How much does a Journey lead singer make -- any guesses?

[johnroxx]

While it may be fun and entertaining to speculate about recent Journey "happenings," I hope everyone here realizes that, for many of these things, that's all we have at this point: speculation. Nobody here knows how much Augeri has ben paid for his role in Journey. Nobody here knows if he was "paid off" for the remaining dates of the tour. Nobody here knows if he has been paid a "severance"...how would anyone? Unless I missed something, the man hasn't been fired from the band, as of now anyway.

Just hope nobody gets too riled up about all of this stuff, because for all intents and purposes, it's a buncha hooey anyway.

;^)

[AR]

All band members are equal partners. I'm sure of that

ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!

Wrong.

If I create a band and have a stake in it, and someone (Steve Perry) leaves, but retains his percentage, I sure as hell am not going to make Deen or Steve A full members.

C'mon. PM me if you really want stories.

[The_Noble_Cause]

None of us, and that includes Deano and countless other people here (excluding Andrew) who try to convince us that they're "on the inside" know exactly what happened, who was responsible and who knew what.

More pontificating.
You do realize there were reputable music industry professionals on this site's very own Noticeboard corroborating what Deano said, right?
Who are you to come along and debunk their word?

[siobhan222]

those who say he wasn't a good singer from 98-04, never liked him "taking over".

And I don't think many will dis-agree that the band as a whole was responsible for anything that happened recently. Augeri was just the fall guy. Schon/Cain/Mgmt. made sure of that.

You know what really sickening about that is *if* there is truth in this, then the band as a whole let the fraud go on ... and then, when it came out, the next logical step in the equation is that, in order to get that severance package, they made him go out and show his strained voice so that he *would* be the fall guy and be humiliated in front of the fans he played for night after night for 8 years. And if that isn't just disgusting, then I don't know what is. And the crowd who didn't like him taking over are the first ones to bash him over the head any chance they get. Instead of blaming the band for what they perceive to be the truth, they blame a man who, if this is true, was just doing what obviously, he had to do in order to have any money to take home to support himself and his family. I sat with Steve and his wife for hours. They were good people -- some of the best I've ever met -- and he had no ego. He was just a lovely guy.

So, *if* that scenario is what happened then everyone should hate the whole stinking band and feel sorry for Steve. And anyone who goes along with making him the fall guy is allowing the band to control their puppet strings and further perpetuate the fraud they so adamantly believe occurred. Where is the logic in that?

[whocares]

a few people have to understand these are OPINIONS. No one's opinion is more right than the other. No matter who is visiting Dictionary.com

I agree siobhan222, Fraud is fraud, if one is doing it, everyone is.

btw, LOGIC on an internet board?

[The_Noble_Cause]

Just hope nobody gets too riled up about all of this stuff, because for all intents and purposes, it's a buncha hooey anyway.

;^)

Online fandom thrives on this very kinda conspiratorial hooey (the firing of Ross and Smitty, the dubious Perry hip injury, lip synching allegations etc etc).

[AR]

a few people have to understand these are OPINIONS.

Agreed. I'm basing mine on some facts though that I have about Kiss & Carr & Kulick. We can go further on PM's if anyone wants. But anyone that thinks Augeri was an equal partner in Journey simply has no idea.

[whocares]

I almost said, not talking about you AR. I'm talking about a few others though.

[siobhan222]

All band members are equal partners. I'm sure of that. They are also responsible for their own actions.

The idea that anyone forced Augeri to commit fraud or that he did not know prerecorded tapes were playing is just absurd.

We don't know for sure there were prerecorded tapes ... but if there were ... ALL the band members went along with it. No one forced them to do it either, did they? They could have stood up and said "I am better than this. I won't be a part of any fraud. I have a reputation as a musician."

But if what you're saying is true, then NOT ONE of them did. So they ALL defrauded you ... yet, you ONLY blame Steve. How can that be? I'll tell you why .. because if it's true, not only did they ALL defraud you, but they then manipulated you into blaming their fall guy. And if you're playing along with that, you're playing right into their hand. And what does that make you? Their puppet. Does that feel good?

[whocares]

whatever the case, Fraud in "the real world" would get most all of us prison terms.

I dont' agree with making Augeri the fall guy, it's just what happened.

[The_Noble_Cause]

But if what you're saying is true, then NOT ONE of them did. So they ALL defrauded you ... yet, you ONLY blame Steve. How can that be? I'll tell you why .. because if it's true, not only did they ALL defraud you, but they then manipulated you into blaming their fall guy. And if you're playing along with that, you're playing right into their hand. And what does that make you? Their puppet. Does that feel good?

What can we say?
We all are fans and love the music and want to see Journey live up to their legacy and the talent that reverberates within each of its members.

[nolippin]

Yes, but the point is that if it had not been Augeri, they would have gone on with someone else. There would have STILL been a Journey.

You said (and I quote) that without Augeri "there would've been no Journey up to this point".

Well there would not have been. They made their choice. I had been tired of waiting since "Ask the Lonely" on the Greatest Hits CD.

I never said (as some nuts did) that Augeri was better than Steve Perry. What I have always said is that he was able to make me care and go to shows I would have never have seen and enjoy myself (minus 2005).

[Dano]

You said (and I quote) that without Augeri "there would've been no Journey up to this point".

Well there would not have been. They made their choice. I had been tired of waiting since "Ask the Lonely" on the Greatest Hits CD.

I never said (as some nuts did) that Augeri was better than Steve Perry. What I have always said is that he was able to make me care and go to shows I would have never have seen and enjoy myself (minus 2005).

