Finale

[Rockindeano]

get the fuck outta here and go die.

With all due respect, Dean, you have disowned Journey, but you are in a Journey forum telling a huge Journey fan to go away. A bit ridiculous, don't you think?

With all due respect NIG, I haven't disowned Journey. I just want them to stop this shit.

With all do respect NIG, you have no right to tell me what I can and can't do. I have been a main staple hear and contribute a helluva lot more than that kook.

With all due respect NIG, you have disappointed me in your lack of character.

I look at this way. IF Journey sings live this tour, then either I am wrong, or I have possibly in some way contributed to them to get their act back on the proper track. IF they don't, I will light their asses up like no other. This isn't a Journey only thing. It's a rock n roll thing.

I notice nether arrivalrules, 13 nor yourself has commented on the hard evidence. Lots of diversion. Sorry, I am not waning.

[Red13JoePa]

Yes I have, and I'll comment again. It's not evidence of the accusation. Too many of them have different vocals.

[Rockindeano]

Yes I have, and I'll comment again. It's not evidence of the accusation. Too many of them have different vocals.

Ok 13. Good enough for me.

So let me ask you, when Jeremy comes in and says he matched em all up and they are identical, will that be good enough for you?

Your defence is waning. People know you are blocking for blocking's sake.

[Red13JoePa]

No. I asked for JH's opinion not knowing what he'd say. He sided for the most part with you. Doesn't mean I agree with it, nor does it mean the guy (or you) is not my friend.

PS. What "people?" I just hope this "people" is not the guy I think it is. You've taken that "people's" word for way too much already.

[Free]

When Journey pays my mortgage, puts food on my table and clothes on my kids backs I'll let this alleged information outrage and upset me.

Until then, they are nothing but a band and they could care less if I exist or not.

As for calling everyone a foul, vulgar name that does not happen to support your theory 100% is about as immature as it gets.

New topic please.

They should care if you exist or not. You are one of their fans that pays their mortgage, puts food on their table and clothes on their kids.

[Rockindeano]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

[Rockindeano]

No. I asked for JH's opinion not knowing what he'd say. He sided for the most part with you. Doesn't mean I agree with it, nor does it mean the guy (or you) is not my friend.

He didn't side with me. He fucking proved it with technology that he himself uses to test out stuff. First you want a professional singer to debunk me, and he validates me instead. Talk about your all time backfires.

[Free]

Well…I hate to interrupt, but I have to get technical… and this is my last "entry", so to speak.I really don’t need more proof.
I loaded the Greek and the Montreal tracks on two different audio programs,equalized their volumes and overlapped them. Made them play from the same exact nanosecond where SA emits the first note.The result was a perfect match.Every word,every syllable has the same inflection and the same length,which is impossible to happen in two different shows.Even supposing that SA is using the same modulations everytime he sings Faithfully,it is impossible to be such a mathematical singer and be able to sustain a note identically each and everytime.He is not a robot!So as long as he doesn’t have a MD in his throat then there must be one at the mixer.Or whatever they’re using.
Maybe they don't do this all the time,but it's sad enough that it even happened.

One more thing...It's obvious that ALL the bands out there are playing around with technology because it is so easy to use and so tempting.They all want to sound as best as they can.But as long as an artist walks on stage he is supposed to do his job for real.
A comparison would be when a man realizes that his woman is faking one orgasm out of two... Damn it!

Good comparison but most guys don't care if his women is faking. Except me of course. I'm such a thoughtful husband.

[Abitaman]

I felt compelled to post this again.

This is it.

Reply to Abs if I feel up to it? He doesn't deserve the response.

Tell you what, and listen carefully. I have never been this pissed.

Fuck you, 13. You are a douche. For you to say to me in PM, if this shit, and I use the term loosely, is real and proved, then you would say, "you're right, Dean." Instead, you cower and run around with your other blinded folk. Fuck, it's been proved here a few times, SCIENTIFICALLY by a singer no less, with more than sufficient technology. You are spineless. I have lost a great deal of respect for you. I was the only one to put my fucking neck out there to be chopped off, with a chance to be sued(which will probably happen now), because I knew I was right, and that current day Journey, led by Neal fucking Schon, have ripped us off for 2 years(allegedly). Yep, that's right. Neal, if you got a problem with me, feel free to get in touch via PM or have your "people " do it. You are ALL spineless fuckers.

