President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:04 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Those are EXAMPLES, SFB's. An EXAMPLE of a Conservative SOURCE. Keep going, you might figure it out yet, but I doubt it.

Well, if you want to get technical, Bill O'Reilly claims to be "a traditionalist", not a conservative. And Beck, well, Beck used to be a card carrying Republican, now claims to be a Libertarian, but these days seems to be in full blown Willy Wonka on acid mode (see image). Anyway, none of these lightweight TV blowhards have anything to do with Barton being a liar and having his own Christian publishing house recall his book off of store shelves. Look at all the bandwidth you wasted. I said five pages back that Barton was NOT a leading historian and you've yet to add anything to the conversation to prove otherwise. Just like the WMD argument. You talk in circles.

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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:41 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:http://humanevents.com/2014/08/25/the-yin-and-yang-of-climate-change/?utm_source=iacfbp&utm_medium=fbpage&utm_campaign=IAC


The "pause" is not true. The simple truth is if you ignore the warming of the oceans, you are ignoring 2/3 of the planet. it is a bit too convenient for you and others deniers to ignore to try to make "point". This is what the very definition of "cherry picking" facts to prove your OPINION...instead of allowing ALL of the facts to show you the truth.

This article read like a comedy routine...an old and tired one. Michael Crichton is the first person to compare things like Climate Change to religion, over 10yrs ago. I have to wonder what he would have thought now, and who the real religious zealots are:

www.pe.tamu.edu/DL_Program/graduate_sem ... talism.pdf

In fact, I remember a few years ago, I started a thread here saying that modern day Conservativism is treated like a religion...after reading the above link. It still seems to fit VERY well.

The other bit is stealing Ann Coulter's whining about the phrase "climate change deniers" and how it somehow realtes to holocaust deniers. Too bad. Both are facts. If that is where you all want to go, it's your decision to make that comparison.

The truth is articles like this are trying to go about things the wrong way. if you can't look at ALL of the facts before you come up with your theory, then you are doomed from the start. This article is trying to look at 1/3 of the climate and come up with a theory to explain it. Sorry, that's not how things work.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:01 am

Fact Finder wrote:This sums it up brilliantly....


Too hot, blame Global Warming. Too cold, blame Global Warming. 19 years of non rising temperatures, blame Global Warming. 43% rise in Arctic Sea Ice, blame Global Warming. Couple of Hurricanes, blame Global Warming. Too much rain, yep, blame Global Warming. Not enough rain, yep again, Global Warming. Hell, Global Warming is the Duct Tape of weather.......



:lol: :lol:


Yep, it sums up how ignorant conservatives are.

Like I said, 19yrs of "non-rising temperatures" is wrong...unless you are cherry picking.

"Arctic sea ice" is not rising...Antarctic Sea Ice is...and is probably due to the melting of the inland ice due to climate change.

The rest of that post is about the weather of the moment...which has nothing to do with Climate Change.

"Global Warming is the duct tape of weather." Only if you are a conservative ass who can't look past the weather outside the window. Climate change is real, it is happening. It's has been happening for years. "Weather" you want to or not, you have to live with it.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:24 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:O'Riley claims to be a Conservative Libertarian.

Since when? You don’t have to be the proud owner of a “No Spin Zone” coffee mug, door mat, life alert bracelet, motorized stair lift, or walk-in bathtub (or whatever other cheap crap Bill-o is hawking these days) to know this is a LIE. As someone who has watched O’Reilly on and off over the years, I have heard him refer to himself as both an independent and a traditionalist. Never a “libertarian conservative.” Prove it. As recently as a June 2014 interview, O’Reilly said that he is “an independent” politically. The link is below. So one sentence into your post and already you’re provably factually WRONG. I can only assume you find the sensation of lies flying straight out of your ass like evil winged Oz monkeys to be orgasmic.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... agues.html

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Yes, Beck does Comedy, nice cherry pick for a photo.

EXCEPT Beck wasn't doing comedy in this photo. He was doing a serious monologue encouraging support for a boy who likes My Litte Pony (I shit you not). So you're wrong again. See link below. However, I will openly admit that sometimes I turn on Beck and laugh so hard that I need Stanley Steemer to help remove nutty brown Rorschach patterns off my recliner! Especially if it’s an episode where he cries like a little bitch, which is practically all the fucking time!

http://www.glennbeck.com/2014/03/17/sta ... c-student/

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:For being an idiot, as YOU say, Beck sure was able to do a number on ACORN…

I’m so thankful Beck targeted a powerful community action group like Acorn and left poor defenseless organizations like Lehman Brothers, NSA, Haliburton, and Alec alone. You Teabaggers really have your priorities straight. Next up – the professional librarians union will be taken down and exposed as indoctrinating America’s youths with liberal tracts like The Communist Cat in the Hat and Green Energy Eggs and Ham. :roll:
K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Loved his show where he proved many ties between Tides foundation, which is Soros, and Jarrett, Obama, Holder, and many of the trash you love so much.

