The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[JrnyScarab]

Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them.

There are some mentally ill people and people with disabilities that are far greater human beings than some of the dreck that is alive. I can imagine that some of the poor souls that were aborted were in this class of people. If anyone should be aborted I vote for the politicians. Lying scum.

I can't remember the name right off but there is one prominent supporter of abortion that is even beginning to argue that children can be killed up to the age of two years old.

That's just plain sick. In the same class as Hitler.

[Lula]

Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them.

There are some mentally ill people and people with disabilities that are far greater human beings than some of the dreck that is alive. I can imagine that some of the poor souls that were aborted were in this class of people. If anyone should be aborted I vote for the politicians. Lying scum.

I can't remember the name right off but there is one prominent supporter of abortion that is even beginning to argue that children can be killed up to the age of two years old.

you have got to be kidding me! who is this idiot? more info please.

[conversationpc]

Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them.

There are some mentally ill people and people with disabilities that are far greater human beings than some of the dreck that is alive. I can imagine that some of the poor souls that were aborted were in this class of people. If anyone should be aborted I vote for the politicians. Lying scum.

I can't remember the name right off but there is one prominent supporter of abortion that is even beginning to argue that children can be killed up to the age of two years old.

you have got to be kidding me! who is this idiot? more info please.

It was some professor from a prominent university. If I can find it, I'll post the info here.

[treetopovskaya]

with every medical procedure there are risks. at least if it's done in a sterile environment the chances are better there will be no complications.

because people will have them anyway... like they did before it was made legal & performed safely. nobody wants to go back to the day where young girls were dying from botched abortions... or doing things to make themselves miscarry.

"Because people will have them anyway" is really the worst excuse for having/not having a law that there is. Women still die from botched abortions only you never hear about it because it's not reported and there are all kinds of possible side effects, some serious from even supposed safe abortions.

[conversationpc]

you have got to be kidding me! who is this idiot? more info please.

I'm not sure if this is the guy or not but this is still pretty disturbing...

http://www.euthanasia.com/prince.html

And then you've got people like this that actually admit that abortion is murder but STILL support it...

I have always frankly admitted that abortion is murder, the extermination of the powerless by the powerful

http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2008/sep/08091204.html

[7 Wishes]

Bullshit. That's just the Right Wing Machine at it again.

I just LOVE these new McCain ads...

"Sarah Palin fought against the Bridge to Nowhere, and she won."

I mean, if Obama tried to pass off a lie like that, some people on this board would skewer him. But those same people don't seem to have ANY comment when the McCain campaign pulls shit like that.

Oh, and please try to find me, as a countenance, an OBAMA-ENDORSED ad that makes outrageously false claims like that.

[JrnyScarab]

you have got to be kidding me! who is this idiot? more info please.

I'm not sure if this is the guy or not but this is still pretty disturbing...

http://www.euthanasia.com/prince.html

"According to the experts in the field, he is the one of the strongest bioethicists out there," Harmon said.

Too bad he's not so brilliant when it comes to the value of human beings. Just disgusting.

[7 Wishes]

Well, there is no hell painful enough for an asshole like that.

Anyway, last time I checked, this guy wasn't on the Obama campaign, and no Democrat endorses his positition.

[JrnyScarab]

Well, there is no hell painful enough for an asshole like that.

Anyway, last time I checked, this guy wasn't on the Obama campaign, and no Democrat endorses his positition.

Thank God for that! I can't imagine many Democrats would support an extremist like that!

[treetopovskaya]

do you not listen to spanish radio?

mccain did it too tho so shame on both of them.

}:C|

Bullshit. That's just the Right Wing Machine at it again.

I just LOVE these new McCain ads...

"Sarah Palin fought against the Bridge to Nowhere, and she won."

I mean, if Obama tried to pass off a lie like that, some people on this board would skewer him. But those same people don't seem to have ANY comment when the McCain campaign pulls shit like that.

Oh, and please try to find me, as a countenance, an OBAMA-ENDORSED ad that makes outrageously false claims like that.

