The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[SteveForever]

Wow.
An inveterate ex-smoker falling off the wagon.
Never encountered one of those before.
Some of the smartest people I know have carton a day habits.
Meaningless.

God this kills me...but I have to agree with TNC here. Obama being a smoker/ex-smoker/fallen-off-the-wagon ex-smoker is meaningless and irrelevant.

Argue policy positions, not habits. We all have them.

But damn dude, a CARTON a day???

If you ask them how they feel do they tell you, "My LUNG feels great!"?

Ross, no! the argument was a few days back when TNC said Obama HAD stopped smoking and the Obama campaign was attacking McCain's health
with no proof relentlessly in ads running on t.v. with doctors saying he has skin cancer....yet Obama could very well have lung cancer himself for being a chain smoker....
dude, don't give them an inch for the love of your country!!!!!

[RossValoryRocks]

Wow.
An inveterate ex-smoker falling off the wagon.
Never encountered one of those before.
Some of the smartest people I know have carton a day habits.
Meaningless.

God this kills me...but I have to agree with TNC here. Obama being a smoker/ex-smoker/fallen-off-the-wagon ex-smoker is meaningless and irrelevant.

Argue policy positions, not habits. We all have them.

But damn dude, a CARTON a day???

If you ask them how they feel do they tell you, "My LUNG feels great!"?

Ross, no! the argument was a few days back when TNC said Obama HAD stopped smoking and the Obama campaign was attacking McCain's health
with no proof relentlessly in ads running on t.v. with doctors saying he has skin cancer....yet Obama could very well have lung cancer himself for being a chain smoker....
dude, don't give them an inch for the love of your country!!!!!

Just a FYI, I am Stu or RVR...people might think Ross is actually posting here otherwise!

I debate policy or actions only. Well almost only.

You could be right but I don't think it actually matters and it wasn't the Obama campaign it was one of those idiotic 527's running it.

Once Obama develops a hacking cough I think it matters.

[Rick]

Wow.
An inveterate ex-smoker falling off the wagon.
Never encountered one of those before.
Some of the smartest people I know have carton a day habits.
Meaningless.

God this kills me...but I have to agree with TNC here. Obama being a smoker/ex-smoker/fallen-off-the-wagon ex-smoker is meaningless and irrelevant.

Argue policy positions, not habits. We all have them.

But damn dude, a CARTON a day???

If you ask them how they feel do they tell you, "My LUNG feels great!"?

Ross, no! the argument was a few days back when TNC said Obama HAD stopped smoking and the Obama campaign was attacking McCain's health
with no proof relentlessly in ads running on t.v. with doctors saying he has skin cancer....yet Obama could very well have lung cancer himself for being a chain smoker....
dude, don't give them an inch for the love of your country!!!!!

Just a FYI, I am Stu or RVR...people might think Ross is actually posting here otherwise!

I debate policy or actions only. Well almost only.

You could be right but I don't think it actually matters and it wasn't the Obama campaign it was one of those idiotic 527's running it.

Once Obama develops a hacking cough I think it matters.

Ross is posting here!?!? Holy shit!

[RossValoryRocks]

Ross is posting here!?!? Holy shit!

See what I mean?!

[S2M]

ANYWOO

Back to my point.....what's up with the canned questions last night, and the illiterates asking them?

[Rick]

ANYWOO

Back to my point.....what's up with the canned questions last night, and the illiterates asking them?

Agreed, not my favorite format.

[RossValoryRocks]

ANYWOO

Back to my point.....what's up with the canned questions last night, and the illiterates asking them?

I like the format IF they allow spontaneous questions. I thought the last question asked was the best: "What don't you know, and how will you learn it"

GREAT question...I think McCain actually answered it in the way the person wanted it answered.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Ross, no! the argument was a few days back when TNC said Obama HAD stopped smoking..

Yes, the news at the time was that Obama had quit the habit.
Even in the story you just posted, nowhere does it state he has given up.
So he bums a few smokes now and then - big deal.
How many non-smokers light up simply because they are at a bar?
Again, non-issue.

