W.E.T. - the album Journey should have made but couldn't

[Carlitto H@kk]

Not sure what "studio tricks" Dan is referring to.

Very thick, layered harmonies and lead vocals. And that's not a diss, as they came out great. It's just very difficult to pull off live.

Dean, Journey has the budget and technology to pull it off live. What's W.E.T. gonna use ... a walkman plugged into the monitors?

Never took it as a diss, Dan. I know what you mean.
Pulling that stuff off live isn't really that over-the-top expensive though.
Pretty much can do it with a MacBook or PC, the right software, and in-ear monitors.
there's actually a lot of "bar bands" and cover bands doing this kinda stuff nowadays.

[WalrusOct9]

there's actually a lot of "bar bands" and cover bands doing this kinda stuff nowadays.

Not the least of which are Frontiers, and presumably other Journey tribute bands. A friend of mine was in a U2 tribute in Chicago and did the same thing for the keyboards/sequences. Not difficult at all these days.

[Deb]

Not sure what "studio tricks" Dan is referring to.

Very thick, layered harmonies and lead vocals. And that's not a diss, as they came out great. It's just very difficult to pull off live.

Dean, Journey has the budget and technology to pull it off live. What's W.E.T. gonna use ... a walkman plugged into the monitors?

He pulled out Brothers in Arms and Comes Down Like Rain at a couple of the shows he did when he toured Brazil with EM earlier this year. From the youtubes, he sounded just fine on them.

[Jana]

Not sure what "studio tricks" Dan is referring to.

Very thick, layered harmonies and lead vocals. And that's not a diss, as they came out great. It's just very difficult to pull off live.

Dean, Journey has the budget and technology to pull it off live. What's W.E.T. gonna use ... a walkman plugged into the monitors?

He pulled out Brothers in Arms and Comes Down Like Rain at a couple of the shows he did when he toured Brazil with EM earlier this year. From the youtubes, he sounded just fine on them.

Brothers In Arms Live Brazil - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Smk-vC6j ... re=related

Comes Down Like Rain (part of the song) Live Brazil - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kATqPg7 ... re=related

[Saint John]

Not sure what "studio tricks" Dan is referring to.

Very thick, layered harmonies and lead vocals. And that's not a diss, as they came out great. It's just very difficult to pull off live.

Dean, Journey has the budget and technology to pull it off live. What's W.E.T. gonna use ... a walkman plugged into the monitors?

He pulled out Brothers in Arms and Comes Down Like Rain at a couple of the shows he did when he toured Brazil with EM earlier this year. From the youtubes, he sounded just fine on them.

Brothers In Arms Live Brazil - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Smk-vC6j ... re=related

Comes Down Like Rain Live Brazil - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kATqPg7 ... re=related

Is he running pitch correction or some sort of voice modulator? Not sure I've ever seen a lead singer hitting a foot pedal. Perhaps he's triggering backing vox ... which would make sense. At any rate, it came off very well.

[yulog]

I like WET better than Journey's last effort with AP

They're both about the same for me. Uneven in places for me as far as my taste of music. But W.E.T. has the best song out of both of them

If I Fall = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWoaB95d ... re=related

Great melodic rock song. Love the intro. Love the vocal delivery by Jeff, love love love the guitar in this song, love the backing vocals so strong in this song in places, love the layering of Jeff's vocals in places. Fantastic song. Great job by the whole band.

Great song but i think "I'll be there" is better

[Deb]

I like WET better than Journey's last effort with AP

They're both about the same for me. Uneven in places for me as far as my taste of music. But W.E.T. has the best song out of both of them

If I Fall = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWoaB95d ... re=related

Great melodic rock song. Love the intro. Love the vocal delivery by Jeff, love love love the guitar in this song, love the backing vocals so strong in this song in places, love the layering of Jeff's vocals in places. Fantastic song. Great job by the whole band.

Great song but i think "I'll be there" is better

Love If I Fall and Comes Down Like Rain and My Everything has definitely become a fave too. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCu4q7yH6OQ

[Vladan]

Listening to this really brings it home just how wrong it was to let go of JSS. He knows Perry inside out, even putting in some For the Love of Strange Medicine-isms here and there on the W.E.T record. In short, he was the right man for the band. W.E.T. beats Revelation all across the board really. The production, the songs, everything. And still, imagine the difference in budgets.