Everything Beck revealed was already in the public domain or stolen from Alex Jones. Throw in some cheap stagecraft including a chalkboard, pipe, a professorial elbow patch sweater and there ya go. Little wonder that Swamp People rejects like you were convinced that you were experiencing an Ivy League academic experience and picking up where your GED classes left off. By the end of his Fox run, Roger Ailes kicked him off the network and Beck has recently apologized for saying “stupid things” while at Fox. Boy, some legacy, huh?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... -fox-news/

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:I showed WMD's that were found in Iraq, and they were. They just didn't meet YOUR standards.

There’s no such thing as a conservative truth or a liberal truth. There are lies and then there are facts. We did not go to war for small caches of chemical weapons. Every country has those. The case was made that Saddam was working on an advanced nuclear weapons program. Bush later admitted in his own autobiography that we did not find them. You are starting to sound like the team of “researchers” on that reality show, Finding Bigfoot. Week after week, they come soo close to proving Mr. Foot’s existence, only to come up totally empty. At this point, you have better odds of spotting Sasquatch drinking frappe at your local Starbucks than locating Saddam’s imaginary mushroom cloud doomsday device.
K.C.Journey Fan wrote: I used Conservative sourced links to counter Monker...

Uh, you posted ONE press release. That’s not even a news source. It's a marketing tool. Get a grip.
K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Again you assume I am a Bush fan. If you could read, you'd be able to see I said many times, I haven't been a fan of any of the last four Presidents.

Blah blah blah. The only reason you dislike Bush is because he refuses to join your fact-free parallel universe and continues to deny that WMDs were found. Good for him. I’m glad that an ex-leader of the free world and handler of the nuclear football kept his small pinkie toe in reality. Unlike you, on the other hand. You’re clearly more fried than Keith Richards eating a ten piece bucket of KFC. Fuck off already.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:24 pm

Fact Finder wrote:President Obama authorizes deployment of 350 additional US troops to protect diplomatic facilities, personnel in Baghdad, Iraq - @PressSec


End of alert


More: 350 additional US troops deployed to Baghdad, Iraq, will not serve combat role, White House says - @PressSec





Save
Iraq crisis 
16m

White House Press Secretary: 'The President has made clear his commitment to doing whatever is required to provide the necessary security for US personnel and facilities around the world. The request he approved today will allow some previously deployed military personnel to depart Iraq, while at the same time providing a more robust, sustainable security force for our personnel and facilities in Baghdad'


End of alert


So, is B.O. still going around telling people that "the world is a more peaceful now" and " the terrorists are beaten back"?

The other thing that get s me is that we are supposed to be the best nation in the world when it comes to defending and protecting itself but, it seems we can't even contain our own southern border.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:47 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:TNC, Bush never said we were going into Iraq for weapons of mass destruction alone, another liberal spin and lie, like your "none were found. Yes, some were found. Little stash or not, they were found. Thank you for admitting that.


You are either joking or are a complete idiot.

The entire original excuse was inspectors not being allowed to do their job and Iraq breaking UN resolutions. Do you not even remember Colin Powel presenting all of that "evidence" to the UN?

Was it the ONLY excuse? NO. But, it was a HUGE part of the reasoning....a "we can't let a psycho like Saddam have weapons of mass destruction." Even though it was the first Bush who did NOTHING when Saddam gassed the Kurds and used gas against Iran. When Saddam was acting in our interest, he could have WMD, hell we probably sold him the gas.

Then we implied Iraq was supporting terrorism, which was NOT true. The Bush administration allowed the American public to believe Iraq was somehow connected to 9/11. Which is also NOT TRUE. ALL of the reasoning to justify the Iraq war was built on bad intel and lies by the administration, and allowing the American public to believe things which they knew were not true.

Argue it all you want but Iraq NEVER posed a direct threat to the US. The Bush administration was simply making excuses. It was a war that should have never happen - a bigger mistake than Vietnam, IMO.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:03 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Your the idiot Monker. you tell me I'm wrong, then prove my point. It was decided under Clinton that Saddam had to go. He was flipping off the UN, violating air space restrictions,ect. Weapons were another reason given, he got them the hell out of there, and they are being found in Syria. Bush just didn't believe in bombing Asprin factories and scaring the hell out of A security gaurd with multi million dollar rockets. If liberals could Govern as good as they can spin and bullshit, theyed be something.


