Interview of JOURNEY in Manila (Guys sing Lights a capella)

[Behshad]

Neal didn't have to mention JSS by name, but he is totally downgrading the fact that JSS did become an official member of Journey. He would have been better off simply calling JSS "another singer" or a "previous singer".

Journey, on another note, must be loving the superstar treatment over there. That kind of stuff really doesn;t happen here.

It seems obvious that there's some bad blood there. Maybe Neal didn't want to mention his name as it would open that whole subject up for interviews. Maybe he doesn't want to talk about it.
But yeah, it wasn't the best thing to say, totally agree.

Indeed it wasn't the best thing to say, but I'm gonna post what I just did over at another forum here:

Look, it wasn't a very classy remark. But have you ever heard the adage, "Don't meet your heroes... you might be afraid of what you may find?"

Whether it's some cocksucking, but talented athlete turning down a single autograph request from a little boy or a rock star like Neal with an overinflated ego, you just can't take 'em seriously. Enjoy watching them hit or shoot the ball or light up the fretboard.

Nothing more really needs to be or ought to be expected. For those that go the extra mile and sign 20 autographs after a tough loss or 3 hour show, more power to 'em, their fans will appreciate it even more. A lot of these guys never even had the chance for a normal college growth experience or even high school experience. Neal's a dick, but I mean shit, if I were running around jamming with Santana and Clapton, making millions by my mid-twenties, and never really having a normal young life, it might be tough for me to have some perspective and tact too.

I'm not excusing the behavior, just contextualizing it. It's not Neal's job to be a carefully spoken ambassador.

[MCC620]

Neal didn't have to mention JSS by name, but he is totally downgrading the fact that JSS did become an official member of Journey. He would have been better off simply calling JSS "another singer" or a "previous singer".

Journey, on another note, must be loving the superstar treatment over there. That kind of stuff really doesn;t happen here.

It seems obvious that there's some bad blood there. Maybe Neal didn't want to mention his name as it would open that whole subject up for interviews. Maybe he doesn't want to talk about it.
But yeah, it wasn't the best thing to say, totally agree.

Indeed it wasn't the best thing to say, but I'm gonna post what I just did over at another forum here:

Look, it wasn't a very classy remark. But have you ever heard the adage, "Don't meet your heroes... you might be afraid of what you may find?"

Whether it's some cocksucking, but talented athlete turning down a single autograph request from a little boy or a rock star like Neal with an overinflated ego, you just can't take 'em seriously. Enjoy watching them hit or shoot the ball or light up the fretboard.

Nothing more really needs to be or ought to be expected. For those that go the extra mile and sign 20 autographs after a tough loss or 3 hour show, more power to 'em, their fans will appreciate it even more. A lot of these guys never even had the chance for a normal college growth experience or even high school experience. Neal's a dick, but I mean shit, if I were running around jamming with Santana and Clapton, making millions by my mid-twenties, and never really having a normal young life, it might be tough for me to have some perspective and tact too.

I'm not excusing the behavior, just contextualizing it. It's not Neal's job to be a carefully spoken ambassador.

since so many say it's a business....shouldn't an executive of that business know how to conduct himself properly when marketing or advertising for the business by doing radio and print interviews?

[Ehwmatt]

Neal didn't have to mention JSS by name, but he is totally downgrading the fact that JSS did become an official member of Journey. He would have been better off simply calling JSS "another singer" or a "previous singer".

Journey, on another note, must be loving the superstar treatment over there. That kind of stuff really doesn;t happen here.

It seems obvious that there's some bad blood there. Maybe Neal didn't want to mention his name as it would open that whole subject up for interviews. Maybe he doesn't want to talk about it.
But yeah, it wasn't the best thing to say, totally agree.

Indeed it wasn't the best thing to say, but I'm gonna post what I just did over at another forum here:

Look, it wasn't a very classy remark. But have you ever heard the adage, "Don't meet your heroes... you might be afraid of what you may find?"