Revelation sounds like Journey trying to sound like the band they once were, but failing. It just sounds too watered down. The cardboard sounding drums, Neal's shredding and sound totally out of control... it just becomes very empty on feeling. Add the fact that Arnel's singing lyrics he has no connection with and it becomes very soulless. Very Walmart and a far cry from the band they were with Perry, where the soul was key.

With JSS they could have moved into a new direction. They would have had a singer with a (soulful) voice of his own and could have created something brand new. Also, let's not forget JSS's stage presence. He looks like a star onstage, whereas Arnel looks like someone who jumped up onstage from the audience. Big difference.

Journey is not so much a band anymore, as a business account and it's a great shame.

And although they got a singer they could control 100%, we lost Journey in the process.

"And when you lose a guy like Steve (Augeri), who was a tremendous team player, and y'know, Jeff Scott steps up and kinda helps us out there. But, y'know, his sound wasn't for us and then later on, I think his personality wasn't for us."

- Jonathan Cain
http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/blabbe ... mID=149513

Control, yes.

+1!

Plus 1000! best post i've read in a week! well put! letting JSS go was their downfall. I agree 100%!

The whole "JSS wasn't the right sound for us" is a whole load of stinking BS, please. There are other factors at play here, things we don't know. The personality thing? 0k maybe, that could of been it.

I would also venture and say, if JSS was with journey today, with Jeff's appeal? yeah a hit would of been on the rise, more recognition? yes. Arnel was an unknown, that's the problem, and a host of other problems.

[Behshad]

To compare WET and Journey, is like comparing Gretzky a year before he retired to Sedin brothers.

We are talking about a once great band with classic hits , trying one last time to put up a show before they retire for good vs a fresh band with great music , amazing song writing skills and a voice that even tho it's been around for 20+ years still sounds as great as ever.


In regards to pulling it off live , sure they can. Last I checked , live version doesn't have to sound exactly like the studio version ,,,, that's the beauty of live shows.

[Melissa]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

[Saint John]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

Fair points. However, Revelation was a done deal and wasn't really even an organic album with Arnel. It was material Jon Cain had stored and was the only thing they could come up with on such short notice to fulfill the Walmart offer. This will be the first album Arnel is really affiliated with. And don't believe what you've heard here, he and Neal spent a lot of time together working on melodies and this album's direction. Neal then brought that to Jon and the concept was off and running. The vocals were laid down and the album is now being mixed and finished.

[Rockindeano]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

Fair points. However, Revelation was a done deal and wasn't really even an organic album with Arnel. It was material Jon Cain had stored and was the only thing they could come up with on such short notice to fulfill the Walmart offer. This will be the first album Arnel is really affiliated with. And don't believe what you've heard here, he and Neal spent a lot of time together working on melodies and this album's direction. Neal then brought that to Jon and the concept was off and running. The vocals were laid down and the album is now being mixed and finished.

And you know this how? How do you know Pineda and Schon spent countless hours making magic? LOL, I and everyone else will believe it when we see it. So far, the record is clear- Pineda has not contributed jack shit to this band. The next song he is listed on the credits will be his first. The guy just sucks as a songwriter, period.

[Saint John]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

Fair points. However, Revelation was a done deal and wasn't really even an organic album with Arnel. It was material Jon Cain had stored and was the only thing they could come up with on such short notice to fulfill the Walmart offer. This will be the first album Arnel is really affiliated with. And don't believe what you've heard here, he and Neal spent a lot of time together working on melodies and this album's direction. Neal then brought that to Jon and the concept was off and running. The vocals were laid down and the album is now being mixed and finished.

And you know this how? How do you know Pineda and Schon spent countless hours making magic? LOL, I and everyone else will believe it when we see it. So far, the record is clear- Pineda has not contributed jack shit to this band. The next song he is listed on the credits will be his first. The guy just sucks as a songwriter, period.