I did this because it stinks to high heaven. The people here who now believe and do believe are smart and have a spine...you others are blind and/or retarded.

Eric(Abitaman), you are the dumbest SOB I have ever met. Fuck you. YOU GODDAMNED KNOW they have been fakin it, yet you are such a Goddamned pussy, you STILL can't see the difference between night and day.

This is the EASIEST disection you will ever see. let's see, the two professional singers on this board agree 100% that there is a Fucking Taped Fraudgeri performing. (By the way Steve, you too can feel free to PM me, or have one of your "people" do it as well). You wouldn't last 5 minutes with me in an interview, because I have all the truth. You would be exposed faster than Janet Jacksons' left tit...Now, my hard evidence is locked away.(Sorry Irving, you can't have the hard truth you scumdick).

I am furious at all of you who tell me, "produce it, loudmouth" or "Let's hear it RnD." I present it, it's proven, and you yellow-bellied pussies elect to go stray on me. I am serious, fuck you all(you know who you are.). I DESERVE some respect, IMO, for having the FUCKING balls to present this serious accusation, and present IRREFUTABLE truth, and have you all say, "I still don't believe this."

Well guess what. This isn't ending. Eric, fuck you again, you know why? I DID LOVE Journey, but NEVER again. Your stupid assed post(like it's any different than any before) set me off. This story is headed for a MAJOR MUSIC PUBLICATION, and don't think I won't do it. You can all get ready for a bomb in the industry, courtesy of yours truly. I was going to drop this whole thing. I felt bad, and was going to let it dissipate. After taking the day off(due to some legal pressure), and after reading the shit that has been spoken of in my absence, I have decided to tell all. So those of you who thought I was too scared to tell the secret first time, you get another chance to second guess me. You will all see this blowing up in the very NEAR future. There is a chance this tour does NOT get finished, that's how serious I am.

Eric, 13, NIG, Big J, Eric, Dave28, Yogi, and anyone else I forgot, you all are either deaf, blind, spineless, or flatout lifeless to NOT back someone(ME) who used to go to war for this band, and now is soured because of corruption and FLATOUT ROBBERY, even after my FACTUAL EVIDENCE has been proved.

Don't think I wouldn't blow the whistle on Bruce Springsteen, The Stones or U2 if I knew the same thing. Jeremy needs to reappear. Jeremy needs to say that although bands do this every night, they don't do it to these extremes. THIS IS FRAUD.

Neal, Jon, Deen, Ross and Steve, I would love to talk face to face with ANY of you, because you are ALL guilty, along with Management(allegedly), for this TRAVESTY.

It is highly unlikely I will EVER forgive those who told me to prove it, then ran and kept up their spineless BS.

Thanks a lot guys. Just keep telling yourselves I am a Loon.

Sincerely,

The ONLY one with guts and balls on this Pussy laden board.

Dean, why is it, if someone disagrees with what you say, they are dumb, stupid, don't know what they are talking about? Why are you name calling and Cussing these people? Someone thinks different from you, look out, you will do your best to run them into the ground. How many times have you promised to quit the board, then come back. How many times have you promised something...and not done it.
Maybe I do need a dictionary to spell, but it doesn't take much intelligence to spell cuss words, most are four letters anyway. Maybe you need the dictionary to learn some new ones
I have nothing against you, other than how you wrought this about.
As for you denying the list of 10 things, so be it. You say you never said it, so be it. I say you did. Who they gonna believe. Doesn't matter to me, why because.......well look at my first paragraph.
But I have nothing against you, you just keep hammering this in, and would not let up. How many time have you done this to someone? yea I BELIEVE Journey is guilty of this! Happy!?! BUT, not the the degree you say. I have thought this for some time. I have stood behind them, just like I stood behind you with your wreck and cancer, when there was lack of either, and everyone was coming down on you. I believe you on that, and as said, would today stand behind you, the same way with Journey. You didn't want people accusing you then, same with Journey.

Anyway, you didn't say all those thing I posted fine, No one else has spoken up, maybe I dreamed it. But I don't think I did, but since you promised to over look all my posts, maybe someone will read this to you, but I have no hard feelings, sorry you do, BUT GET OVER IT!-ERIC

[Red13JoePa]

No. I asked for JH's opinion not knowing what he'd say. He sided for the most part with you. Doesn't mean I agree with it, nor does it mean the guy (or you) is not my friend.

