The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[The_Noble_Cause]

Bush is a Republican, not a conservative. It just goes to show that you're either politically ignorant or willfully untruthful.

As if deregulatory efforts to yank consumer safety standards is anomalous to this one GOP administration?
Republican, Neo-liberal, Neo-con, ...whatever tag you want to pin on your boy, Bush's deregulatory efforts are 100% in line with classic Conservative principles.
You don't even know what the hell you're supporting.

[Jana]

John, you're so right about McCain. This Joe the Plumber I said before earlier in the thread smacks of desperation. It's such overkill. Hell, he couldn't even find him at his last stop. He's calling out for Joe the Plumber. Joe, where are you? Joe? He didn't show up. McCain looked so pathetic. I thought, what has his campaign come to, dragging Joe the Plumber around to his rallies?

When Obama was here with Bill Clinton, it was very moving. Bill Clinton was fantastic. I wish that I had gone because I'm a huge Bill Clinton fan. And it was actually one of Obama's best speeches in the campaign. It was at 11 p.m. and across town in Kissimmee, so I was lazy. But I regret it.

[Enigma869]

They're already doing that but, in my opinion, they wouldn't even be as close as they are if she weren't in the mix. This thing would've been over before the Republican convention.

I don't agree with that, Dave. I know that your opinion of Palin is FAR more favorable than mine. I will concede that I don't think McCain is going to lose this election, just because of Palin (even though I think that is reason enough not to elect the guy)! I think McCain is losing this one, regardless of who his running mate was (assuming he ran the same type of campaign).

Even friends of mine, who are die-hard Republicans (and yes, there are plenty of them in New England), have told me they are embarrassed by the campaign McCain has run. At this point McCain is grasping at straws. McCain is almost completely ignoring issues that ALL Americans care about, and simply spending his time trying to scare Americans into thinking that Obama is some kind of terrorist or at least has terrorist ties, and I believe this is going to backfire on him, IN A BIG WAY!

While I personally thought Obama's informercial was a bit self-indulgent for my taste, it was a masterful production. The most striking thing about it was that John McCain's name wasn't mentioned, one single time. Obama stuck to the issues, and that's what most people care about. I'm not saying that I agree with Obama on everything, because I don't. I just think for an "inexperienced" politician, he has run one of the best campaigns that I've ever seen run, in American politics. At this point, I will be very surprised if this election is even close. I think the American public is losing confidence in McCain, as the days pass. I can only hope (for all of us) that Obama is a good President. Fortunately for Obama, W. hasn't exactly set the bar very high, so hopefully, he'll at least succceed, by default!


John from Boston

[strangegrey]

Bush is a Republican, not a conservative. It just goes to show that you're either politically ignorant or willfully untruthful.

As if deregulatory efforts to yank consumer safety standards is anamalous to this one GOP administration?
Republican, Neo-liberal, Neo-con, ...whatever tag you want to pin on your boy, Bush's deregulatory efforts are 100% in line with classic Conservative principles.
You don't even know what the hell you're supporting.

TNC, I dunno man. While you can certainly make an argument that *some* of Bush's stances fall in line with party doctrine...Bush has bucked against the mainstream conservative/republican party considerably over the past 8 years. I still feel that some of Bush's efforts have undermined the republican party to act as one unit...

While his approval rating is a result of his actions plus expected democrat bucking against what he's done....he's created huge rifts in the republican party leadership and constituency...and that most certainly factors into the approval rating going far lower. Let's assume that 50% of the people polled for approval ratings are democrats, that leaves 2/3 of the remaining republicans to have an unfavorable opinion. That doesn't happen unless you piss off your own party to siginificant factors.

Now, I'm sure from the democrat's point of view, Bush's actions as a whole don't have distinctions from republicans...but I assure you, there's significant differences. He's chopped up the republican base and set it to fight against itself....


Ironically, if there wasnt such infighting and confusion among the republican base, there'd likely be a different candidate than John McCain running against Obama....as McCain's *never* had the support of the core of the party. The fact that the party is all sortsa fucked up, points to McCain's success.

[strangegrey]

I'll also follow up that after this election is in the bag, we will probably see a category of voters labeled "Obama Democrats" much like the "Reagan republicans."


There are alot of republicans (myself, possibly included) that are not only fed up with the republican party (for whatever reason) but actually do see a change in leadership being something that we need.....

[bluejeangirl76]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

That is all.