[conversationpc]

Bullshit. That's just the Right Wing Machine at it again.

What are you saying "Bullshit" about? You didn't quote anyone.

"Sarah Palin fought against the Bridge to Nowhere, and she won."

I mean, if Obama tried to pass off a lie like that, some people on this board would skewer him. But those same people don't seem to have ANY comment when the McCain campaign pulls shit like that.

She did initially support the bridge to nowhere. However, when she talked to the people of the town that the bridge was to be built in, she found that a ferry system would be just as effective and less costly.

Oh, and please try to find me, as a countenance, an OBAMA-ENDORSED ad that makes outrageously false claims like that.

We already talked about it in this thread. Obama's own campaign put out an ad making it look like Rush Limbaugh was being racist when it was obvious from its context that it was a comedy bit about MEXICO'S OWN IMMIGRATION LAWS. Limbaugh was purposely acting as if those laws were ours and how people would react if we enforced immigration laws that way. This Spanish-language ad went on to falsely tie Limbaugh's comments to McCain, when McCain's own beliefs are far from Limbaugh's. Outright lies in that ad and even ABC reported on it.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch ... act-1.html

This was discussed starting on page 17 of this thread and has been mentioned elsewhere also... http://forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/vie ... &start=480

[7 Wishes]

do you not listen to spanish radio?

mccain did it too tho so shame on both of them.

Sorry. I only speak German and Italian. And a little Norwegian. But NPR is not, unfortunately, Norwegian Public Radio.

[JrnyScarab]

do you not listen to spanish radio?

mccain did it too tho so shame on both of them.

Sorry. I only speak German and Italian. And a little Norwegian. But NPR is not, unfortunately, Norwegian Public Radio.

LOL!

[csiako]

because people will have them anyway... like they did before it was made legal & performed safely. nobody wants to go back to the day where young girls were dying from botched abortions... or doing things to make themselves miscarry.

all i can say is thank god my hubby's birth mother kept him & gave him up to a loving home... along with all his sibs. she gave him life... & he grew into a pretty cool guy. }:C)) what an amazing thing she did & may not even realize... because of her i have my best friend & soul mate.

sorry... mush mush mush... blllllllllllahhhhhhhhhh...

why do you think young girls wanted to have an abortion? making abortion legal actually forces some young girls to have abortion even if they didnt want to.

[Enigma869]

She did initially support the bridge to nowhere. However, when she talked to the people of the town that the bridge was to be built in, she found that a ferry system would be just as effective and less costly.

You can't be serious Dave. I know you're a poltiical dude, but you're also an intelligent dude! The "bridge to nowhere" being squashed had abolutely nothing to do with Sarah Palin. Also, she kept the money that was given for this "earmark". Those are facts that she isn't even disputing, at this point. I've even heard very recently that "the bridge to nowhere" isn't yet a dead deal and that options are still being explored to get a bridge to Ketchikan! The ad that 7 is talking about is laughable. I'm not going to kill her too much for the ad, because every one of these dopey politicians' ads are full of blatant lies. These ads are all designed to tell half truths and complete falsehoods! I gurantee you that when the debates begin next week and we get the old "fact checks" at the end, from all the political reporters, less than half of everything claimed will have any shred of truth to it. It's really astonishing (and sad) just how many lies that politicians are willing to tell, just to get elected!


John from Boston

[conversationpc]

You can't be serious Dave. I know you're a poltiical dude, but you're also an intelligent dude! The "bridge to nowhere" being squashed had abolutely nothing to do with Sarah Palin. Also, she kept the money that was given for this "earmark". Those are facts that she isn't even disputing, at this point.

It's my understanding the the money was used for other transportation projects.

[csiako]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJbRiPzPTZU&feature=user

[Lula]

You can't be serious Dave. I know you're a poltiical dude, but you're also an intelligent dude! The "bridge to nowhere" being squashed had abolutely nothing to do with Sarah Palin. Also, she kept the money that was given for this "earmark". Those are facts that she isn't even disputing, at this point.

