The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[Rick]

FF, you're going to pull a muscle reaching for shit. CNN reported nothing but postulations. Ayres said he wished he had done more to stop the war means nothing. Nowhere did he say he wished he had committed more heinous acts. But CNN would love you to believe that. If they don't dramatize it, people begin changing the channel.

[7 Wishes]

Sorry dude...you are wrong wrong wrong...I think I need to come down for that intervention now...

Eh. I like and respect you too much to go any further with this. We'll just have to disagree.

But any intervention needs plenty of good German beer, bodacious babes, and a few MR bands. Next summer.

[Rhiannon]

good German beer

Did someone say hiefeweisse?

[7 Wishes]

good German beer

Did someone say hiefeweisse?

Franzeskahner? Yeah, baby!

[Lula]

Thanks bjg, I felt a bit beaten up and i was tired, but i hung on .

let's talk about our gal sarah!! there she goes again being all cute and spewing lies about barack. while mccain says going negative with attacks only shows you've got nothing to say about the issues at hand. i just love that ticket

[Rhiannon]

Thanks bjg, I felt a bit beaten up and i was tired, but i hung on .

let's talk about our gal sarah!! there she goes again being all cute and spewing lies about barack. while mccain says going negative with attacks only shows you've got nothing to say about the issues at hand. i just love that ticket

I know you like B.O., Lu... but I really think that we're effed. All these years bitching and moaning and this is the best our country can come up with? These four stooges? Oy.

[treetopovskaya]

...and the obama ticket has played above board the whole time.

yeah... right.

this is my prob with dems/libs... they think their poop smells like fresh cut flowers.

(not directed at you lula... i'm talking in general. }:C))

Thanks bjg, I felt a bit beaten up and i was tired, but i hung on .

let's talk about our gal sarah!! there she goes again being all cute and spewing lies about barack. while mccain says going negative with attacks only shows you've got nothing to say about the issues at hand. i just love that ticket

[Jana]

Lula, they've got nothing. They are grasping at straws. It's so hard now for McCain to talk about experience and have it mean a lot when Palin is a heartbeat away from the presidency. P.S. I'm glad to see you survived last night. Ya' did good.

[SteveForever]

Lula, they've got nothing. They are grasping at straws. It's so hard now for McCain to talk about experience and have it mean a lot when Palin is a heartbeat away from the presidency. P.S. I'm glad to see you survived last night. Ya' did good.

Palin is tough and a breath of fresh air, I think she's awesome!!!

Biden is boring as heck and he's had 30 years to do these big changes he talks about already?
McCain is old but Obama really is a puppet...

[Uno_up]

Lula, they've got nothing. They are grasping at straws. It's so hard now for McCain to talk about experience and have it mean a lot when Palin is a heartbeat away from the presidency. P.S. I'm glad to see you survived last night. Ya' did good.

Not so fast Jana...
Rezko might be ready to sing
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081007/ap_ ... iser_trial
"Federal prosecutors moved Monday to delay indefinitely the sentencing of convicted fundraiser Antoin “Tony” Rezko, sending their strongest hint yet that he is ready to spill his political secrets.

The filing asks for a postponement while prosecutors and defense attorneys “engage in discussions that could affect their sentencing postures.”

Speculation has simmered for weeks that the key fundraiser for Gov. Rod Blagojevich and Sen. Barack Obama was whispering what he knows about corruption in Illinois government to federal prosecutors in hopes of getting a lighter sentence.

Rezko raised more than $1 million for Blagojevich’s campaign fund and was one of the governor’s key advisers. He was frequently by the governor’s side in the early days of his administration and could be in a position to shed considerable light on federal investigations into patronage hiring and a host of other issues involving Blagojevich.

Rezko also raised $250,000 for Barack Obama and was his most important fundraiser during Obama’s state senate career, as well as for his US Senate race. The feds are likely much more focused on Blagojevich and Mayor Richard Daley than Barack Obama, though, as they have attempted to crack the walls of corruption surrounding the Chicago Machine for several years. Patrick Fitzgerald may only have a few more months as a US Attorney, and he wants to complete his mission before a new president appoints someone else in his position."

[treetopovskaya]

true dat! }:C)

Lula, they've got nothing. They are grasping at straws. It's so hard now for McCain to talk about experience and have it mean a lot when Palin is a heartbeat away from the presidency. P.S. I'm glad to see you survived last night. Ya' did good.

Palin is tough and a breath of fresh air, I think she's awesome!!!

Biden is boring as heck and he's had 30 years to do these big changes he talks about already?
McCain is old but Obama really is a puppet...

