Final Frontier Tour Setlist Thread

[Monker]

Can you please point me in the direction of the autotune being used in the clips we've seen from Hershey and Pittsburgh? Preferably with timestamps so it's easy to review.

Before I do that, can you please quote where I said anything about autotune being used.

I said he pulled the mic away and the note continued on. I said the next song just looked wrong and phony to me, but nothing specific. And, I admitted I am biased and can't get into this crap any longer. Is that proof of anything?

If you enjoy it, fine...go ahead, enjoy it. I just don't care about it. But, if Fil does another analysis and everything falls down, don't be surprised. To me, IMBO, I think Arnel's vocals have not been real since the vocal issues were solved by a new ear monitor. I think they were solved with a combination of autotune and turning down his live vocal and turning up a prerecorded background vocal...and I am not going to try to prove it.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Can you please point me in the direction of the autotune being used in the clips we've seen from Hershey and Pittsburgh? Preferably with timestamps so it's easy to review.

Are you really in denial about its usage? It's been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt by Fil / Wings of a Pegasus.
You could hear it on the tour rehearsal footage of Patiently.
I heard it on the clips of WYLAW from Pittsburgh last night.
It's so obvious.

But - AGAIN - I don't really care!

Short of Jon having a chat with a burning bush or hearing a choir of angels, his mind is made up. The band's end is nigh (this version anyway).

[youkeepmewaiting]

Obviously they’re using some auto tune, I’m not sure why anyone would even debate that at this point. Most acts do at this stage, it is what it is, and particularly for Journey what does it matter now

[danielb]

I heard it on the clips of WYLAW from Pittsburgh last night.
It's so obvious.

Not obvious to me (I just had a look at WYLAW), but I am sure you could be right. He sounds very good on WYLAW. But it doesn't make sense that they would use autotune on some songs and then let Arnel struggle with other songs. If autotune was used then surely he'd be sounding spot on all night?

[brywool]

Short of Jon having a chat with a burning bush or hearing a choir of angels, his mind is made up. The band's end is nigh (this version anyway).

[JourneyHard]

If this is really their last tour ever, they need to include Remember Me as the last song before Don't Stop Believin'. Nobody is leaving without hearing DSB so no worries about a massive exodus.

[Loneman1]

Yeah, this is pretty much what I figured the big setlist change was going to be. I wasn't expecting JTT level of awesome variation, but at least one pre-Perry song rotated would have been a nice addition in place of "Faith in the Heartland" or another one they've already rotated in and out for years. I was starting to be on the fence about trying to score decent tickets with this being the farewell and all and was waiting for the first couple setlists to come out......but after seeing almost this same setlist so many times over the years, I'm going to wait and see what Neal has planned following Jon's exit before I grab any tickets from here on out.

[RumTumJM]

A - If Arnel held out a long note, pulled the mic away from his mouth, and the note continued, couldn't that have simply been a delay effect? I'm not saying it definitely wasn't a track, but it sure sounds like it could have been delay.

B - Autotune is still better than tracks, as I see it, especially when we know the singer is struggling a lot.

C - Perhaps some songs still sounded rough, because the autotune only helps with out of tune notes, not completely wrong notes? Also, maybe they cut the autotune on the songs they know the struggles most with, figuring it would be easily detectable, or they just used the autotune on the ballads/songs with elongated notes?

[Journey/Survivor]

I think that a lot of people have made up their minds, and they don't want to change their opinions? Even if they are wrong.

[danielb]

A - If Arnel held out a long note, pulled the mic away from his mouth, and the note continued, couldn't that have simply been a delay effect? I'm not saying it definitely wasn't a track, but it sure sounds like it could have been delay

Absolutely.

[danielb]

I think that a lot of people have made up their minds, and they don't want to change their opinions? Even if they are wrong.

I don't agree with the use of autotune or any added components that will allow the band to fake their performance. But any claims need to be be backed up with Youtube links highlighing the use in question. So far I haven't seen any links expect for the reference to Fil's channel. Fil analysed a clip from Sacramento a few years back and also the recent televised performance from a few months back, where everything was prerecorded (not unusual at such events).

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

[Journey/Survivor]

I think that a lot of people have made up their minds, and they don't want to change their opinions? Even if they are wrong.

I don't agree with the use of autotune or any added components that will allow the band to fake their performance. But any claims need to be be backed up with Youtube links highlighing the use in question. So far I haven't seen any links expect for the reference to Fil's channel. Fil analysed a clip from Sacramento a few years back and also the recent televised performance from a few months back, where everything was prerecorded (not unusual at such events).