He didn't side with me. He fucking proved it with technology that he himself uses to test out stuff. First you want a professional singer to debunk me, and he validates me instead. Talk about your all time backfires.

I didn't KNOW what he'd say. I was hoping for a different opionion out of him but oh well.
I'll sleep alright. It's not a chess game, not a war, nothing like that.

[jrnyman28]

Funny how you can claim he sings 95% of the songs, and that the songs don't sound alike, yet you just said you didn't upload and listen to the songs. Amazing.

I think he was referring to uploading his stuff and analyzing it all.

[Rockindeano]

Dean, why is it, if someone disagrees with what you say, they are dumb, stupid, don't know what they are talking about? Why are you name calling and Cussing these people? Someone thinks different from you, look out, you will do your best to run them into the ground.

Stop right there. You aren't disagreeing with me because you disagree. You just don't want the Loons to get the upper hand.

How many times have you promised to quit the board, then come back. How many times have you promised something...and not done it.

So I said I would quit and didn't. is that a crime? No. And what the fuck are you insinuating( deftly asking), I have promised and not kept? I promised to put these out there and did...Now your panties are all in a wad. You are shocked.

But I have nothing against you, you just keep hammering this in, and would not let up. How many time have you done this to someone? yea I BELIEVE Journey is guilty of this! Happy!?! BUT, not the the degree you say.

Unbelievable.

I have thought this for some time. I have stood behind them, just like I stood behind you with your wreck and cancer, when there was lack of either, and everyone was coming down on you

.

Lack of either? I wish I lied about those two things. Fuck you Eric. So you stood behind me then, but now say I was full of shit. What a Christian backbone. Where the fucks the morality of honesty you Christians always speak of?

I believe you on that, and as said, would today stand behind you, the same way with Journey. You didn't want people accusing you then, same with Journey.

Hey, Journey are multi-millionaires. What's the difference between Journey and Ken Lay? Answer; Journey has more members.(allegedly)

[*Laura]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

Ok,I lied.I have to make on more comment because this is absolutely... Seriously,one must be deaf not to hear this!
True,until 2:53 he is live and a little out of pitch towards the end.Then I hear the switch.It almost like I "felt" a fresh soundwave going through my ears.Major change,anyway.
I can see why they used this trick...SA was getting vocally tired and that is the most demanding part of the song.
I couldn't help noticing that Deen was killing himself in the background...for real.

[Free]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

Ok,I lied.I have to make on more comment because this is absolutely... Seriously,one must be deaf not to hear this!
True,until 2:53 he is live and a little out of pitch towards the end.Then I hear the switch.It almost like I "felt" a fresh soundwave going through my ears.Major change,anyway.
I can see why they used this trick...SA was getting vocally tired and that is the most demanding part of the song.
I couldn't help noticing that Deen was killing himself in the background...for real.

If people still don't believe it after listening to this then there is NOTHING that will make you believe this.

[Abitaman]

I think Deano you are reading what I said about the accident the wrong way. I am saying I was behind you 100%. And although you had no proof of it, as a friend I stood behind you. That is what a Christain or any friend does. The fact that ws no press or pictures, I DID NOT CARE, I was behind you!!! Stop trying to look at what I say as the worse ( I know with my spelling, it is easy to do ) And as I said, I would be behind you if that were to happen today!!!!
I was using your accident of how one stands behind a friend, proof or no proof. I didn't need proof, everyone was trying to disprove you, remember? And the Journey part of it was to imply that, I stand behind this group, and will becasue I like them, support them. Yes it appears the band is going thru some hard times, but I have not given up on them, nor you.
Christain backbone? It takes more backbone to stand up to a friend and say they are wrong, and then support the,, than say I'm out of here, or call some one names.
Dean, I' admitted to some of what you thought, but I do not think it is as bad as you say. That does not make for a bad show.
And yes Perry did!!! More to make his voice fuller than anything.

Well lost my thought, had to go, my son feel and hit his head. Don't remember what was next.

90%of the big acts are doing this now, and the smaller ones too. Just becasue everyone is doing this, does it make it right, NO! But they are there to give the most abng for the buck, while staying honest. Sort of like special effects in a movie, should they stop using computers to make the movies look better. They better not stop, I want to belive a man can fly this summer (Superman Returns plug, sorry). It is in all how you look at it. Same with life too!

