Tonight's the night

[S2M]

Again, not true, lol... First, and I've not been secretive about this, Revelation was missing something for me, even with the great songs it had. I never completely loved that album, and I guess it was because it just aimed for familiarity instead of originality. It seems to be what happens when they change vocalists -- try to prove that they are "still Journey". The same reason I Arrival wasn't that big for me at first -- some songs sounded like reworks of past songs for the sake of keeping the sound, plain and simple.

That might be part of it. I think the other side of it is that Revelation was written before they knew who was going to be singing it. Once you get an album under your belt, you know the strengths and weaknesses of your singer, and you can better tailor the material to their strengths the next time. Seen this happen over and over, and not just with Journey. The 2nd album is usually better. Same goes for albums after a breakup. The 2nd reunion album is usually better than the first.

Does that mean Album 'X' tops Revolve?

[Monker]

Well, my initial reaction is that the new songs all sound the same. But, I also agree that it's hard to get a good idea of the songs from YouTube...So, maybe the studio versions will change my mind, maybe....not very hopeful tho.

"But, IMO, when the entire band was in sync and new their roles and how to best fill them, then they made the best music. To me, it doesn't matter if it's "Separate Ways" or "Any Way You Want It" or "Lights" or "Faithfully" or "Higher Place" or "Kiss Me Softly"...When the entire band is clicking, and NOBODY is trying to 'take over', then Journey sounds the best. " -- Me, typos and all, in alt.music.journey 5/5/2001....and I still believe it.

[Jana]

Neal's blog:

Thanks!
by neal_schon
Thanks to every one of our fans who came to the first show of our Eclipse Tour last night in Las Vegas, you KICKED ASS .

[kgdjpubs]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

That works on your typical pop-rock song if they pick the right 30 seconds. I've heard plenty of samples where they show the opening 30 seconds, and not one beat of the chorus. It's basically useless. Others, they get dead on with the sample.

Once you get into more complicated songwriting with timing changes and stuff, 30 seconds isn't enough to show an accurate representation of the song.

[Monker]

Again, not true, lol... First, and I've not been secretive about this, Revelation was missing something for me, even with the great songs it had. I never completely loved that album, and I guess it was because it just aimed for familiarity instead of originality. It seems to be what happens when they change vocalists -- try to prove that they are "still Journey". The same reason I Arrival wasn't that big for me at first -- some songs sounded like reworks of past songs for the sake of keeping the sound, plain and simple.

That might be part of it. I think the other side of it is that Revelation was written before they knew who was going to be singing it. Once you get an album under your belt, you know the strengths and weaknesses of your singer, and you can better tailor the material to their strengths the next time. Seen this happen over and over, and not just with Journey. The 2nd album is usually better. Same goes for albums after a breakup. The 2nd reunion album is usually better than the first.

Not an excuse. A huge chink of Infinity was written prior to Perry joining and that didn't hurt that album at all.

Revelation was written for nostalgia and the 'legacy' sound....THAT was the problem

[Don]

Revelation was missing something for me, even with the great songs it had. I never completely loved that album, and I guess it was because it just aimed for familiarity instead of originality. It seems to be what happens when they change vocalists -- try to prove that they are "still Journey". The same reason I Arrival wasn't that big for me at first -- some songs sounded like reworks of past songs for the sake of keeping the sound, plain and simple.

Also, grower doesn't necessarily mean I dislike an album at first. It only means exactly what Andrew says -- that I don't get everything an album has to offer in the first 1 or 2 listens. It's a discovery process.

Revelation kept everything true to formula to match up with the second disc of classics. All well and good but totally forgettable after awhile. What I would call a nice album.

This disc puts Arnel into new territory where it's him and the guys only, without the ghost of Perry hiding in the package. Even if it's not a commercial success, I've already gotten a lot of what I wanted with this new direction by the group. And in the end that is all that matters to me as a consumer.

