President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[Rockindeano]

Why is Harry Reid a piece of shit? What did he say so wrong? The war was lost? I got news for you, it is lost. Over 4,000 American casualties, allies bailing on us, terrible mismanagement therof, and NO exit plan. What's so incorrect with what the Senator said?

That war should of A). been done and over in 6 months or less, B) had a viable and somewhat strategic exit plan, C) should have been conducted with a decent amount of allied help(not the token three countries who showed up), and maybe the most important, D) Never been waged. Bullshit, unnecessary war, based on lies and fear tactics, to rally the electorate.

Now Obama is stuck holding the shit bag that is W's War.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Gee...did you READ the article??? In RECENT months...as in under OBAMA'S watch...

And accordingly, Obama recieved flack for his wiretap appproval, during the campaign and now.

Oh and they DIDN'T spy on him...they WANTED to spy on him...but it was blocked.

You said the wiretaps did not extend to domestic communications.
That's been proven false.
In Europe, the Conservatives actually care about things like civil liberties.
Here, we have big brother brownshirts who put their blind faith in the government as long as it's under the guise of "national security" - despite the instructive precedent of history.

Did you even notice that a memeber of congress was talking to a TERRORIST?

And Nixon said he was justified to wiretap citizens to find Vietnam war intel leaks.
Either you believe in the law or not.

OF COURSE NOT! It doesn't match your political ideology...which is so far left you can even see the center let alone claim to be a part of it.

Enforcing the law has nothing to do with which way your political barometer swings.
If only for posterity's sake, you cannot impeach Clinton for a pecadillo, and then give the most massive executive overreach since Nixon a pass.

Again...step away from the Donkey dung, and Elephant drool and see what is really happening dude. Your golden boy Obama is as bad as the rest of them.

And justice will be brought to bear, whether he stands in the way or not.
The difference is, liberals didn't come down with moral amnesia the moment our "golden boy" was in office.
Spain and the UN have already looked into prosecutions, just a matter of time.

[The_Noble_Cause]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/19/cia.torture.chief/

Reckless

Maybe Obama could've kept the torture documents classified and then turned around and waged war on the press when they inevitably got leaked, as hapened with the Pentagon Papers in the 70s.
By releasing the memos, Obama renews the country's commitment to an open democracy.
Meanwhile, the pro-torture, pro-censorship GOP continues its slide into stormtrooper fascism.

[Eric]

Why is Harry Reid a piece of shit? What did he say so wrong? The war was lost? I got news for you, it is lost. Over 4,000 American casualties, allies bailing on us, terrible mismanagement therof, and NO exit plan. What's so incorrect with what the Senator said?

That war should of A). been done and over in 6 months or less, B) had a viable and somewhat strategic exit plan, C) should have been conducted with a decent amount of allied help(not the token three countries who showed up), and maybe the most important, D) Never been waged. Bullshit, unnecessary war, based on lies and fear tactics, to rally the electorate.

Now Obama is stuck holding the shit bag that is W's War.

War is won...W had already agreed with Iraqi officials on withdrawal plans, contrary to the the media pretending these dates are new. We toppled Saddam+thugs, spread freedom in a region desperately needing it, scared the shit out of Kadahfi...and drew Al Queda in and beat them delivering a blow to their momentum. all the while distracting them from our homeland.

It was waged very poorly for a long time - nobody rationale disagrees with that, and that caused way too many casualties.

[Eric]

Meanwhile, the pro-torture, pro-censorship GOP continues its slide into stormtrooper fascism.

The only one using storm troopers was the Obama campaign:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2070026/posts

Oh and the "torture" or should I say Fraternity Hazing-esque interrogation methods used saved American lives:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/modules.ph ... e&sid=5825

[The_Noble_Cause]

The only one using storm troopers was the Obama campaign:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2070026/posts

LOL.
I'm talking about institutionalized torture and witholding documents from the public, and the best you can muster is Obama's groupies flooding a radio station switchboard?
You know what they say, the first casualty of war is Casey Kasem's Top 40 American Countdown.

Oh and the "torture" or should I say Fraternity Hazing-esque interrogation methods used saved American lives:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/modules.ph ... e&sid=5825

Great.
Then it should've been debated in Congress initially, just like the Patriot Act.
You seem to have a problem with this thing called Democracy, Eric.

[The_Noble_Cause]

...scared the shit out of Kadahfi...