So Deano, stay mad at me? Up to you, still don't agree, and I'll let you know. Still think you talked to me about those 10 things, you don't, fine!
But, don't say I don't have backbone, because I refuse to get down and dirty like you.
One last thing I don't wear panties dude-ERIC

[jrnyman28]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

OK, I must say that I do believe there is a bad thing happening with Journey. But there is a flaw with using this example: You have maintained all along that Steve would sing the first 20 seconds or so and the last 20 seconds or so. But you alledge that Steve is lip-synching the rest. Now you offer an example where he sings almost half the song, has some trouble, and gets help from the tape for a section, and then returns to singing. This is a better example of what the "other side" is saying than it is what You are saying.

[Abitaman]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

Ok,I lied.I have to make on more comment because this is absolutely... Seriously,one must be deaf not to hear this!
True,until 2:53 he is live and a little out of pitch towards the end.Then I hear the switch.It almost like I "felt" a fresh soundwave going through my ears.Major change,anyway.
I can see why they used this trick...SA was getting vocally tired and that is the most demanding part of the song.
I couldn't help noticing that Deen was killing himself in the background...for real.

And why were they doing this? To blind the fans becasue they thing they are stupid? No, trying to put on a good show? How long were the shows last year? I can overlook it.-ERIC

[Rockindeano]

You have maintained all along that Steve would sing the first 20 seconds or so and the last 20 seconds or so. But you alledge that Steve is lip-synching the rest. Now you offer an example where he sings almost half the song, has some trouble, and gets help from the tape for a section, and then returns to singing. This is a better example of what the "other side" is saying than it is what You are saying.

This is the exception, not the rule. After hearing him live for 2:53, they SHOULD use tape...Oh, j/k.

He tackles a few piddly minutes of HP. Poor Deen is singing a duet with a laser tape machine, and Neal and Jon are counting in their domes the thousands going into their accts.

[Rockindeano]

How long were the shows last year? I can overlook it.-ERIC

You are too easy.

This show was 90 minutes..REAL grueling.

[Abitaman]

How long were the shows last year? I can overlook it.-ERIC

You are too easy.

This show was 90 minutes..REAL grueling.

SO!! He is having trouble. You never had trouble. If it was Perry everyone would be defending him-ERIC

[Rockindeano]

How long were the shows last year? I can overlook it.-ERIC

You are too easy.

This show was 90 minutes..REAL grueling.

SO!! He is having trouble. You never had trouble. If it was Perry everyone would be defending him-ERIC

What? We were ALL over him for his singing in Chicago at the world Series! Dude, you need to get a clue.

This is NOT a Perry thing.

[junky]

Here is a PERFECT case of taping.

Now this is from Casino Rama, Toronto, ONT.

Higher Place. He sounds awful for the first 2:53. Then you can hear the double hiccup, and voila! perfecto! They turn him back on at 5:01. Embarrassing.

All Augeris' choruses are lipped but Deen is live. At one point Deen is singing a duet with a tape machine. Classic.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?a ... AD6914BF08

OK, I must say that I do believe there is a bad thing happening with Journey. But there is a flaw with using this example: You have maintained all along that Steve would sing the first 20 seconds or so and the last 20 seconds or so. But you alledge that Steve is lip-synching the rest. Now you offer an example where he sings almost half the song, has some trouble, and gets help from the tape for a section, and then returns to singing. This is a better example of what the "other side" is saying than it is what You are saying.

Yes, thanks Dave.
This is why I have been in disagreement with you Deano.
I saw Journey six times last year and Higher Place is a good example of what I heard.
Yes, I believe Steve is lip-synching, some, but not all the leads(except the intro and outro) at all 80-odd shows they did last year.

It also supports what Jeremy had to say:

My suspicion is this: The tracks are always there, but not always put through the house PA. The entire Journey show is done to click track with BGV and rhythm guitars and synth licks throughout the show. The lead or "guide" vocal is sent on it's own channel out to the front of house mixer as well....My guess is that depending on the night or the song, the engineer will blend a mix of the guide vocal and the live mic depending on how well Steve's voice is holding up. End of the mystery, bada bang bada bing....

[AR]

If people still don't believe it after listening to this then there is NOTHING that will make you believe this.

