Moderator: Andrew
Boomchild wrote:ohsherrie wrote:
Ponder this, was it just a mere coincidence that as soon as HRC lost the 2016 election that CF shutdown the operation of the "Clinton Global Initiative"? I have talked here about the investigative work on the CF by Charles Ortel. By far he is one, if not the best investigator into the operations of the foundation. I encourage you to look at his work on his website.
http://charlesortel.com/
Also remember that the Clinton's claimed that at the end of BC's term as POTUS they were "flat dead broke". So since then were did all their wealth come from? Sometimes it best to just use the old adage "follow the money".
The_Noble_Cause wrote:From Ron Paul editorial in USA today this week...
"There was no al-Qaeda in Iraq before the 2003 U.S. invasion. There was no Islamic State in Syria before President Obama’s covert support for regime change after the 2011 unrest. The massive pipeline of U.S. weapons to “moderate” rebels in Syria ended up in the hands of al-Qaeda affiliated groups and ISIS. Does anyone think that harebrained scheme makes anyone safer?"
ohsherrie wrote:
What Bernie Madoff did to people made me angry but didn't effect me personally. What I've just read on http://charlesortel.com/ make me feel sick because I voted for Bill Clinton and respected him as a president.
ohsherrie wrote:
Not me, and there was the Fast and Furious fiasco. Oh and let us not forget that the weapons that Al Qaeda had in Afghanistan had been provided by Bill Clinton for the Afghanis to fight Russia. We could also go back and dig up Iran Contra and the subsequent CIA involvement in cocaine trafficking to fund the Contra rebels.
Who among them has any right to question Trump's methods?
Fact Finder wrote:Boomchild wrote:Things that make you go Hmmm.......
Yep, that dude gets around, and I'm not speaking of McCain.
Before the Syrian Emergency Task Force, Moustafa was the Executive Director of the Libyan Council of North America, which like the SETF existed to help push regime change. Before that, he mentions working with "rebels" in Egypt. On his Twitter feed, he denounces the overthrow of Morsi making it rather clear which side he was on.
Predating his international period, Mouaz Moustafa did stints as a Field Organizer for the Democratic National Committee and a senate staffer. On Instagram, he calls himself a Freelance Revolutionary.
K.C.Journey Fan wrote:This would be a great start.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/04 ... ommittees/
I have to ask again if you're really that naive or have you been reading revisionist history? My grandparents were farmers in Iowa and my mother, aunt, and uncles picked the produce for sale to canneries and markets in Council Bluffs and Glenwood. My father worked as a maintenance worker on farms in Iowa. They weren't too good for that work. They never asked for a government handout. I have a younger cousin who started working as a farm hand in high school and after graduating stayed on doing the job because he liked it. He took night and Internet classes and is now making a good living doing on that farm. Do you think hard work has no dignity.
When I talk about building America I'm not necessarily talking about the physical construction, but many immigrants who were here to become Americans, not just here illegally or on a work visas, did a lot of that.
Boomchild wrote:Since the subject has been brought up that in the past most farming work was performed by slaves, there is this information on it.Less than 5% of the whites in the South owned slaves. Fully 3/4's of the white people of the South had neither slaves nor an immediate economic interest in the maintenance of slavery or the plantation system.
This was written by none other than the late John Hope Franklin in From Slavery to Freedom, McGraw-Hill, 1994., p. 123. Franklin was a Harvard educated Professor Emeritus of History and Professor of Legal History at Duke University. Dr. Franklin also happened to be a Black man.
It seems to me the argument being made here is coming from the position of entitlement. That people should only have to work at jobs they really want to do and if that is not possible then they should be entitled to public assistance.
ohsherrie wrote:Thank you again Boomchild. There is a huge difference between the immigrants who settled this country, the ones who came here later through Ellis Island dreaming of becoming Americans and what we have today whether coming as hoards of refugees or sneaking across the borders.
Boomchild wrote:ohsherrie wrote:
Not me, and there was the Fast and Furious fiasco. Oh and let us not forget that the weapons that Al Qaeda had in Afghanistan had been provided by Bill Clinton for the Afghanis to fight Russia. We could also go back and dig up Iran Contra and the subsequent CIA involvement in cocaine trafficking to fund the Contra rebels.
Who among them has any right to question Trump's methods?
And people wonder why the U.S. has been unable to "win the war" on illegal drugs.
Monker wrote:ohsherrie wrote:Thank you again Boomchild. There is a huge difference between the immigrants who settled this country, the ones who came here later through Ellis Island dreaming of becoming Americans and what we have today whether coming as hoards of refugees or sneaking across the borders.
I say you are completely wrong. The Irish were talked about and treated in the exact same way you are talking about Mexicans. Look it up anywhere. This is the first Google search I clicked...and it is so ironic:
https://www.history.com/news/when-america-despised-the-irish-the-19th-centurys-refugee-crisis
"The refugees seeking haven in America were poor and disease-ridden. They threatened to take jobs away from Americans and strain welfare budgets. They practiced an alien religion and pledged allegiance to a foreign leader. They were bringing with them crime. They were accused of being rapists. And, worst of all, these undesirables were Irish."
You are viewing history through tinted glasses and you see only what you want to see.
Monker wrote:Boomchild wrote:Since the subject has been brought up that in the past most farming work was performed by slaves, there is this information on it.Less than 5% of the whites in the South owned slaves. Fully 3/4's of the white people of the South had neither slaves nor an immediate economic interest in the maintenance of slavery or the plantation system.