Whether it's some cocksucking, but talented athlete turning down a single autograph request from a little boy or a rock star like Neal with an overinflated ego, you just can't take 'em seriously. Enjoy watching them hit or shoot the ball or light up the fretboard.

Nothing more really needs to be or ought to be expected. For those that go the extra mile and sign 20 autographs after a tough loss or 3 hour show, more power to 'em, their fans will appreciate it even more. A lot of these guys never even had the chance for a normal college growth experience or even high school experience. Neal's a dick, but I mean shit, if I were running around jamming with Santana and Clapton, making millions by my mid-twenties, and never really having a normal young life, it might be tough for me to have some perspective and tact too.

I'm not excusing the behavior, just contextualizing it. It's not Neal's job to be a carefully spoken ambassador.

since so many say it's a business....shouldn't an executive of that business know how to conduct himself properly when marketing or advertising for the business by doing radio and print interviews?

It's a business in the sense that profit is the end goal and tough decisions have to be made. The entertainment industries are a far cry from typical corporate industries - look at how that buffoon Azoff acts (and gets away with it). Analogizing it further than that and equating athletes or musicians with executives doesn't work. They are not placed in situations that require them to learn the same kind of decorum that someone who ascends to senior management learns throughout his time in business.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Neal didn't have to mention JSS by name, but he is totally downgrading the fact that JSS did become an official member of Journey. He would have been better off simply calling JSS "another singer" or a "previous singer".

Journey, on another note, must be loving the superstar treatment over there. That kind of stuff really doesn;t happen here.

It seems obvious that there's some bad blood there. Maybe Neal didn't want to mention his name as it would open that whole subject up for interviews. Maybe he doesn't want to talk about it.
But yeah, it wasn't the best thing to say, totally agree.

Neal could have mentioned his name during that interview but I guarentee you that no one would have asked any follow-up questions in regards to it cause.....hardly anyone, if anyone, knows of the name over in the Philippines.

Also we're hearing Neal's point of view on the last singer before Arnel. That's his opinion, and his opinion is the dude was a sit-in. Consider that perhaps that's exactly what Neal himself perceived it to be but never had the opportunity or the need to state that publically, and regardless of what other members of the band thought. Personally it doesn't matter to me all that much. I'm here to enjoy the music they make and not to make their personal relationships with former band mates a part of my life.

[Don]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

[Ehwmatt]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

As would I. I totally feel for Jeff and he has every right to whatever feelings he chooses to have. I'm just not going to stop listening to Journey or be upset that Cain and Schon aren't the most honest guys out there. The faux outrage from many here is laughable. They either feel the need to create drama or suffer from so little excitement in their own lives that they want to get all bent out of shape about shit like this.

[S2M]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

As would I. I totally feel for Jeff and he has every right to whatever feelings he chooses to have. I'm just not going to stop listening to Journey or be upset that Cain and Schon aren't the most honest guys out there. The faux outrage from many here is laughable. They either feel the need to create drama or suffer from so little excitement in their own lives that they want to get all bent out of shape about shit like this.

You mean the same outrage when actors and singers wax political? Those people must lead pretty boring lives to comment on that kind of shit too, right?

[The Sushi Hunter]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

[stevew2]

Thank you for kissing my rose red ass

Thank you.

Dude,

Do you really think there is anyone on this board that doesn't know this story inside and out? Especially Tito? Pointing out the obvious just gives folks that are not your biggest fans more ammunition. Everyone here is well aware that you were the official singer for 11 months and that bastards bent you over. You are your own worst enemy at times.

Aaron

Arnel Pineda and The Journey.

LOL

Stop being so negative !

At least I didn't allude to the "sit in singer" comment.

Just to remind you!!

"Jeff Scott Soto has been officially named the new lead singer of Journey. He had been filling in for Steve Augeri, who had to leave the U.S. tour with Def Leppard shortly after it began on June 23 due to illness.

"We are so grateful to Steve for all the years he dedicated to Journey," says Journey in a joint statement. "We thank Steve for all his hard work and we wish him only the best in his future endeavors. Over the past few months, we've come to realize that Jeff has proven himself above and beyond that he can sing the hell out of our songs and we're happy to officially welcome him as part of the family. We're excited to start a new chapter with Jeff and we're excited about what the future may bring."

