Neal wasn't the first to hire a clone

[Don]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer interprets what has been created.

[Ritchie]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

[Don]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

Of course, just pointing out that there is a difference especially in the royalties game.

[Ritchie]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

Of course, just pointing out that there is a difference especially in the royalties game.

Royalties are great but a true artist and performer prefers a standing ovation from the audience.

[Don]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

Of course, just pointing out that there is a difference especially in the royalties game.

Royalties are great but a true artist and performer prefers a standing ovation from the audience.

When they're young the adulation from the audience is great but when Father time steals their gifts later those royalties are going to come in mighty handy.

I've done work for the screen actors guild and can tell there are thousands of artists and performers who totally depend on those quarterly checks coming in.

[slucero]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

Of course, just pointing out that there is a difference especially in the royalties game.

Royalties are great but a true artist and performer prefers a standing ovation from the audience.

One can be an artist... and not be a performer... and vice versa. The two are not mutually exclusive


A fella named J.D. Souther wrote this song called "Tequila Sunrise".... pretty famous song.. Yet J.D. hates performing... I'm pretty sure Don Henley considers J.D. an artist though....


Diane Warren has written all these hits...

"I Don't Want to Miss a Thing - Aerosmith
"I Turn to You" - All-4-One / Christina Aguilera
"Love Will Lead You Back" - Taylor Dayne
"Because You Loved Me" - Celine Dion
"Have You Ever?" - Brandy
"Un-Break My Heart" - Toni Braxton
"There You'll Be" - Faith Hill
"I'll Never Get Over You - Exposé
"Blue Eyes Blue" - Eric Clapton
"How Can We Be Lovers?" - Michael Bolton
"When I See You Smile" - Bad English
"Saving Forever for You" - Shanice
"How Do I Live" - LeAnn Rimes / Trisha Yearwood
"I Could Not Ask for More" - Edwin McCain / Sara Evans
"I Don't Want to Be Your Friend" - Cyndi Lauper

.....yet she's not a performer..


Thats like saying JC would stop writing if he left Journey

[Ritchie]

I would use the term "performer" rather than artist. An artists creates, a performer replicates what has been created.

Both Pineda and Brewster have written their own original material,that makes them artists performing Journey songs.

Of course, just pointing out that there is a difference especially in the royalties game.

Royalties are great but a true artist and performer prefers a standing ovation from the audience.

One can be an artist... and not be a performer... and vice versa. The two are not mutually exclusive


A fella named J.D. Souther wrote this song called "Tequila Sunrise".... pretty famous song.. Yet J.D. hates performing... I'm pretty sure Don Henley considers J.D. an artist though....


Diane Warren has written all these hits...

"I Don't Want to Miss a Thing - Aerosmith
"I Turn to You" - All-4-One / Christina Aguilera
"Love Will Lead You Back" - Taylor Dayne
"Because You Loved Me" - Celine Dion
"Have You Ever?" - Brandy
"Un-Break My Heart" - Toni Braxton
"There You'll Be" - Faith Hill
"I'll Never Get Over You - Exposé
"Blue Eyes Blue" - Eric Clapton
"How Can We Be Lovers?" - Michael Bolton
"When I See You Smile" - Bad English
"Saving Forever for You" - Shanice
"How Do I Live" - LeAnn Rimes / Trisha Yearwood
"I Could Not Ask for More" - Edwin McCain / Sara Evans
"I Don't Want to Be Your Friend" - Cyndi Lauper

.....yet she's not a performer..


Thats like saying JC would stop writing if he left Journey

Not every great songwriter is a great performer and not every great performer is a great songwriter....yep I get your drift!

[Voyager]

This has been one of my chief complaints with SP and the idea that Journey cracked the stone. In reality, it was SP who cracked the stone.

That is what I was trying to emphasize. Well said.

If you listen to Lincoln Brewster playing the lead solo for "I'll Be Alright Without You" in the video I posted, it's obvious that he was trying to play it exactly like Neal - and he did a very impressive job of it. If that isn't equal to "cracking the stone" I don't know what is. If I was Neal and I watched that video, I would have been pissed off and all loyalty to SP would have gone out the window.