My God, you are nothing but a pathetic whiny little kid arguing the same bullshit over and over again.

The prelude to the Iraq war was WMD. Period. THAT is why we went there.

I sat on Journey's BT Watercooler forum and argued for months that only an idiot would believe Saddam had the brain power to create a nuclear weapon. He didn't. His ability to create poison gas ended during Desert Storm. The gas that you insist is relevant is left over from the Iran/Iraq war and is less then useless, and has been for decades. Please get a brain transplant with somebody who has a bit more brainpower...at least a 16yr old. This isn't that complicated.

AFTER the invasion and it was OBVIOUS WMD was not going to be found THEN they started making up all these other excuses...it was terrorism. It was 9/11. blah, blah, blah. A bunch of fucking chicken-hawk liars and bullshitters.

Now you are blaming Clinton wanting a regime change. We wanted a regime change in Cuba for DECADES. Why didn't W invade Cuba? They actually posed more of a threat to the US than Iraq. It's because idiots like you need to pass the responsibility for such a dumb-ass war onto somebody else. Republicans and conservatives (most) WANTED this war. YOU own it...not Clinton. Maybe after your balls drop you will be man enough to take responsibility for a war conservatives and Republicans OWN.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby trekman » Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:06 am

Are Obama and his people really so inept or incapable of performing their jobs that they actually put America in Harms Way? Isnt it an Administration's responsibility to make some kind of attempt to foresee possible coming threats, analize them and prepare somehow to protect the USA? Isnt that why they have an Intelligence community to keep them updated on threats? With so much chaos going on in the middle east, how could they not see that the evil there would be coming after us, again? Do they really, Really hate what America is/was that they would allow attacks? Do they really want to change America so bad they would wait until its too late to stop an attack? :(

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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:20 pm

trekman wrote:Are Obama and his people really so inept or incapable of performing their jobs that they actually put America in Harms Way?


The way they handled the attack on the embassy in Benghazi gives us a clue.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby steveo777 » Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:30 pm

Boomchild wrote:
trekman wrote:Are Obama and his people really so inept or incapable of performing their jobs that they actually put America in Harms Way?


The way they handled the attack on the embassy in Benghazi gives us a clue.


The way the Islamic terrorists are partying at our empty embassy in Libya, filming themselves swimming in our pool, should also give us a clue that this president is absent from his post.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:51 pm

So how do the citizens in countries allied with the U.S. feel about ISIS?

"One in six French citizens sympathises with the Islamist militant group ISIS, also known as Islamic State, a poll released this week found."

http://www.newsweek.com/16-french-citiz ... nds-266795

Wonder if any of those that sympathize with ISIS are in positions of running these allied countries?
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:58 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Shit for brains, quit putting words in my mouth. I never said anything about nuclear weapons. I did say WMD's were not the only reason Bush went into Iraq, nor did I ever say what the main reason was. I only said what Saddam was doing at the time, for years, that violated the Un treatys.Clinton did have Saddam on his radar and kicked the can like a good little liberal. As far as Republicans wanting the war, I remember Democrats voting 100% for it on the same intel Bush had. Intel does not come from cheeny. Maybe Democrats are that stupid. I'm not TNC.going to let you put words in my mouth and twist things around. Go fuck yourself. Your almost as much of a stupid asshole as


Ah, poor baby. I should have known you are too immature to know that nuclear weapons ARE WMD. So sad.

The only reason given PRIOR to Iraq war was potential nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. You probably were not alive back then to know that.

Every President since Kennedy "kicked the can" on Castro, too. When you get into high school, you should learn that.

I don't know who "cheeny" is...but it's OK if you have imaginary friends. You'll eventually grow out of it. But, the intel that started the Iraq war came from a biased idiot whoose name I don't remember...but he was obviously not the most credible person to rely on. The Democrats are not "stupid". They are pussies who were afraid to stand up and tell the President how wrong he was. The best they could do was, "Well, I don't believe in this war but at this time we need to stand together as a country." Or, other bullshit like that. Even if they enthusiastically voted for it, W did not ask for nor did he need, the approval of congress - it was HIS and the Republicans war. YOU own it.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby RedWingFan » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:03 pm

I worked at this same McDonald's during my senior year in high school. Left that job for a better job by getting an education in engineering. These Obama voters don't think they need to improve themselves to improve their income. Just raise hell and demand it like good little democrats. Probably slept through or didn't choose to go to their "free" public education, now they want us to pay $6 for a Big Mac? Screw you and screw the SEIU that is financing this crap.

