President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[Rick]

If you haven't seen it, this is Samuel L. Jackson's Obama ad called "Wake The Fuck Up!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY

[Behshad]

If you haven't seen it, this is Samuel L. Jackson's Obama ad called "Wake The Fuck Up!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY

That was great !
Thanks for sharing pRick

[Rick]

If you haven't seen it, this is Samuel L. Jackson's Obama ad called "Wake The Fuck Up!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY

That was great !
Thanks for sharing pRick

Y/w. This one is pretty good also.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFJUz1DO20Q

[Memorex]

The CNN/ORC International poll of registered and likely voters released Tuesday shows Romney leading Obama among likely independent voters, 54 percent to 40 percent.

It was the independent vote that helped Obama win the 2008 election. He won 52 percent of independents, compared with 44 percent for McCain. Independents comprised about 33 percent of the overall vote in 2008.

This could be one reason:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgvMGLdc908

[Seven Wishes2]

Sept. 28 (Bloomberg) -- President Barack Obama leads Republican challenger Mitt Romney in the swing state of New Hampshire and runs narrowly ahead of him in the surprising battlegrounds of North Carolina and Nevada, according to polls released last night in the run-up to next week’s first presidential debate.

The latest results are in line with other recent surveys showing Obama with the edge in states that strategists in both parties say will decide who wins the White House on Nov. 6. The new NBC News/Wall Street Journal/Marist College poll shows Obama ahead among likely voters in New Hampshire, 51 percent to 44 percent, and with two-point edges in Nevada, 49 percent to 47 percent, and North Carolina, 48 percent to 46 percent.

The results for Nevada and North Carolina are within the margin of error for the surveys of plus or minus 3.1 percentage points. The three states together account for 25 of the 270 electoral votes required to win the White House.

Romney “needs to change the whole dynamic,” said Lee Miringoff, director of the Marist Institute of Public Opinion in Poughkeepsie, New York. “Right now, the trends are not going his way.”

Obama has led in the nine swing states surveyed by the Marist Institute for NBC News and the Journal since the end of the Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, North Carolina, earlier this month.

50 Percent

In five of the nine -- Colorado, Iowa, Ohio, Wisconsin and now New Hampshire -- Obama’s support has been at 50 percent or more. Along with North Carolina and Nevada, the other states where the polling has shown him ahead with less than 50 percent support are Florida and Virginia.

In Ohio, without which no Republican has won the White House, a CBS News/New York Times/Quinnipiac University poll taken Sept. 18-24 showed Obama ahead of Romney, 53 percent to 43 percent, among likely voters. The CBS/Times survey also put Obama ahead in Florida, the largest battleground state, 53 percent to 44 percent.

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

[Seven Wishes2]

Seriously, this has me so angry I'm thinking about not voting for him. This is why we're all screwed in a two-party system where it's simply a matter of the slightly lesser of two evils. THIS is the kind of thing that could undermine his candidacy, not some four-casualty "cover-up" six thousand miles away.

[The_Noble_Cause]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

We're at war. Get over it.

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

We're at war. Get over it.

LOL, who wacked you on the head and turned you into a neo-con. Next thing we know your avatar name will be changed from the Noble Cause to Bolton's Cause

[Memorex]

If Romney doesn't offer up a clear plan in the debates, he's done. He needs to make people understand why they should get off the couch and change directions.

Obama needs to figure out a way to explain how the next four years will be any better than the last four. There are no indicators that I see that lead me to think we are going to get back to prosperity and get people's money back into the economy. I see the opposite right now. The stock market is going to fall again because the growth is based on nothing real. The debt is going to become even more unsustainable. All these companies that are teetering on the edge will collapse.

If I was Romney, I'd ask Obama one simple question. Where have you been and what have you done for the last 18 months? I can't think of anything substantial that Obama has done in a very long time. He needs to lead this county out of where we are. And if he was waiting for a second term to do that, that's a pity. Obama allowed the air to be let out of the balloon.

[The Sushi Hunter]

When I was in jr high, we loved it when a substitute teacher was teaching the class because we could fuck off all day long and not be held accountable for anything we did, or didn't do. We would play stupid and the substitute would practically "give" us all the answers to everything. If we could vote on it, we would have voted to keep the substitute as the head of the class as long as possible.