[conversationpc]

Even friends of mine, who are die-hard Republicans (and yes, there are plenty of them in New England), have told me they are embarrassed by the campaign McCain has run. At this point McCain is grasping at straws. McCain is almost completely ignoring issues that ALL Americans care about, and simply spending his time trying to scare Americans into thinking that Obama is some kind of terrorist or at least has terrorist ties, and I believe this is going to backfire on him, IN A BIG WAY!

I'm not a die-hard Republican by any stretch of the imagination and I have no problem admitting that the McCain campaign has been horribly run.

[lights1961]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

That is all.

4 DAYS TO GO DAMN IT....

GO MCCAIN.
Obama is in town today. I thought he had Iowa all wrapped up.

[Enigma869]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

Hey BJ Girl...

Hang in there. Even though it's over, it will be official in a few more days


John from Boston

[lights1961]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

Hey BJ Girl...

Hang in there. Even though it's over, it will be official in a few more days


John from Boston

John.. just remember the DRIVE... Elway against the Browns... 98 yards to victory for MCCAIN (Elway) and Cleveland (Obama )just fumbled... (spread the wealth... ) or Montana agains the Bengals. Its not over til the FAT LADY SINGS.

[bluejeangirl76]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

Hey BJ Girl...

Hang in there. Even though it's over, it will be official in a few more days

true.

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

[RossValoryRocks]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

Hey BJ Girl...

Hang in there. Even though it's over, it will be official in a few more days

true.

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

Yeah and this time people will be coming armed as well!

[strangegrey]

It's gonna be so much worse if he loses.

Rodney King X 1000....

[conversationpc]

Great article from the San Diego Union-Tribune on the sub-prime crisis...

UNION-TRIBUNE EDITORIAL
Look elsewhere

Deregulation did not cause financial crisis

October 31, 2008

The mismanagement of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac is no orphan. It has many fathers, and deregulation of financial markets isn't one of them.

Starting three decades ago, lawmakers began calling for wider home ownership, which often resulted in government-backed mortgages going to people who couldn't repay them, forcing ever more of the risk on to Fannie and Freddie, two quasi-private corporations. Chartered by Congress years ago, Fannie and Freddie exist to buy mortgages from lenders so that the lender can then recycle the money to other borrowers.

The broadened mission of Fannie, Freddie and other mortgage lenders began in Jimmy Carter's administration with passage of the well-intentioned Community Reinvestment Act. Initially, this legislation mandated that mortgage lenders quit “redlining” urban neighborhoods of low-to moderate-income residents. That was a good idea, but pressure from Congress to approve ever more loans to buyers of modest means eroded the criteria banks traditionally used to gauge the risk of default.

In their place came subprime loans with low teaser rates set to soar. But many marginal borrowers expected to refinance at lower fixed rates and affordable payments.

To encourage lenders to approve these riskiest of mortgages, Congress required that Fannie and Freddie buy ever more of them. By 2005, high-risk home loans comprised 52 percent of Fannie's and Freddie's portfolios. No problem, banks were eager to unload this iffy paper and get back to creditworthy borrowers.

Then Fannie figured how to make this paper pay by bundling the worst and the best loans to back bonds for investment firms to sell. And investors the world over bought the bonds, not least because they saw Uncle Sam as their guarantor.

For years, some Republican lawmakers have proposed regulations to curb the worst excesses but were rebuffed by Fannie's and Freddie's foremost cheerleaders, Sen. Chris Dodd of Connecticut and Rep. Barney Frank of Massachusetts. With Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois, they were also the top three recipients of campaign contributions from the corporations' honchos and their supporters.

Former Clinton administration official Franklin Raines, a most egregious example, departed Fannie Mae with an accounting investigation at his back but personally ahead by $91 million. That's enough to buy down mortgage interest rates to levels affordable for hundreds of moderate-income families.

Appallingly, some Democrats still claim that deregulation fomented by Republicans and greedy investors caused the meltdown. Never mind that the policy of spreading homeownership around to folks who couldn't afford it will cost millions their homes and taxpayers an extra $700 billion.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib ... ottom.html

[lights1961]

I can't wait til this god damned election is over.

Hey BJ Girl...

Hang in there. Even though it's over, it will be official in a few more days

true.

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

Iam in Europe next week for work... If we were home I would be watching returns until 2AM... on FOX NEWS... here is why Anersonj Cooper on CNN was doing his electorial map.... one state I think it was NEVADA had Obama up by 7 calling it a lock... MCCAIN had one state up by 7 calling it too close to call... SO you know what is going to happen on Tuesday dont you..any state that is a LOCK for MCCAIN the networks will still say too close to call... if it looks like MCCAIN is going to win enough votes for the electorial college... they wont call it until VERY LATE. but if Obama can be declared the winner in most states by 10p... even if it really is too close to call.. they will do it in a heart beat... and the race will be over by 10P CDT... mark my words...