I am not ripping on Perry or Schon. I'm just saying it wasn't Schon who first cracked the stone. It's easy for me to see how they both felt invested in the music they created together, and also why they might both be jealous over its control. Imagine if it would have been Perry who re-grouped Journey and found some shredder on YouTube with a Les Paul and a big black afro to replace Neal?

[SherriBerry]

For the record, I have no problem with him touring and doing Journey songs...just like I don't have a problem with Journey touring and doing Journey songs (can't believe I had to say that). I just don't think Perry put himself in the band's shoes when he criticized them for cracking the stone is all. Journey has toured on new albums themselves. So, what's the difference? Except Journey sound more like Journey than the Perry solo tour did to me, which they should.

I see your point - My interpretation of "cracking the stone" may be different which is why I've butt in here, LOL. I always took it to mean, not that they are cracking the integrity of the name of the band, but that once they "fracture" that partnership between Cain, Perry, and Schon, there's no going back - Meaning, "do you understand that if you move forward, there will never be a time again when we are onstage together as Journey," which I think Perry also elaborated on, saying "there's no going back," or something to that effect.

When Steve Perry was interviewed for BTM, that is exactly how he defined "cracking the stone" and he was the one who used the phrase. He said that he was fine if the band toured and played Journey music as long as they didn't call themselves Journey - they could call themselves the "J-Boys" for all he cared, but if they continued on as Journey, he considered it cracking the stone and for him there would be no going back. The comment wasn't a critical assessment of their past actions - it was what he told them it meant to him before they did it. It wasn't about whether another band member did a solo project or what they played when they toured and somehow people have used the phrase to describe points in the band's history when it could have broken up and there are more than a few. Neal started a new band (HSAS) in 1983 at the height of Journey's success - if HSAS had been a success this would be an entirely different discussion.

Personally I believe they had the right to carry on as Journey, but they knew what it meant when they made the decision. To be clear, I don't think either side was "wrong". I don't think Neal and Jon were wrong to feel that they had waited long enough and that they wanted to move on under the Journey name and I don't think Steve was wrong for how he felt about that.

[Abitaman]

The work Lincoln did on FTLOSM, considering his age and maturity as a player and writer at the time, was pretty damned amazing. I consider him a prodigy; since he chose to channel his abilities into a different avenue/genre of music, most of us haven't heard much else from him, but he's maintained a successful solo career for nearly 20 years now. When I hear FTLSOM I hear very little, if anything, that is derivative of Schon's work. Honestly felt that Brewster was a much more progressive and technical player where Schon was more of a melodic and soulful player in that Perry-era Journey material. That being said, he's covering Journey songs in a Perry concert here, so not sure what else he should have been doing on those numbers.

I have really found nothing in FTLOSM that really reminds of Neal or Journey, other than Perry singing. The playing is removed, IMO from Journey pretty much on all the songs. Anyway, IMO sounds very Journeyish, but that is mainly a vocal song. I think one of the reasons it wasn't a big seller is the fact that it didn't have enough of the Journey feel.

[Michigan Girl]

When Steve Perry was interviewed for BTM, that is exactly how he defined "cracking the stone" and he was the one who used the phrase. He said that he was fine if the band toured and played Journey music as long as they didn't call themselves Journey - they could call themselves the "J-Boys" for all he cared, but if they continued on as Journey, he considered it cracking the stone and for him there would be no going back. The comment wasn't a critical assessment of their past actions - it was what he told them it meant to him before they did it. It wasn't about whether another band member did a solo project or what they played when they toured and somehow people have used the phrase to describe points in the band's history when it could have broken up and there are more than a few. Neal started a new band (HSAS) in 1983 at the height of Journey's success - if HSAS had been a success this would be an entirely different discussion.

Thank you~~ again, I don't understand why people do not understand this?!?
The cracking of the stone has taken on a whole new meaning over the years.