[Rip Rokken]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

I quite often quickly scan thru tracks on a new album, but when I do, I rarely find anything that grabs me immediately when I do. 20 seconds is just not nearly enough time to judge many songs by. Some have musical intros that really have nothing to do with the meat of a song, so you must strictly be judging them on opening riffs. Not even enough time to get thru the first vocal verse, much less hear a chorus.

[Monker]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

That works on your typical pop-rock song if they pick the right 30 seconds. I've heard plenty of samples where they show the opening 30 seconds, and not one beat of the chorus. It's basically useless. Others, they get dead on with the sample.

Once you get into more complicated songwriting with timing changes and stuff, 30 seconds isn't enough to show an accurate representation of the song.

But, in this Twitter influenced world where iTunes and single songs dominate, if the song does not hook the listener quickly, it's over. In that sense it IS like a book.

[kgdjpubs]

Again, not true, lol... First, and I've not been secretive about this, Revelation was missing something for me, even with the great songs it had. I never completely loved that album, and I guess it was because it just aimed for familiarity instead of originality. It seems to be what happens when they change vocalists -- try to prove that they are "still Journey". The same reason I Arrival wasn't that big for me at first -- some songs sounded like reworks of past songs for the sake of keeping the sound, plain and simple.

That might be part of it. I think the other side of it is that Revelation was written before they knew who was going to be singing it. Once you get an album under your belt, you know the strengths and weaknesses of your singer, and you can better tailor the material to their strengths the next time. Seen this happen over and over, and not just with Journey. The 2nd album is usually better. Same goes for albums after a breakup. The 2nd reunion album is usually better than the first.

Does that mean Album 'X' tops Revolve?

dunno, but never really cared for Danger Danger to begin with (lyrics!)

[DrFU]

Live, "Resonate" struck me as a great, intense make-out song. Somewhere, somebody's going to get lucky while playing it.

I think the couple in front of me already did.

Truthfully... did it make you think about George Lynch?



I'm still laughing about our cab driver's story, btw... lol!

Seriously ... "Sin City" was living up to its rep yesterday ...

[S2M]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

I quite often quickly scan thru tracks on a new album, but when I do, I rarely find anything that grabs me immediately when I do. 20 seconds is just not nearly enough time to judge many songs by. Some have musical intros that really have nothing to do with the meat of a song, so you must strictly be judging them on opening riffs. Not even enough time to get thru the first vocal verse, much less hear a chorus.

Intros that have nothing to do with the rest of the song are useless. i usually don't like songs with long intros.

[Don]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

That works on your typical pop-rock song if they pick the right 30 seconds. I've heard plenty of samples where they show the opening 30 seconds, and not one beat of the chorus. It's basically useless. Others, they get dead on with the sample.

Once you get into more complicated songwriting with timing changes and stuff, 30 seconds isn't enough to show an accurate representation of the song.

But, in this Twitter influenced world where iTunes and single songs dominate, if the song does not hook the listener quickly, it's over. In that sense it IS like a book.

So true, imagine Pink Floyd trying to release something for this generation of musical youth. Outside of their fanbase, I don't think they would be able to garner any new fans with their writing style.

[kgdjpubs]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

That works on your typical pop-rock song if they pick the right 30 seconds. I've heard plenty of samples where they show the opening 30 seconds, and not one beat of the chorus. It's basically useless. Others, they get dead on with the sample.

Once you get into more complicated songwriting with timing changes and stuff, 30 seconds isn't enough to show an accurate representation of the song.

But, in this Twitter influenced world where iTunes and single songs dominate, if the song does not hook the listener quickly, it's over. In that sense it IS like a book.

in the pop music spectrum, you are correct. I wonder sometimes who makes the decision as to what clip to show. Seen some clips on itunes where the entire clip is instrumental (on a pop-rock song), and hardly one lyric in the entire clip. Maybe it works for some people, but the guitar solo is not the predominate factor as to whether I'll buy a song or not. Give me some of the verse and a chorus.

[RedWingFan]

Intros that have nothing to do with the rest of the song are useless. i usually don't like songs with long intros.

How about "Louisiana Rain"?