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

I totally agree!

And even then, Fil isn't infallible.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I think that a lot of people have made up their minds, and they don't want to change their opinions? Even if they are wrong.

I don't agree with the use of autotune or any added components that will allow the band to fake their performance. But any claims need to be be backed up with Youtube links highlighing the use in question. So far I haven't seen any links expect for the reference to Fil's channel. Fil analysed a clip from Sacramento a few years back and also the recent televised performance from a few months back, where everything was prerecorded (not unusual at such events).

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

I mentioned a few specific examples where I heard it blatantly on this tour already (ex. rehearsing patiently, on WYLAW in Pittsburgh).

As far as someone on here providing links and doing soundwave forensic analysis (like Fil does)....err, no thanks.
For starters, the band is throwing in the towel so I really don't care.
Secondly, the band's willingness to cheat extends waaaay further back than Sacramento. Were you even around for the fully-mimed Generations tour or the UK Augeri tour?
Your moral indignation seems quaint and innocent.

That said, since you are being very demanding, I will email links to Fil. Remember - careful what you wish for.

[Eric]

Last night in DC nothing new but switched up opener again. This time Be good to yourself.

[danielb]

As far as someone on here providing links and doing soundwave forensic analysis (like Fil does)....err, no thanks.

Fair enough.

Secondly, the band's willingness to cheat extends waaaay further back than Sacramento. Were you even around for the fully-mimed Generations tour or the UK Augeri tour?

Yes. But that was Augeri and full on miming

[The_Noble_Cause]

Yes. But that was Augeri and full on miming

They were helping him with auto-tune by 2003. There is an entire toolbox of tricks to help these guys out.

[danielb]

Unless I'm mistaken, so far Fil has only covered the Sacramento concert (autotune going bonkers) and the televised 49ers performance (not live). It will be interesting to see if he will have reason to dig into the current tour as well.

[Monker]

Unless I'm mistaken, so far Fil has only covered the Sacramento concert (autotune going bonkers) and the televised 49ers performance (not live). It will be interesting to see if he will have reason to dig into the current tour as well.

The problem is:

\The Sacramento concert happened at a time when nobody was scrutinizing the vocals in any detail. Even after, it was a few years after when I forwarded it to Fil. So, there is all of this time during that tour (maybe even before) and after when Journey was using autotune without anybody really noticing or critiquing. I was suspicious when they gave Arnel a magical ear monitor that cured his vocal issues...which never made any sense to me.

Then the 49ers game. They used prerecorded AND tuned vocals for Deen. Ok, fine...it's a halftime show...give them a break. But, the one thing that people seem to miss is Fil said the autotune is set to sometimes be sharp or flat to make it harder to detect. They are trying to HIDE this shit...even in that broadcast.

Finally Augeri...nobody sat down and made a video like Fil did for Arnel...btw, Fil is very patient and explains things well. I don't think he is a bad guy who just talks shit. Yeah, there was a webpage with all of these screenshots and such. I looked at it for like 30secs and decided to not go through all of it. Even if prerecorded vocals were used for every Augeri era concert...everybody here was blaming Augeri and displaying sheer hatred for the guy, and demanding Augeri leave the band. By the very nature, it is a BAND decision. What Fil showed by both Deen and Neal being very, very slightly off in the fake performing proves that if even one of them is playing to a prerecorded performance, then they are ALL bound by it. There are no adlib solos added or time taken away, or "I fucked that up, lets reperform that chorus..." because it screws up the timing of the prerecording. In the MTV concert Perry is trying to get the crowd to sing the na na's in LTS and he turns to the band and says, "let's give them some help..." that kinda stuff CAN'T happen with prerecorded anything. Augeri never deserved such hatred...and neither does Arnel - it is the full band that deserves any anger and/or blame.

Now we have Arnel sounding like SHIT over New Years and suddenly he sounds perfect with Journey. It's just so obvious what is going on. Denial and suspension of disbelief is a miraculous thing, I guess. The entire thing looks fake to me and I can't watch it...because I am VERY biased now.

[HydraRed]

Jason is absolutely killing it on the RoR tunes.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Even if prerecorded vocals were used for every Augeri era concert...everybody here was blaming Augeri and displaying sheer hatred for the guy, and demanding Augeri leave the band. By the very nature, it is a BAND decision.