Bullshit.
Those negotiations were underway long before Bush was even in office.
Libya came to us and the Brits in the 90's agreeing to give up weapons if we let up on sanctions.
Sounds very much the type of move the GOP would label as appeasement.
Cheney took credit (and hey, why not, they had nothing else going for them) and the GOP flock lapped it up.

[Eric]

The only one using storm troopers was the Obama campaign:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2070026/posts

LOL.
I'm talking about institutionalized torture and witholding documents from the public, and the best you can muster is Obama's groupies flooding a radio station switchboard?
You know what they say, the first casualty of war is Casey Kasem's Top 40 American Countdown.

Oh and the "torture" or should I say Fraternity Hazing-esque interrogation methods used saved American lives:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/modules.ph ... e&sid=5825

Great.
Then it should've been debated in Congress initially, just like the Patriot Act.
You seem to have a problem with this thing called Democracy, Eric.

Hundreds and hundreds of examples of his campaign's storm trooper tactics, here are a couple of more:
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2031500/o ... ers_in_pa/
http://www.kmov.com/localnews/stories/k ... 69e89.html

And you seem to have a problem with the notion that you don't give our enemies our playbook.

[Eric]

...scared the shit out of Kadahfi...

Bullshit.
Those negotiations were underway long before Bush was even in office.
Libya came to us and the Brits in the 90's agreeing to give up weapons if we let up on sanctions.
Sounds very much the type of move the GOP would label as appeasement.
Cheney took credit (and hey, why not, they had nothing else going for them) and the GOP flock lapped it up.

There were negotiations for years and years but he didn't give up the program until December, 2003...after the Iraq invasion. I think he feared an Iraq style invasion.

[Eric]

Geez, I sure hope Barry sits down with this evil fuck next!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 132972.ece

[The_Noble_Cause]

There were negotiations for years and years but he didn't give up the program until December, 2003...after the Iraq invasion. I think he feared an Iraq style invasion.

Not true.
Libya's WMDs were already put on the table back in 1999.
Even if you are correct, I don't think anyone can objectively say Iraq has pacified Iran, North Korea, Russia etc. - just the opposite.

[Rockindeano]

War is won...W had already agreed with Iraqi officials on withdrawal plans, contrary to the the media pretending these dates are new. We toppled Saddam+thugs, spread freedom in a region desperately needing it, scared the shit out of Kadahfi...and drew Al Queda in and beat them delivering a blow to their momentum. all the while distracting them from our homeland.

It was waged very poorly for a long time - nobody rationale disagrees with that, and that caused way too many casualties.

"War is Won?" Are you fucking serious? What should have been a gleeful skip over the river and through the woods became a nightmare middle of the night blind journey through a 5 mile long maze. Hell, by your definition, we will never "lose" a war, but come on already? Sure we'll eventually outlast everyone in battle, but my God, with all the billions we spend on technology, our casualties should be 1/4000th of what they are in this "won war." What a joke.

I have said it many times before, my son wanted to join up and serve and I wouldn't let him. I threatened to break his arm. No way can I as a father, let my naive 17 at the time some, go to "war" for George W Bush. No way do I let him ship off to die for a mistake. Now had he wanted to go to Afghanistan, and actually somewhat knew what the differences were between the two, I could live with his decision, but Iraq, under Bush/Cheney and Rumsfeld? No fucking way at all, never, ever. We would be in Vancouver on conscientious objector emmigrate desires in 4 hours.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Hundreds and hundreds of examples of his campaign's storm trooper tactics, here are a couple of more:

Ok..let's have it...

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2031500/obamas_ss_storm_troopers_blocking_white_voters_in_pa/

No proof whatsoever that the black panthers have any affiliation with Obama or are on the DNC payroll.
None.
The cops were called and these men were removed, as they should have been.
This is the best you got?

http://www.kmov.com/localnews/stories/kmov_election_092808_truthsquad.bec69e89.html

So some cop chose to support Obama's presidential bid over McCains'?
What's the problem here?
This is some seriously weak shit.
Laughable, really.

And you seem to have a problem with the notion that you don't give our enemies our playbook.

That's just a soundbyte.
The memos didn't say anything that wasn't already public knowledge.
If anything, it just saves a future president the trouble of apologising for our actions later.
Y'know, kinda how that traitorous commie Reagan apologized to the Japs for internment camps in WW2.

[Eric]

Y'know, kinda how that traitorous commie Reagan apologized to the Japs for internment camps in WW2.