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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:34 pm

RedWingFan wrote:I worked at this same McDonald's during my senior year in high school. Left that job for a better job by getting an education in engineering. These Obama voters don't think they need to improve themselves to improve their income. Just raise hell and demand it like good little democrats. Probably slept through or didn't choose to go to their "free" public education, now they want us to pay $6 for a Big Mac? Screw you and screw the SEIU that is financing this crap.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.s ... cart_river


This is just the first step in a long range plan. What the government would really like to do is be able to categorize the pay level for each and every job position out there. So in effect your compensation won't be based on your own personal merit, work ethic or actual job performance.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:36 am

Boomchild wrote:
RedWingFan wrote:I worked at this same McDonald's during my senior year in high school. Left that job for a better job by getting an education in engineering. These Obama voters don't think they need to improve themselves to improve their income. Just raise hell and demand it like good little democrats. Probably slept through or didn't choose to go to their "free" public education, now they want us to pay $6 for a Big Mac? Screw you and screw the SEIU that is financing this crap.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.s ... cart_river


This is just the first step in a long range plan. What the government would really like to do is be able to categorize the pay level for each and every job position out there. So in effect your compensation won't be based on your own personal merit, work ethic or actual job performance.


That is so ridiculous...Nothing but political scare tactics to trip the easily paranoid to believe crazy shit.

And, yeah, you should pay $6 for a Big Mac. If people don't want to pay it, they won't buy it. Funny how those who consider themselves so capitalist do not trust the market adjust properly and believe crazy shit instead.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby steveo777 » Sat Sep 06, 2014 11:10 am

Monker wrote:
Boomchild wrote:
RedWingFan wrote:I worked at this same McDonald's during my senior year in high school. Left that job for a better job by getting an education in engineering. These Obama voters don't think they need to improve themselves to improve their income. Just raise hell and demand it like good little democrats. Probably slept through or didn't choose to go to their "free" public education, now they want us to pay $6 for a Big Mac? Screw you and screw the SEIU that is financing this crap.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.s ... cart_river


This is just the first step in a long range plan. What the government would really like to do is be able to categorize the pay level for each and every job position out there. So in effect your compensation won't be based on your own personal merit, work ethic or actual job performance.


That is so ridiculous...Nothing but political scare tactics to trip the easily paranoid to believe crazy shit.

And, yeah, you should pay $6 for a Big Mac. If people don't want to pay it, they won't buy it. Funny how those who consider themselves so capitalist do not trust the market adjust properly and believe crazy shit instead.


I don't eat that shit anyway, so the prices at McD's won't affect me. That said, what happens when the people who actually possess some skill, who were earning $15 per hour already, revolt and feel they should get a proportionate raise? You can't double wages, then expect everyone else to sit still. There is going to be a domino effect. It's not going to just impact fast food prices. Anyone thinking about this?
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Sat Sep 06, 2014 2:58 pm

Monker wrote:
That is so ridiculous...Nothing but political scare tactics to trip the easily paranoid to believe crazy shit.

And, yeah, you should pay $6 for a Big Mac. If people don't want to pay it, they won't buy it. Funny how those who consider themselves so capitalist do not trust the market adjust properly and believe crazy shit instead.


While being a senator B.O. co sponsored a bill to enact a comparable worth law. In which the Federal Government and not the marketplace would determine the worth of each job. The Federal Government would compare unrelated jobs and if under the FG view they find those unrelated jobs to be comparable in worth then those jobs must be paid the same.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Sun Sep 07, 2014 9:44 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:
Fact Finder wrote:Image


You know what FF? When they can do it, they are going to do it anyway. Their employees might as well get what they can while they can. $15.00 per hour didn't cause it. It's just another way to short change the worker and make millions for those that have millions. Both Trickle Down and Socialism share the same flaw, human greed.I wish I could come up with the answer. It's getting to where education isn't the answer either. The job market is flooded. Too many workers, too little jobs.


Actually it's the consumer that drives it more then the companies being "greedy". Consumers have demanded lower and lower prices for goods and services. This has more effect on this issue then anything else. Also no matter what, advancements in technology will replace people with jobs that require little to no skills.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Sun Sep 07, 2014 9:17 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:That's interesting, but the reality is, prices are going up, and wages are going down. It just doesn't seem like the old game is still working. The 1% is making out better then ever while the middle class is going away.


