability costs, etc etc. It'll get downright catastrophic if the government is playing the role of insurance man.

Employer mandates blow nuts too

Thank you

And I'm terribly sorry, but not everyone without medical insurance is in that boat because they can't "afford" it, or because of the "economy". Bullshit. I've been a nurse a looong time now, and it's pretty amazing to me how many of these people who claim they can't afford health insurance can damn sure afford expensive cars and coming waltzing in here with their Medicaid cards with Coach, Luis Vuitton, and Gucci bags slung over their shoulders .

Do my husband and I enjoy spending hundreds of dollars every month on our health insurance? Well of course not, I mean gee, if we could have a free handout then maybe we could buy expensive cars and purses too. But no, we choose to WORK and live within our means, gee what a concept.

I know this may offend some and guess what? I don't care Truth hurts sometimes, oh well.