Bottom line, Obama is that substitute teacher letting the majority fuck off while "giving" these same ones who play stupid everything.

For this reason I bet Obama will win this election.

[Behshad]

When I was in jr high, we loved it when a substitute teacher was teaching the class because we could fuck off all day long and not be held accountable for anything we did, or didn't do. We would play stupid and the substitute would practically "give" us all the answers to everything. If we could vote on it, we would have voted to keep the substitute as the head of the class as long as possible.

Bottom line, Obama is that substitute teacher letting the majority fuck off while "giving" these same ones who play stupid everything.

For this reason I bet Obama will win this election.

Yep thats the reason he will win
Specially since before this subsitute teacher we has a REAL teacher in class

[Monker]

If Romney doesn't offer up a clear plan in the debates, he's done. He needs to make people understand why they should get off the couch and change directions.

Obama needs to figure out a way to explain how the next four years will be any better than the last four. There are no indicators that I see that lead me to think we are going to get back to prosperity and get people's money back into the economy. I see the opposite right now. The stock market is going to fall again because the growth is based on nothing real. The debt is going to become even more unsustainable. All these companies that are teetering on the edge will collapse.

If I was Romney, I'd ask Obama one simple question. Where have you been and what have you done for the last 18 months? I can't think of anything substantial that Obama has done in a very long time. He needs to lead this county out of where we are. And if he was waiting for a second term to do that, that's a pity. Obama allowed the air to be let out of the balloon.

Well, if I were Obama, I would answer that with, "That's interesting...a 'conservative' asking what government has done for him." That question reminds me of Jon Stewart's "Bullshit Mountain" tirade. If you're successful, "You built that." If not, then government stood in your way. If you get a break, it's a good thing. If someone else does, it's an entitlement and you are dependent on the system. Obama shouldn't take it to that level...but he should absolutely remind people of the hypocrisy of the Republican party for even asking that question.

As for what Obama has done: Brought us out of another great depression. Ended the work in Iraq. Killed Osama bin Laden. Saved the auto industry. Ensured the health care for millions of Americans. We were on the precipice of national financial disaster even worse the the Great Depression - and we avoided, and started building things in the right direction. No, it's not complete. No, not enough people are back to work. However, IMO only, we are at a point where 'prosperity' is going to happen as business start feeling more relaxed with their cash, hiring and expanding their businness...I *KNOW* this is already happening in the financial industry and IT. There are so many more jobs out there now compared to a few years ago, if you have the skills/experience, I don't know why you are still not employed.

The economy is so much better now then when Bush left. It's not that way EVERYWHERE in the country...but it will be within the next four years - regardless of who is President. And, it is to Obama's credit that it will happen.

Debt doesn't matter. That has been proven over and over again in our history. Even Reagan ignored the debt after he beat Carter. The debt has increased so much because the economy collapsed. As the economy picks up, the debt will decrease. Again, I think that's going to happen regardless of who is President. Neither of these guys is Ross Perot. The debt is not a winning, or losing, issue for either of them.

Now, IMO, I think this is Obama's election to lose now. He is going to have to do some REALLY bad to lose this. Romney can't do enough to win now....it's up to Obama to really screw up somewhere. I don't see that happening AT ALL.

[The Sushi Hunter]

So.....what has he done for the last 18 months?

[Monker]

When I was in jr high, we loved it when a substitute teacher was teaching the class because we could fuck off all day long and not be held accountable for anything we did, or didn't do. We would play stupid and the substitute would practically "give" us all the answers to everything. If we could vote on it, we would have voted to keep the substitute as the head of the class as long as possible.

Bottom line, Obama is that substitute teacher letting the majority fuck off while "giving" these same ones who play stupid everything.

For this reason I bet Obama will win this election.

That explains a bit. You must have had a lot of substitute teachers.

[Behshad]

When I was in jr high, we loved it when a substitute teacher was teaching the class because we could fuck off all day long and not be held accountable for anything we did, or didn't do. We would play stupid and the substitute would practically "give" us all the answers to everything. If we could vote on it, we would have voted to keep the substitute as the head of the class as long as possible.

Bottom line, Obama is that substitute teacher letting the majority fuck off while "giving" these same ones who play stupid everything.