We are still importing goods from China and other countries that are able to produce cheap products with slave labor wages. Even though that prices may be on the rise that does not change the attitude of the consumer which is getting products and services at the cheapest price possible. Also, the value of the dollar is lowering at the same time. The consumer has either not given thought to how that effects the wages of those making or providing said products or services or just doesn't care.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby No Surprize » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:36 pm

I don't eat that shit anyway, so the prices at McD's won't affect me. That said, what happens when the people who actually possess some skill, who were earning $15 per hour already, revolt and feel they should get a proportionate raise? You can't double wages, then expect everyone else to sit still. There is going to be a domino effect. It's not going to just impact fast food prices. Anyone thinking about this?

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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:43 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Which means it's time for that 1% which I always defended to start sharing the love. Wouldn't it be nice if a CEO could only make 1,000 to 1 over his lowest paid employee? Then every time he got a raise, so did everyone else. When they TOOK our comm's with the swipe of a pen and a 48 hour notice, I lost $9.00 per hour. It really made me happy to see the millionaires get 50% pay increases this year. I'm a Conservative. always have been, always will board be, but it's time to admit, trickle down was trickle on. Our Board of Directors owns the lions share of stock, as do most companies board of directors . When our stock is low, they buy the hell out of it. Then they drive us like slaves with threats of termination if we don't get results. When the stock goes up, they sell it off. The company is nothing but a money whore to them. I'm sorry guys, but my rose colored glasses are off on this one. The employee can GF himself. That attitude is not good for the country, and it shows. When the 1% is done sucking the life out of America, they will just take the money and move. The Global Economy was for suckers.


The issue I have with this viewpoint is it paints a picture that those running the company did nothing to earn their salaries and benefits. That they didn't get there by getting an education, working hard and taking high risks. That they should be paid less simply because someone is not happy with how they are being compensated. Sometimes I get the impression that this is similar to Hitler blaming the Jewish people for society's ills. In this case the scapegoat is the wealthy. The funny thing I have found over the years while managing people is no matter if the company was doing well or doing poorly they felt they were not being paid as much as they felt they were worth. Here it seems to me that you feel burned by your employer. I hope that you have considered looking elsewhere for employment that you feel compensates you better or doing something that would give you the advantage of obtaining a job that comes with a higher pay level.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Tue Sep 09, 2014 3:05 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:You would think looking somewhere else would be the answer, but other companies have done the same and driven wages down. You keep giving me text books, and I keep giving you reality. Education is no longer the answer either. Ask all the kids that got out to find they can't get paid enough to pay off their debt. What makes you think a CEO should cut the pay of workers to stuff it in his, and his buddies pockets? Like I said, a CEO should make 1,000 times per hour what the lowest employee makes. Every week I watch a vetran employee get fired for some trumped up reason so he can be replaced with a $8.00 per hour newbie. The customers hate them because they are new and they want someone that knows something. If you think employees should continue to get screwed, fine. That's exactly why liberals will keep coming back. I don't think McDonald workers are worth $15.00. maybe in New York or Chicago, but they do work their butts off.

There is a McDonalds down the street from my house. In the 1990's, they were offering $12.00 per and a $300.00 sign on bonus because they couldn't get help. They stayed open just fine with $12.00 help. Enter the Mexican invation, suddenly it's $7.25 per and no sign on, and prices went up, but that was planned ahead I'm sure. Some of these companies can stop the $200,000,000,.00 per year pay checks to one person and send some of it down.


You and I do have different a viewpoint on this subject. Personally, I take the viewpoint that the one person that controls what I earn is me. I never felt I was at the mercy of someone else controlling it. When I reach a point where I am not earning what I need or want to earn I move on. It took a long time but I did it. I looked for the business that was right for me and worked very hard to prove myself to that business. Sure I started out with a position with meager wages but with time showed them my potential and worked my way up the ladder. So I went from a meager wage job to a very well compensated job. So it's not only education or more of it that increases or provides the opportunity to better earnings. There will always be jobs out there that offer low wages and a path to nowhere. Such as the jobs at McDonalds you cited above. But your talking about jobs that were never meant to be long term careers or designed for someone to support a whole family on. The minute someone subscribes to the mindset that their income or the ability to change it is not under their own control, they have already lost. It's not easy and it's not getting easier but it is possible. But, in my opinion the solution is not to look above and demand someone else fork over their earnings to someone else.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby slucero » Tue Sep 09, 2014 8:28 am

