President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[steveo777]

Here is what a respected insurance agent in our area, who has been in business here over 30 years, posted on his FB page this morning:

Just ran a health exchange rate,for a 61 year old man,who makes $39,000 a year.His rate is $809/mo.,but he will get a tax credit of $500/mo.,so his cost is $309/mo.It is great,for him,but tell me how we can afford to give millions of people $6,000/yr.,and not go broke?

[Rick]

Walmart employs somewhere between 1.5 and 2 million people in this country alone. Where in the job market are this many people going to find better paying jobs? Those jobs just aren't there. The unemployment rate is high enough to tell you that. People are already having to work 2 jobs just to make ends meet, and that hurts the unemployed as well. 1 person doing 2 jobs equals one less job for someone looking for work. I think raising the minimum wage to $10.00 an hour would help substantially.

The writer of this article thinks $15 is doable.

http://www.nationofchange.org/job-loss- ... 1378995201

Job Loss at $15 an Hour: Real Problem or Big Whopper?

The fast food industry has put its lobbyists into hyper-drive. Their concern is the growing public support for striking workers at the major chains who are demanding $15 an hour. The lobbying groups argue that this sort of pay hike would inevitably backfire, leading to job loss and higher unemployment.

I’ve taken a special interest in this argument since I have apparently become a prop in their efforts, being cited as an economist who agrees that there would be job loss from a sudden increase in wages in the industry to $15 an hour. Undoubtedly there would be somewhat fewer jobs in the industry if wages doubled for low-end workers, but to seriously assess the merits of the policy we need to do a bit more arithmetic.

First it is necessary to get some context. There is currently a debate in Congress over proposals to raise the minimum wage to $10.10 an hour. This is roughly the wage that would be needed to bring the purchasing power of the minimum wage back to the level of the late 1960s. In other words, if workers in the fast food industry got $10.10 an hour, they would be able to buy as much with this money as their parents did working for the minimum wage 45 years ago.

That would be a big improvement over today’s minimum wage of $7.25 an hour. However, at $10 an hour workers would be seeing none of the benefits of the nation’s economic growth over the last four and half decades. If the wage of minimum wage workers had kept pace with the economy’s productivity growth over this period, it would be almost $18 an hour today.

This means if everyone had shared equally in the gains from technology and increased education of the workforce, including the minimum wage workforce, workers at fast-food restaurants would be getting $18 an hour right now. In this context, $15 an hour hardly seems like an outlandish demand.

Costs will rise

Suppose that restaurants were to grant this demand and raise their wages to $15 an hour tomorrow. A study from 2011 found that raising wages at big box stores to $12 an hour would raise their labor costs by around 10 percent. Taking wages to $15 an hour would imply a larger increase in an industry with somewhat lower pay. Let’s say it would increase labor costs by one fourth, or 25 percent.

If labor costs are 30 percent of the total costs at fast food chains (the rest goes for the food, rent, utilities, and other costs), the pay hike to $15 an hour would mean raising costs by roughly 7.5 percent. This increase in costs would likely be met in part by some reduction in profits, which are currently at record highs, and presumably some cut in the pay of the CEOs and other top executives.

It is also likely to result in savings due to lower turnover. A recent study found that higher pay is associated with sharp reductions in turnover, which means lower costs for employers.

Given modest reductions in profits, pay for top executives, and savings on turnover, let’s say prices end up increasing by 5 percent. This means that a Big Mac that used to cost $4.00 will now cost $4.20. This will undoubtedly mean some reduction in sales.

Let’s assume sales fall by half this amount or 2.5 percent. If employment falls by the same amount, the low-wage workers in this story would face a world in which there are 2.5 percent fewer jobs in the fast-food sector, but their pay would be twice as high when they are working.

Cascading effects

There are two other important points that must be kept in mind. Workers are pushing for a $15 an hour wage as part of a collective bargaining agreement, not a minimum wage law. Some employers will be better situated to meet this demand than others. Presumably the ones that can more easily absorb this cost will be the ones who will actually agree to pay workers $15 an hour.

The other point is that a full-time worker who sees her pay go from $7.25 an hour to $15 an hour will have another $15,000 to spend each year. This money may go to hire childcare workers for her children, home health care workers for parents, or be spent in thousands of other ways. Higher pay in the fast-food industry might lead to an economy in which we have fewer people working in the fast-food industry but many more people working in other industries. On its face, that would not seem to be a problem.