[Enigma869]

Obama is tough and a breath of fresh air, I think she's awesome!!!

Biden is boring as heck and he's had 30 years to do these big changes he talks about already?
McCain is old but Palin really is a puppet...

There...I fixed it for you! For the record, I don't really believe that Obama is a breath of fresh air at all! I simply think Puppet Palin is a bumbing idiot!


John from Boston

[RossValoryRocks]

Obama is tough and a breath of fresh air, I think she's awesome!!!

Biden is boring as heck and he's had 30 years to do these big changes he talks about already?
McCain is old but Palin really is a puppet...

There...I fixed it for you! For the record, I don't really believe that Obama is a breath of fresh air at all! I simply think Puppet Palin is a bumbing idiot!


John from Boston

Obama is a breath of FRESH AIR?? You mean FRESH AYERS! And you must live next to a open sewer! LOL

All politicians STINK...just some stink worse that others!

[Enigma869]

Obama is a breath of FRESH AIR?? You mean FRESH AYERS! And you must live next to a open sewer! LOL

All politicians STINK...just some stink worse that others!

Apparently you didn't read the rest of my post! I think I made it pretty clear that I am not enamored with Obama. We don't agree on much, but we certainly agree that ALL politicians suck! They're all dishonest crooks, so people arguing to defend them is laughable. You'll notice that nowhere in the 90+ pages of this thread have I defended a single politician. Partisan politics has always been ridiculous, and hopefully Americans will one day wake the fuck up and stop voting for a candidate just because there happens to be a "D" or "R" after their name. Six weeks ago, nobody outside of Alaska ever heard of Sarah Palin's name. Now there are people on this website purporting to know everything about the woman, and why she is so qualified to lead our country. The one thing I can guarantee you is that the Palin defenders here and elsewhere, would not have a single positive thing to say about her, if she had a "D" after her name. Instead, it would be the yahoo Democrats extolling the virtues of the magical hand puppet


John from Boston

[RossValoryRocks]

Obama is a breath of FRESH AIR?? You mean FRESH AYERS! And you must live next to a open sewer! LOL

All politicians STINK...just some stink worse that others!

Apparently you didn't read the rest of my post! I think I made it pretty clear that I am not enamored with Obama. We don't agree on much, but we certainly agree that ALL politicians suck! They're all dishonest crooks, so people arguing to defend them is laughable. You'll notice that nowhere in the 90+ pages of this thread have I defended a single politician. Partisan politics has always been ridiculous, and hopefully Americans will one day wake the fuck up and stop voting for a candidate just because there happens to be a "D" or "R" after their name. Six weeks ago, nobody outside of Alaska ever heard of Sarah Palin's name. Now there are people on this website purporting to know everything about the woman, and why she is so qualified to lead our country. The one thing I can guarantee you is that the Palin defenders here and elsewhere, would not have a single positive thing to say about her, if she had a "D" after her name. Instead, it would be the yahoo Democrats extolling the virtues of the magical hand puppet


John from Boston

Dude...take a breath...I read your whole post...I was making a joke!

[RedWingFan]

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hvb0LfZQ5mY-X8PYSvYxTe3QGgdgD93LPR783

ACORN office in Vegas raided in voter-fraud probe

By OSKAR GARCIA – 1 hour ago

LAS VEGAS (AP) — Nevada state authorities are raiding the Las Vegas headquarters of an organization that works to get low-income people to vote.

A Nevada secretary of state's office spokesman said Tuesday that investigators are looking for evidence of voter fraud at the office of the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, also called ACORN.

No one was at the ACORN office when state agents arrived with a search warrant and began carting records and documents away.

Secretary of State spokesman Bob Walsh says ACORN is accused of submitting multiple voter registrations with false and duplicate names.

The raid comes two months after state and federal authorities formed a task force to pursue election-fraud allegations in Nevada.

Who do we know who worked with ACORN....hmmmm..can't remember...

Yeah, they just got busted here in Michigan for the same thing. Gotta love that community organization!

[Jana]

Enigma, your post regarding if Sarah Palin had a D after her name was a very astute observation.

[Tito]

Dude...take a breath...I read your whole post...I was making a joke!

If I wanted a joke, I would've followed you to the bathroon and watch you take a leak. j/k That's from Planes, Trains, and Automobiles.

[treetopovskaya]

...and if obama had an "R" after his name? the dems wouldn't be so supportive i'm guessing... or so easy to turn a blind eye & deaf ear.

Enigma, your post regarding if Sarah Palin had a D after her name was a very astute observation.