You don't see the difference?????

[Eric]

Hundreds and hundreds of examples of his campaign's storm trooper tactics, here are a couple of more:

Ok..let's have it...

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2031500/obamas_ss_storm_troopers_blocking_white_voters_in_pa/

No proof whatsoever that the black panthers have any affiliation with Obama or are on the DNC payroll.
None.
The cops were called and these men were removed, as they should have been.
This is the best you got?

http://www.kmov.com/localnews/stories/kmov_election_092808_truthsquad.bec69e89.html

So some cop chose to support Obama's presidential bid over McCains'?
What's the problem here?
This is some seriously weak shit.
Laughable, really.

Spin and gloss over these things all you want, but YOU used storm troopers to label W, when Obama has people conducting themselves in a much more storm trooperish way.

[Eric]

War is won...W had already agreed with Iraqi officials on withdrawal plans, contrary to the the media pretending these dates are new. We toppled Saddam+thugs, spread freedom in a region desperately needing it, scared the shit out of Kadahfi...and drew Al Queda in and beat them delivering a blow to their momentum. all the while distracting them from our homeland.

It was waged very poorly for a long time - nobody rationale disagrees with that, and that caused way too many casualties.

"War is Won?" Are you fucking serious? What should have been a gleeful skip over the river and through the woods became a nightmare middle of the night blind journey through a 5 mile long maze. Hell, by your definition, we will never "lose" a war, but come on already? Sure we'll eventually outlast everyone in battle, but my God, with all the billions we spend on technology, our casualties should be 1/4000th of what they are in this "won war." What a joke.

I have said it many times before, my son wanted to join up and serve and I wouldn't let him. I threatened to break his arm. No way can I as a father, let my naive 17 at the time some, go to "war" for George W Bush. No way do I let him ship off to die for a mistake. Now had he wanted to go to Afghanistan, and actually somewhat knew what the differences were between the two, I could live with his decision, but Iraq, under Bush/Cheney and Rumsfeld? No fucking way at all, never, ever. We would be in Vancouver on conscientious objector emmigrate desires in 4 hours.

You're arguing about whether the war was worth it and about how it was waged. Whether it was worth it or not is way too over my head and only time will tell, however, I'll argue there was good to come out of it (points made in above post) unlike Vietnam. I also don't see how it was good for the soldiers to have someone in their Government saying that the war was lost. And again - the way it was waged for a long time was disgraceful.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Y'know, kinda how that traitorous commie Reagan apologized to the Japs for internment camps in WW2.

You don't see the difference?????

Yes.
FDR passed an executive order and eventually went to the Supreme Court over detainee camps.
Bush Co., on the other hand, acted like a dictatorship.
Is that what you meant?

[Eric]

Y'know, kinda how that traitorous commie Reagan apologized to the Japs for internment camps in WW2.

You don't see the difference?????

Yes.
FDR passed an executive order and eventually went to the Supreme Court over detainee camps.
Bush Co., on the other hand, acted like a dictatorship.
Is that what you meant?

If you want to compare Japanese-Americans to Terrorists who want to kill us its your right, but I'm not buying it.

[RossValoryRocks]

Y'know, kinda how that traitorous commie Reagan apologized to the Japs for internment camps in WW2.

You don't see the difference?????

Yes.
FDR passed an executive order and eventually went to the Supreme Court over detainee camps.
Bush Co., on the other hand, acted like a dictatorship.
Is that what you meant?

Ok...I see now...the modus operani is blame it all on Bush...even though the current Democrat controlled Congress approved the wiretaps all over again...didn't change a damn thing...and this is what the Obama administration is currently doing...but because it is Obama it is ok...or rather...you change the subject and blame Bush?

Dude...you are completely wacked...they are BOTH wrong...or both right...you can't have one be ok and one not.

Also...in response to your earlier post to me...it may be a difference of symantecs...but note they TRIED...the Obama administration that is...to warrantless tap a congressmen...they were shot down...I have seen no proof from you...or anyone else...that at ANYTIME during the Bush administration or the Obama adminisrtration that they actually did so.

So nice try but you are getting crazier by the day.

[RossValoryRocks]

Going to force the Cabinet to cut $100 million in spending!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090420/ap_ ... r_wh/obama

[The_Noble_Cause]

Spin and gloss over these things all you want,..