[Boomchild]

Your right, the Supreme Court ruled that it was Constitutional. They ruled on the version of the bill as it was at that time. But since then, B.O. has changed it. Examples of this are, Delay of the employer mandate, exemptions given to some union organizations and Congressional Representatives having portions of their coverage paid for by tax payers.

Then have the Supreme Court rule on it again. They'll find it constitutional, and the GOP will once again throw a hissy fit because things didn't work out the way they wanted to.

Good idea. Have them present it to the Supreme Court with all the changes that have occurred not through Congressional approval. I wouldn't be so sure of the outcome once they see that it has been changed from the same rules apply to all to it excludes certain groups and Congress members. Still that does not answer the question of if this reform bill is so good for ALL AMERICANS, then why delay the employer mandate, exempt certain groups and subsidize Congress members from paying the same amount as the average citizen?

[Boomchild]

Nice, you care that its the "law of the land".. but you don't care that the Senate leader who ramrodded it admits they originally wanted single-payer.. and that this is just a "trojan horse" to get to that end... nice selective hearing ya got going on there...

And Obama didn't write this bill, and army of HC lawyers did..

And I said, way back before this thing was passed and you were "singin it's praises"... that all it was was a was money grab by the HC industry... but you knew that.. and support it anyways..

Speaking of mandated healthcare, a radio talk show was playing several clips recorded during B.O.'s first run for POTUS where he was attacking Hillary Clinton for wanting to implement mandated health care for everyone and his plan wouldn't. Which of course by now we know is a lie. The next to be uncovered is that this reform has been put into place to pave the way for a single payer system. Which is what B.O. and most politicians actually want but know very well you can't get it by openly stating that's what they actually want.

[Boomchild]

Here is one of the first "success" stories for Obamacare. A law student who was paying for his health coverage through a plan offered by his college, applied online yesterday for Obamacare. After entering his information the system told him that he qualified for Medicaid and now he does not have to pay a dime. So he went from paying his own way for coverage to being an additional cost to tax payers in his state. Yeah! Another person on entitlement.

[The_Noble_Cause]

So you('ve) work(ed) at Kmart AND Walmart? When are the Doritos going back on sale?

Not in a retail capacity, but yea, I have visited the break rooms of alot of different big box stores.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Nice, you care that its the "law of the land".. but you don't care that the Senate leader who ramrodded it admits they originally wanted single-payer..

Why should I care?
The public option was immediately dropped.
Expanding Medicare was never even considered.
And single payer advocates were routinely frogmarched out of Senate Hearing rooms.
If the administration and the Democratic kingmakers truly have an interest in single payer, they have a funny way of showing it.

and that this is just a "trojan horse" to get to that end... nice selective hearing ya got going on there...

OoOoOoh how scary. Ever stop and think that's what dear old Harry simply tells his rabid MoveOn.org base, as the insurance industry discreetly lines his re-election coffers? Wake up and smell the corporate takeover of American democracy and get a fucking clue.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Which is what B.O. and most politicians actually want but know very well you can't get it by openly stating that's what they actually want.

Absolutely! If Obama makes the mistake of proposing a single payer system, then the 50 million senior citizens already enrolled in such a program will realize they are communists and force themselves onto a slow boat back to Mother Russia. And then who would Wilford Brimley make commercials for? Boy, I tell ya, this country is dumb, dumb, dumb.

[steveo777]

So you('ve) work(ed) at Kmart AND Walmart? When are the Doritos going back on sale?

Not in a retail capacity, but yea, I have visited the break rooms of alot of different big box stores.

Janitor?

[The_Noble_Cause]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

[steveo777]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

Do you think I'm a freaking millionaire? Not every conservative is some rich white fucker with a Bentley.

[verslibre]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

Now wait a second, dude!

Wal-Mart is essentially an entry-level job, it starts out at minimum wage and you get some increases (and more, depending on how long you work there and how well you do). I may not make a lot, but I make enough as a full-time associate to get by. Yes, I can get a better job and maybe some schooling (which I am doing, by the way), but I don't demand more because I am pretty much replaceable. People need to be more motivated on bettering themselves by going to school or learning a trade, instead of getting minimum wage jobs and then complaining because it doesn't pay enough or does not have any kind of benefits

Come back to us after you have your degree, 30K in student loans, and still can't find a job. You sound fairly naive.

[slucero]

Nice, you care that its the "law of the land".. but you don't care that the Senate leader who ramrodded it admits they originally wanted single-payer..