...and the Obama campaign was attacking McCain's health

The Obama campaign never did such.

...with no proof relentlessly in ads running on t.v. with doctors saying he has skin cancer....

Umm, those 527 ads did feature real doctors, and his recurrent bouts with one of the most deadly forms of the big C (four times in all) is public knowledge.
I have seen no ad that says he currently has cancer.

...yet Obama could very well have lung cancer himself for being a chain smoker....

The same could be said about Roosevelt, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon etc. - all smokers.
Should they have been barred from public office?
Having tumors exculpated off your face like some overgrown garden topiary is vastly different from enjoying a good puff.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Folks, the blogosphere is breaking out today with all kinds of info on Baracks history in Chicago. It seems he was a member of The New Party and has many associations with the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). Also see where he was a community organizer in Harlem during his lost Columbia years. I'll post more after I digest it all and make some sense of it.

Good.
Ralph Nader is a Democratic Socialist and has more keen political insight then anyone.

Also, here's a pic apparently from the New York Times that does not appear photoshopped. Chilling stuff, at least to me anyway.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0393062 ... eader-link The Post American World

LOL.
A Fareed Zakaria book.
How chilling.
The ABC and CNN foreign affairs correspondent in favor of coporate globalist trade deals like NAFTA.
What a revolutionary!

[S2M]

Folks, the blogosphere is breaking out today with all kinds of info on Baracks history in Chicago. It seems he was a member of The New Party and has many associations with the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). Also see where he was a community organizer in Harlem during his lost Columbia years. I'll post more after I digest it all and make some sense of it. Long story short, Barack was heavily involved with quasi-communist groups that want to spread Socialism to the good old USA.

Also, here's a pic apparently from the New York Times that does not appear photoshopped. Chilling stuff, at least to me anyway.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0393062 ... eader-link The Post American World

Hmmmm.....are you sure Ruby actually killed Oswald?




"I'm just a patsy"

[RedWingFan]

Don't shoot the messenger...I said I needed to digest the shit I'm being sent/reading. Not sure what all to make of it.

20 years of Jeremiah "God damn America" Wright, William Ayers, "the Global Poverty Act". It's all pretty clear. Frightening, but clear.

[Don]

Folks, the blogosphere is breaking out today with all kinds of info on Baracks history in Chicago. It seems he was a member of The New Party and has many associations with the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). Also see where he was a community organizer in Harlem during his lost Columbia years. I'll post more after I digest it all and make some sense of it. Long story short, Barack was heavily involved with quasi-communist groups that want to spread Socialism to the good old USA.

Also, here's a pic apparently from the New York Times that does not appear photoshopped. Chilling stuff, at least to me anyway.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0393062 ... eader-link The Post American World

I watch Fareed Zakaria every week on PBS. Please explain it to me what's wrong with that book.

[Rick]

Don't shoot the messenger...I said I needed to digest the shit I'm being sent/reading. Not sure what all to make of it.

20 years of Jeremiah "God damn America" Wright, William Ayers, "the Global Poverty Act". It's all pretty clear. Frightening, but clear.

You can't make much of it after 8 years of George "The Constitution is just a god damned piece of paper." Bush.

[Don]

Folks, the blogosphere is breaking out today with all kinds of info on Baracks history in Chicago. It seems he was a member of The New Party and has many associations with the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). Also see where he was a community organizer in Harlem during his lost Columbia years. I'll post more after I digest it all and make some sense of it. Long story short, Barack was heavily involved with quasi-communist groups that want to spread Socialism to the good old USA.

Also, here's a pic apparently from the New York Times that does not appear photoshopped. Chilling stuff, at least to me anyway.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0393062 ... eader-link The Post American World


I watch Fareed Zakaria every week on PBS. Please explain it to me what's wrong with that book.

Don't know about the book, as I said, don't shoot the messenger...not yet anyways. I'm sure if this is all a misunderstanding you and TNC and 7 will set me straight.

I'm not interested in the other banter, I just wanted to know why the book was being brought up. I hope it's for the content, not because of the author's muslim name. Hillbilly tactics were what concerned me.