This was written by none other than the late John Hope Franklin in From Slavery to Freedom, McGraw-Hill, 1994., p. 123. Franklin was a Harvard educated Professor Emeritus of History and Professor of Legal History at Duke University. Dr. Franklin also happened to be a Black man.
And, that is a very misleading statistic since this is a percentage of ALL whites, whether they had any "need" for a slave or not. What percentage of large farms or plantations had slaves - regardless of race? THAT would be a statistic that would have meaning in the context of this discussion.It seems to me the argument being made here is coming from the position of entitlement. That people should only have to work at jobs they really want to do and if that is not possible then they should be entitled to public assistance.
No, that is NOT the position I am taking.
I am saying it is wrong for goverment to control a business decistion on who to legally hire as an employee. I am saying it is wrong for government to force a person to work in these type of jobs. This is basically communism and I doubt such policies would hold up in court.
You are setting up a situation where an employer is hiring people they don't want, and employees are forced into jobs they don't want. it's a HORRIBLE idea.
ohsherrie wrote:Nobody in this country is entitled to have whatever they want. They are entitled to what they earn, nothing more.
Monker wrote:I have to ask again if you're really that naive or have you been reading revisionist history? My grandparents were farmers in Iowa and my mother, aunt, and uncles picked the produce for sale to canneries and markets in Council Bluffs and Glenwood. My father worked as a maintenance worker on farms in Iowa. They weren't too good for that work. They never asked for a government handout. I have a younger cousin who started working as a farm hand in high school and after graduating stayed on doing the job because he liked it. He took night and Internet classes and is now making a good living doing on that farm. Do you think hard work has no dignity.
And, I have to ask you if you even read my post. I said, "Also, corporate farming is much, much more common today than it once was..."
Small family farms, as you describe above, are no where near as common as they were even 25yrs ago. Large farms are FAR more common, the last I knew it was around 75% of all farms. At that size, a family can NOT do ALL of the work. So, they contract out the work.When I talk about building America I'm not necessarily talking about the physical construction, but many immigrants who were here to become Americans, not just here illegally or on a work visas, did a lot of that.
Now you are trying to get into people's heads and deciding who is/was here to become a citizen and who wasn't/isn't. I don't believe Mexicans are treated any better than say the Irish fleeing the potato famine. They take the shit jobs because that is what is avaiable. The first generation probably don't get citizenship because it can take decades...but, their children and grandchildren do. IMO, if it were 1850, you would be making these exact same arguments - except you would be talking about the Irish instead of Mexicans.
verslibre wrote:Wow. Cohen's offices AND hotel room raided. They must have sniffed something.
ohsherrie wrote:My point is still that whatever unskilled labor jobs that are available in this country should be available first to the able bodied, working age citizens of this country who are qualified for those jobs before migrant workers are hired. If those citizens CHOOSE not to work they are not ENTITLED to sponge off the tax payers.
Monker wrote:I say you are completely wrong. The Irish were talked about and treated in the exact same way you are talking about Mexicans. Look it up anywhere. This is the first Google search I clicked...and it is so ironic:
https://www.history.com/news/when-america-despised-the-irish-the-19th-centurys-refugee-crisis
"The refugees seeking haven in America were poor and disease-ridden. They threatened to take jobs away from Americans and strain welfare budgets. They practiced an alien religion and pledged allegiance to a foreign leader. They were bringing with them crime. They were accused of being rapists. And, worst of all, these undesirables were Irish."
You are viewing history through tinted glasses and you see only what you want to see.OhSherrie wrote:I've seen that website. Of course it pops up, it got really popular when the History Channel ran that series, which was right about the time President Trump caused controversy about wanting to keep the Mexican illigals from bringing their drugs and crime to this country. No big revelation there and of course the History Channel has never dramatized anything.
The_Noble_Cause wrote:verslibre wrote:Wow. Cohen's offices AND hotel room raided. They must have sniffed something.
FBI is becoming the Democratic gestapo. Shut it down.
ohsherrie wrote:My point is still that whatever unskilled labor jobs that are available in this country should be available first to the able bodied, working age citizens of this country who are qualified for those jobs before migrant workers are hired. If those citizens CHOOSE not to work they are not ENTITLED to sponge off the tax payers.
if you're such a marshmallow that you call honest hard work for an honest day's pay slavery,
the point still remains that we have to get our own people out of the welfare cycle and keep immigrants from coming here and starting their own cycles. That's just common sense. I guess that's why it's so hard for you to understand. Now I'm through arguing with you about it.
Fact Finder wrote:The_Noble_Cause wrote:verslibre wrote:Wow. Cohen's offices AND hotel room raided. They must have sniffed something.
FBI is becoming the Democratic gestapo. Shut it down.
I just heard something about Cohen getting $350,000 from some organized crime group in 1999. Trying to track a link down. If so, has nothing to do with POTUS.
Boomchild wrote:Citizens need to be put to or back to work before making work available to those looking to come here.
verslibre wrote:Wow. Cohen's offices AND hotel room raided. They must have sniffed something.
Monker wrote:Boomchild wrote:Citizens need to be put to or back to work before making work available to those looking to come here.
If a Mexican (or Indian, or Russian, or Bosnian or...) has a work VISA and a company wants to hire him, then government should stay the fuck out of it.
tj wrote:
The government provides the visa. They're in in already.
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