Why should I care?
The public option was immediately dropped.
Expanding Medicare was never even considered.
And single payer advocates were routinely frogmarched out of Senate Hearing rooms.
If the administration and the Democratic kingmakers truly have an interest in single payer, they have a funny way of showing it.

That would be because Reid said they dropped it... you would have read that... had you read the article... but you don't read do ya.. since you are so pedantically omniscient.

and that this is just a "trojan horse" to get to that end... nice selective hearing ya got going on there...

OoOoOoh how scary. Ever stop and think that's what dear old Harry simply tells his rabid MoveOn.org base, as the insurance industry discreetly lines his re-election coffers? Wake up and smell the corporate takeover of American democracy and get a fucking clue.

No because the HC industry donors are listed UN-discreetly here.. https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians ... cycle=2010 ...and they aren't a significant % of his donor base.. no more than any other Democrat or Republicans..

And here's a "clue" for you: America never was a democracy.... had you passed Civics you'd know that..

[Boomchild]

Which is what B.O. and most politicians actually want but know very well you can't get it by openly stating that's what they actually want.

Absolutely! If Obama makes the mistake of proposing a single payer system, then the 50 million senior citizens already enrolled in such a program will realize they are communists and force themselves onto a slow boat back to Mother Russia. And then who would Wilford Brimley make commercials for? Boy, I tell ya, this country is dumb, dumb, dumb.

So enlighten us. If the healthcare reform act is the best thing since sliced bread and it benefits every American, then why the delay of the employer mandate, exemptions for certain groups and subsidizing Congress members from paying the full actual cost of coverage based on the program as it is for everyone else?

[pinkfloyd1973]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

The majority of people who work with me at Wally World actually voted for Obama

[steveo777]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

The majority of people who work with me at Wally World actually voted for Obama

He's done a fine job of keeping people, like you, who work at Wally World sipping on his Kool Aid. There has never, in my 54 years on this planet, been a president that has divided a nation as much as this president. He might have just taken one of your garden axes and thrown it through the heart of America. Never before, so much hate, racism, poor treatment of minorities, class division, community disorganization, have I seen in any president, EVER!

[The Sushi Hunter]

So you('ve) work(ed) at Kmart AND Walmart? When are the Doritos going back on sale?

Not in a retail capacity, but yea, I have visited the break rooms of alot of different big box stores.

Janitor?

or...
an independent contractor who stocks the snack vending machines located in breakrooms.

or...
using the breakroom of a company as the meeting place to hold your presentation for selling something to employees such as health insurance, life insurance, investments, etc. etc. etc.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

The majority of people who work with me at Wally World actually voted for Obama

I'm very sorry to hear that.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Shots fired, commencing lockdown sequence. Someone's pissed.

[The Sushi Hunter]

"Officer and others injured". The very first OBOzocare claims.

[Memorex]

Shots fired, commencing lockdown sequence. Someone's pissed.

Maybe someone thought they were more essential than the government did.

[slucero]

The following are 36 facts which prove that almost everything is still running during this government shutdown...

1. According to U.S. Senator Rand Paul, 85 percent of all government activities are actually being funded during this "government shutdown".
   
   
2. Approximately 1,350,000 "essential" federal employees will continue to work during this "government shutdown".
   
   
3. Overall, 63 percent of the federal workforce will continue to work during this "government shutdown".
   
   
4. The U.S. Postal Service will continue to deliver our mail.
   
   
5. U.S. military personnel will remain on duty and will continue to get paid.
   
   
6. Social Security recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
7. Medicare recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
8. Medicaid recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
9. Food stamp recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
10. Those on unemployment will continue to get their benefits.
    
    
11. Federal retirees will continue to get their pensions.
    
    
12. The federal school lunch program has enough money to go through at least the end of this month.
    
    
13. Public schools all over the country will continue to stay open.
    
    
14. Almost all federal law enforcement officials will continue working.
    
    
15. The Federal Reserve will remain "completely functional".
    
    
16. The Supreme Court will continue to operate normally and federal courts have enough money to keep going for at least two weeks.
    
    
17. TSA employees will continue to molest travelers at our airports.
    
    
18. Air traffic controllers will continue to monitor traffic at our airports.
    
    
19. Hopelessly outmanned border patrol agents will continue to try to stem the tide of illegal immigration.
    
    
20. Visas and passports will continue to be issued by the State Department.
    
    
21. The Veterans Administration will continue to offer substandard medical services, and it will be able to continue processing benefit payments at least for now.
    
    
22. The Obama administration apparently has plenty of money to spend on closing open-air memorials that are usually open to the public 24 hours a day.
    