[RedWingFan]

A perfect example of your liberal media!
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives2/print/021716.php

A Tree Falls In the Forest

Yesterday in Albuquerque, John McCain delivered an excellent speech that finally made the case that Barack Obama and the Democrats are primarily responsible for the current financial crisis. McCain contrasted his own record, particularly as it related to Fannie and Freddy, with Obama's blank slate. He also accused Obama of a lack of leadership in the current crisis. The guts of McCain's speech related to the economy, but he made his economic points in the context of the broader question, "who is the real Barack Obama?" Again and again, McCain argued, Obama's deeds don't match his words.

If you read our post yesterday, you know that McCain talked about the economy in Albuquerque. You even had the opportunity to watch a ten-minute excerpt from his speech in which he did just that.

But if you rely on the mainstream media for your news, you probably have no idea that McCain gave an important speech on the economy yesterday. Patterico documents the fact that the Los Angeles Times quoted McCain's speech right up to the point where he started talking about the economy. Then without, acknowledging that the economy was in fact the main subject of the speech, the Times jumped to a quote from Barack Obama to the effect that McCain is afraid to talk about the economy.

That's pretty bad, but really not much worse than how most mainstream outlets covered the speech. The Associated Press headlined, "Character attacks emerge in McCain-Obama race." The AP's focus was on the negativity that was engaged in by both campaigns yesterday. In one sentence, the AP did at least acknowledge that McCain had referred to economic issues:

In Albuquerque, N.M., McCain delivered an unusually scathing broadside. He accused Obama of lying about McCain's efforts to regulate the home loan industry. And he suggested Obama is a mysterious figure who cannot be trusted.
But that's it: no discussion of the substance of McCain's speech. Instead, the AP launched into a long, disapproving account of campaign "vitriol," the principal instance being Sarah Palin's references to Bill Ayers. The AP went on to peddle the Democrats' line on past instances of Republican "vitriol:"

Obama, meanwhile, has learned the lessons of Michael Dukakis and John Kerry. Those Democrats lost presidential elections after hesitating to counter hard-hitting and factually dubious attacks on their character and judgment. The shorthand terms for those attacks - "Willie Horton" and "Swiftboating" - have become a call-to-arms for Democratic activists who vow always to return fire with fire.
Actually, as we've pointed out many times, the Swift Boat Vets did a number of ads (seven, I think), only one of which contained facts that were questioned by John Kerry. As for Willie Horton, there were at least three ads or speeches that referred to him, a speech by Al Gore, an ad by the Bush campaign, and an ad by an independent Republican group. None of them contained anything that was "factually dubious." The AP just made that up because they don't like it when Democrats lose Presidential elections.

Like the L.A. Times, the New York Times buried the fact that McCain delivered a powerful speech on the economy, and quoted Obama approvingly:

Mr. Obama scolded his opponent as trying to turn attention away from the economy.
“I cannot imagine anything more important to talk about than the economic crisis,” Mr. Obama said, campaigning in Asheville, N.C. “And the notion that we’d want to brush that aside and engage in the usual political shenanigans and scare tactics that have come to characterize too many political campaigns, I think is not what the American people are looking for.”


If you relied on the New York Times, you would not know that McCain had just delivered a speech on the topic Obama said he was avoiding.

Just another day in the mainstream media.

[SteveForever]

Palin is tough and a breath of fresh air, I think she's awesome!!!

Biden is boring as heck and he's had 30 years to do these big changes he talks about already?
McCain is old but Palin really is a puppet...

There...I fixed it for you! For the record, I don't really believe that Obama is a breath of fresh air at all! I simply think Puppet Oblama is a bumbing idiot!


John from Boston

dude, you're just mad the mortgage industry is in the crapper...

[S2M]

Latest Electoral vote tally....based on polls.



http://www.electoral-vote.com/

[SteveForever]

Latest Electoral vote tally....based on polls.



http://www.electoral-vote.com/

I really think Obama will win, but I'm hoping NOT !!!

[Enigma869]

dude, you're just mad the mortgage industry is in the crapper...

Actually, I couldn't be any more pleased that the mortgage industry is down so much. It has forced about 90% of the people in the business to go back to changing oil or whatever they were doing before the boom years. Luckily, I'm still making a living, and still paying the bills. Far less competition in the industry makes me soooooo not mad


John from Boston

[Enigma869]

John, what are the avg mortgage rates in Boston?

A 30 year fixed is hovering right around 6%. Also, as an FYI, mortgage rates are pretty standard across the country, and not unique by geographic region.