He was brought into Journey with songs whose lyrics and melodies were already in place ... so how do you have any idea what kind of songwriter he is? And don't worry about what I know.

[Rockindeano]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

Fair points. However, Revelation was a done deal and wasn't really even an organic album with Arnel. It was material Jon Cain had stored and was the only thing they could come up with on such short notice to fulfill the Walmart offer. This will be the first album Arnel is really affiliated with. And don't believe what you've heard here, he and Neal spent a lot of time together working on melodies and this album's direction. Neal then brought that to Jon and the concept was off and running. The vocals were laid down and the album is now being mixed and finished.

And you know this how? How do you know Pineda and Schon spent countless hours making magic? LOL, I and everyone else will believe it when we see it. So far, the record is clear- Pineda has not contributed jack shit to this band. The next song he is listed on the credits will be his first. The guy just sucks as a songwriter, period.

He was brought into Journey with songs whose lyrics and melodies were already in place ... so how do you have any idea what kind of songwriter he is? And don't worry about what I know.

The guy hasn't written a song heard by the public since he started singing. It is a fact, when he joined, yes much of the music was layed down, but still, what band wants a singer who just sings? The guy has to do something to prove himself. Just singing Perry tunes is a pretty dismal resume. Hell, even Augeri wrote a song or two...granted they were shit, but at least he attempted it.

[Saint John]

Let's just wait and see.

[Don]

PEACE!

[slucero]

If this album comes out and AP still sounds like he needs a scholarship to Ebonics University these boards are gonna light up like crazy...

[Saint John]

PEACE!

Salamat, Don ... salamat, Deano.

[RossValoryRocks]

The guy just sucks as a songwriter, period.

Ummm...your logic is flawed...

#1 You said he hasn't written anything...Ok...you are right...
#2 But then you say he sucks as a songwriter...

Look at the those statments...how on earth can you say #2 when he hasn't done #1 yet?

[Jana]

I like the W.E.T. album better than Revelation. Revelation isn't bad, just a bit too sugary and not as rocking as I think an album with Jeff would have been. I liked the more edgy direction Journey could have gone, but instead it's just the same old, same old, and that's not a diss to Arnel since I think he's a great singer, I just think Journey should have tried to move forward a bit and out of the same old spotlight. But to each their own.

Fair points. However, Revelation was a done deal and wasn't really even an organic album with Arnel. It was material Jon Cain had stored and was the only thing they could come up with on such short notice to fulfill the Walmart offer. This will be the first album Arnel is really affiliated with. And don't believe what you've heard here, he and Neal spent a lot of time together working on melodies and this album's direction. Neal then brought that to Jon and the concept was off and running. The vocals were laid down and the album is now being mixed and finished.

And you know this how? How do you know Pineda and Schon spent countless hours making magic? LOL, I and everyone else will believe it when we see it. So far, the record is clear- Pineda has not contributed jack shit to this band. The next song he is listed on the credits will be his first. The guy just sucks as a songwriter, period.

He was brought into Journey with songs whose lyrics and melodies were already in place ... so how do you have any idea what kind of songwriter he is? And don't worry about what I know.

The guy hasn't written a song heard by the public since he started singing. It is a fact, when he joined, yes much of the music was layed down, but still, what band wants a singer who just sings? The guy has to do something to prove himself. Just singing Perry tunes is a pretty dismal resume. Hell, even Augeri wrote a song or two...granted they were shit, but at least he attempted it.

Dave Gahan never wrote any music for Depeche Mode until he demanded to in 2005. They are a hugely successful 80s band that has transcended from the 80s into the 90s and this decade with a huge fan base, while continually making new music. None of his fans mind. His showmanship and vocals and delivery was always and still is amazing. It is a band that has some of the best electronica music of all time with the music written by Martin Gore and Alan Wilder before he left, but always with the unique vocal style of Dave in mind.

[Carlitto H@kk]

The guy hasn't written a song heard by the public since he started singing. It is a fact, when he joined, yes much of the music was layed down, but still, what band wants a singer who just sings? The guy has to do something to prove himself. Just singing Perry tunes is a pretty dismal resume. Hell, even Augeri wrote a song or two...granted they were shit, but at least he attempted it.

