President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[RossValoryRocks]

Stu,

With all undue respect, a citation doesn't mean shit. A citation is about as useful as a celebrity endorsement, 'Choose Oxycontin, Rush gives it 2 thumbs WAYYYY up!'.

I've never been a fan of citations.....I choose to think for myself.

Well if you can't back you opinions up with facts it just shows flawed and lazy thinking. Which also shows in the opinions you hold.

However since you are spouting the liberal taking points almost verbatim, I really doubt you are thinking for yourself.

[RossValoryRocks]

Obama is trying to head off bankruptcy of Medicare. It's almost as simple as that. If you imagine, there are millions and millions of people coming of Medicare age. How is that to be paid for?!? Just let it go bankrupt? Talk about death panels. Will you be howling then because YOU can't get it? Probably... But not until it affects YOU sadly.

Sorry, but this argument makes absolutely no sense at all. In order to 'save' Medicare, BO is gonna create another program, essentially just like it, for people who haven't contributed to the program and many of whom don't deserve the benefits anyway...? Actually, what Obama is trying to do, IMO, is bankrupt America.

Well just think if we weren't fighting a bogus war in Iraq, where there is absolutely zero connection to 9-11, we could more than fund Health Care Reform.

So let's add this up. You got your war. A war based on blatant lie, where thousands of troops have perished. Now you have blocked a program that could have helped millions of Americans. I see your point, I really do.

Nothing anyone here has said in the last few pages has one thing to do with the war in Iraq or anything even resembling it.

You are bankrupt intellectually as the rest of the liberal establishment, all you can do is bring up the big bad boogie man "Bush" and say it is all his fault.

Man up and realize that your golden boy, and his cronies are every bit as bad a Bush was, in different ways of course, as they are still grasping, fawning politicians who will say or do anyting to remain in power.

[S2M]

Stu,

With all undue respect, a citation doesn't mean shit. A citation is about as useful as a celebrity endorsement, 'Choose Oxycontin, Rush gives it 2 thumbs WAYYYY up!'.

I've never been a fan of citations.....I choose to think for myself.

Well if you can't back you opinions up with facts it just shows flawed and lazy thinking. Which also shows in the opinions you hold.

However since you are spouting the liberal taking points almost verbatim, I really doubt you are thinking for yourself.

Stu, you know what's funny? I don't read, watch or in any other way, shape, or form listen to any political show. If my opinions are in lockstep with talking points...well, i guess that just proves that there is something true about them.

Question: If you were never told, coached, or in other other fashion schooled that murder is wrong - and one day you saw a person murdered....What conclusion would you come to? I'm extremely curious for your answer.

[Don]

I don't think it needs a separate thread but Robert Novak has died.


http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/08 ... Novak.html

[RossValoryRocks]

Stu,

With all undue respect, a citation doesn't mean shit. A citation is about as useful as a celebrity endorsement, 'Choose Oxycontin, Rush gives it 2 thumbs WAYYYY up!'.

I've never been a fan of citations.....I choose to think for myself.

Well if you can't back you opinions up with facts it just shows flawed and lazy thinking. Which also shows in the opinions you hold.

However since you are spouting the liberal taking points almost verbatim, I really doubt you are thinking for yourself.

Stu, you know what's funny? I don't read, watch or in any other way, shape, or form listen to any political show. If my opinions are in lockstep with talking points...well, i guess that just proves that there is something true about them.

Question: If you were never told, coached, or in other other fashion schooled that murder is wrong - and one day you saw a person murdered....What conclusion would you come to? I'm extremely curious for your answer.

I believe there in an inborn morality, that inately directs us as to right and wrong, and that most people would see it as wrong.

You are right, you do work in bullshit. Truth?? In talking points? From EITHER party? You are simply high if you think that.

I am done arguing with you unless you can start backing up your positions with some glimmer of credible source. Otherwise your arguments are nothing but bloated opinion that lack substance and show you for the simple trouble maker you are. And I am not the first, nor the last to notice that is all you do: Cause trouble and argue for nothing but that sake of arguement.

[RossValoryRocks]

I don't think it needs a separate thread but Robert Novak has died.


http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/08 ... Novak.html

I am sure Deano and the other libs are planning celebrations as we speak.

[Rockindeano]

Nothing anyone here has said in the last few pages has one thing to do with the war in Iraq or anything even resembling it.

You are bankrupt intellectually as the rest of the liberal establishment, all you can do is bring up the big bad boogie man "Bush" and say it is all his fault.

Man up and realize that your golden boy, and his cronies are every bit as bad a Bush was, in different ways of course, as they are still grasping, fawning politicians who will say or do anyting to remain in power.

Thanks a bunch Stu.