Boomchild wrote:
K.C.Journey Fan wrote:You would think looking somewhere else would be the answer, but other companies have done the same and driven wages down. You keep giving me text books, and I keep giving you reality. Education is no longer the answer either. Ask all the kids that got out to find they can't get paid enough to pay off their debt. What makes you think a CEO should cut the pay of workers to stuff it in his, and his buddies pockets? Like I said, a CEO should make 1,000 times per hour what the lowest employee makes. Every week I watch a vetran employee get fired for some trumped up reason so he can be replaced with a $8.00 per hour newbie. The customers hate them because they are new and they want someone that knows something. If you think employees should continue to get screwed, fine. That's exactly why liberals will keep coming back. I don't think McDonald workers are worth $15.00. maybe in New York or Chicago, but they do work their butts off.

There is a McDonalds down the street from my house. In the 1990's, they were offering $12.00 per and a $300.00 sign on bonus because they couldn't get help. They stayed open just fine with $12.00 help. Enter the Mexican invation, suddenly it's $7.25 per and no sign on, and prices went up, but that was planned ahead I'm sure. Some of these companies can stop the $200,000,000,.00 per year pay checks to one person and send some of it down.


You and I do have different a viewpoint on this subject. Personally, I take the viewpoint that the one person that controls what I earn is me. I never felt I was at the mercy of someone else controlling it. When I reach a point where I am not earning what I need or want to earn I move on. It took a long time but I did it. I looked for the business that was right for me and worked very hard to prove myself to that business. Sure I started out with a position with meager wages but with time showed them my potential and worked my way up the ladder. So I went from a meager wage job to a very well compensated job. So it's not only education or more of it that increases or provides the opportunity to better earnings. There will always be jobs out there that offer low wages and a path to nowhere. Such as the jobs at McDonalds you cited above. But your talking about jobs that were never meant to be long term careers or designed for someone to support a whole family on. The minute someone subscribes to the mindset that their income or the ability to change it is not under their own control, they have already lost. It's not easy and it's not getting easier but it is possible. But, in my opinion the solution is not to look above and demand someone else fork over their earnings to someone else.



Both of you are right ... but article below will illustrate the reality of the job market now...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-09-0 ... bor-market

In a few deft seconds, a “no jobs” nobody who apparently doesn’t actually have one himself, essentially explained the contents of the chart below to his silenced CNBC hosts. Over the course of 170 “jobs Fridays” since mid-2000, the latter have apparently never noticed the single most stunning fact embedded in the monthly BLS report. Namely, that outside of health and education there has not been one net new job created in the American economy since July 2000! Yes, not a single new jo - as in none, nein, nichts, nada, zip!
Image

Yes, we do have about 7.3 million more teachers, nurses, home health aides and bed-pan changers - meaning that the total job count in what I have termed the HES Complex (health, education and social services) now stands at 31.7 million compared to 24.4 million in early 2000 (see below). Moreover, since all work is noble - that applies not the least to the labors of those who educate our children and care for the sick.

The point here, however, is about economics, not social worth. And in the realm of economics, the notion implicit in “jobs Friday” - that all jobs are created equal - is simply a fatuous shibboleth.

In fact, the 107 million non-HES Complex jobs shown above can be divided into two categories - part time jobs and breadwinner jobs. Compared to breadwinner jobs which pay about $50,000 per year, the former pay at a rate of about $20,000 annualized, reflecting around 26 hours of work per week and hourly pay of about $14.

Stated differently, the bartender, waiter, bellhop, maid, shoe repair, retail clerk and temp positions reflected in the graph below represent 40% jobs from an economic value perspective. And from a societal angle, they provide no foundation whatsoever on which to support middle-class families and a thriving citizenry.
Image

By contrast, breadwinner jobs in manufacturing, mining, construction, FIRE, transportation and distribution, information technology, the white collar profession and business management do generate the means for at least a minimum standard of living. Unfortunately, the graph shows an awful truth that Steve Leisman and Mark Zandi, the Keynesian statist from Moody’s Economics (who advised John McCain in the 2008 campaign to fold his tent on the abominable Wall Street bailout), have never noticed. Namely, that the US economy has been losing breadwinner jobs at a rate of 18,000 per month for 14 years running.
Image

Taken together, these two charts leave nothing to the imagination. Since Bill Clinton’s last month in office there has been a 3 million or 5% shrinkage of breadwinner jobs. There is nothing like this in modern history, yet the Jobs Friday revelers have always been oblivious to that economically debilitating trend—a harsh reality which massively dwarfs the seasonally maladjusted, continuously revised, heavily imputed and guesstimated monthly noise that is the essence of Hampton Pearson’s summary.