It's my understanding the the money was used for other transportation projects.

yeah. they built a road to the bridge site

[7 Wishes]

During her 2006 gubernatorial campaign, Palin supported the proposed construction of a bridge from Ketchikan to a small island of about 50 inhabitants. That is UNDENIABLE and IRREFUTABLE.

While Palin was mayor of Wasilla, the city received more Federal money per capita than any other city in the country, and still ran up a $22 million debt.

Then, as governor of Alaska, she requested 31 earmarks, totaling $197.8 million, and during the 2008 fiscal year Alaska received almost $380 million in pork barrel spending money, almost $100 million more than any other state. HMMMMM.

Maj. Gen. Craig Campbell, service commander of the AK Guard, told McClatchy that Palin has never order the National Guard to do anything. Interesting.

Palin is also currently under investigation for the firing of State Trooper Mike Wooten, her ex-brother-in-law, while she was governor of Alaska. The Alaska police union has filed a complaint against Palin for allegedly releasing information from Wooten’s personal record. When Alaska public safety commissioner Walt Monegan refused to fire Wooten, Palin had Monegan fired, for which she is also under investigation. The McCain campaign is reportedly attempting to cock-block the investigation, the findings of which were scheduled to be announced on Oct. 31. Now the Alaska Senator in charge of the investigation has said he’ll move up the release date.

As mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, Palin also had a police officer and a library worker fired because they didn’t support her campaign. This isn’t directly related to the “Troopergate” scandal, but the term "track record" comes to mind.

[treetopovskaya]

so the best answer is...

don't get knocked up!

there ya go! }:C)

because people will have them anyway... like they did before it was made legal & performed safely. nobody wants to go back to the day where young girls were dying from botched abortions... or doing things to make themselves miscarry.

all i can say is thank god my hubby's birth mother kept him & gave him up to a loving home... along with all his sibs. she gave him life... & he grew into a pretty cool guy. }:C)) what an amazing thing she did & may not even realize... because of her i have my best friend & soul mate.

sorry... mush mush mush... blllllllllllahhhhhhhhhh...

why do you think young girls wanted to have an abortion? making abortion legal actually forces some young girls to have abortion even if they didnt want to.

[7 Wishes]

That's why God invented cunnilingus.

Seriously, I do think education is the best answer...if kids know what they're doing and understand the ramifications, they're less likely to have unwanted pregnancies

[conversationpc]

7 Wishes....Any response to my response to your challenge earlier to post where the Obama campaign has lied in an ad?

[7 Wishes]

7 Wishes....Any response to my response to your challenge earlier to post where the Obama campaign has lied in an ad?

Please be specific. This thread is already winding out of control.

[Enigma869]

During her 2006 gubernatorial campaign, Palin supported the proposed construction of a bridge from Ketchikan to a small island of about 50 inhabitants. That is UNDENIABLE and IRREFUTABLE.

While Palin was mayor of Wasilla, the city received more Federal money per capita than any other city in the country, and still ran up a $22 million debt.

Then, as governor of Alaska, she requested 31 earmarks, totaling $197.8 million, and during the 2008 fiscal year Alaska received almost $380 million in pork barrel spending money, almost $100 million more than any other state. HMMMMM.

Maj. Gen. Craig Campbell, service commander of the AK Guard, told McClatchy that Palin has never order the National Guard to do anything. Interesting.

Palin is also currently under investigation for the firing of State Trooper Mike Wooten, her ex-brother-in-law, while she was governor of Alaska. The Alaska police union has filed a complaint against Palin for allegedly releasing information from Wooten’s personal record. When Alaska public safety commissioner Walt Monegan refused to fire Wooten, Palin had Monegan fired, for which she is also under investigation. The McCain campaign is reportedly attempting to cock-block the investigation, the findings of which were scheduled to be announced on Oct. 31. Now the Alaska Senator in charge of the investigation has said he’ll move up the release date.

As mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, Palin also had a police officer and a library worker fired because they didn’t support her campaign. This isn’t directly related to the “Troopergate” scandal, but the term "track record" comes to mind.