[Rockindeano]

I don't think it needs a separate thread but Robert Novak has died.


http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/08 ... Novak.html

I am sure Deano and the other libs are planning celebrations as we speak.

And this comment just cements the case that you are an asshole.

[RossValoryRocks]

I don't think it needs a separate thread but Robert Novak has died.


http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/08 ... Novak.html

I am sure Deano and the other libs are planning celebrations as we speak.

And this comment just cements the case that you are an asshole.

Well...all I learned about how to be one, I learned from you...

You condem people to Hell on here all the time (Bush and Cheney at least), and you are going to be pissy about being called on how you act?

Grow some thicker skin my friend.

[S2M]

Stu, what is your horrid fascination with sources and citations?

I told you Limbaugh pitching Oxycontin does nothing for me.....

and just because, 'Susan Blotnik' some rogue blogger says that Obama's healthcare plan is this or that, doesn't make an opinion I, you , or joe shmoe holds any more credible......get real.

politics is a sham....look behind the curtain. Smoke, mirrors, strings, and such are all that's there. I do not hate this country, but I'm embarrassed and disappointed in it.....and I have been for a long time.

[RossValoryRocks]

Nothing anyone here has said in the last few pages has one thing to do with the war in Iraq or anything even resembling it.

You are bankrupt intellectually as the rest of the liberal establishment, all you can do is bring up the big bad boogie man "Bush" and say it is all his fault.

Man up and realize that your golden boy, and his cronies are every bit as bad a Bush was, in different ways of course, as they are still grasping, fawning politicians who will say or do anyting to remain in power.

Thanks a bunch Stu.

Well show me you aren't then...quit name calling, attacking the posters, and back up your claims with SOME sort of proof and stay on topic.

Otherwise you are as bad as any other political hack, be they liberal (Mathews etc) or conservative (Hannity, Limbaugh).

[RossValoryRocks]

Stu, what is your horrid fascination with sources and citations?

I told you Limbaugh pitching Oxycontin does nothing for me.....

and just because, 'Susan Blotnik' some rogue blogger says that Obama's healthcare plan is this or that, doesn't make an opinion I, you , or joe shmoe holds any more credible......get real.

politics is a sham....look behind the curtain. Smoke, mirrors, strings, and such are all that's there. I do not hate this country, but I'm embarrassed and disappointed in it.....and I have been for a long time.

It's not horrid facination...it is the CORRECT way to backup what you say. It's called EVIDENCE, and is shows A) sound debating technique, and B) that you can and do looking deeper than surface content.

And don't bullshit about not reading anything political, because otherwise you would have NO opinion on politics because you wouldn't even know what the topic is about.

[Eric]

Obama is trying to head off bankruptcy of Medicare. It's almost as simple as that. If you imagine, there are millions and millions of people coming of Medicare age. How is that to be paid for?!? Just let it go bankrupt? Talk about death panels. Will you be howling then because YOU can't get it? Probably... But not until it affects YOU sadly.

Sorry, but this argument makes absolutely no sense at all. In order to 'save' Medicare, BO is gonna create another program, essentially just like it, for people who haven't contributed to the program and many of whom don't deserve the benefits anyway...? Actually, what Obama is trying to do, IMO, is bankrupt America.

Well just think if we weren't fighting a bogus war in Iraq, where there is absolutely zero connection to 9-11, we could more than fund Health Care Reform.

So let's add this up. You got your war. A war based on blatant lie, where thousands of troops have perished. Now you have blocked a program that could have helped millions of Americans. I see your point, I really do.

Universal Health care would cost over 2 trillion dollars PER YEAR. You could stop both wars and go back in time and stop Korea and Vietnam and it wouldn't be enough.

[S2M]

I do not hate this country, but I'm embarrassed and disappointed in it.....and I have been for a long time.

Oh Boo Fucking Hoo. Christ, even Michelle Obama is now finally proud of this Country, what eles do you need to make you happy, more rich people money being redistributed to the poor? If so, prepare for a fight.

She is 'proud' of this country because she is married to the Head honcho. Jesus.

What would make me proud is closed borders, a just justice system, healhcare for all, and politicians who truly govern for their constituents.

[separate_wayz]

Saw this posting online ......

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Ok, so many of the Obamacare advocates are claiming that legions of people can't afford health insurance -- and therefore if Obamacare isn't passed America will see something like the scene from Monty Python's Holy Grail movie: "Bring out your dead -- [clang]."

So I went to Sam's Club online and went through the steps to apply for health insurance, except the actual payment. I posed as several different people: a 19-year-old single male; a 42 year-old male with a 45-year-old wife; and a 30 year-old female with three children.

For each of the scenarios I received approximately 90 different plan quotes. In no case was the low quote more than $150/month. In fact, a 19-year-old male non-smoker can get health insurance for $28/month.

Twenty-Eight Dollars.

