Trial By Fire or Generations?

by **NealIsGod** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 3:25 am

I am interested to know if people generally preferred Trial By Fire and the direction the band was going had Steve Perry stayed in the group, OR are you happy with the current state of the band and their new release, Generations? I don't want you to vote for one album over the other, I want to to know if you wish Steve Perry had stayed in the group and Journey had continued on that musical path.

by **ohsherrie** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 3:45 am

Well, I'm sure you all know how I feel. :wink:

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:30 am

I am not sure there will be any surprises here.
Except I hope some of the newer posters will chime in.

by **NoMoreTails** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 6:58 am

We know the musical path Journey would be on if they had continued with Perry--None.
This is my favorite Journey of all as I used to wish Perry had more of a rocker attitude in his performance and that Journey had stayed more of the rock band they were.

by **cubby69** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 8:51 am

NoMoreTails wrote:We know the musical path Journey would be on if they had continued with Perry--None.
This is my favorite Journey of all as I used to wish Perry had more of a rocker attitude in his performance and that Journey had stayed more of the rock band they were.

Well actually I blame Jonathan as much as Perry for Journey taking the turn from a rock band to a pop band. Up until Departure most of Journey songs still had a rock feel to them even the slower ones. They didn't really have a 'ballad' up until Escape when Perry had an ally in Cain in writing more pop songs.

I personally like TBF, it was definitely ballad heavy, no doubt. But you yank out three or four songs out of the soft middle of that album and you have a pretty good overall sounding group of songs. But I definitely prefer where this band has gone. I love Generations, definitely some of the best music this band has done since Departure(IMHO) the last great album this band has produced. Escape, Frontiers, especially ROR and to a point TBF were just to commercial and pop oriented for me. Not saying they were bad albums, but I believe Journey changed their sound way more between Departure/Escape than I believe they did between Next/Infinity. but then again, maybe its just me... :lol:

by **Guest** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 12:51 pm

NealIsGod wrote:I am interested to know if people generally preferred Trial By Fire and the direction the band was going had Steve Perry stayed in the group, OR are you happy with the current state of the band and their new release, Generations? I don't want you to vote for one album over the other, I want to to know if you wish Steve Perry had stayed in the group and Journey had continued on that musical path.

Well this is thought provoking to say the least! :wink:

I think we all, at varying degrees, having that feeling "What if..." regarding a TBF tour and the lineup with Perry and Smitty. I mean really, who knows?
Having said that, I do doubt the band would be together with that lineup, but there SURELY would have been a bigger buzz with Perry back on tour with Journey for the first time since 1986.

by **Monker** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:00 pm

cubby69 wrote:They didn't really have a 'ballad' up until Escape when Perry had an ally in Cain in writing more pop songs.

This just isn't true. "Patiently", one of the first songs Perry wrote with Journey, is a ballad. The "B" side of Infinity is full of ballads, "Winds of March", "Opened the Door"...even though they did have instrumental Progressive bits, they are still "ballads". On Departure, "Good Morning Girl" and "Stay Awhile" are definitely ballads.

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:48 pm

I think Cubby is referring to the sentimental, lovey-dovey, kleenex-song, pop ballads!

by **cubby69** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:07 pm

jrnyman28 wrote:I think Cubby is referring to the sentimental, lovey-dovey, kleenex-song, pop ballads!

Exactly! Thanks Dave.

What I'm trying to say is, Journey had 'soft' songs, but even a song like Patiently since Monker brought it up as an example, becomes much more than just some simple ballad. It rocks a little, and as Dave pointed out, it wasn't until Cain joined in '81 that the whole 'lovey-dovey' bullshit poppy songs came to be.

by **Monker** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:09 pm

jrnyman28 wrote:I think Cubby is referring to the sentimental, lovey-dovey, kleenex-song, pop ballads!

Oh, come on! "Stay Awhile" isn't a kleenex-song?

Won't you just <sniff>

Stay <sniff> :'(
With me awhile....

Bwaaaaa! :,'( Come on, you all want to ball like babies!

And, "Good Morning"? That's not lovey-dovey?

Oh, and let's not forget "Little GIrl"....definitely a love ballad!

I mean, com one, look up the lyrics! They are AT LEAST as sugar coated as anything Jonathan ever wrote...maybe even more so!

...the difference is, Jonathan does it BETTER. He finds words and phrases that Perry can't.

by **cubby69** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:16 pm

...the difference is, Jonathan does it BETTER. He finds words and phrases that Perry can't.

[/quote]

In your opinion.

by **Greg** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:06 am

Wow....just yesterday, it appeared TBF was in the lead. This is a tough question, just because I happened to really enjoy TBF even though it was heavily ballad laden! However, I LOVE the sound of Arrival and Generations. I also might be one of the few that also enjoyed Red 13. I'm a sucker for a band with orginal members (I know I know - Greggie Rollie was the orginal keyboardist,) but I love the band leading more toward rockers!

by **jrnyman28** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 5:06 am

Greggie wrote:I also might be one of the few that also enjoyed Red 13.

You are not alone. Once the "shock" of the production values wore off, "RED13" became my favorite Journey work for a LONG time. Only until I got a copy of "Generations" did I stop listening to "RED13" more than any other Journey work. So, for about 3 years, I played "RED13" more than anything else by Journey.

by **yak** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 9:33 am

NealIsGod wrote: I don't want you to vote for one album over the other, I want to to know if you wish Steve Perry had stayed in the group and Journey had continued on that musical path.

Well, no, NIG, because if Perry had stayed with the band.......