I agree with some of the things in your post, but some of your facts are messed up. As I understand it, the State Trooper you are referring to is still a member of the Alaska State Police. I believe Palin actually fired his boss (the head of the Alaskan State Police). I think the accusation is that she fired this Public Safety Commissioner (or whatever title Alaska gave the guy) because he wouldn't agree to fire this Trooper. Obviously, none of this has been proven yet. I will say that although I don't support Palin, at all, I wouldn't come to the defense of her ex-brother in law. From what I've read, the guy sounds psychotic and probably has no right to be carrying a gun. That doesn't mean that she went about her business the way she should have. I just don't think she's out of line for suggesting the guy is a nutbag! On another note, it is an absolute fact that the state of Alaska receives more money, per capita, (from the Feds) than any other state in the Union, and it's a pretty wide disparity! I don't know the reasons for that or even if Palin is responsible, but it is an odd fact.


John from Boston

[conversationpc]

7 Wishes....Any response to my response to your challenge earlier to post where the Obama campaign has lied in an ad?

Please be specific. This thread is already winding out of control.

See my response earlier on this page...You challenged someone to find an Obama-endorsed ad that was blatantly false. I did so and, as I pointed out, it had already been discussed in this thread starting back on page 17.

[Jana]

7 Wishes: During her 2006 gubernatorial campaign, Palin supported the proposed construction of a bridge from Ketchikan to a small island of about 50 inhabitants. That is UNDENIABLE and IRREFUTABLE.

While Palin was mayor of Wasilla, the city received more Federal money per capita than any other city in the country, and still ran up a $22 million debt.

Then, as governor of Alaska, she requested 31 earmarks, totaling $197.8 million, and during the 2008 fiscal year Alaska received almost $380 million in pork barrel spending money, almost $100 million more than any other state. HMMMMM.

Maj. Gen. Craig Campbell, service commander of the AK Guard, told McClatchy that Palin has never order the National Guard to do anything. Interesting.

Palin is also currently under investigation for the firing of State Trooper Mike Wooten, her ex-brother-in-law, while she was governor of Alaska. The Alaska police union has filed a complaint against Palin for allegedly releasing information from Wooten’s personal record. When Alaska public safety commissioner Walt Monegan refused to fire Wooten, Palin had Monegan fired, for which she is also under investigation. The McCain campaign is reportedly attempting to cock-block the investigation, the findings of which were scheduled to be announced on Oct. 31. Now the Alaska Senator in charge of the investigation has said he’ll move up the release date.

As mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, Palin also had a police officer and a library worker fired because they didn’t support her campaign. This isn’t directly related to the “Troopergate” scandal, but the term "track record" comes to mind."





McCain has lost any chance of a vote from me with her as VP. If he kicks the bucket, I do not want her as President of the United States in the times we are in. I was truly on the fence. I consider myself a moderate. I voted for Bush and then reluctantly for Bill Clinton. But my dislike for President Bush is unlike anything I've ever felt for a sitting president before. I voted for Kerry, because more than anything I wanted Bush out of office. I wanted Hillary Clinton as the Democratic nominee. With her out, I was definitely considering McCain. I have a high regard for him, except his view on the war was a big problem. Obama picked Biden, which made me happy. I knew he was never going to pick Hillary, so Biden was my next choice. When McCain announced Sarah Palin, and I read up on her. No way, no how is she going to be the next President if he dies in office. At 72, who he has as VP is very important to me.


ARNEL MAKES ME A BETTER GUY JUST KNOWING HIM - JONATHAN CAIN

[treetopovskaya]

man oh man i want to bitch slap jonathan cain. better person my ass.

oops! did i say that out loud? }:C)

7 Wishes: During her 2006 gubernatorial campaign, Palin supported the proposed construction of a bridge from Ketchikan to a small island of about 50 inhabitants. That is UNDENIABLE and IRREFUTABLE.

While Palin was mayor of Wasilla, the city received more Federal money per capita than any other city in the country, and still ran up a $22 million debt.