[Yoda]

For the record, I have no problem with him touring and doing Journey songs...just like I don't have a problem with Journey touring and doing Journey songs (can't believe I had to say that). I just don't think Perry put himself in the band's shoes when he criticized them for cracking the stone is all. Journey has toured on new albums themselves. So, what's the difference? Except Journey sound more like Journey than the Perry solo tour did to me, which they should.

I see your point - My interpretation of "cracking the stone" may be different which is why I've butt in here, LOL. I always took it to mean, not that they are cracking the integrity of the name of the band, but that once they "fracture" that partnership between Cain, Perry, and Schon, there's no going back - Meaning, "do you understand that if you move forward, there will never be a time again when we are onstage together as Journey," which I think Perry also elaborated on, saying "there's no going back," or something to that effect.

When Steve Perry was interviewed for BTM, that is exactly how he defined "cracking the stone" and he was the one who used the phrase. He said that he was fine if the band toured and played Journey music as long as they didn't call themselves Journey - they could call themselves the "J-Boys" for all he cared, but if they continued on as Journey, he considered it cracking the stone and for him there would be no going back. The comment wasn't a critical assessment of their past actions - it was what he told them it meant to him before they did it. It wasn't about whether another band member did a solo project or what they played when they toured and somehow people have used the phrase to describe points in the band's history when it could have broken up and there are more than a few. Neal started a new band (HSAS) in 1983 at the height of Journey's success - if HSAS had been a success this would be an entirely different discussion.

Personally I believe they had the right to carry on as Journey, but they knew what it meant when they made the decision. To be clear, I don't think either side was "wrong". I don't think Neal and Jon were wrong to feel that they had waited long enough and that they wanted to move on under the Journey name and I don't think Steve was wrong for how he felt about that.

Exactly! Game, set, match! I personally didn't mind Journey moving on as "Journey" without Steve Perry in '98. I had waited years for action in the Journey camp, and just when I thought my favorite band was finally back (amongst the era of 90's music that was far removed from the AOR sound) Perry leaves the band again. So, being hungry for something more out of Journey, I was happy for them to move on with a new singer who could cover the back catalog and hits respectfully, and I thought Augeri did a pretty good job of it. Yes, my choice will always be Perry over anybody else singing for Journey, but knowing that Perry wasn't coming back, then I fully supported Journey moving on and putting out the style of music that is my favorite.

I will say, the Generations CD kind of made things stale for me in terms of that lineup. I LOVED Arrival and will put that album against a lot of others, but Generations kind of killed it for me in terms of that lineup. Maybe a handful of good songs, the rest were, well...blah to me. So, after that CD, I wasn't very excited about that line up anymore. If Journey had done more songs like Remember Me and Higher Place, I would have vehemently supported that lineup until the die I left this world! So, when the time comes that Augeri left, I was ready for something completely fresh, new, and different for Journey. I really felt either they do something complete different, or just end it then. It's one thing to bring in a guy to sound enough like the original singer of the hits to keep things going, but to bring in yet another new guy to do, yet, the same thing? I have to draw the line at THAT point. Of course, if Journey had stuck with Jeremey, I would have definitely supported that move, because I've supported Jeremey and Frontiers for many, many years, and I felt Jeremey deserved that chance and certainly would have carried on the legacy very respectfully. But other than that, I really feel a band has one chance to replace a singer with one that sounds "similar" and if he/she doesn't work out or doesn't stick around, you need to either make peace with the original guy/gal or move on to something completely different. Completely my opinion and one that not everybody will support I'm sure. That's what I felt Journey had with Jeff, and they kind of screwed that up in my opinion. But, that's really the reason, for me, why I wasn't very excited (and still not) about Arnel in the band. Revelation was an album that should have been either the album Journey did as their "comeback" album in 2001, or the sophomore album to Arrival. Eclipse, to me, was the album Journey should have done with Jeff.