For this reason I bet Obama will win this election.

That explains a bit. You must have had a lot of substitute teachers.

[The Sushi Hunter]

When I was in jr high, we loved it when a substitute teacher was teaching the class because we could fuck off all day long and not be held accountable for anything we did, or didn't do. We would play stupid and the substitute would practically "give" us all the answers to everything. If we could vote on it, we would have voted to keep the substitute as the head of the class as long as possible.

Bottom line, Obama is that substitute teacher letting the majority fuck off while "giving" these same ones who play stupid everything.

For this reason I bet Obama will win this election.

That explains a bit. You must have had a lot of substitute teachers.

I did, and I saw how the no loads in class took advantage of the situation. But unlike in class, we now have to deal with these no loads creating the future of America by voting in who fits the life that they created for themselves, reference youtube lady screaming about getting the Obama phone.

[slucero]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

I remember the Obama campaign promise to end the Patriot Act... and I thought, finally a President with some balls, after all he is a "constitutional scholar"...

And then he not only doesn't end it, he extends it... (just like Romney would)

[slucero]

If Romney doesn't offer up a clear plan in the debates, he's done. He needs to make people understand why they should get off the couch and change directions.

Obama needs to figure out a way to explain how the next four years will be any better than the last four. There are no indicators that I see that lead me to think we are going to get back to prosperity and get people's money back into the economy. I see the opposite right now. The stock market is going to fall again because the growth is based on nothing real. The debt is going to become even more unsustainable. All these companies that are teetering on the edge will collapse.

If I was Romney, I'd ask Obama one simple question. Where have you been and what have you done for the last 18 months? I can't think of anything substantial that Obama has done in a very long time. He needs to lead this county out of where we are. And if he was waiting for a second term to do that, that's a pity. Obama allowed the air to be let out of the balloon.

If I was Romney , I'd make the following 2 campaign promises:

1. End the Lobby on K Street

2. End the Patriot Act


This would make him more liberal than Obama... and would also be 2 2008 campaign promises Obama didn't keep...

Romney might even get some Dem votes with those two promises..

[The Sushi Hunter]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

I remember the Obama campaign promise to end the Patriot Act... and I thought, finally a President with some balls, after all he is a "constitutional scholar"...

And then he not only doesn't end it, he extends it... (just like Romney would)

Remind me again what the patriot act exactly is. What don't you like about it?

[slucero]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

I remember the Obama campaign promise to end the Patriot Act... and I thought, finally a President with some balls, after all he is a "constitutional scholar"...

And then he not only doesn't end it, he extends it... (just like Romney would)

Remind me again what the patriot act is. What don't you like about it?

Providing for the common defense does not give Congress the power to legislate away the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

The 9/11 Report showed that US Intelligence already had reams of info regarding an attack.. but failed to review it... with the lack of cooperation and intelligence sharing among many agencies being the primary cause. This is exactly what occurred during the 1993 and 2001 World Trade Center attacks. It is an indisputable fact that some of our intelligence agencies were fully aware of the “planes as missiles” plan as early as 1993. Our country did not need the Patriot Act; we needed our intelligence agencies to do their jobs.

The Constitution already provides the answer to the problem of a, non-uniform, nameless, and nation-less enemy. It is provided for in the Constitution under Article 1, Section 8, Clause 11: To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water. Letters of Marque and Reprisal allow pursuing the nation-less enemy. A bill introducing this concept had no support from a well-intended but a constitutionally ignorant Congress.

Law enforcement must adapt to new technologies within the confines of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Any thing else is implying we have a “living” Constitution, which we do not.

Former Superior court Judge Andrew Napolitano says it best: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJvrulLgoK0

[The Sushi Hunter]

Since I'm not up to doing anything wrong and I don't have anything to hide, I guess it doesn't matter to me for those reasons. However, if some information fell into the wrong hands that were out to harm me and not just monitor me, that would be more of my concerns perhaps.

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

OK, point made. I just think it's being overblown. Compared with the fabrication of a letter of a non-existent purchase of yellow cake by a secular government via a terrorist organization as THE pretense for an unncessary and probably illegal war, this is nothing.

Now, THIS is a big deal.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/28/warrantless-electronic-surveillance-obama_n_1924508.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

THIS makes Obama a hypocrite at best. Talk about breaking a campaign promise.