Even when you look at the growth in part-time jobs outside the HES-Complex, the pattern has been volatile and tepid on a trend basis. During the “recovery” since the Great Recession ended in June 2009, for example, most of the gain has consisted of “born again jobs”. That is, two-thirds of the 3.7 million part-time job gains reported since June 2009 were first generated during the Greenspan housing bubble. Needless to say, they were then wiped-out during the Great Recession plunge—- only to be slowly recouped in the 61 months since then as “born again” jobs represented as new hires.

Stated differently, Bernanke boasted in February 2004 that the US economy had entered a period he was pleased to term “The Great Moderation”. But it didn’t exactly work out that way—since just four years later he claimed the nation’s economy stood at the gates of the Great Depression 2.0.

Bernanke’s lack of clairvoyance, however, is not the point here. At least by the lights of the monetary central planners in the Eccles Building, the 14 year since the turn of the century were certainly intended to represent a great moderation. That’s why twice during that period they flooded the financial markets with unprecedented liquidity—–a maneuver designed to flatten the cyclical bottom and ignite the rebound.

Yet what did it do for the non-HES labor market? It did not arrest the trend decline in breadwinner jobs in the slightest. And even in that bleak corner of the economy that I have labeled the part time economy there has been a net gain of just 21,000 per month over the past 14 and one-half years.

That bears repetition. During a decade and one-half, the US economy has managed to generate only 21,000 part-time jobs per month outside the HES Complex. So it might well be well and truly wondered how these people keep putting on their party hats month-after-month.

In the first place, even if you believe that prosperity can be sustained by the vaunted “shop until they drop” American consumer, the pattern shown above doesn’t get the job done by a long shot. The periodic rebirth of a modest quotient of part-time positions paying $20k per year will support robust consumption spending in the current GDP reports only at the expense of ballooning credit losses and over-time work for the repo man down the road.

Apart from this obvious non-starter, there are three specific facets of the American economy’s complete dependence on the HES Complex for job growth sector that are deeply troubling, but have perennially escaped the notice of the Jobs Friday commentariat.

First, nearly all of these jobs are “fiscally dependent” owing to direct government spending, loans and tax expenditures. At present, total government expenditures for Medicare and Medicaid, for example, amount to $1.2 trillion annually and account for well-more than 50% of health service delivery, but upwards of 90% in some areas that are jobs intensive. The 3.3 million jobs in nursing facilities, for example, are almost completely funded by Medicare and Medicaid.

Likewise, the number of home health care jobs has soared by 700k and nearly doubled since the year 2000, but this sector is also heavily dependent upon the two big government programs. At the same time, the tax expenditure each year for employer-based health coverage and individual tax credits and deductions is upwards of $200 billion, meaning absent these fiscal subventions underlying health care expenditures and employment gains would be far lower.

Even in the education sector where 13.6 million jobs were reported for August compared to 11.6 million in January 2000, 75% of this pick-up was in higher education, not K-12; and it goes without saying that the boom in higher education is the direct result of $1.2 trillion in student loans and $40 billion annually in direct grant programs financed entirely by Uncle Sam.

On the margin, all of this fabulous fiscal support for the HES Complex consists of borrowed money—-since if there actually were a balanced budget law that required today’s taxpayers to foot the cost of government rather than the unborn taxpayers of tomorrow, the first thing to be cut would be the giant subsidies being collected by the health and education cartels. In any event, governments are now bumping up against “peak debt”, meaning that the stupendous flow of fiscal resources to the HES Complex is beginning to abate sharply, resulting in a unmistakable slowing in the rate of so-called job creation.

During the Greenspan Boom between 2000 and 2007, for example, the monthly rate of job creation in the HES Complex was 51,000. During the Great Recession that slowed to 43,000 per month; and during the 61 months of recovery since then it has dropped further to just 28,000 per month. In short, the American jobs machine—-tentative as it has been for the past 14 years—-has essentially rested on a fiscal mirage that is now reaching it waning days.

The second disability follows—namely, that HES Complex job growth has nothing to do with monetary policy. There is no way, shape or form by which the Yellen’s Fed’s focus on the labor market, and its determination to keep the lunacy of zero interest in place for what will be 78 month running through mid-2015, actually stimulates activity rates and jobs in the HES Complex.

Overwhelmingly, the hospitals, doctors offices, outpatient clinics, nursing homes, for profit higher ed diploma mills and just plain old public education system do not borrow large amounts of money to operate. They do not care whether the money market interest rate is zero or 5%.