[kgdjpubs]

My contention, however, was songs individually....not an album as a whole. I know styles can change song to song. Actually, this is how I do it. I cue up the album in iTunes and click on a song. just like a book....you got 20 secs to impress me. I know after 20 secs if I like a song. I don't have to hear the whole thing. Then it is clicked to the next song, and so forth.....I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

I quite often quickly scan thru tracks on a new album, but when I do, I rarely find anything that grabs me immediately when I do. 20 seconds is just not nearly enough time to judge many songs by. Some have musical intros that really have nothing to do with the meat of a song, so you must strictly be judging them on opening riffs. Not even enough time to get thru the first vocal verse, much less hear a chorus.

Intros that have nothing to do with the rest of the song are useless. i usually don't like songs with long intros.

depends on the song for me. Something like Jimmy Barnes' Driving Wheels has this extended slide guitar intro before the song starts. Not really related to the song much, but it sounds great.

[Rip Rokken]

But, in this Twitter influenced world where iTunes and single songs dominate, if the song does not hook the listener quickly, it's over. In that sense it IS like a book.

True, and all that says to me is that the appreciation of good music is on the wane. If it were different, radio would be playing much different content than we are stuck with today. When artists have to adapt and write for those types of ears, quality goes straight out the window. It's like eating McDonald's every day, and having no patience for any restaurant with sit-down service.

[S2M]

The only one I can think of that even remotely works is Foreplay/Long Time...

[Don]

Lonely is The Night has a great stand alone intro.

[Deb]

Ive checked out most of the clips Rip posted and I'm liking what I hear so far. Like MB this has a more dark and edgy feel, I like it! Vocally, Arnel sounds great on them, not quite enough soul/emotion to move me like some, but am curious to hear the studio cuts. 9 times out of 10 I'm more drawn to deeper cuts than the big hook driven commercial sounding songs. Probably in the minority, but for the most part, the radio hits of some of my favorite bands are not my favorites. I am definitely not one who needs that big hook commercial song, it's the musicality and vocals for me. Resonate, am curious to hear the album version of that one.

S2M, dead wrong dude, grow-ers and show-ers can both be just as satisfying in the end. I can think of one song off the top of my head (and I won't bore you with which one) that I didn't dig on the first couple or 3 listens, but REALLY like it now. Some are just a little deeper musically and have more to them that can be missed on only the first couple listens.

[Melissa]

It's hard to judge songs based on youtube clips recorded on little handheld cameras with pinhole microphones, so I think it's hard to dismiss songs the first time around when you don't even know what they really sound like yet with no album versions. But I also find it just as hilarious on the other end that people will say it's "amazing" hearing it that way for the first time too, lol. Really? But anyhow, so far from having only these to go by, Chain of Love, City of Hope, Edge of the Moment, and Human Feel, while they don't blow me away, they do sound promising as the "rockers" that have been mentioned will make this a more "hard rock" album. Well, at least as "hard" as Journey can get anyway, lol. Resonate I find to be boring as a box of rocks though so far, but hopefully will come across better on the album. Maybe they are "growers", there are a few albums from other artists in the past I've totally found after time to be growers, so it's possible. I'm sure hearing them right there live they sounded different, always do. Youtubes are just hard to go by.

[kgdjpubs]

The only one I can think of that even remotely works is Foreplay/Long Time...

the extended 12" remix of Magnum's Midnight (which was done live) is vastly superior to the album version.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKEB5LmTVU
the regular song begins about a half-second before the vocals start, with a few bars cut off from this live version

[Jana]

Revelation was missing something for me, even with the great songs it had. I never completely loved that album, and I guess it was because it just aimed for familiarity instead of originality. It seems to be what happens when they change vocalists -- try to prove that they are "still Journey". The same reason I Arrival wasn't that big for me at first -- some songs sounded like reworks of past songs for the sake of keeping the sound, plain and simple.

Also, grower doesn't necessarily mean I dislike an album at first. It only means exactly what Andrew says -- that I don't get everything an album has to offer in the first 1 or 2 listens. It's a discovery process.