Have you seen prices falling, and most important are loans being made?

Prices have been falling across the board, for almost two years. The only areas of the country that I know of that haven't plummeted are Seattle, San Francisco, and NYC, and even those areas are beginning to level off (although, they are still ridiculously expensive). As to your final question...yes, loans are being made. That said, loans are only being made to solid credit borrowers (not counting FHA here), with sizeable down payments. I would say that more than 50% of the people who could get mortgages 5 years ago have zero shot of getting a mortgage in today's VERY stringent lending environment.


John from Boston

[Enigma869]

Here is an article from a McCain campaign worker, on Barack Obama. I just heard on the news that the McCain camp had fired him, because of this article.

http://www.zimbio.com/pilot?ZURL=%2FBar ... 750415.pdf

(FYI...It's a PDF newspaper article, so you'll probably have to increase it to 200% to make it legible)


John from Boston

[Monker]

Why John McCain will lose the election:

It's not 2000 any longer. It's obvious, to me anyway, that was the election he could have won - in a landslide. People wanted to move away from Clinton. People wanted the type of 'change' he was offering. 8yrs of Bush, neo-conservatives starting wars, and Republicans running congress for much of that time, has erased that. None of the issues that he could have won with in 2000 are on his side any longer.

He is running a Karl Rove style campaign. I said in the primaries that being negative would not win. The same is obviously true in the general election. McCain running a negative campaign destroys any chance he had. I don't care what the excuse is.

He is running on the same issues Clinton lost with. Why would it suddenly be a winning strategy to bring up people from Obama's past, attack him personaly, pretend that you are the REAL change/maverick? If a Clinton lost with that strategy, why would a McCain win? It was a failed campaign for him from the start because of this.

It's still the economy, stupid. The entire economic climate goes against McCain. I think people are generaly sick of the status quo. That means a Republican President leading the worst econimic disaster in most of our lifetimes.

Sarah Palin. You can put lipstick on a neo-conservative, but she's still a neo-conservative. Yeah, she may 'energize' the base. So what. She didn't bring in any new voters. In general, I think she has turned out to be a negative for independents and swing voters. She is more like Bush then McCain is - and that in itself will scare anybody outside of the Republican party away. She was smart to accept the VP slot simply because it has brought her national attention...and I would say she is setting herself up to run in the next 8yrs.

The Sarah Palin interviews. There were so many WTF moments that I'm sure it scared away some people, and made others at least question what they were really voting for.

Shooting from the hip and hitting his foot. McCain has made some very, very recless decisions over the past few weeks...Especialy with the 'bailout' bill. The entire, "the fundamentals of the economy are strong." "I will suspend my campaign..." "It's Obama's fault the bill didn't pass..." Blah, blah, blah. I think a lot of people witnessed that and thought, "What the hell are you doing? And, YOU, want to be President?"

As in 2000, people are sick of Bush and want to move on. The furthest thing from Bush is Obama. That is where people will flock to. Again, I said it in the primaries, people want change. They are starving for it. I don't think McCain has made a real case that he is that person. He is too busy being negative and trying to tear down Obama.

I am very disapointed in McCain. These were the two canidates who I wanted to win the nomination. I really was not disapointed in either one earlier this year. But, I think McCain has been very dishonorable not only towards Obama, but to himself and to his own experience dealing with Bush in 2000.

So, I don't think McCain has a chance any longer. It may be 'close', but I do not see McCain having any chance at winning - at all. He blew it when he "suspended" his campaign.

[RedWingFan]

Why John McCain will lose the election:

8yrs of Bush, neo-conservatives starting wars

Yeah, we rushed right into Afghanastan w/o provocation huh? You're a dope!
That's as far as I had to go with your stupid post. Nonsense.

[Jana]

Monker, thank you. I have said so much of what you stated regarding the poor judgment McCain has shown and my fear regarding Sarah Palin in office and have been blasted on this site. Like you, I really respected McCain, but I have lost so much of what I respected about him. His grandstanding on the economy and suspending his campaign when a week before he said "the fundamentals of the economy were good." I do consider Palin a lot like Bush, a warmonger, among other things. And now his negative attacks instead of focusing on the issues. I enjoyed reading your post. It was very insightful.

Regarding the debate, I expect both men to do very well tonight. They are both very accomplished men. It just boils down to the issues that are important to each person watching the debate.

[RedWingFan]

I do consider Palin a lot like Bush, a warmonger, among other things.

Palin's a warmonger? Did she threaten to start a war with Pakistan like Obama did?
Jana, Thank you for that post. It was a fun read.