Neal claimed SA wasn't in his ear monitors because he was so off sometimes. He claimed this predated the Tapegate tours.
Probably BS BUT there's always a slim possibility it was coordinated mostly between Elson and Augeri.

What Fil showed by both Deen and Neal being very, very slightly off in the fake performing proves that if even one of them is playing to a prerecorded performance, then they are ALL bound by it. There are no adlib solos added or time taken away, or "I fucked that up, lets reperform that chorus..." because it screws up the timing of the prerecording.

I think a click track would keep them in sync regardless. These guys rarely deviate from the set list anyways.

In the MTV concert Perry is trying to get the crowd to sing the na na's in LTS and he turns to the band and says, "let's give them some help..." that kinda stuff CAN'T happen with prerecorded anything.

True, but a relationship between the frontman and live sound engineer can give the illusion of spontaneity w/out impacting the band....

For example, during the 2005 tour, there would be times that Augeri's live feed would actually be "on" so he could greet the audience or do some riffing like here on FITH around 4:27-4:49, and then again 5:17 til the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0J0VdEa0634

Or here on Higher Place. He is live to intro the song and then live again at 4:46.

https://youtu.be/4eYK2lejTmo?si=wg2lvKzK4H-EEaZw

In Augeri's case, it wasn't just the sudden, unusual, face-concealing mic technique that was a dead giveaway, but also the stark difference between the studio tracks and his obviously weakened damaged voice.

[kmjrr]

Unless I'm mistaken, so far Fil has only covered the Sacramento concert (autotune going bonkers) and the televised 49ers performance (not live). It will be interesting to see if he will have reason to dig into the current tour as well.

Now we have Arnel sounding like SHIT over New Years and suddenly he sounds perfect with Journey. It's just so obvious what is going on. Denial and suspension of disbelief is a miraculous thing, I guess. The entire thing looks fake to me and I can't watch it...because I am VERY biased now.

Arnel does not sound perfect. Two months have elapsed since NYE. He rested his voice and it has improved, somewhat. His voice in the recent tour clips is still rough in the middle range and it is pitchy. He does not have the perfect pitch that he had 2017 and before. He still pauses for the audience to sing, he yells "C'mon!" once in a while, and improvises. It's not like Don Henley sitting behind the drums singing the songs with absolutely no improvising, no change from any other night, singing it just like it is on the record. Yes, I am sure Arnel gets some help. There is definitely huge delay/reverb. But for it to be fake, it is a crappy job of faking it. I was playing one of these first shows on the television and my wife stopped as she walked by the TV, watched for a moment, then looked at me and said "That sounds awful!"

[HydraRed]

Patiently and Walks Like a Lady added last night in Trenton.

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/journey/2026/cure-insurance-arena-trenton-nj-b4fedaa.html

[Gideon]

Also in Trenton:

Neal and Jon interact on stage for the first time of the tour during the Wheel in the Sky solo/jam

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?t=2569

[The_Noble_Cause]

Also in Trenton:

Neal and Jon interact on stage for the first time of the tour during the Wheel in the Sky solo/jam

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?t=2569

Love to see it. The ice has melted. The Pisces brothers are back!

[The_Noble_Cause]

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

You were saying?

It's all over this version of Faithfully. Yikes.

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?si=aZdoKSlcK_hyan35&t=2949

[FamilyMan]

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

You were saying?

It's all over this version of Faithfully. Yikes.

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?si=aZdoKSlcK_hyan35&t=2949

Yikes.

[danielb]

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

You were saying?

It's all over this version of Faithfully. Yikes.

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?si=aZdoKSlcK_hyan35&t=2949

Then why is it that he is out of tune?

[youkeepmewaiting]

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

You were saying?

It's all over this version of Faithfully. Yikes.

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?si=aZdoKSlcK_hyan35&t=2949

Then why is it that he is out of tune?

Because it can't work miracles

[kmjrr]

Do we have any links to the use of autotune on the current farewell tour?

You were saying?

It's all over this version of Faithfully. Yikes.

https://youtu.be/4RvYdLYdAro?si=aZdoKSlcK_hyan35&t=2949

Really? That's auto tuned?

Please, send it to Fil to analyze. I wanna see that.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It seems like the goal posts are now moving and you guys don't even seem to understand what auto-tune is or how it works....

What, pray tell, do you think you are hearing in this clip? Aliens possessing Arnel's body?