These are plans with Anthem, United Healthcare, and other top companies.

I find it hard to believe that any person in this country -- mind you, a nation of people who incessantly text on their cell phones, smoke, and purchase UFC bouts for $49.95 on pay-per-view -- can't rustle-up $28 a month.

To apply yourself:
1. go to www.samsclub.com
2. scroll down to the "Featured Services" section of links on the left side of the page close to the bottom
3. under "Featured Services" click on "Health Care Services" A new page will open.
4. Scroll down to the middle of the page to the blue link to "Health Insurance." Click this link -- a new page will open.
5. Under the banner"Extend Health" there will be a blue link to "Website." Click this link. You will be redirected to the Extend Health page.
6. On the right-side of the page a large blue link will say "Find the Right Coverage for You." Click this link. A new page will open.
7.A small box will open that asks you to input your zipcode. Input your zip, click submit, and the application process will begin.

(Alternately you can begin the process at the Extend Health site by typing in the web address: extendhealth.com/sams)

So .... tell me again -- why do we need Obamacare???

[Eric]

My new plan with American Community Mutual was approved just today. Me, age 49 and smoker, wife age 46 non smoker.
$194 a month with a $7500 deductable and 100% coverage after that. 2 year guarantee on the $194 rate.

Some will scream about the deductable but to keep the payments low you have to do that now days. $7500 is about the price of a decent car and I can put some of that on a Visa or make monthly payments to the hospital if need be. I'll shell out $7500 easily. It's the quarter million dollar cancer or heart attack bill that I want insured for.

Can you send me a link for that...that sounds pretty tasty.

[fredinator]

Not a link, but a review:

Worst Insurance Ever
Problem:
Poor Service
Date of Problem:
2009-03-30 07:52:30.0
Company Name:
American Community Mutual Insurance Company
Has this problem been resolved yet?
No
Submitted by:
Wayne Stonestreet
I was referred to my agent through a friend. I do not feel it is the agent's fault who recommended the policy through American Community. The price he quoted and which was on all our paper work was $144/month for a copay saver with a $2500 deductible to cover my wife and I. When we received our first bill, the company had raised the price to $188. After we had the policy for a while, my wife contracted Graves disease and had to have radiation to kill her thyroid, and then take a replacement drug. American Community delayed in the payments so long, our credit was hurt. The hospitals kept calling and calling. We offered to pay the $2,500 deductible, however they claimed it must all be settled. It took over 7 months for them to pay, ruining our credit in the mean time. When we had complained about the first increase in premium, the agent insisted that this was a state-wide increase and claimed the premiums were now "locked" for a period of 2 years. Guess what?? Now they have raised our premiums again, in just over 1 year to $225. I am definately in the process of changing companies. I would like everyone out there to know of this horrible experience I had with this company. I must not be the only one, because the company's rating has declined from an A rating to a B through AM Best rating service.

Thanks very much for your support.
Wayne Stonestreet

Good luck with that, FF.

[Jana]

Not a link, but a review:

Worst Insurance Ever
Problem:
Poor Service
Date of Problem:
2009-03-30 07:52:30.0
Company Name:
American Community Mutual Insurance Company
Has this problem been resolved yet?
No
Submitted by:
Wayne Stonestreet
I was referred to my agent through a friend. I do not feel it is the agent's fault who recommended the policy through American Community. The price he quoted and which was on all our paper work was $144/month for a copay saver with a $2500 deductible to cover my wife and I. When we received our first bill, the company had raised the price to $188. After we had the policy for a while, my wife contracted Graves disease and had to have radiation to kill her thyroid, and then take a replacement drug. American Community delayed in the payments so long, our credit was hurt. The hospitals kept calling and calling. We offered to pay the $2,500 deductible, however they claimed it must all be settled. It took over 7 months for them to pay, ruining our credit in the mean time. When we had complained about the first increase in premium, the agent insisted that this was a state-wide increase and claimed the premiums were now "locked" for a period of 2 years. Guess what?? Now they have raised our premiums again, in just over 1 year to $225. I am definately in the process of changing companies. I would like everyone out there to know of this horrible experience I had with this company. I must not be the only one, because the company's rating has declined from an A rating to a B through AM Best rating service.

Thanks very much for your support.
Wayne Stonestreet

Good luck with that, FF.

You have to watch out on a lot of these plans. So many companies leave a lot to be desired, but self-employed people or even small companies switch from plans with United Healthcare and other more reputable companies b/c the rates keep going up higher and higher and get cheaper rates and run into real problems down the road. They also did a 20/20 expose' type show on this, and when many had a serious illness, they did end up in bankruptcy b/c the plans or companies were crap and refused to cover many necessary procedures and care.