Revelation kept everything true to formula to match up with the second disc of classics. All well and good but totally forgettable after awhile. What I would call a nice album.

This disc puts Arnel into new territory where it's him and the guys only, without the ghost of Perry hiding in the package. Even if it's not a commercial success, I've already gotten a lot of what I wanted with this new direction by the group. And in the end that is all that matters to me as a consumer.

I just watched your sig. Is it going to be released now since they have a trailer out?

[Don]

I just watched your sig. Is it going to be released now since they have a trailer out?

They're trying to collect emails to prove to potential investors/distributors? that there is an audience out there for this movie. Interest seems to have waned. The Director chic has been banned from FaceBook twice for her aggressive friending requests. They need 1000s of people to join their cause but only have garnered a few hundred since she put the word out. It's just taken Waaaaay too long to get this done. Journey should just finance it and make it a packin disc but the director seems to have her own agenda, (trying to get an Academy award for best documentary) and is still trying to push it to the big screen.

[kmjrr]

I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

A terabyte would be roughly 200,000 songs. That's a lot of money (assuming you purchased the music) and a LONG time listening to 20 second clips.

[Jana]

Ive checked out most of the clips Rip posted and I'm liking what I hear so far. Like MB this has a more dark and edgy feel, I like it! Vocally, Arnel sounds great on them, not quite enough soul/emotion to move me like some, but am curious to hear the studio cuts. 9 times out of 10 I'm more drawn to deeper cuts than the big hook driven commercial sounding songs. Probably in the minority, but for the most part, the radio hits of some of my favorite bands are not my favorites. I am definitely not one who needs that big hook commercial song, it's the musicality and vocals for me. Resonate, am curious to hear the album version of that one.

S2M, dead wrong dude, grow-ers and show-ers can both be just as satisfying in the end. I can think of one song off the top of my head (and I won't bore you with which one) that I didn't dig on the first couple or 3 listens, but REALLY like it now. Some are just a little deeper musically and have more to them that can be missed on only the first couple listens.

I'm with you. Sometimes I buy an album, and I listen over and over to the obvious hits, and then bit by bit, after listening to the album for a while, I start discovering other songs I hadn't paid as much attention to and they actually are the ones with staying power for me many times.

[Jana]

I just watched your sig. Is it going to be released now since they have a trailer out?

They're trying to collect emails to prove to potential investors/distributors? that there is an audience out there for this movie. Interest seems to have waned. The Director chic has been banned from FaceBook twice for her aggressive friending requests. They need 1000s of people to join their cause but only have garnered a few hundred since she put the word out. It's just taken Waaaaay too long to get this done. Journey should just finance it and make it a packin disc but the director seems to have her own agenda, (trying to get an Academy award for best documentary) and is still trying to push it to the big screen.

The best time was the Oprah show period. I would think that ship has sailed if she couldn't get backing during more of the hype period.

[S2M]

I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

A terabyte would be roughly 200,000 songs. That's a lot of money (assuming you purchased the music) and a LONG time listening to 20 second clips.

I currently have 748 gigs of music....close enough.

[Vladan]

CITY OF HOPE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceSmLs2wO4I

This is a great song. Awesome.

Yep. So far best new song in a long time? along with Like A Sun Shower IMO.

[Ligzig]

I choose all my music like this, and believe you me, I have loads of it. I'm approaching close to a terabyte's worth....

A terabyte would be roughly 200,000 songs. That's a lot of money (assuming you purchased the music) and a LONG time listening to 20 second clips.

I currently have 748 gigs of music....close enough.

That's a lot of bad music.

I was pretty indifferent to this new release, but I'm a little more interested after hearing these clips. Audio sucks but I'll save final judgement until I hear the studio versions.

[Rip Rokken]

Quick correction... Song title is actually (mistake).

Oops, very sorry -- this was a misunderstanding, and it has since been clarified -- the correct name of the song was as posted before, "EDGE OF THE MOMENT".