    
23. The Department of Defense announced the awarding of 94 new contracts worth a combined total of more than 5 billion dollars on September 30th - the day right before the "government shutdown".
    
    
24. The "government shutdown" has not prevented the new two billion dollar NSA spy center from opening up.
    
    
25. Federal prisons will continue to operate normally.
    
    
26. Amtrak trains will continue to run.
    
    
27. The Patent and Trademark Office will be open.
    
    #28 The Consumer Product Safety Commission will continue to issue product recalls if the products "create an immediate threat to the safety of human life".
    
    
28. The National Weather Service and the National Hurricane Center will continue to track weather patterns.
    
    
29. If the federal government needs to respond to a natural disaster, this "shutdown" will not affect that.
    
    
30. NASA will continue to support the Mars Rover and the two American astronauts up on the International Space Station.
    
    
31. All city employees of the D.C. government have been deemed "essential" and will continue to go to work.
    
    
32. Even though the Obamacare exchanges are not working properly, people will still be able to access them.
    
    
33. The IRS will continue to collect taxes, but it will be suspending punitive audits of conservative organizations.
    
    
34. Barack Obama will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".
    
    
35. The U.S. Congress will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".

[pinkfloyd1973]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

The majority of people who work with me at Wally World actually voted for Obama

He's done a fine job of keeping people, like you, who work at Wally World sipping on his Kool Aid. There has never, in my 54 years on this planet, been a president that has divided a nation as much as this president. He might have just taken one of your garden axes and thrown it through the heart of America. Never before, so much hate, racism, poor treatment of minorities, class division, community disorganization, have I seen in any president, EVER!

I didn't vote for him

[The_Noble_Cause]

Neither janitor or cashier, but keep it up. It's good to see how disdainful Conservatives truly are of the menial wage worker, which makes up the majority of the American workforce.

Now wait a second, dude!

Wal-Mart is essentially an entry-level job, it starts out at minimum wage and you get some increases (and more, depending on how long you work there and how well you do). I may not make a lot, but I make enough as a full-time associate to get by. Yes, I can get a better job and maybe some schooling (which I am doing, by the way), but I don't demand more because I am pretty much replaceable. People need to be more motivated on bettering themselves by going to school or learning a trade, instead of getting minimum wage jobs and then complaining because it doesn't pay enough or does not have any kind of benefits

Come back to us after you have your degree, 30K in student loans, and still can't find a job. You sound fairly naive.

Point being?

[The_Noble_Cause]

So enlighten us. If the healthcare reform act is the best thing since sliced bread and it benefits every American,

When did I say this?

then why the delay of the employer mandate, exemptions for certain groups and subsidizing Congress members from paying the full actual cost of coverage based on the program as it is for everyone else?

And as I said earlier, the original Soc. Security Act didn't include black people. You're talking about the biggest addition to the nation's safety net in 50 years. Why would anyone expect it to be implemented seamlessly? These things take tweaking.

[verslibre]

Point being?

You're mocking a menial wage worker.

[Boomchild]

The following are 36 facts which prove that almost everything is still running during this government shutdown...

1. According to U.S. Senator Rand Paul, 85 percent of all government activities are actually being funded during this "government shutdown".
   
   
2. Approximately 1,350,000 "essential" federal employees will continue to work during this "government shutdown".
   
   
   
   
3. Overall, 63 percent of the federal workforce will continue to work during this "government shutdown".
   
   
4. The U.S. Postal Service will continue to deliver our mail.
   
   
5. U.S. military personnel will remain on duty and will continue to get paid.
   
   
6. Social Security recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
7. Medicare recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
8. Medicaid recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
9. Food stamp recipients will continue to get their benefits.
   
   
10. Those on unemployment will continue to get their benefits.
    
    
11. Federal retirees will continue to get their pensions.
    
    
12. The federal school lunch program has enough money to go through at least the end of this month.
    
    
13. Public schools all over the country will continue to stay open.
    
    
14. Almost all federal law enforcement officials will continue working.
    
    
15. The Federal Reserve will remain "completely functional".
    
    
16. The Supreme Court will continue to operate normally and federal courts have enough money to keep going for at least two weeks.
    
    
17. TSA employees will continue to molest travelers at our airports.
    
    
18. Air traffic controllers will continue to monitor traffic at our airports.
    
    
19. Hopelessly outmanned border patrol agents will continue to try to stem the tide of illegal immigration.
    
    
20. Visas and passports will continue to be issued by the State Department.
    
    
21. The Veterans Administration will continue to offer substandard medical services, and it will be able to continue processing benefit payments at least for now.
    