Again, all my opinion. With the exception of Jeremey, I'm not sure I would have really cared for whoever else Journey would have brought in after Augeri to continue with the "legacy" sound...I think I was (and am) tired of the "legacy" sound. So, it's really no offense to Arnel whatsoever. I think he's a heck of a singer, but after awhile, one tends to grow tired of a band constantly replacing Steve Perry's voice. Jeff was enough of a departure (no pun intended), I was interested in that line up. I know this was completely off the topic of "clones" but the "crack the stone" thing kind of prompted me to post this. Like Sherri, I agree that both sides aren't wrong in saying or doing what they did.

[shaneslatts]

Again, I think it's just the way you interpret the phrase "don't crack the stone." where I take it to mean "If you carry on under the Journey name without me, there is no going back - we will never perform together as Journey again," some may interpret it to mean "don't use another singer and play Journey songs," in which case yes, Perry did play Journey songs on his solo tour with other guitar/keyboard players etc.

I think it's a big distinction though, but we will have to agree to disagree

If I'm not mistaken, Perry was pretty specific with what he meant with the ' don't break the stone' comment.
He said something along the lines of ' Call it whatever you want, but don't call it Journey'.
From that, I get the impression that Perry simply did not want it to be called 'Journey'.
Don't get me wrong, I am sure Perry would not have liked the same core members adding a 'sound a like' singer and calling themselves' Wheel in the Sky' or what have you.
But I really believe Steve's comment about ' Breaking the Stone' was mainly in regards to the Journey name.

[Arkansas]

This has been one of my chief complaints with SP and the idea that Journey cracked the stone. In reality, it was SP who cracked the stone.

That is what I was trying to emphasize. Well said.

If you listen to Lincoln Brewster playing the lead solo for "I'll Be Alright Without You" in the video I posted, it's obvious that he was trying to play it exactly like Neal - and he did a very impressive job of it. If that isn't equal to "cracking the stone" I don't know what is. If I was Neal and I watched that video, I would have been pissed off and all loyalty to SP would have gone out the window.

I am not ripping on Perry or Schon. I'm just saying it wasn't Schon who first cracked the stone. It's easy for me to see how they both felt invested in the music they created together, and also why they might both be jealous over its control. Imagine if it would have been Perry who re-grouped Journey and found some shredder on YouTube with a Les Paul and a big black afro to replace Neal?

Was he 'trying to', or was he 'told to'? We don't know.
Also, if Perry would have been able to go out as 'Journey', then perhaps the clone stmt would apply. But it's a SP solo tour. His band is going to play whatever he wants, however he wants. I really doubt there was much, if any, individual choice at all.


later~

[koberry]

I think Voyager's point is that people bitch about Arnel singing Journey songs the same way as Perry, but Perry didn't exactly break new ground with the Journey covers bar the inclusion of Sam Cooke's "Cupid" in IBAWY.

Exactly. People were lamblasting Neal, Jon, Steve Augeri, Arnel, etc. on message boards everywhere for replacing "The Voice" and defending Perry like he was a saint. Remember the attacks on YouTube when Arnel first joined the band? It was crazy the way people were so hateful... but not one harsh word was launched against the vocal god Steve Perry, who had basically been running a "Journey Lite" show on the side whenever he couldn't get his way with Journey members. Remember these days: "What? Ross and Smitty are bitching? Replace them! Get Randy Jackson on the phone! Oh nevermind, I will just replace all of you and go on tour with my Journey Lite band. But don't you dare fracture the Journey name."

+1

[koberry]

This has been one of my chief complaints with SP and the idea that Journey cracked the stone. In reality, it was SP who cracked the stone.

That is what I was trying to emphasize. Well said.

If you listen to Lincoln Brewster playing the lead solo for "I'll Be Alright Without You" in the video I posted, it's obvious that he was trying to play it exactly like Neal - and he did a very impressive job of it. If that isn't equal to "cracking the stone" I don't know what is. If I was Neal and I watched that video, I would have been pissed off and all loyalty to SP would have gone out the window.