Jeff Soto also adds, "With delight & pleasure, I am accepting the offer to continue my tenure with Journey now as their permanent vocalist after the amazing past months we've spent together on tour. I also pay high respect to Steve Augeri for coming in and helping Journey continue their legacy for nearly the last decade and to Steve Perry for co-creating this legacy. I hope to now add and help drive Journey into the next stage of this band's future." Detroit Steve Augeri is currently recording his debut solo album, In the Moment, due out the summer of 2007.
www.journeymusic.com"

Quite funny how he can't say my name anymore though...not funny actually.....sad!

[Ehwmatt]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

As would I. I totally feel for Jeff and he has every right to whatever feelings he chooses to have. I'm just not going to stop listening to Journey or be upset that Cain and Schon aren't the most honest guys out there. The faux outrage from many here is laughable. They either feel the need to create drama or suffer from so little excitement in their own lives that they want to get all bent out of shape about shit like this.

You mean the same outrage when actors and singers wax political? Those people must lead pretty boring lives to comment on that kind of shit too, right?

Yep. I don't like that Springsteen pretends to be a working class hero when he's had millions since the 70s, but I'm not gonna sit here and go on and on about how he's a fraud. I might laugh at his bogus handling of that whole Wal-Mart deal or whatever, but will I stop listening to him? Nah

[Don]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially but I can't see it growing on me like I once thought. Oh well.

[Behshad]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially and I stand by that now.

Once in a great while you make some good points . Relax, this is one of them,,,,

[The Sushi Hunter]

Thank you for kissing my rose red ass

Thank you.

Dude,

Do you really think there is anyone on this board that doesn't know this story inside and out? Especially Tito? Pointing out the obvious just gives folks that are not your biggest fans more ammunition. Everyone here is well aware that you were the official singer for 11 months and that bastards bent you over. You are your own worst enemy at times.

Aaron

Arnel Pineda and The Journey.

LOL

Stop being so negative !

At least I didn't allude to the "sit in singer" comment.

Just to remind you!!

"Jeff Scott Soto has been officially named the new lead singer of Journey. He had been filling in for Steve Augeri, who had to leave the U.S. tour with Def Leppard shortly after it began on June 23 due to illness.

"We are so grateful to Steve for all the years he dedicated to Journey," says Journey in a joint statement. "We thank Steve for all his hard work and we wish him only the best in his future endeavors. Over the past few months, we've come to realize that Jeff has proven himself above and beyond that he can sing the hell out of our songs and we're happy to officially welcome him as part of the family. We're excited to start a new chapter with Jeff and we're excited about what the future may bring."

Jeff Soto also adds, "With delight & pleasure, I am accepting the offer to continue my tenure with Journey now as their permanent vocalist after the amazing past months we've spent together on tour. I also pay high respect to Steve Augeri for coming in and helping Journey continue their legacy for nearly the last decade and to Steve Perry for co-creating this legacy. I hope to now add and help drive Journey into the next stage of this band's future." Detroit Steve Augeri is currently recording his debut solo album, In the Moment, due out the summer of 2007.
www.journeymusic.com"

Quite funny how he can't say my name anymore though...not funny actually.....sad!

That's just a public relations address. What needs to be done is to read the actual contract. The pertinent information which really matters will be found in it and not just some document written on a website as what appears to be the case in the set of documents above. Plus the document states they are welcoming JSS as part of the Journey Family. How does that document define the meaning of Journey family, guarentee or specify the length of time that status may be for?

[Ehwmatt]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially and I stand by that now.

Arrival > Rev > Gen > Red13 to me. Maybe it's because I'm a younger fan and don't have my fan history steeped in any one person, but I don't get prejudiced at replacement members too frequently. I see the Little River Band whenever they come through. I'd see Birtles, Shorrock, and Goeble if they ever decided to come to the states. I'll see Journey with SP, SA, JSS, AP, or whoever else. Hell, I'll even give Survivor a chance with that fuckin McCauley clown if they come through on one of their 3 dates. If the band doesn't sound good anymore, then they won't get my ticket or album $.