    
22. The Obama administration apparently has plenty of money to spend on closing open-air memorials that are usually open to the public 24 hours a day.
    
    
23. The Department of Defense announced the awarding of 94 new contracts worth a combined total of more than 5 billion dollars on September 30th - the day right before the "government shutdown".
    
    
24. The "government shutdown" has not prevented the new two billion dollar NSA spy center from opening up.
    
    
25. Federal prisons will continue to operate normally.
    
    
26. Amtrak trains will continue to run.
    
    
27. The Patent and Trademark Office will be open.
    
    #28 The Consumer Product Safety Commission will continue to issue product recalls if the products "create an immediate threat to the safety of human life".
    
    
28. The National Weather Service and the National Hurricane Center will continue to track weather patterns.
    
    
29. If the federal government needs to respond to a natural disaster, this "shutdown" will not affect that.
    
    
30. NASA will continue to support the Mars Rover and the two American astronauts up on the International Space Station.
    
    
31. All city employees of the D.C. government have been deemed "essential" and will continue to go to work.
    
    
32. Even though the Obamacare exchanges are not working properly, people will still be able to access them.
    
    
33. The IRS will continue to collect taxes, but it will be suspending punitive audits of conservative organizations.
    
    
34. Barack Obama will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".
    
    
35. The U.S. Congress will continue to get paid for the full duration of this "shutdown".

So in a nut shell, the government's definition of the word "shutdown" is far different from anyone else not in government.

[Boomchild]

So enlighten us. If the healthcare reform act is the best thing since sliced bread and it benefits every American,

When did I say this?

then why the delay of the employer mandate, exemptions for certain groups and subsidizing Congress members from paying the full actual cost of coverage based on the program as it is for everyone else?

And as I said earlier, the original Soc. Security Act didn't include black people. You're talking about the biggest addition to the nation's safety net in 50 years. Why would anyone expect it to be implemented seamlessly? These things take tweaking.

Your stance seems to have been that the Republicans or anyone objecting to this health care reform should just get over it because the Supreme Court ruled on it and that is now "the law of the land". Based on that stance it appears that you don't have a problem with it. I don't think anyone thinks that anything the government implements goes seamlessly. But, it seems you are trying to explain big issues as "tweaking". Again, if it will be good for all Americans then why exclude certain groups from the law and not have Congress members pay for all of their coverage like the government is expecting all Americans to do? That's not "tweaking" that's favoritism.

[steveo777]

So enlighten us. If the healthcare reform act is the best thing since sliced bread and it benefits every American,

When did I say this?

then why the delay of the employer mandate, exemptions for certain groups and subsidizing Congress members from paying the full actual cost of coverage based on the program as it is for everyone else?

And as I said earlier, the original Soc. Security Act didn't include black people. You're talking about the biggest addition to the nation's safety net in 50 years. Why would anyone expect it to be implemented seamlessly? These things take tweaking.

The 4th entitlement is about to bring our economy to it's knees. The tax credit burden, alone, attached to this is unsustainable. You come back to this thread in three years when we are staring at a 100 trillion dollar deficit. Liberals have no concept of fiscal responsibility.....never have. How many millions of people can you give a $4000 - $6000 tax credit to, for buying into a shit program, and not borrow ourselves into oblivian? The next big fight in congress, guaranteed, is going to be the debt ceiling. If you think what's going on now is ugly, it's about to get ridiculously worse. You will be glad we have Republicans who won't allow this adminstration to "detroit" the whole country. There is just too much n@gger mentality going on right now, from all ethnicities. The government is not our pimp, you stupid Ho's. They work for us, not the other way around!

George Carlin said it best!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rh6qqsmxNs

[Memorex]

Women were not allowed to vote. Blacks were not allowed to vote. Hell, blacks were not allowed to be full people. At the time, 100% constitutional. So constitutional in fact, a simple law or supreme court ruling could not change that fact. We had to add amendments.

Sometimes really shitty things, though constitutional, should be changed. The health care law, with all it's good and bad points and regulations, needs a lot of changing. There is nothing wrong with that discussion. There is nothing wrong with a group of congressional member fighting for what their constituents sent them there for. The law is the least popular it has ever been and so if this fight wasn't going on, it would be malpractice on the part of congress.

Both sides fight very hard for the things they want. This is just another. People should stop the name calling and compromise like we want. This country has given leadership to both parties for this very reason. It's not accidental.