Rick

I remember doing that in 2000 staying up all night and then in 04 doing the same thing...

[bluejeangirl76]

It's gonna be so much worse if he loses.

Rodney King X 1000....

Yeah, you better believe it.

I remember when the Bulls won (either the 1st or 2nd time?) - that was supposed to be a happy thing, and this whole place went batshit and not in a good way.

[Enigma869]

Its not over til the FAT LADY SINGS.

[Enigma869]

John.. just remember the DRIVE... Elway against the Browns... 98 yards to victory for MCCAIN (Elway) and Cleveland (Obama )just fumbled... (spread the wealth... ) or Montana agains the Bengals.

The only problem with your argument is that Elway and Montana actually had a competent team around them. McCain doesn't! As for having "just fumbled", you really need to get a clue. Listen, I respect your right to be a Republican, and support your candidate. That said, there has been FAR more fumbling on the Republican side, during this election, than on the Democratic side. At this point, even the Republican pundits are conceding that this campaign has turned into a train wreck, for them!


John from Boston

[bluejeangirl76]

At this point, even the Republican pundits are conceding that this campaign has turned into a train wreck, for them!

Its been a train wrech since the primaries.

[Rhiannon]

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

Yeah and this time people will be coming armed as well!

Oy. Tuesday's gonna suck.

[lights1961]

At this point, even the Republican pundits are conceding that this campaign has turned into a train wreck, for them!

Its been a train wrech since the primaries.

MCCAIN was left for dead summer of 07...dont get too cocky... you will wake up Nov 5 with a HUGE disappointed headache.... you still have a few million hillary voters that wont vote for Obama...

[conversationpc]

Interesting case but I'm certain it's going to go nowhere...

Supremes asked to halt Tuesday's vote
Constitutional crisis feared over Obama's 'qualifications'
Posted: October 30, 2008
11:00 pm Eastern

© 2008 WorldNetDaily

The U.S. Supreme Court is being asked to help the nation avoid a constitutional crisis by halting Tuesday's election until Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama documents his eligibility to run for the top office in the nation.

Democratic attorney
Philip Berg had filed a lawsuit alleging Obama is ineligible to be president because of possible birth in Kenya, but as WND reported, a federal judge dismissed the complaint claiming Berg lacks standing to bring the action.

The 34-page memorandum that accompanied the court order from Judge R. Barclay Surrick concluded ordinary citizens can't sue to ensure that a presidential candidate actually meets the constitutional requirements of the office.

Instead, Surrick said Congress could determine "that citizens, voters, or party members
should police the Constitution's eligibility requirements for the Presidency," but that it would take new laws to grant individual citizens that ability.

"Until that time," Surrick says, "voters do not have standing to bring the sort of challenge that Plaintiff attempts to bring."

Berg has maintained that uncertainty about how the U.S. does enforce the requirements of presidency may result in a constitutional crisis should an ineligible candidate win the office.

In a statement today, Berg said he is applying to Justice David Souter for an "Immediate Injunction to Stay the Presidential Election of November 4, 2008."

"I am hopeful that the U.S. Supreme Court will grant the injunction pending a review of this case to avoid a constitutional crisis by insisting that Obama produce certified documentation that he is or is not a "natural born" citizen and if he cannot produce documentation that Obama be removed from the ballot for president," Berg said.

"We must legally prevent Obama, the unqualified candidate, from taking the office of the presidency of the United States," Berg said.

Get the book that started it all – Jerome Corsi's "The Obama Nation," personally autographed for only $4.95 – an amazing $23 discount!

The issue of Obama's eligibility first got traction among Internet bloggers and later was heightened when several campaigns were launched to determine whether a "certificate of live birth" posted on the Internet by the Obama campaign was valid.

The issue gained more attention when Berg told radio talk show icon Michael Savage he had an admission from Obama's grandmather that she was at his birth – in Kenya.

"This is a question of who has standing to stand up for our Constitution," Berg told Jeff Schreiber of America's Right blog. "If I don't have standing, if you don't have standing, if your neighbor doesn't have standing to ask whether or not the likely next president of the United States – the most powerful man in the entire world – is eligible to be in that office in the first place, then who does?"