As long as one of the integral members is around, I'll go check out the band. So no, I won't go see The Guess Who that runs around out there without Bachman or Cummings.

[S2M]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially and I stand by that now.

Arrival > Rev > Gen > Red13 to me. Maybe it's because I'm a younger fan and don't have my fan history steeped in any one person, but I don't get prejudiced at replacement members too frequently. I see the Little River Band whenever they come through. I'd see Birtles, Shorrock, and Goeble if they ever decided to come to the states. I'll see Journey with SP, SA, JSS, AP, or whoever else. Hell, I'll even give Survivor a chance with that fuckin McCauley clown if they come through on one of their 3 dates. If the band doesn't sound good anymore, then they won't get my ticket or album $.

As long as one of the integral members is around, I'll go check out the band. So no, I won't go see The Guess Who that runs around out there without Bachman or Cummings.

Dude, are you serious? Robin Mcauley is a great vocalist! Ever listen to MSG? Just because he replaced Jamison doesn't mean he's a clown.

[Ehwmatt]

Dude, are you serious? Robin Mcauley is a great vocalist! Ever listen to MSG? Just because he replaced Jamison doesn't mean he's a clown.

He's just not right for Survivor. But I'd still probably enjoy going to hear the songs and seeing Frankie play guitar.

[Don]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially and I stand by that now.

Arrival > Rev > Gen > Red13 to me. Maybe it's because I'm a younger fan and don't have my fan history steeped in any one person, but I don't get prejudiced at replacement members too frequently. I see the Little River Band whenever they come through. I'd see Birtles, Shorrock, and Goeble if they ever decided to come to the states. I'll see Journey with SP, SA, JSS, AP, or whoever else. Hell, I'll even give Survivor a chance with that fuckin McCauley clown if they come through on one of their 3 dates. If the band doesn't sound good anymore, then they won't get my ticket or album $.

As long as one of the integral members is around, I'll go check out the band. So no, I won't go see The Guess Who that runs around out there without Bachman or Cummings.

Bingo, and let's not forget, Arrival sold over 300,000 copies by itself, at a high price point, with out a bonus disc or DVD packin, had the same number of A/C hits as Rev, and was the first album after the voice which set the bar incredibly high. Rev got bought by 500,000 people, with the packin discs and at a price so low, Walmart lost 5 bucks a disc. I think looking at it that way, Arrival and Revelation did about the same, except Sony/BMG actually made money off of Arriival.

Revelation was great for the band as it brought them back from the last two disappointing releases so it did it's job.

[The Sushi Hunter]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially but I can't see it growing on me like I once thought. Oh well.

Oh yeah, I'm sure lots people will be telling Arnel to sue if they feel he's been wronged in any way. But what will only matter is what is in the contract that Arnel agreed to when he signed it. People can scream and yell to sue all they want to. But the contract is the binding document in the end. I don't believe Arnel would sue them cause I think he's getting exactly all he has ever wanted and needed from music, the opportunity just to sing in a band such as Journey.

[S2M]

I think the problem is the band let JSS finish up his business with Talisman and then gave him the axe. They could have called him and said don't give up your current gig, we're having second thoughts. He could have stayed on the continent and did some things different with that knowledge but they with held it, letting him remove ties with his previous employment opportunity. I equate it to signing a contract with a new employer, who gives you permission to give two weeks notice at your old job. You finish up and out process and while at the coffee shop here your new job let you go, even though no one has called you and you were already announced as a new employee.

I would be pretty pissed too.

From what I understand, JSS was there for almost a year. That's little bit different then your scenario, but I get the idea. Did JSS ever ask how long his Journey gig would be? If so, did he ask the right people? Was it in his contract to be with the band for "x" amount of years? If he was told he'd be on for "x" amount of years and wasn't, I could see him being pissed and have a legal argument. But the contract could also state that if "x" amount of creativity is not produced by "x" amount of time, then the contract will expire. Did JSS leave his former gig on good terms? If so, he could go back, if he's that much of an asset, the band would want him back. Don't burn any bridges is one of the best practices.