The credit market transmission mechanism for Fed policy is over and done, anyway, because the household sector has reached peak debt, as shown below. But the obvious point is that the HES Complex was never dependent upon cheap interest rates and booming debt creation in the first place. It was about fiscal transfers all along.
Image

In short, the Fed has managed to grow it balance sheet from $500 billion to $4.4 trillion during the period encompassed by the charts above—-and the overwhelming Keynesian rationale has been saving and creating jobs. Yet the only net jobs created in the US economy during this period had absolutely nothing to do with this manic spree of money printing. Would that one of Janet Yellen’s vaunted “dashboards” carried a reminder to that effect.

Finally, there is the issue of productity and paying our bills as a nation. We import about $2.5 trillion per year. That giant inflow of consumer products, capital goods and raw materials has to be paid for out of exports of goods and services— or the shortfall must be borrowed from the rest of the world.

The Keynesian money printers, of course, counsel not to worry, because foreigners are eager lenders to an American nation that has lived beyond its means for 30 years. According to Greenspan, Bernanke, and any random Wall Street economist you might happen to choose, the peasants of Asia who have come out of the rice paddies to earn a meager living in the slave factories of east China have an irrational penchant to over-save and thereby accommodate the $12 trillion debt of the US household sector.

Needless to say, that’s a fairy tale. Sooner or later, the American economy will be forced to import only what its earns in foreign sales and services because the export of excess dollars and debt by the Federal Reserve will be brought to a halt as the global central bank race to the bottom enters its final phases.

In this context, there has self-evidently been no recovery in goods production. As of last Friday’s report, the number of jobs in construction, manufacturing and mining (including energy) had hardly budged from the recession bottom and was down nearly 25% from the level of January 2000.
Image

So at the end of the day, the HES Complex does not help the US economy pay its way. Essentially, America has been creating jobs only by borrowing from the rest of the world—–more than $10 trillion on a balance of trade basis during the last 30 years.

And most certainly, this is a structural barrier to real economic growth and job creation that the revelers on Jobs Friday have never even remotely bothered to note.
Image


Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.


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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby slucero » Tue Sep 09, 2014 12:38 pm

Obama promised he'd do that... so did Bush.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.


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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby JBlake » Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:09 am

I wish they would have done this to Obama instead.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjMsU-coB2Q
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby tater1977 » Thu Sep 11, 2014 10:02 am

Perry's good natured bonhomie & the world’s most charmin smile,knocked fans off their feet. Sportin a black tux,gigs came alive as he swished around the stage thrillin audiences w/ charisma that instantly burnt the oxygen right out of the venue.TR.com
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:25 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Just until AFTER the election. :wink:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/apnewsbre ... 49467.html


Not surprised at all. If they could they would make deportation illegal.
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Boomchild » Sun Sep 14, 2014 11:25 pm

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:I missed this one. Anyone else hear about it?





The U.N. Resolution 2117 lists 21 points dealing with firearms control, but perhaps of most interest is point number 11: “CALLS FOR MEMBER STATES TO SUPPORT WEAPONS COLLECTION, DISARMAMENT ---”


In looking over this resolution, I think the reference above is referring to small arms that are part of what would be considered to be involved in small arms trading that would be considered illegal. I could be wrong, but take look for yourself.

http://www.un.org/en/ga/search/view_doc ... %282013%29
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Mon Sep 15, 2014 10:30 am

The entirety of this post is bullshit. Just more propaganda to try to stir anger in a certain group of voters. Perhaps instead of voting against those senators people should vote against a party whose supporters engages in McCarthyism.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/untreaty.asp



Boomchild wrote:
K.C.Journey Fan wrote:I missed this one. Anyone else hear about it?

The U.N. Resolution 2117 lists 21 points dealing with firearms control, but perhaps of most interest is point number 11: “CALLS FOR MEMBER STATES TO SUPPORT WEAPONS COLLECTION, DISARMAMENT ---”


In looking over this resolution, I think the reference above is referring to small arms that are part of what would be considered to be involved in small arms trading that would be considered illegal. I could be wrong, but take look for yourself.

http://www.un.org/en/ga/search/view_doc ... %282013%29
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Re: President Barack Obama - Term 2 Thread

Postby Monker » Tue Sep 16, 2014 2:36 am

K.C.Journey Fan wrote:Ya, Boomchild went on the UN's website and FOUND IT, but you say it's bullshit. OK. :roll:


You are so naive. Your post was a spam Email full of bullshit propaganda.

How can anybody take you seriously? Even FF admits when he is wrong.
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