Dave Gahan never wrote any music for Depeche Mode until he demanded to in 2005. They are a hugely successful 80s band that has transcended from the 80s into the 90s and this decade with a huge fan base, while continually making new music. None of his fans mind. His showmanship and vocals and delivery was always and still is amazing. It is a band that has some of the best electronica music of all time with the music written by Martin Gore and Alan Wilder before he left, but always with the unique vocal style of Dave in mind.

I guess, IMO, here's how I feel about this whole "singer should write" deal.
While I don't think a singer really needs to write any music to lead a band,
I DO, however, think that Journey needs a singer that can write, contribute, and
be a counter-wieght to Jon & Neal's inputs.

Perry had different backgrounds and ideas, and ways of thinking musically.
Cain, Schon, and Perry writing together was a recipe for pure bliss.

Taking Perry out of the mix, and just leaving Schon & Cain to do it all
leaves something to be desired. It's like forgetting to add
the sugar to your cake mix

Cain & Schon seem to just be rehashing old ideas & melodies,
or just throwing melodies & riffs together to meet deadlines
and othe rschedules.

They need a 3rd input to really add some
more excitement to the mix.

just my opinion.

[Rockindeano]

The guy hasn't written a song heard by the public since he started singing. It is a fact, when he joined, yes much of the music was layed down, but still, what band wants a singer who just sings? The guy has to do something to prove himself. Just singing Perry tunes is a pretty dismal resume. Hell, even Augeri wrote a song or two...granted they were shit, but at least he attempted it.

Dave Gahan never wrote any music for Depeche Mode until he demanded to in 2005. They are a hugely successful 80s band that has transcended from the 80s into the 90s and this decade with a huge fan base, while continually making new music. None of his fans mind. His showmanship and vocals and delivery was always and still is amazing. It is a band that has some of the best electronica music of all time with the music written by Martin Gore and Alan Wilder before he left, but always with the unique vocal style of Dave in mind.

I guess, IMO, here's how I feel about this whole "singer should write" deal.
While I don't think a singer really needs to write any music to lead a band,
I DO, however, think that Journey needs a singer that can write, contribute, and
be a counter-wieght to Jon & Neal's inputs.

Perry had different backgrounds and ideas, and ways of thinking musically.
Cain, Schon, and Perry writing together was a recipe for pure bliss.

Taking Perry out of the mix, and just leaving Schon & Cain to do it all
leaves something to be desired. It's like forgetting to add
the sugar to your cake mix

Cain & Schon seem to just be rehashing old ideas & melodies,
or just throwing melodies & riffs together to meet deadlines
and othe rschedules.

They need a 3rd input to really add some
more excitement to the mix.

just my opinion.

I agree with you mostly. There are people out there who write all the music themselves. Bruce writes his bands' music; all of it...drums, keys, guitars, the whole deal. There are a few others, like Bryan Adams as well, but I DO get your idea. The Perry, Schon and Friga team was pretty good, and they have a nice little record. No one can dispute the fact that writing has indeed declined since SP left the band, err, I mean got kicked out.

Also, being the singer he is, why the Hell can't Castronovo write? You'd think a drummer who can sing would be a good addition to the songwriting team, unless of course Schon and Friga want all the royalties which will be very slim anyway. They aren't going to have any singles or get on the radio anyway.

[Carlitto H@kk]

Also, being the singer he is, why the Hell can't Castronovo write? You'd think a drummer who can sing would be a good addition to the songwriting team, unless of course Schon and Friga want all the royalties which will be very slim anyway. They aren't going to have any singles or get on the radio anyway.

I guess we may find out how well Deen writes...

Wasn't there some report or tidbit out there that he has recorded a solo album???

[Jana]

Also, being the singer he is, why the Hell can't Castronovo write? You'd think a drummer who can sing would be a good addition to the songwriting team, unless of course Schon and Friga want all the royalties which will be very slim anyway. They aren't going to have any singles or get on the radio anyway.

I guess we may find out how well Deen writes...

Wasn't there some report or tidbit out there that he has recorded a solo album???