He had been there for almost a year but waited until they OFFICIALY announced him as their new singer before he made any moves.
And like I said before, Journey's tour that year ranked higher then last years tour for summer rock acts, so it's not like people didn't want to see Journey because of JSS.

As far as being here for the music, let Journey give Arnel the pink slip and all those Arnelites professing love for the band will be crying and screaming and telling Arnel to sue them and everything else, I guarantee it.

It doesn't matter to me, I'm into Arrival right now. Revelation was alright for a minute but it ain't their best work by far. I gave it a seven out of ten initially but I can't see it growing on me like I once thought. Oh well.

Oh yeah, I'm sure lots people will be telling Arnel to sue. But what will only matter is what is in the contract that Arnel agreed to when he signed it. People can scream and yell to sue all they want to. But the contract is the binding document in the end.

I wouldn't sign ANYTHING that quelled my right to sue in the future. That's Neal basically saying, 'Arnel, we will probably fuck you in the ass too, but you can't sue us when we do. If you want to be our sit-in, you have to sign this paper'....please

[The Sushi Hunter]

I wouldn't sign ANYTHING that quelled my right to sue in the future. That's Neal basically saying, 'Arnel, we will probably fuck you in the ass too, but you can't sue us when we do. If you want to be our sit-in, you have to sign this paper'....please

As I said, I'm sure Arnel is quite happy just being able to sing for this band. Arnel is much younger then the rest of these guys and he's got lots of life and creativity in him. I doubt Journey would let him go anytime soon. But if they do, it would probably be only because they are retiring from music.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It is sad b/c you and Neal were in Soul SirkUS together and were friends.

That ended bitterly as well.
JSS getting the call to join Journey salvaged a bridge that Neal had already burned to the ground once.
SoulSirkus hinted at what could someday rival a Perry/Schon-like prolific songwriting relationship.
Neal couldn't even be bothered to leave the door slightly ajar for future collaborations - he ruined everything.

[steveo777]

It is sad b/c you and Neal were in Soul SirkUS together and were friends.

That ended bitterly as well.
JSS getting the call to join Journey salvaged a bridge that Neal had already burned to the ground once.
SoulSirkus hinted at what could someday rival a Perry/Schon-like prolific songwriting relationship.
Neal couldn't even be bothered to leave the door slightly ajar for future collaborations - he ruined everything.

Except that nothing Neal supposedly ruined is having any effect on the band or him personally. They are working, selling concerts, etc., so pretty much business as usual. I didn't stop being a fan after SP, nor after SA, nor after JSS.

[Don]

It is sad b/c you and Neal were in Soul SirkUS together and were friends.

That ended bitterly as well.
JSS getting the call to join Journey salvaged a bridge that Neal had already burned to the ground once.
SoulSirkus hinted at what could someday rival a Perry/Schon-like prolific songwriting relationship.
Neal couldn't even be bothered to leave the door slightly ajar for future collaborations - he ruined everything.

Except that nothing Neal supposedly ruined is having any effect on the band or him personally. They are working, selling concerts, etc., so pretty much business as usual. I didn't stop being a fan after SP, nor after SA, nor after JSS.

Well that's not exactly true as far as the band' relationship with it's peers. Brian May is pretty respected in Rock music circles and he made it known what he thought about the situation. Being that he was friends with Neal and spoke his mind about the JSS debacle anyway, I think that might have had an effect on their relationship which doesn't appear to exist anymore.
Of course if it's all about the money, Schon won't give a shit anyway.

Anyway glad you still love the band.
Hey, what about you moderating over at that other site. They used to complain about us here, but lately they've done more damage to AP then we could ever do here. Al Queda? Charice as a money hungry OFW? Some other dude trolling for money (people know about him here but looks like he found some naive people to sweet talk over there)?
Nice official site they got there, huh?

[Gideon]

It is sad b/c you and Neal were in Soul SirkUS together and were friends.