You are exactly right. This is a big deal. Unfortunately both major are seem to want to out do each other in the way that they violate and disrespect the the 4th amendment. All in the name of security- well not even in the name of that anymore, they just assume they can do it.

I remember the Obama campaign promise to end the Patriot Act... and I thought, finally a President with some balls, after all he is a "constitutional scholar"...

And then he not only doesn't end it, he extends it... (just like Romney would)

Remind me again what the patriot act exactly is. What don't you like about it?

Too lazy to write out a synopsis of the whole thing but here is a summary, which I guess is accurate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act

The below statement represents one thing wrong with it. Among a number of other things wrong with with it simply violates the 4th amendment under the guise of security.

http://www.civilfreedoms.org/?p=1667

Furthermore the Patriot Act has opened the door to other abuses. Last years Defense Authorization Act contained a clause actually opened the door for the US military to detain US citizens on US soil under the name of anti terrorism.

We are told all of these provisions are temporary, but when is this open ended war going to end. is the government going to keep all of these extra powers?

Sadly there are only a handful of folks in Congress - a few on the left and a few the libertarian right who are willing to speak out against what is going on.

[The Sushi Hunter]

I would have to say "yes" to the government keeping the extra powers because that is what they have done with taxes so why not everything else.

It's for safety and security, which I can understand.

[slucero]

I would have to say "yes" to the government keeping the extra powers because that is what they have done with taxes so why not everything else.

It's for safety and security, which I can understand.

That's the definition of a totalitarian state...

totalitarian

1. of or pertaining to a centralized government that does not tolerate parties of differing opinion and that exercises dictatorial control over many aspects of life.
2. exercising control over the freedom, will, or thought of others; authoritarian; autocratic.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Theoretically it's for safety and security. Is there any evidence that it's been used for anything other than that?

[slucero]

Theoretically it's for safety and security. Is there any evidence that it's been used for anything other than that?

From here: http://www.aclu.org/pdfs/safefree/patri ... 090310.pdf

WANDA GUTHRIE, a volunteer with the Thomas Merton Center for Peace & Justice, an organization founded in 1972 to bring people from diverse philosophies and faiths together to work, through nonviolent efforts, for a more just and peaceful world, was monitored by the FBI Joint Terrorism Task Force. “The overnment’s surveillance of the TMC events and gatherings which may include those of Roots for Peace is just horrible. Spying invades peoples’ privacy and sacred space when they are speaking out - and make no bones about it, when you’re speaking out for peace it is sacred space. For the FBI to monitor us as if we were terrorists is unconscionable.”


BREWSTER KAHLE is the founder and digital librarian of the Internet Archive, a digital library. In November 2007, the FBI used an NSL to demand personal information about one of the Archive’s users. The NSL also included a gag order, prohibiting the Archive from revealing the existence of the letter. In April 2008, the FBI withdrew the unconstitutional NSL as part of the settlement of a lawsuit brought by the ACLU and the Electronic Frontier Foundation. “The free flow of information is at the heart of every library’s work. That’s why Congress passed a law limiting the FBI’s power to issue NSLs to America’s libraries. While it’s never easy standing up to the government - particularly when I was barred from discussing it with anyone - I knew I had to challenge something that was clearly wrong. I’m grateful that I am able now to talk about what happened to me, so that other libraries can learn how they can fight back from these overreaching demands.”

TARIQ RAMADAN, a Swiss native and Visiting Fellow at the University of Oxford, is a leading scholar of the Muslim world. The U.S. government revoked Ramadan’s visa in August 2004, preventing him from assuming a tenured teaching position at the University of Notre Dame and from attending speaking
engagements with U.S. audiences. Although Professor Ramadan has been a consistent critic of terrorism and those who use it, the Department of Homeland Security cited a provision of the Patriot Act that allows the government to deny a visa to anyone whom the government believes has “endorse[d] or espouse[d] terrorist activity” as the basis for its decision. The government later withdrew that accusation but Professor Ramadan remains barred from the country.