There would be no band! :roll:

by **NealIsGod** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 9:57 am

yak wrote:
NealIsGod wrote: I don't want you to vote for one album over the other, I want to to know if you wish Steve Perry had stayed in the group and Journey had continued on that musical path.

Well, no, NIG, because if Perry had stayed with the band.......

There would be no band!

I guess I should have been more clear. I mean do you like the direction the band was going in with TBF, had Perry remained in the band AND STAYED IN IT, or do you prefer the current state of the band. My bad.

by **Eric** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 1:58 am

I would love to see what Journey would have done had Perry not retired.....but that is so hypothetical I think my brain may explode.

by **yak** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 6:21 am

NealIsGod wrote:I guess I should have been more clear. I mean do you like the direction the band was going in with TBF, had Perry remained in the band AND STAYED IN IT, or do you prefer the current state of the band. My bad.

No prob, NIG, but the point is rather moot because Perry left each project, everytime he rejoined, before anybody had a chance to find out what would or wouldn't happen.

I love Journey now. It's rockin', it's in a good place, and it's had great success this summer. It's a bit like Journey starting over after Perry left...It took a while for the band to find their way once again, but little by little they have, and now they're on their on their way once again, more cohesive than ever.

by **jrnyman28** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 6:58 am

yak wrote:It took a while for the band to find their way once again, but little by little they have, and now they're on their on their way once again, more cohesive than ever.

Too bad NOW is when they decide to take some time off....

by **Fingers_of_Joy** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 2:08 pm

Hi..New here.

I saw the band last night, and was and still am in awe.

I voted to go with the Generations way of thought. Journey now is every bit as good as the "classic Journey."

I wouldn't be too quick to say the band is taking time off.. I just checked their website, and even though the Greek Theatre was to be their last stop, it now seems they have added "new" shows while making up the cancelled stops as well. Then they have Europe just around the corner. My feeling is they take these 3 weeks off, and get back on the horse again.....

by **jrnyman28** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:23 am

Neal and Steve have mentioned their plans for the near future in his interview with this site. The band has added some shows. I suspect that if "Generations" were to "hit" then Journey's plans would change. But Neal wants to get SS rolling again. And Steve wants to spend some time with his son before he goes off to college. There hasn't been much of a writing/recording spark for the guys either. Yes there will be some time in Europe next summer, but that is a long time gone. Journey is really rolling now, it is not the best time to back off. But, as I say often, it all depends on what Journey wants. They seem to be pretty content wth the way things are going now. So they have no need to worry.

Welcome to the board Fingers_of_Joy. Have you met NoMoreTails? You are both named after Neal publishing names...

by **NoMoreTails** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:33 am

Yes, welcome Fingers Of Joy, now we just need a Rockdog on board.

Regarding Journey's plans, I hope they do change and am encouraged somewhat by the addition of shows this fall/winter. I believe Steve's plan to spend one last summer with his son before he leaves the house is a result of Journey's lack of summer 06 activity, with the exception of the couple of weeks or so in Europe, and not the reason for it. A Journey winter-spring or spring-summer tour of the US would leave plenty of time for Soul Sirkus to record and tour in the fall of 06. Now is the time for Journey to push forward.

by **jrnyman28** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:40 am

NoMoreTails wrote: Now is the time for Journey to push forward.

I agree.

by **yogi** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 3:16 am

I have yet to hear Generations. Our Wal Mart was suppose to get it last Tuesday, but the CD was a no show so I cant vote yet.

But I must say I thought the band must of liked the direction of Trial By Fire because Arrival was SURE cut from the same cloth.

I was hoping the band would come out with some songs like Remember Me on Arrival. But outside of World Gone Wild I was disappointed. I really felt they were trying toooo hard for a Steve Perry record.

In Generations I am hoping for a Remember Me type of Journey.

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 3:41 am

yogi wrote:In Generations I am hoping for a Remember Me type of Journey.

I don't know what that means.
"Remember Me" sounded like classic melodic rock to me, and I feel Arrival had an ample portion of that.
"To Be Alive Again" "I Got a Reason" "Higher Place" and the aforementioned "World Gone Wild".
However, even with all that, it could've used even more.

As far as seeing a re-occurence of that sound on "Generations", I am afraid you will be sadly dissapointed. With the exception of "Place in Your Heart" and "Never Too Late" this Journey album is largely a musical beast all it's own.

"Out of Harm's Way" has an Escape vibe to it though.

by **heardonthestreet** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 8:32 am

I know that it's off topic, Noble, but It's a riot the way your posts fit your avatar so well.

Just a random thought! :lol:

by **Fingers_of_Joy** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:05 am

heardonthestreet wrote::lol: I know that it's off topic, Noble, but It's a riot the way your posts fit your avatar so well.

Just a random thought!

I know that at a newbie shouldn't say anything, but that picture scares me! Eeew! I have to make sure to steer clear of Rush....lol

Generations..Bought it the day it came out.. I absolutely love it! IMO, far better than Arrival, and twice the record of Trial by Fire...not even close!

So far I like tracks, 1 (love it), 2 (even better), 3 is nice, 4 is catchy...I need to listen to the rest..

by **heardonthestreet** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:12 am

Sorry fingers-of-joy, but your nic cracks me up, more than Nobles avatar. It's just me so don't be offended. I tend to see humor where none exists. It's a way of life. Anyway.......................................

by **jrnyman28** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:58 am

heardonthestreet wrote: I tend to see humor where none exists. It's a way of life.

I feel the same way about your posts...

MR