That ended bitterly as well.
JSS getting the call to join Journey salvaged a bridge that Neal had already burned to the ground once.
SoulSirkus hinted at what could someday rival a Perry/Schon-like prolific songwriting relationship.
Neal couldn't even be bothered to leave the door slightly ajar for future collaborations - he ruined everything.

Except that nothing Neal supposedly ruined is having any effect on the band or him personally. They are working, selling concerts, etc., so pretty much business as usual. I didn't stop being a fan after SP, nor after SA, nor after JSS.

Well that's not exactly true as far as the band' relationship with it's peers. Brian May is pretty respected in Rock music circles and he made it known what he thought about the situation. Being that he was friends with Neal and spoke his mind about the JSS debacle anyway, I think that might have had an effect on their relationship which doesn't appear to exist anymore.
Of course if it's all about the money, Schon won't give a shit anyway.

I suppose the implication was that Journey's lost the respect of countless fans and musicians over the world when they canned Soto, which has not been substantiated. Even May's comments reflect one man and, to my knowledge, I can't recall other famous musicians condemning Journey's business decision.

[Don]

It is sad b/c you and Neal were in Soul SirkUS together and were friends.

That ended bitterly as well.
JSS getting the call to join Journey salvaged a bridge that Neal had already burned to the ground once.
SoulSirkus hinted at what could someday rival a Perry/Schon-like prolific songwriting relationship.
Neal couldn't even be bothered to leave the door slightly ajar for future collaborations - he ruined everything.

Except that nothing Neal supposedly ruined is having any effect on the band or him personally. They are working, selling concerts, etc., so pretty much business as usual. I didn't stop being a fan after SP, nor after SA, nor after JSS.

Well that's not exactly true as far as the band' relationship with it's peers. Brian May is pretty respected in Rock music circles and he made it known what he thought about the situation. Being that he was friends with Neal and spoke his mind about the JSS debacle anyway, I think that might have had an effect on their relationship which doesn't appear to exist anymore.
Of course if it's all about the money, Schon won't give a shit anyway.

I suppose the implication was that Journey's lost the respect of countless fans and musicians over the world when they canned Soto, which has not been substantiated. Even May's comments reflect one man and, to my knowledge, I can't recall other famous musicians condemning Journey's business decision.

I was only talking about May's comments. Now the fan pool is full of TRUE JOURNEY FANS that won't buy any other album unless AP's voice is on it (even though they don't own any of the back catalog), I have nothing to say about the respect aspect of Journey anymore.

[Gideon]

Personally, the fans out there who are interested solely because of Arnel I can't relate to. And the ones that you have affectionately dubbed the ArnelArmy or Plokkers can also get annoying; there was a band called Journey well before Arnel and, as with Perry, they are the reason that he has gotten such attention -- and the only reason.

But in the same token, you have a group that is even larger with the exact same sentiments towards Perry and have been acting equally loony for decades. So I don't take any particular umbridge with Arnel's fans, especially when you consider this: Perry was, inarguably, an ass during some of Journey's most critical moments. Arnel, in contrast, is Augeri-level in terms of being a class act and nice guy.

Why ignore the Loons and dish out all the hate on the Plokkers? That's bias, man.

[Don]

Personally, the fans out there who are interested solely because of Arnel I can't relate to. And the ones that you have affectionately dubbed the ArnelArmy or Plokkers can also get annoying; there was a band called Journey well before Arnel and, as with Perry, they are the reason that he has gotten such attention -- and the only reason.

But in the same token, you have a group that is even larger with the exact same sentiments towards Perry and have been acting equally loony for decades. So I don't take any particular umbridge with Arnel's fans, especially when you consider this: Perry was, inarguably, an ass during some of Journey's most critical moments. Arnel, in contrast, is Augeri-level in terms of being a class act and nice guy.

Why ignore the Loons and dish out all the hate on the Plokkers? That's bias, man.

Because I can relate to the loons, with the memories of watching new videos on MTVand going to stadium shows and the multiplatinum albums and endless airplay on the radio, and the fact that there was no one to compare SP against.