JOHN DOE, the President of an Internet Service Provider, is an NSL recipient who has been under an FBI gag order for more than four years. John Doe challenged the constitutionality of the NSL statute. Because of the gag order, the lawsuit was initially filed under seal, and even today the ACLU is prohibited from disclosing its client’s identity. The FBI continues to maintain the gag order even though the underlying investigation is more than four years old (and may well have ended), and even though the FBI abandoned its demand for records two years ago. In December of 2008, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit ruled that the NSL statute’s gag provisions, as amended by Congress in 2006, violated the First Amendment.

KONSTANTY HORDYNSKI, a student at the University of California at Santa Cruz, was quite surprised to learn that he was in a Pentagon domestic threat database. “I didn’t protest with Students Against War to be threatening, or to be un-American, or to waste anyone’s time. I protested because it was a way I could stand up for what I believed was right. I knew that my actions were protected by the Constitution. Yet the government believes that the peaceful protest in which I took part is a “credible threat.” When lawfully standing up for my beliefs—standing up for what I think is right and just—is a “threat” to the government, something is wrong…

(This one might make you rethink your "I'm not up to doing anything wrong and I don't have anything to hide, I guess it doesn't matter to me" position...)

BRANDON MAYFIELD, an American attorney practicing in Portland, Oregon, was subjected to secret FISA searches of his home and office after an FBI agent mistakenly identified his fingerprint on materials related to a terrorist bombing in Madrid, Spain. The FBI agents who conducted the searches of the Mayfield home left tell-tale signs of their presence, leading the Mayfield family to fear their home was being burglarized. Mayfield challenged the constitutionality of the Patriot Act provision that allows FBI agents to use FISA orders to gather evidence in a criminal investigation. “In the debate over the scope of the government’s authority to wiretap Americans we often hear people say, ‘if you’re not doing something wrong you have nothing to worry about.’ I am here to tell you that even the innocent can have their lives turned upside-down when laws designed to protect against unrestrained government actions are weakened.”

Funny thing is... the ACLU is a liberal organization... and Obama is a liberal... yet....

Obama promised to repeal the Patriot Act... which is something only someone with libertarian/constitutionalist leanings would do.

So it appears that the ACLU is more conservative than Obama... at least with regards to the Constitution and the Patriot Act..

[Memorex]

If Romney doesn't offer up a clear plan in the debates, he's done. He needs to make people understand why they should get off the couch and change directions.

Obama needs to figure out a way to explain how the next four years will be any better than the last four. There are no indicators that I see that lead me to think we are going to get back to prosperity and get people's money back into the economy. I see the opposite right now. The stock market is going to fall again because the growth is based on nothing real. The debt is going to become even more unsustainable. All these companies that are teetering on the edge will collapse.

If I was Romney, I'd ask Obama one simple question. Where have you been and what have you done for the last 18 months? I can't think of anything substantial that Obama has done in a very long time. He needs to lead this county out of where we are. And if he was waiting for a second term to do that, that's a pity. Obama allowed the air to be let out of the balloon.

Well, if I were Obama, I would answer that with, "That's interesting...a 'conservative' asking what government has done for him." That question reminds me of Jon Stewart's "Bullshit Mountain" tirade. If you're successful, "You built that." If not, then government stood in your way. If you get a break, it's a good thing. If someone else does, it's an entitlement and you are dependent on the system. Obama shouldn't take it to that level...but he should absolutely remind people of the hypocrisy of the Republican party for even asking that question.

As for what Obama has done: Brought us out of another great depression. Ended the work in Iraq. Killed Osama bin Laden. Saved the auto industry. Ensured the health care for millions of Americans. We were on the precipice of national financial disaster even worse the the Great Depression - and we avoided, and started building things in the right direction. No, it's not complete. No, not enough people are back to work. However, IMO only, we are at a point where 'prosperity' is going to happen as business start feeling more relaxed with their cash, hiring and expanding their businness...I *KNOW* this is already happening in the financial industry and IT. There are so many more jobs out there now compared to a few years ago, if you have the skills/experience, I don't know why you are still not employed.

The economy is so much better now then when Bush left. It's not that way EVERYWHERE in the country...but it will be within the next four years - regardless of who is President. And, it is to Obama's credit that it will happen.