That was absolutely Steve's worst sounding night of the tour. No wonder I hate that boot. And what I've said is true. He struggled live to the point of Higher Place where it is pretty much all chorus/duet. And this is not done every night as some would imply. These threads have read like Augeri isn't singing at all.

So they have a choice. Stop the show cold in mid song, or enhance a minute or two.

You tell me what the audience would prefer?

Why ruin an entire show over a problem that isn't constant?

Also tell you what, if someone wants to Pro Tools several complete shows, I will circulate the stuff I can and you'll see how often it happens. (not very)

If you want the true indication you need many shows from several tours. Analyze the entire show, not just a snippet here and there. Also you should check out shows from a couple different tours. You'll find very little enhancements on the earlier tours.

My 2 cents. Still don't see what everyone is up in arms about. Augeri is gutting it out as best he can, not doing full blown lip synchs like some here are alledging.

If you want, blame the band for going out on tour too often to make money. Don't blame the guy trying his ass off on lead vox and make him out to be a "fakery" or whatever else. Really what they should do is avoid the songs that are problematic, but sometimes you don't know until the show is under way.

And again, if you think this is out of the ordinary for many bands (especially bands of Journey's age) then think again. I could do this same kind of thing with plenty of other groups.

[jrnyman28]

If you want, blame the band for going out on tour too often to make money. Don't blame the guy trying his ass off on lead vox and make him out to be a "fakery" or whatever else. Really what they should do is avoid the songs that are problematic, but sometimes you don't know until the show is under way.

This is where I am at. I think Neal and Jon have been pushing too hard. I think they are the ones pulling the strings. I also think there would have been less vocal problems for Steve if he had the opportunity to sing more of his own material. That stuff would feel more natural to him. But instead, Neal and Jon kept pushing the hits (and almost ONLY the hits) year after year after year. They have toured too much. They have toured 2.5 hour shows following a long 90 minute tour. I know this is what they learned from HH. And I know it is important to stay oput there in everyone's face. But at the expense of their singer? I thought they learned their lesson from Perry's voice. I didn't think they would do that again. Especially when the singer admittedly was never as strong as Perry, and he HAS to sing all that Perry material.

[AR]

This is where I am at. I think Neal and Jon have been pushing too hard. I think they are the ones pulling the strings. I also think there would have been less vocal problems for Steve if he had the opportunity to sing more of his own material. That stuff would feel more natural to him. But instead, Neal and Jon kept pushing the hits (and almost ONLY the hits) year after year after year. They have toured too much. They have toured 2.5 hour shows following a long 90 minute tour. I know this is what they learned from HH. And I know it is important to stay oput there in everyone's face. But at the expense of their singer? I thought they learned their lesson from Perry's voice. I didn't think they would do that again. Especially when the singer admittedly was never as strong as Perry, and he HAS to sing all that Perry material.

Exactly. Great post He has been pushed way too hard.

Augeri is 47 years old now himself. Not the same singer he was when he joined due to the abuse. He is still very good at this point more often than he is not though.

So the band could sack him completely, go get Hugo, Kevin Chaflant, or maybe the guy from Frontiers. What does that get them? Not much. And they'd probably wear out as well.

Or they can stick with a loyal soldier who is still good, and have some aides to help pick him up every once in awhile when he's off. With the amount of shows they play every year, I have no problem with them covering the occassional hiccup. I'd rather have them do that and still go to the shows and have a great time.

[Rockindeano]

That was absolutely Steve's worst sounding night of the tour. No wonder I hate that boot.

What? That boot is pretty damned good except for about 5 minutes, HP being the main culprit. Hell, The entire show was flawless because it was borrowed from Vegas 5 years ago. The worst sounding show was irvine, opening night. people walked out.

And what I've said is true. He struggled live to the point of Higher Place where it is pretty much all chorus/duet. And this is not done every night as some would imply.

That was one song. The rest of that night was lipped, plain and simple except LTS as always
. You are wrong.

These threads have read like Augeri isn't singing at all.

Yep, that's my claim.

So they have a choice. Stop the show cold in mid song, or enhance a minute or two.

Choice? Well ok, I can see getting through the song, for sure. But when that goes over well, they do another song, and then another and another. See a pattern here?

Choice? Step down. Fire his ass. Make up a story of illness. Something, but don't keep doing it!

You tell me what the audience would prefer?

A Live show. Honesty. You know, what they paid for.