As WND reported, Berg filed suit in U.S. District Court in August, alleging Obama is not a natural-born citizen and is thus ineligible to serve as president of the United States. Berg demanded that Obama provide documentation to the court to verify that the candidate was born in Hawaii, as Obama contends, and not in Kenya, as Berg believes.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php? ... geId=79519

[Enigma869]

Apparently not all hockey moms are fans of Puppet Palin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh9BmNuqeiQ


John from Boston

[bluejeangirl76]

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

Yeah and this time people will be coming armed as well!

Oy. Tuesday's gonna suck.

They're telling people who work downtown to leave work at least by 3:00 and get out of Dodge.

I am not kidding, I'm gonna be in my home, hiding under a big blanket with a big ass Starbucks, watching Journey Live in Houston and pretending its 1981 when things were good - Steve Perry was in Journey, Big Macs were still about 1.50, gas was, like, what, practically free, The Facts of Life was still on TV, and my only worry was where the hell is the hell did my Big Bird figure from the Sesame Street house go.

[RossValoryRocks]

Apparently not all hockey moms are fans of Puppet Palin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh9BmNuqeiQ


John from Boston

Of course not. Just like not ALL black people like Obama, not all the people in Deleware like Biden and so forth.

You know, I am convinced you are just an evil, ugly person with a single shred of decency in you. I don't like Obama's policies it's true, but I never spewed the hateful shit toward Obama you and 7 and others have spewed toward McCain and Palin.

Now I know you will blast off on me now, and I will admit that I have tossed out a few bombs toward you and others here, but I actually "know" you in the cyberworld sense of it. You don't even know McCain or Palin in that limited sense.

The fact you are raising children is scary to me, much the same as I feel scared by KKK or Black Panthers raising children to hate.

I know it all fits in with that liberal mantra of "If it feels good do it", but really you should be ashamed of your behavior. I know you won't be but you should.

[bluejeangirl76]

At this point, even the Republican pundits are conceding that this campaign has turned into a train wreck, for them!

Its been a train wrech since the primaries.

MCCAIN was left for dead summer of 07...dont get too cocky... you will wake up Nov 5 with a HUGE disappointed headache.... you still have a few million hillary voters that wont vote for Obama...

I wasn't being cocky. Truth be told I can't stand either of the choices. No matter who gets the job on Tuesday, I'm gonna wake up Nov. 5th annoyed as crap.

[Ehwmatt]

I'm telling you, my happy ass is gonna be HIDING on Tuesday night, especially with that Obama party being held here. Whether he wins or loses, there is gonna be utter pandemonium in this city. I'm thinking about when the Bulls won and everyone just went complete apeshit crazy. This is so much bigger.

Yeah and this time people will be coming armed as well!

Oy. Tuesday's gonna suck.

They're telling people who work downtown to leave work at least by 3:00 and get out of Dodge.

I am not kidding, I'm gonna be in my home, hiding under a big blanket with a big ass Starbucks, watching Journey Live in Houston and pretending its 1981 when things were good - Steve Perry was in Journey, Big Macs were still about 1.50, gas was, like, what, practically free, The Facts of Life was still on TV, and my only worry was where the hell is the hell did my Big Bird figure from the Sesame Street house go.

Yeah, I'm glad I'm nowhere near anywhere urban right now. Good thing I'm armed, just in case

[Jana]

Lights, You're wrong on Hillary voters. I doubt there's as many as you're saying (a few million) that aren't going to vote for Obama. Believe me, I've said this before. I really was for Hillary until the bitter end, so much so I was seriously looking at McCain, for a nanosecond until he self-destructed with Sarah Palin. That was his first error in judgment, among "many" in his campaign. We all know I loved Romney for his VP. But as a Hillary supporter, I have really come around to Obama after this whole campaign process. I suspect most will stay in the Democratic fold. Bill and Hillary are on the campaign trail, especially Hillary, and have been very effective for his campaign and the healing that needed to be done.

[bluejeangirl76]

I really was for Hillary until the bitter end, so much so I was seriously looking at McCain, for a nanosecond until he self-destructed with Sarah Palin. .

Yep. Me too. I almost considered McCain... ALMOST.
But he fell out of my consideration when he picked that arse for his mate.

[Skylorde]

Great article from the San Diego Union-Tribune on the sub-prime crisis...

Comon Dave, stop spewing your Right Wing trash & hate!

*Everybody* knows its mainly George Bush's fault and the remaining blame falls on the backs of the Republicans!