Debt doesn't matter. That has been proven over and over again in our history. Even Reagan ignored the debt after he beat Carter. The debt has increased so much because the economy collapsed. As the economy picks up, the debt will decrease. Again, I think that's going to happen regardless of who is President. Neither of these guys is Ross Perot. The debt is not a winning, or losing, issue for either of them.

Now, IMO, I think this is Obama's election to lose now. He is going to have to do some REALLY bad to lose this. Romney can't do enough to win now....it's up to Obama to really screw up somewhere. I don't see that happening AT ALL.

Then why this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyLmru6no4U

Yea - only one side are hypocrites. The sooner everyone realizes that they are two sides of the same coin, the better off we'll be.

[slucero]

If Romney doesn't offer up a clear plan in the debates, he's done. He needs to make people understand why they should get off the couch and change directions.

Obama needs to figure out a way to explain how the next four years will be any better than the last four. There are no indicators that I see that lead me to think we are going to get back to prosperity and get people's money back into the economy. I see the opposite right now. The stock market is going to fall again because the growth is based on nothing real. The debt is going to become even more unsustainable. All these companies that are teetering on the edge will collapse.

If I was Romney, I'd ask Obama one simple question. Where have you been and what have you done for the last 18 months? I can't think of anything substantial that Obama has done in a very long time. He needs to lead this county out of where we are. And if he was waiting for a second term to do that, that's a pity. Obama allowed the air to be let out of the balloon.

Well, if I were Obama, I would answer that with, "That's interesting...a 'conservative' asking what government has done for him." That question reminds me of Jon Stewart's "Bullshit Mountain" tirade. If you're successful, "You built that." If not, then government stood in your way. If you get a break, it's a good thing. If someone else does, it's an entitlement and you are dependent on the system. Obama shouldn't take it to that level...but he should absolutely remind people of the hypocrisy of the Republican party for even asking that question.

As for what Obama has done: Brought us out of another great depression. Ended the work in Iraq. Killed Osama bin Laden. Saved the auto industry. Ensured the health care for millions of Americans. We were on the precipice of national financial disaster even worse the the Great Depression - and we avoided, and started building things in the right direction. No, it's not complete. No, not enough people are back to work. However, IMO only, we are at a point where 'prosperity' is going to happen as business start feeling more relaxed with their cash, hiring and expanding their businness...I *KNOW* this is already happening in the financial industry and IT. There are so many more jobs out there now compared to a few years ago, if you have the skills/experience, I don't know why you are still not employed.

The economy is so much better now then when Bush left. It's not that way EVERYWHERE in the country...but it will be within the next four years - regardless of who is President. And, it is to Obama's credit that it will happen.

Debt doesn't matter. That has been proven over and over again in our history. Even Reagan ignored the debt after he beat Carter. The debt has increased so much because the economy collapsed. As the economy picks up, the debt will decrease. Again, I think that's going to happen regardless of who is President. Neither of these guys is Ross Perot. The debt is not a winning, or losing, issue for either of them.

Now, IMO, I think this is Obama's election to lose now. He is going to have to do some REALLY bad to lose this. Romney can't do enough to win now....it's up to Obama to really screw up somewhere. I don't see that happening AT ALL.

Then why this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyLmru6no4U

Yea - only one side are hypocrites. The sooner everyone realizes that they are two sides of the same coin, the better off we'll be.

There is a bizarre (and very sophomoric) "rah-rah yay team" dynamic in our culture whereby if the guy presented as being on "Team D" with the donkey mascot holds a position the "Team R" fans boo, while if the guy presented as being on "Team R" with the elephant mascot does exactly the same thing, the "Team R" people cheer.

One could theorize that this is all a byproduct of our sports culture.

This culture breeds unabashed loyalty to "their team", no matter who is playing on the team. So, saying "I'm a Cowboys fan" or "I'm a Red Wings fan" or "I'm a Knicks fan" is quite literally the same thing mentally as "I'm a Republican." or "I'm a Democrat". It doesn't matter who the players are, and players get moved around and traded. It doesn't matter if a player gets accused of rape, or beating his girlfriend or dog-killing. So long as he is presented as being on "my team", all is forgiven and we root for "our team." Most importantly, it doesn't matter how BAD a team is. You are still expected to root for "your team" no matter how awful they are.

[Memorex]

I really think this narrative that says if you don't believe something, you must be an idiot is dangerous.