[RedWingFan]

Don't shoot the messenger...I said I needed to digest the shit I'm being sent/reading. Not sure what all to make of it.

20 years of Jeremiah "God damn America" Wright, William Ayers, "the Global Poverty Act". It's all pretty clear. Frightening, but clear.

You can't make much of it after 8 years of George "The Constitution is just a god damned piece of paper." Bush.

Is that why he got 2 originalists to the Supreme Court to uphold the Constitution rather than use foreign law? Oh wait, I forgot Bush is spying on your phone call to your mechanic.

[Rick]

Don't shoot the messenger...I said I needed to digest the shit I'm being sent/reading. Not sure what all to make of it.

20 years of Jeremiah "God damn America" Wright, William Ayers, "the Global Poverty Act". It's all pretty clear. Frightening, but clear.

You can't make much of it after 8 years of George "The Constitution is just a god damned piece of paper." Bush.

Is that why he got 2 originalists to the Supreme Court to uphold the Constitution rather than use foreign law? Oh wait, I forgot Bush is spying on your phone call to your mechanic.

If you only knew my mechanic...

[The_Noble_Cause]

Uhh, we actually don't know the extent of who's being wiretapped or how many wiretapping programs are even in existence.

Just for my own curiosity, how many other self-styled Conservatives on this forum are in favor of warrantless wiretapping free of government oversight?

[RedWingFan]

Check these 2 links and see something very interesting...again, this is all new..handle with caution..

http://web.archive.org/web/200105311622 ... lss13.html

http://web.archive.org/web/200110170721 ... lstsen.htm


WTF???

WTF is right? What the hell are you talking about.

[RedWingFan]

Uhh, we actually don't know the extent of who's being wiretapped or how many wiretapping programs are even in existence.

Just for my own curiosity, how many other self-styled Conservatives on this forum are in favor of warrantless wiretapping free of government oversight?

TNC, I didn't type that.

[S2M]

A president is supposed to put his hand on the bible and swear to uphold the constitution, not put his hand on the constitution and swear to uphold the bible......

[RedWingFan]

A president is supposed to put his hand on the bible and swear to uphold the constitution, not put his hand on the constitution and swear to uphold the bible......

That's stupid.

[RedWingFan]

Check these 2 links and see something very interesting...again, this is all new..handle with caution..

http://web.archive.org/web/200105311622 ... lss13.html

http://web.archive.org/web/200110170721 ... lstsen.htm


WTF???

WTF is right? What the hell are you talking about.

J

Barack J Obama

Look down. The "J" is right next to the "H"

Maybe he was misheard. Instead of Barack Hussein Obama someone assumed he said Barack Jermaine Obama.

[RossValoryRocks]

Uhh, we actually don't know the extent of who's being wiretapped or how many wiretapping programs are even in existence.

Just for my own curiosity, how many other self-styled Conservatives on this forum are in favor of warrantless wiretapping free of government oversight?

I don't approve of it. However from what I have read and heard it is not a domestic program. But enlighten me if I heard wrong.

[Uno_up]

Our mission is to establish democratic socialism as a political force in the United States and around the world by training and mobilizing socialist activists to participate in a vibrant and diverse socialist organization at both the local and the national level. DSA both educates the public about democratic socialist values and policies and builds progressive coalitions to win victories that move the U.S. and the world toward social democracy. In the near term, democratic socialists struggle for reforms that shift power and resources away from corporate elites and put them in the hands of ordinary citizens. In the long term, democratic socialists fight for a world in which all people share equally in the governing of the economic, political and cultural institutions and relationships that shape their lives.

It is all good fun to argue socialism from our comfortable lives, made so by "greedy capitalism". (I am not arguing here that unregulated capitalism is good.) However, please don't mention these naughty socialist ideas around my wife who hails from Poland. Her family suffered greatly from it, and she will go straight for the jugular if anyone does.

If there is any question about the superiority of the regulated capitalist system over socialism, then the next time you are at a resort in the Carribean or elsewhere, try to find a teacher on the beach that hails from a socialist country. If you are still in doubt after your fruitless search on the beach, give my mother-in-law a call (a retired teacher), and you can compare your retirement to hers.