I am not ripping on Perry or Schon. I'm just saying it wasn't Schon who first cracked the stone. It's easy for me to see how they both felt invested in the music they created together, and also why they might both be jealous over its control. Imagine if it would have been Perry who re-grouped Journey and found some shredder on YouTube with a Les Paul and a big black afro to replace Neal?

News Flash!
- Journey Founder Steve Perry invites SLASH to join Journey, he thanks Neal Schon for his many faithful years of service.

[ForceInfinity]

Bloody hell since we're talking about clones, I sometimes wonder if Neal has turned into a Frankie Sullivan clone in concert, because about the only thing those two seem to get off on is going on some shred fest in the middle of a song almost for the sake of it and drives me up the friggin wall. I keep wondering if Neal is going to go off on some 10 minute long solo in the middle of the concert like FS seems to always do

[yandtguy]

At the time of this video, Neal had gotten back with Gregg and was doing the Abraxas Pool thing with other former Santana cast outs. In fact, both groups were playing San Francisco on the same night. Perry's at the Warfield I believe, and Abraxas at the Filmore. Neal and Gregg could have very well played a few Journey songs also, yet they did not. For what ever reason, I do not know, but that is a fact. I was there. This can all be argued forever by fans (and has been) as to who was right and who was wrong, and who did what to whom. However, Perry's comment of "Don't crack the stone" at the time he made it was highly hypocritical.

Why Abraxas Pool play Journey songs? They were essentially a Santana clone. They DID play Santana songs live, and I didn't have a problem with that then, just like I don't have a problem with Journey playing and recording without Perry now or Perry recording albums and playing Journey songs on tour then. In other words, I could give a crap as long as these musicians are putting out music in whatever formation they find themselves in. It's a little like musical chairs, and as long as the music is good, I'm find with it. Now, I will admit that Journey without Perry hasn't recorded an album I love yet (Arrival was close), but I have enjoyed the albums enough and the tours enough to keep my Journey jones satisfied. And, I think Abraxas Pool satisfied a lot of Santana fans who were missing old school Santana. It's a shame that album wasn't promoted better.

[yandtguy]

When Steve Perry was interviewed for BTM, that is exactly how he defined "cracking the stone" and he was the one who used the phrase. He said that he was fine if the band toured and played Journey music as long as they didn't call themselves Journey - they could call themselves the "J-Boys" for all he cared, but if they continued on as Journey, he considered it cracking the stone and for him there would be no going back. The comment wasn't a critical assessment of their past actions - it was what he told them it meant to him before they did it. It wasn't about whether another band member did a solo project or what they played when they toured and somehow people have used the phrase to describe points in the band's history when it could have broken up and there are more than a few. Neal started a new band (HSAS) in 1983 at the height of Journey's success - if HSAS had been a success this would be an entirely different discussion.

HSAS was a project. That album wasn't even a studio album. It was recorded live in front of an audience. It was released on Sammy's record label, and I wonder if it was tied to Sammy's contract. It fit nicely in-between Three Lock Box and VOA, and Sammy only owed Geffen one more solo album after he joined Van Halen which would have been I Never Said Goodbye (his fifth album for Geffen), the follow up to VOA. 5 album deals are pretty standard. Neal's albums with Jan Hammer were also clearly products of an experimental side project. Now, I don't think any musician goes into a project hoping for it to fail, but I think that all the players on those albums had to know that the albums weren't going to see platinum sales based on the type of material on the albums.

[annie89509]

By all accounts, Journey (past and present) have moved on...it's the hardcores that keep dredging up age-old arguments...lol.

Look, SP released 2 solo and 7 (8 if you count DAD) Journey albums...1 to 3 ratio. He played 6-7 solo songs in a 18-19 setlist...about the same 1 to 3 ratio. He sang 4 or 5 songs from the FTLOSM record in each show. Conversely, I don't think Journey ever played more than 2 (maybe 3) new songs in any of their post-Perry concerts.

I don't get the argument that SP "did it first."