[Lula]

But the fact remains that in the plan being floated by the libs, some bureaucrat would be making medical decisions based on cost accounting, not sound medical knowledge.

this is no different from the current hmo system.

[Saint John]

Watching Curious George decimate the country's capitalist approach and move towards socialism, have beer sipping circle jerks with a white-hating mini-Sharpton in an attempt to take his foot out of his mouth, and setting up watch groups for people exercising free speech is priceless. This guy has the practical intellect of a wet pair of shoes and the country is slowly realizing that. Couple that with his brain dead VP and it's no wonder his poll numbers are going down like an Aretha Franklin milkshake.

[RossValoryRocks]

But the fact remains that in the plan being floated by the libs, some bureaucrat would be making medical decisions based on cost accounting, not sound medical knowledge.

this is no different from the current hmo system.

Bull Lula sweetie. As long as it is not some brand new experimental treatment, they will usually pay for it.

[Lula]

But the fact remains that in the plan being floated by the libs, some bureaucrat would be making medical decisions based on cost accounting, not sound medical knowledge.

this is no different from the current hmo system.

Bull Lula sweetie. As long as it is not some brand new experimental treatment, they will usually pay for it.

yeah well, it's still suckie. all this is suckie.

[RedWingFan]

But the fact remains that in the plan being floated by the libs, some bureaucrat would be making medical decisions based on cost accounting, not sound medical knowledge.

this is no different from the current hmo system.

Bull Lula sweetie. As long as it is not some brand new experimental treatment, they will usually pay for it.

Yeah, We are customers of the HMO's, they have an interest in keeping us happy and healthy. The shackles of the federal government is a completely different story!

[Rockindeano]

The percentage of Americans who hold a favorable view of the Democratic Party has slipped below 50 percent for the first time since President Barack Obama took office, according to a new Pew Research Center poll released Wednesday.


Only 49 percent of Americans now hold a favorable view of the Democratic Party, down from 62 percent in the same poll shortly after Obama assumed office. Democratic favorable ratings hovered around 60 percent as recently as April, when 59 percent of those polled held a favorable view.

So? I see you failed to also mention that the GOP is at 40% and that Obama still has a 51-37 approval rating. Now, this is all done by the same polling outfit, so no picking this apart to appease the Cons.

[donnaplease]

But the fact remains that in the plan being floated by the libs, some bureaucrat would be making medical decisions based on cost accounting, not sound medical knowledge.

this is no different from the current hmo system.

Bull Lula sweetie. As long as it is not some brand new experimental treatment, they will usually pay for it.

Yeah, We are customers of the HMO's, they have an interest in keeping us happy and healthy. The shackles of the federal government is a completely different story!

Ok, guys, I don't completely agree with this. I have two very good examples to explain:

(Insurance) I worked in a primary care physician's office a few years ago. We had a patient with severe migraines, and he wanted to order an MRI to look for causative factors. We were told we needed pre-authorization for those types of procedures then, so we attempted to get a pre-auth number. We were told by the insurance company that they would not pay for an MRI, unless there was a CT scan done first. The doctor (who had about as much get-up-and-go as a wet sponge) called them personally to tell them that the CT would not show him what he was looking for, that only an MRI would. They insisted that he get the CT first, which he did. The patient went in & got the CT, and when the results were sent to the doctor, guess what it said: "An MRI is a more appropriate test when looking for this condition." Well, DUH! Talk about mad, this doc was furious!!! Another thousand bucks pissed down the drain...

(Medicare) Case 2 is the case of my mom, who was having seizures and suspected of having strokes. The doc at the hospital kept ordering non-contrast CTs and found nothing. Well, eventually something did show up, which led them to a CT with contrast, which showed a huge brain tumor. Now, I had asked for an MRI initially because the CT was negative yet she was so symptomatic. I was told the MRI was not cost-effective. Of course, she finally got the MRI, but by that time the tumor was so large that is was inoperable. She died about 5 days later...

The insurance companies definitely employ knowledge-deficit people who don't always make decisions based on clinical symptoms and what's in the best interest of the patient. I do believe that needs to be fixed. However, jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire is just plain stoo-pid!

[Lula]

thanks for sharing your experiences, donna. i did not want to type out the personal experiences i've had with insurance not covering something because the end results have been significant losses in my life. sometimes i'd rather not get into debate when it's too personal of an experience to make my point. i went with "suckie" lol.

[treetopovskaya]

obama should come out & tell people to lay off john mackey... some people really are pathetic.

i'm going shopping at whole foods this weekend! }:C)) don't tell mom! (indy will be the only one to get that!!) };C)

[Lula]

are ya pro choice now ff?

[treetopovskaya]

http://www2.wholefoodsmarket.com/blogs/jmackey/

[treetopovskaya]

people that need to get lives...

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=1 ... 8204298..1