[donnaplease]

Mine is about $1200/year with dental Blue Cross/Blue Shield of Illinois, but its through my employer... and its just me.

You'll learn pretty quickly that once you have a family, your insurance will go from $1,200.00 a year to about $1,200.00 per month! I suspect that if you're only paying $100.00 per month, your employer is probably picking up about 50% of that bill. Health insurance generally won't bankrupt a single person. It's the "family plans" that cripple most families.


John from Boston

John, this one threw me, so I just pulled out my last pay stub. I pay approximately $365 a month for my family of 5. That includes BCBS insurance, Delta Dental, short-term disability for myself, and life insurance for all 5 of us (the company pays for some of my life insurance, but I also purchase the supplemental on me, Trav & the kids). I don't especially like seeing that chunk of money coming out of my check every pay period, but all-in-all I guess I'm pretty fortunate.

I work in an environment that is VERY easy to find a job... health care. There are jobs out there that provide decent benefits. Much of the time though, the ones bitching the loudest are the ones not willing to get off their tushies to find them.

[RedWingFan]

Mine is about $1200/year with dental Blue Cross/Blue Shield of Illinois, but its through my employer... and its just me.

You'll learn pretty quickly that once you have a family, your insurance will go from $1,200.00 a year to about $1,200.00 per month! I suspect that if you're only paying $100.00 per month, your employer is probably picking up about 50% of that bill. Health insurance generally won't bankrupt a single person. It's the "family plans" that cripple most families.


John from Boston

John, this one threw me, so I just pulled out my last pay stub. I pay approximately $365 a month for my family of 5. That includes BCBS insurance, Delta Dental, short-term disability for myself

$201 every 2 weeks here for coverage for 3.

[sadie65]

Mine is about $1200/year with dental Blue Cross/Blue Shield of Illinois, but its through my employer... and its just me.

You'll learn pretty quickly that once you have a family, your insurance will go from $1,200.00 a year to about $1,200.00 per month! I suspect that if you're only paying $100.00 per month, your employer is probably picking up about 50% of that bill. Health insurance generally won't bankrupt a single person. It's the "family plans" that cripple most families.


John from Boston

John, this one threw me, so I just pulled out my last pay stub. I pay approximately $365 a month for my family of 5. That includes BCBS insurance, Delta Dental, short-term disability for myself

$201 every 2 weeks here for coverage for 3.

I consider myself extremely fortunate that for every other problem currently in my life, I am employed by a company with tremendous benefits. I pay $24 a month for family coverage. That includes medical, dental, and eye. And I fully realize that most people do not have that benefit to the degree I do.

[scarygirl]

My health insurance is $338 a month BCBS Blue Plan, 500 deductible. I pay 0 dollars for it. My company picks up the tab. Not bragging just saying. I know I'm fortunate.

[scarygirl]

My health insurance is $338 a month BCBS Blue Plan, 500 deductible. I pay 0 dollars for it. My company picks up the tab. Not bragging just saying. I know I'm fortunate.

Up your deductible and put $100 in you pocket.

I've thought about that. I could use the extra money. Trust me. Not complaining or anything. I'd feel like I was stealing or something though.

[Rick]

Mine is about $1200/year with dental Blue Cross/Blue Shield of Illinois, but its through my employer... and its just me.

You'll learn pretty quickly that once you have a family, your insurance will go from $1,200.00 a year to about $1,200.00 per month! I suspect that if you're only paying $100.00 per month, your employer is probably picking up about 50% of that bill. Health insurance generally won't bankrupt a single person. It's the "family plans" that cripple most families.


John from Boston

John, this one threw me, so I just pulled out my last pay stub. I pay approximately $365 a month for my family of 5. That includes BCBS insurance, Delta Dental, short-term disability for myself

$201 every 2 weeks here for coverage for 3.

That's about what I pay for 3 people. United Healthcare. I think we're switching to Aetna at the start of the year. It's going up, again.