[Kor'n]

I think Voyager's point is that people bitch about Arnel singing Journey songs the same way as Perry, but Perry didn't exactly break new ground with the Journey covers bar the inclusion of Sam Cooke's "Cupid" in IBAWY.

Exactly. People were lamblasting Neal, Jon, Steve Augeri, Arnel, etc. on message boards everywhere for replacing "The Voice" and defending Perry like he was a saint. Remember the attacks on YouTube when Arnel first joined the band? It was crazy the way people were so hateful... but not one harsh word was launched against the vocal god Steve Perry, who had basically been running a "Journey Lite" show on the side whenever he couldn't get his way with Journey members. Remember these days: "What? Ross and Smitty are bitching? Replace them! Get Randy Jackson on the phone! Oh nevermind, I will just replace all of you and go on tour with my Journey Lite band. But don't you dare fracture the Journey name."

Gideon's post makes no sense. Arnel did not write or co-write those songs, but Perry did. Perry did not copy "note for note" but Arnel did.... I do not understand why there is ever a comparison to Perry. I would say when you come out doing what Pineda does, you better have some creative skills in your arsenal otherwise it more or less turns into a "SNL" thing or "little more than a cover band." Perry toured with true artists.

I think it is so "hateful" how people bash Perry when all are ADULTS. Neal's band? What were Neal and Jon doing or saying? I don't think Perry called his band Journey thus did not "fracture the stone" according to his meaning "Don't call it Journey." FTLOSM sounds nothing like Journey to me. Have read some reviews of "Perry's great band" on FTLOSM and the difference with it and Journey.

There is nothing like someone not having the guts to say no, etc, but yet coming back later griping about it. To this day, Neal and Jon are speaking of what Perry did. If I were they, I would be ashamed to speak of not having the guts to stop what they both did not want. Should have gotten rid of those two. I'm not the greatest mathematician, but believe with three of them, 2/3rds could have overruled 1/3.

From what I've read, no one has EVER done what Journey did to Steve Perry, have a guy "spend an entire disc" mocking him. Don't think you can go any lower than that when it comes to artistic integrity. Unlike others who may naturally sound like Perry, (and not try sounding just like every other artist on the planet) not the case with Pineda so its turns insulting. Even Arnel understands that yet goes on to speak of his respect for Perry. Steve Perry has not and would not insult his idol, Sam Cooke, in that manner.

There are lots of artist out there that don't "break new ground" with songs that's how the original artists get in the RRHOF. Every artist takes styles, etc. from other artist, but doubtful you find one that takes everything from everybody, just for the sake of making a dollar.

If Perry, had so much power, too bad he used it too late for he should have halted that excessive touring.

Jeremy's post ^ pretty spot on.

[Kor'n]

?
FLTOSM wasn't a Journey tribute show, though I think you'd be hard pressed to deny the similarities between Brewster and Schon, regardless of the former's diversity as a solo musician.
The tour, on the other hand, was definitely a tribute to Journey.

With regards to clone players vs. clone singers, the fact is that whatever criticisms can be leveled at modern!Journey for not touring with a singer whose approach differs radically from Perry's can also be leveled at Perry's decision to recruit players who, when playing Journey songs, play them nigh-identically to the members of Journey. I've never been one to actually subscribe to this criticism, since Perry's voice and Journey's musicianship are what defined those songs to begin with and to stray too far from that would change the songs too much for my liking. That said, what's good for the goose is good for the gander and there's no logical reason why both sides shouldn't catch heat if and when this criticism arises. But as with most things, historically, Perry gets a pass.

Lastly, regarding the stone comment, I've always interpreted the stone to be Journey itself. Perry had no compunction about cracking it when it suited his artistic vision nor did he resist temptation to tour with Journey soundalikes when it suited his finances. He cracked the stone first, but again, Perry always gets a pass.

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

[Kor'n]

Again, I think it's just the way you interpret the phrase "don't crack the stone." where I take it to mean "If you carry on under the Journey name without me, there is no going back - we will never perform together as Journey again," some may interpret it to mean "don't use another singer and play Journey songs," in which case yes, Perry did play Journey songs on his solo tour with other guitar/keyboard players etc.