The re-records are my biggest problem though. Something about that just gets under my skin. Yea yea, they had to do it, I get that but IT STILL SUCKS.

[Gideon]

Because I can relate to the loons, with the memories of watching new videos and going to stadium shows.

I don't understand that and perhaps it was because I didn't get to see Perry with Journey back in the '80s. There is certainly a difference between watching the DVDs or the clips on Youtube and experiencing it all firsthand. But the bottom line is that Perry and his fans should not be held to a different set of standards than those we hold Arnel and his fans to. The fact that he was the Voice and one of the greatest singers of all time does not change the fact that he acted like a total ass during some of the most critical moments in the band's history nor does it change the fact that there were four other members who worked and played right along with him, each contributing their own prodigious talent to the concept of the band. Arnel and Perry have a great deal in common: they're both fantastic singers who have wowed countless people with their voices and, though both of them have contributed much to the band (Perry moreso, of course), both of them owe the same institution the entirety of their career.

Personally, I see no reason to condemn or mock a section of the fanbase when the same actions are exhibited -- and have been exhibited for decades! -- by an even larger and older group. I see problems in both sides and criticise both. No reason any side should get a free pass, even if you can relate to them.

That's all I'm saying.

The re-records are my biggest problem though. Something about that just gets under my skin.

The re-records were a necessary evil to get the deal with Wal-Mart. Furthermore, I see it as the band proving that they have a singer who can honor the Voice's legacy by hitting those awesome notes and singing those great lyrics.

Besides, we all prefer the originals anyway. No harm done. (Except Open Arms, which I like a lot better than the Perry-led one).

[Don]

Because I can relate to the loons, with the memories of watching new videos and going to stadium shows.

I don't understand that and perhaps it was because I didn't get to see Perry with Journey back in the '80s. There is certainly a difference between watching the DVDs or the clips on Youtube and experiencing it all firsthand. But the bottom line is that Perry and his fans should not be held to a different set of standards than those we hold Arnel and his fans to. The fact that he was the Voice and one of the greatest singers of all time does not change the fact that he acted like a total ass during some of the most critical moments in the band's history nor does it change the fact that there were four other members who worked and played right along with him, each contributing their own prodigious talent to the concept of the band. Arnel and Perry have a great deal in common: they're both fantastic singers who have wowed countless people with their voices and, though both of them have contributed much to the band (Perry moreso, of course), both of them owe the same institution the entirety of their career.

Personally, I see no reason to condemn or mock a section of the fanbase when the same actions are exhibited -- and have been exhibited for decades! -- by an even larger and older group. I see problems in both sides and criticise both. No reason any side should get a free pass, even if you can relate to them.

That's all I'm saying.

The re-records are my biggest problem though. Something about that just gets under my skin.

The re-records were a necessary evil to get the deal with Wal-Mart. Furthermore, I see it as the band proving that they have a singer who can honor the Voice's legacy by hitting those awesome notes and singing those great lyrics.

Besides, we all prefer the originals anyway. No harm done. (Except Open Arms, which I like a lot better than the Perry-led one).

Actually I was bordering on being a Perry hater when I first came to this site, but the plokkers cured me.

[Gideon]

I've been accused of such all the time, as do Saint John and Tito. I can't speak for them, but I'd like to think none of us are Perry haters. The man had (has?) a fantastic voice which, for SJ and myself, at least, in its prime the best we've ever heard. He and I differ where we think his prime was. '83 - '94, I think no one on this planet could touch him and even before that, I think he was one of the best.

The problem is that I don't get caught up in the trap of being a fan. I love his voice, but he was an ass. I don't shade it, I don't whitewash it. He made shitty decisions in pursuit of self-aggrandizement and ego trips and they are inexcusable. Was he a bad man? No. He was human. But he was no better than what Neal and Jon have been roasted for. I don't excuse his decisions on the merits of his voice.

In contrast, Arnel's a class act who has demonstrated humility, gentility, and kindness that easily surpass anything I've ever seen and heard of Perry doing. And he's got a nice set of pipes on him, too.