Edit:

Here's a portion of Deen being interviewed by Andrew back during the Generations time period.

Do you ever see yourself doing a record?
You know, I'd love to…but I wouldn't know where to start. I don't write music. Like I said, I am a good chameleon. Someone can say play this and do that and I can do that.
But I have never been able to create on my own; I'm not that kind of guy. You have guys like Phil Collins and Don Henley that can write their own stuff.
I wouldn't know where to start!
Hook me up bro, get me some songs, let's do a solo record together!! Haha

[Jana]

The guy hasn't written a song heard by the public since he started singing. It is a fact, when he joined, yes much of the music was layed down, but still, what band wants a singer who just sings? The guy has to do something to prove himself. Just singing Perry tunes is a pretty dismal resume. Hell, even Augeri wrote a song or two...granted they were shit, but at least he attempted it.

Dave Gahan never wrote any music for Depeche Mode until he demanded to in 2005. They are a hugely successful 80s band that has transcended from the 80s into the 90s and this decade with a huge fan base, while continually making new music. None of his fans mind. His showmanship and vocals and delivery was always and still is amazing. It is a band that has some of the best electronica music of all time with the music written by Martin Gore and Alan Wilder before he left, but always with the unique vocal style of Dave in mind.

I guess, IMO, here's how I feel about this whole "singer should write" deal.
While I don't think a singer really needs to write any music to lead a band,
I DO, however, think that Journey needs a singer that can write, contribute, and
be a counter-wieght to Jon & Neal's inputs.

Perry had different backgrounds and ideas, and ways of thinking musically.
Cain, Schon, and Perry writing together was a recipe for pure bliss.

Taking Perry out of the mix, and just leaving Schon & Cain to do it all
leaves something to be desired. It's like forgetting to add
the sugar to your cake mix

Cain & Schon seem to just be rehashing old ideas & melodies,
or just throwing melodies & riffs together to meet deadlines
and othe rschedules.

They need a 3rd input to really add some
more excitement to the mix.

just my opinion.

I agree on that. It never hurts to shake it up. Arrival benefited from some new blood on songwriting. I was just pointing out it doesn't have to be that the lead singer writes, though usually definitely does and is the norm. But Depeche Mode, as a 30-year band, has a fan base that spans all age groups and manages to stay relevant and even play stadiums, which is no small feat.

[Glenn]

No set-up, just a new poster expressing his view on the state of Journey 2010. Would be interesting to hear what others think.

Well if you don't know you should do a little research.....It's all over this place what people think of the current state of Journey.

You're right...A lot like current Journey, and a lot don't.

[ebake02]

They are so full of shit,:roll: we all know Cain is a greedy money whore. Wave enough $$$ in his face and he couldn't dial Perry's number fast enough.

[Carlitto H@kk]

Tadpole is leaving and won't come back until Steve Perry comes back!!! 5 days ago[/i]

Wow...
Guess Tadpole might as well discontinue his/her internet service, eh?

Who knows, if Neal weds & divorces a few more wives in the next year or so,
maybe he'll be so hard up for alimony cash that he'll swallow his
pride and beg Steve to come back for a final tour

[Michigan Girl]

Tadpole is leaving and won't come back until Steve Perry comes back!!! 5 days ago[/i]

Wow...
Guess Tadpole might as well discontinue his/her internet service, eh?

Who knows, if Neal weds & divorces a few more wives in the next year or so,
maybe he'll be so hard up for alimony cash that he'll swallow his
pride and beg Steve to come back for a final tour

lol ...sorry Carlitto, had that post
in the wrong thread!!

[Carlitto H@kk]

Tadpole is leaving and won't come back until Steve Perry comes back!!! 5 days ago[/i]

Wow...
Guess Tadpole might as well discontinue his/her internet service, eh?

Who knows, if Neal weds & divorces a few more wives in the next year or so,
maybe he'll be so hard up for alimony cash that he'll swallow his
pride and beg Steve to come back for a final tour

lol ...sorry Carlitto, had that post
in the wrong thread!!

No worries!
Point was still made on how sad the state of Journey-Fan nation