I think it's a big distinction though, but we will have to agree to disagree

I think Perry was the one out of line for telling them "don't crack the stone", afterall, he is the one who left. My feeling is he shouldn't be giving directives that would determine the future of a band he left. (twice) There were four of them to think of, who still wanted to work and make a living.

You can give any "directives" you want as long as not by force.

[Eric]

By all accounts, Journey (past and present) have moved on...it's the hardcores that keep dredging up age-old arguments...lol.

Look, SP released 2 solo and 7 (8 if you count DAD) Journey albums...1 to 3 ratio. He played 6-7 solo songs in a 18-19 setlist...about the same 1 to 3 ratio. He sang 4 or 5 songs from the FTLOSM record in each show. Conversely, I don't think Journey ever played more than 2 (maybe 3) new songs in any of their post-Perry concerts.

I don't get the argument that SP "did it first."

Journey has played as many as 8 new songs in concert, and routinely 4-6. That's why last year was so disappointing.

[Eric]

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

I don't think it was Perry's place to tell Schon what to call his band. Its not like he helped him form Journey, he joined as they were already a successful touring entity.

[Yoda]

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

I don't think it was Perry's place to tell Schon what to call his band. Its not like he helped him form Journey, he joined as they were already a successful touring entity.

They were a touring entity, but I'm not sure I would say successful, since the record label was about to drop them before Perry came on board.

[Eric]

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

I don't think it was Perry's place to tell Schon what to call his band. Its not like he helped him form Journey, he joined as they were already a successful touring entity.

They were a touring entity, but I'm not sure I would say successful, since the record label was about to drop them before Perry came on board.

Unsuccessful selling records.

[Gideon]

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

I don't think it was Perry's place to tell Schon what to call his band. Its not like he helped him form Journey, he joined as they were already a successful touring entity.

They were a touring entity, but I'm not sure I would say successful, since the record label was about to drop them before Perry came on board.

Unsuccessful selling records.

+1. Per BTM, I believe. Though Schon may have embellished the popularity.
Either way, Perry was content to tour under the name Journey minus Greg Rolie, Ross Valory, and Steve Smith, two of which were founding members. The band gave him 2 years just to make a decision, he wouldn't commit. The fault is his.

[Yoda]

He did not crack the stone "Don't call it Journey." Haven't read any articles to that effect, but have read many many.... about Journey's Perry clones. If FTLOSM was a Journey tribute band, perhaps Journey should have changed its name as many have been saying. Nothing wrong with tribute bands, just "Don't call it Journey." SP

I don't think it was Perry's place to tell Schon what to call his band. Its not like he helped him form Journey, he joined as they were already a successful touring entity.

They were a touring entity, but I'm not sure I would say successful, since the record label was about to drop them before Perry came on board.

Unsuccessful selling records.

Yes, but back then, unsuccessful selling records = unsuccessful band.

[Monker]

This has been one of my chief complaints with SP and the idea that Journey cracked the stone. In reality, it was SP who cracked the stone.

That is what I was trying to emphasize. Well said.

If you listen to Lincoln Brewster playing the lead solo for "I'll Be Alright Without You" in the video I posted, it's obvious that he was trying to play it exactly like Neal - and he did a very impressive job of it. If that isn't equal to "cracking the stone" I don't know what is. If I was Neal and I watched that video, I would have been pissed off and all loyalty to SP would have gone out the window.

I am not ripping on Perry or Schon. I'm just saying it wasn't Schon who first cracked the stone. It's easy for me to see how they both felt invested in the music they created together, and also why they might both be jealous over its control. Imagine if it would have been Perry who re-grouped Journey and found some shredder on YouTube with a Les Paul and a big black afro to replace Neal?

Did Gregg, Ross, and Steve Smith "crack the stone" when they hired a guy who can sing Journey, and a guitarist who also sounds remarkably like Neal for The Storm...and they even perform Journey songs in concert.