You mean calling you out on your lies?

but YOU used storm troopers to label W,

Yes, the curtailment of civil liberties and the use of torture is very Nazi like.
Hell, the term "enhanced interogration" is actually from the Nazis.
Defend or denounce it's efficacy in the War on Terror, but that is a fact.

When Obama has people conducting themselves in a much more storm trooperish way.

You are talking about a campaign that had volunteers in the hundreds of thousands.
Many of the instances you cite, like the Black Panthers, don't even have any relationship to Obama.
I am talking about decisions that originated in the oval office and cost people their lives.

[The_Noble_Cause]

If you want to compare Japanese-Americans to Terrorists who want to kill us its your right, but I'm not buying it.

Why do you think we locked them up, dumbshit?
Like the indiscriminate dragnet that brought innocents to Gitmo and Abu Ghraib, all the Japs were broadbrushed as wanting to destroy America.

[Barb]

Going to force the Cabinet to cut $100 million in spending!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090420/ap_ ... r_wh/obama

That will have a HUGE impact. Good job!!

[RossValoryRocks]

Going to force the Cabinet to cut $100 million in spending!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090420/ap_ ... r_wh/obama

That will have a HUGE impact. Good job!!

It's a START...I will give him props for it...I said I would be fair, unlike the libs, and will compliment or bash accordingly.

Neither Clinton nor Bush tried to cut shit. So Obama is one up on them here.

[Eric]

Going to force the Cabinet to cut $100 million in spending!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090420/ap_ ... r_wh/obama

That will have a HUGE impact. Good job!!

It's a START...I will give him props for it...I said I would be fair, unlike the libs, and will compliment or bash accordingly.

Neither Clinton nor Bush tried to cut shit. So Obama is one up on them here.

Indeed this is good. I'll toss it in the good bucket with his stem cell reversal and the way he handled the Somali pirate thing......

[Barb]

Going to force the Cabinet to cut $100 million in spending!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090420/ap_ ... r_wh/obama

That will have a HUGE impact. Good job!!

It's a START...I will give him props for it...I said I would be fair, unlike the libs, and will compliment or bash accordingly.

Neither Clinton nor Bush tried to cut shit. So Obama is one up on them here.

Considering the monstrosity of the deficit, cutting $100M is the equivalent of not cutting shit. What is the point, really?

[The_Noble_Cause]

Ok...I see now...the modus operani is blame it all on Bush...even though the current Democrat controlled Congress approved the wiretaps all over again...didn't change a damn thing...and this is what the Obama administration is currently doing...but because it is Obama it is ok...or rather...you change the subject and blame Bush?

Bush didn't do it with Congress's approval.
Only after the NYTimes exposed the wiretaps (after sitting on it per Bush's request), was Congress brought in.
Bush acted like a King, ignored FISA, and broke the law.
End of story.

Dude...you are completely wacked...they are BOTH wrong...or both right...you can't have one be ok and one not.

Obama did not circumvent checks and balances like Bush.
The issue was brought to the floor and it was voted on.
Y'know, the American way.

Also...in response to your earlier post to me...it may be a difference of symantecs...but note they TRIED...the Obama administration that is...to warrantless tap a congressmen...they were shot down...I have seen no proof from you...or anyone else...that at ANYTIME during the Bush administration or the Obama adminisrtration that they actually did so.

Just last week you were also under the impression that Bush followed FISA, the very law which he deliberately flaunted.
I don't think you know the facts of this case, nor do you care.
You're just defending Bush at all costs.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Neither Clinton nor Bush tried to cut shit. So Obama is one up on them here.

You're kidding right?
Clinton is the only president in modern history to actually reduce the size of gov't.

[Eric]

If you want to compare Japanese-Americans to Terrorists who want to kill us its your right, but I'm not buying it.

Why do you think we locked them up, dumbshit?
Like the indiscriminate dragnet that brought innocents to Gitmo and Abu Ghraib, all the Japs were broadbrushed as wanting to destroy America.

Innocents? Come on! If you're found in Kabul and you're not from there and are doing terrorist activities you are a terrorist. You still don't seem to care about saving American lives as much as you do about whining about anything W.

Jap-Americans were not a threat......the evil mofo's at Gitmo are. We're also talking about 340 terrorists at Gitmo as opposed tens of thousands of Japanese-Americans. Just a real unfair and ignorant comparison. Just atrocious!

[Eric]

Spin and gloss over these things all you want,..

You mean calling you out on your lies?

Name one?