Why ruin an entire show over a problem that isn't constant?

Why put yourself in that position in the first place. If you can't get past the first round on American idol, you shouldn't sing in Journey for Christs' sakes!

Also tell you what, if someone wants to Pro Tools several complete shows, I will circulate the stuff I can and you'll see how often it happens. (not very)

I don't care about pro Tools. I care about faking an act.

If you want the true indication you need many shows from several tours. Analyze the entire show, not just a snippet here and there. Also you should check out shows from a couple different tours. You'll find very little enhancements on the earlier tours.

Thank you. You made my point. This year, the voice was so bad, they had no choice. He was great in 2000, 01, and 02. 03 is the start of the decline.

My 2 cents. Still don't see what everyone is up in arms about. Augeri is gutting it out as best he can, not doing full blown lip synchs like some here are alledging.

Let's make it clear. I am the one with the claim. others have decided I was right. Gutting it out? So what? Hey, The Houston Texans gut it out too, but they went 2-14 last year. WTF is your point? Fire him if he cannot sing!

If you want, blame the band for going out on tour too often to make money. Don't blame the guy trying his ass off on lead vox and make him out to be a "fakery" or whatever else.

I agree. However, everyone says what a stand up guy Augeri is. Stand up? Knowingly going out and making money by NOT singing when your IRS return says, "singer?" Oh ok. If that is character, I am Abe fucking Lincoln. The blame goes ALL the way around on this.

And again, if you think this is out of the ordinary for many bands (especially bands of Journey's age) then think again. I could do this same kind of thing with plenty of other groups.

Again, we aren't talking a little enhancement. We are talking a much grander scale. I don't see Kevin Cronin, Tommy Shaw, Bruce Springsteen, Bono or even John Meelencamp resorting to this. Steven Tyler even stepped down for awhile. That's my point. They could have done this right. [/quote]

[Abitaman]

Deano, you know and I know it ALL comes down to Perry-ERIC

[AR]

What? That boot is pretty damned good except for about 5 minutes, HP being the main culprit. Hell, The entire show was flawless because it was borrowed from Vegas 5 years ago. The worst sounding show was irvine, opening night. people walked out.

I think both Casino Rama shows that exist are pretty bad. People walked out in Irvine because of the pre-Perry material and too much from Generations.

Your best post of the day. I still completely disagree with you about the extent of the enhancements, but then again I have more shows to judge from than you. Nothing I can do about that but get some out to people in trades.

Claiming Augeri isn't singing at all is where you lose out. You have something about the hiccups being covered, but the out and out full lyp synch isn't true.

Sorry I didn't go die. I decided to just drive home from work safely instead.instead.

If you can't get past the first round on American idol, you shouldn't sing in Journey for Christs' sakes!

Here's some conspiracy for you. Half the acts on the show "Hit Me Baby One More Time" were completely lip synched.

Kevin Cronin

He sounds horrible these days. It's like whatever manliness in his voice is gone.

[*Laura]

So they have a choice. Stop the show cold in mid song, or enhance a minute or two.

You tell me what the audience would prefer?

Why ruin an entire show over a problem that isn't constant?

And again, if you think this is out of the ordinary for many bands (especially bands of Journey's age) then think again. I could do this same kind of thing with plenty of other groups.

Nice.But you forget the moral part of all this: where's the integrity of the band and the respect for the people? With the risk of repeating myself, I'll say this again:when you decide to become an artist and earn your money from the people who buy your art, then give them what they should get – your full artistic workout. If a band can't carry on a full show without faking half of it, maybe it's time to re-evaluate.Oh,ok,if they don't care and they're in it only for the big $,then yes,they can live with compromise.
You know,art and compromise do not rhyme, in my book at least.

Can’t help throwing in another comparison: what if the people who attend the shows would pay their tickets half with real money, half with Xeroxed dollars?

[AR]

the moral part of all this

Since when have morality and rock and roll had anything to do with each other?

You want immoral? How about Madonna REALLY lip synching ENTIRE shows, charging hundreds of dollars for it, and coming out crucified on a cross?

Journey. $35 bucks for a good time, relive some memories and hear some good music.

We're going to disagree, I get that. Let me work on my list of JRNY shows so you all have more to listen and compare with and not just 2 boots from the Generations tour. I think that's where I can add the most to this discussion.

Someone post what shows you worked with. I know Casino Rama. What else?