Then, as governor of Alaska, she requested 31 earmarks, totaling $197.8 million, and during the 2008 fiscal year Alaska received almost $380 million in pork barrel spending money, almost $100 million more than any other state. HMMMMM.

Maj. Gen. Craig Campbell, service commander of the AK Guard, told McClatchy that Palin has never order the National Guard to do anything. Interesting.

Palin is also currently under investigation for the firing of State Trooper Mike Wooten, her ex-brother-in-law, while she was governor of Alaska. The Alaska police union has filed a complaint against Palin for allegedly releasing information from Wooten’s personal record. When Alaska public safety commissioner Walt Monegan refused to fire Wooten, Palin had Monegan fired, for which she is also under investigation. The McCain campaign is reportedly attempting to cock-block the investigation, the findings of which were scheduled to be announced on Oct. 31. Now the Alaska Senator in charge of the investigation has said he’ll move up the release date.

As mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, Palin also had a police officer and a library worker fired because they didn’t support her campaign. This isn’t directly related to the “Troopergate” scandal, but the term "track record" comes to mind."





McCain has lost any chance of a vote from me with her as VP. If he kicks the bucket, I do not want her as President of the United States in the times we are in. I was truly on the fence. I consider myself a moderate. I voted for Bush and then reluctantly for Bill Clinton. But my dislike for President Bush is unlike anything I've ever felt for a sitting president before. I voted for Kerry, because more than anything I wanted Bush out of office. I wanted Hillary Clinton as the Democratic nominee. With her out, I was definitely considering McCain. I have a high regard for him, except his view on the war was a big problem. Obama picked Biden, which made me happy. I knew he was never going to pick Hillary, so Biden was my next choice. When McCain announced Sarah Palin, and I read up on her. No way, no how is she going to be the next President if he dies in office. At 72, who he has as VP is very important to me.


ARNEL MAKES ME A BETTER GUY JUST KNOWING HIM - JONATHAN CAIN

[donnaplease]

i would never advocate a woman of any age have an abortion. regardless of the results of my amnio my boys were always going to be born. at the same time it is a personal choice. a young woman wanting to have sex should never be of mind that she could just have an abortion. that is why i think a thorough teaching of sex education to age appropriate students is necessary. the thing with obama and sex ed is being blown way out. the man has two little girls he's raising, come on do some of you really think barck obama wants to teach kindergartners about masturbation?

From the guidelines (these are level 1 Development Messages - ages 5-8 ):
http://www.siecus.org/_data/global/imag ... elines.pdf

Page 25 - Reproductive and Sexual Anatomy & Physiology: Both boys and girls have body parts that feel good when touched.
Page 26 - Reproduction: Vaginal intercourse - when a penis is placed inside a vagina - is the most common way for a sperm and egg to join.
Page 29 - Sexual Orientation: Human beings can love people of the same gender and people of another gender.
Page 51 - Masturbation: Touching and rubbing one's own genitals to feel good is called masturbation.
Page 53 - Abstinance: ......... (apparently it's not appropriate to discuss that with 5-8 year olds...)
Page 54 - Human Sexual Response: Both boys and girls may discover that their bodies feel good when touched.
Page 63 - Sexually Transmitted Diseases: Are you kidding me??

Apparently the bill in IL died before it was passed. But I did find this link to MSNBC from last year which references this information, from a BO spokesperson.
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/ ... 77886.aspx

Now, my understanding is that his reasoning is to prevent a child from being abused. That's great. I have no problem with that. It is included in the SIECUS guidelines. But why go through all that other stuff to get to it?

[conversationpc]

[Lula]

like i said, i think the sex ed thing was blown way out of proportion. a national guideline is just that- a guideline. it is stated that a child should receive their introduction to sex ed from a parent/family.

when this broke i laughed. to say obama wants a sex ed curriculum implemented in kindergarten is as absurd as saying mccain protects pedophiles over children. the example about "good touching and bad touching" was the driving force of implementing sex ed in kindergarten.