I concur again, AR. The tapes were supposedly being used somewhere during last year's tour. Coincidentally, that's the one tour I missed as well. I have maintained since the beginning of this that every time I have seen the band from '98-'04, Augeri has been 100% live. There were way too many ad-libs and such to be otherwise, and believe me, I had great seats most times. Whatever happened on the last tour, I have no idea.

All this being said, it's amazing how some voices can still hold up year after year and some can't. Perry, Augeri, Brad Delp and Don Dokken (just to name a few) are on one extreme, but there are so many others that are still able to bring it even into their 50's. Bobby Kimball is one. I saw Toto twice last year, and was amazed at his voice. And he's said that Toto refuses to tune down-that he has to hit those notes he hit in his 20's. The guy's incredible. And look at Paul Stanley, Dennis DeYoung, David Coverdale and Ronnie James Dio (in his 60's, no less!!). I guess it's just like an athlete. At some point, you can no longer do it anymore. The muscle just becomes tired and/or irreparable. Then there are the phenomenons where age doesn't seem to factor in as much.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Thanks for trying to impress me with your ability to visit dictionary.com, though.

Only visited Dictionary.com for your sake as you questioned my usage of the term (wrongly so, I might add).
Again, even ur above response displays more unwarranted pomposity.
You're an illiterate, potato eating simpleton.
Go read a book.

[whocares]

if you aren't singing RIGHT, then it doesn't matter what your age is. If you are trying TOO hard to emulate "the voice", then you are singing wrong, because it's not natural for you as a singer. Augeri wasn't singing very many of the songs that he sang on CD's, that were more in his range.

[Dano]

But if what you're saying is true, then NOT ONE of them did. So they ALL defrauded you ... yet, you ONLY blame Steve. How can that be? I'll tell you why .. because if it's true, not only did they ALL defraud you, but they then manipulated you into blaming their fall guy. And if you're playing along with that, you're playing right into their hand. And what does that make you? Their puppet. Does that feel good?

What can we say?
We all are fans and love the music and want to see Journey live up to their legacy and the talent that reverberates within each of its members.

I can wholeheartedly agree with that statement, Noble. LOL.

It's true. We're all pretty passionate about this, one way or another. We do love this band a whole lot, don't we?

[The_Noble_Cause]

It's true. We're all pretty passionate about this, one way or another. We do love this band a whole lot, don't we?

Yes. The majority here want nothing but the best for the band. I truly believe that.

[The_Noble_Cause]

if you aren't singing RIGHT, then it doesn't matter what your age is. If you are trying TOO hard to emulate "the voice", then you are singing wrong, because it's not natural for you as a singer. Augeri wasn't singing very many of the songs that he sang on CD's, that were more in his range.

Such as?
Most of the songs seemed written for Perry, anyways.
"Kiss Me Softly" is very Steve-ish. Most of 'Arrival' seems written for Perry, however.
The trend continues on "Generations".
All of Augeri's songs are seemingly written for Perry.
"Butterfly" and "Beyond the Clouds" are more tailored towards Augeri's strengths.

[Dano]

Thanks for trying to impress me with your ability to visit dictionary.com, though.

Only visited Dictionary.com for your sake as you questioned my usage of the term (wrongly so, I might add).
Again, even ur above response displays more unwarranted pomposity.
You're an illiterate, potato eating simpleton.
Go read a book.

Nice, real nice. There's no reason for personal attacks here. I've read books aplenty, and have worked in a journalist capacity on many an occasion. Anyone who has to resort to personal attacks on a discussion board about a musical act is clearly the simpleton.

Now if you don't mind, there are intelligent adults who are here to discuss JOURNEY. As I've asked nicely before, can we please get back to that, or do you have more pontificating to get out of your system?

[siobhan222]

More pontificating.
You do realize there were reputable music industry professionals on this site's very own Noticeboard corroborating what Deano said, right?
Who are you to come along and debunk their word?

With all due respect to you sir or madam, I read an awful lot of the archives on this subject. I'm sure I missed some and I suspect some may have been deleted. The music industry professionals that I saw remark on this were a Swedish guy and Jeremey. The internet is anonymous and we can never be sure who people are behind their remarks. I don't know for sure the Swedish guy is who he says he is, do you? Jeremey is, as far as I can tell, the lead singer for a Journey Tribute Band and he appears to be a very nice guy.

From what I read, the Swedish guy claimed that there was one feed into the truck his friends were in -- that was Steve Augeri singing his lungs out as hard as he could yet missing notes and singing off key. There was another feed going to the PA system where Steve sounded perfect. Jeremey claimed that he downloaded some boots and compared them in his sound machines (pardon me if my terminology is not exact here) to the Vegas DVD from 01. He said that, in his opinion, although some of the vocals were different, there were some spots where Steve's vocals were being augmented by the DVD track. Those are two very different reports of what supposedly occurred.

I also read what was on Deano's blog until it was taken down yesterday and I went to the 2dorks.com site which hosted the 2 tracks: Faithfully and Be Good To Yourself. The assertion there was that the prerecorded taped Faithfully cut out around a minute and a half (not sure that's exact) and Steve had to sing the rest of the song but he sang in a very raspy voice. I listened to that track over and over and over and asked friends to listen to it. The first part of the track (the allegedly recorded part) was not perfect. What it sounded like to me is that Steve went to hit a high note and couldn't .. that's where it seems the allegation was made that the "tape" ended. However, although he seemed to struggle with his voice after that, he still sang. And on some notes he sounded raspy, but he did hit other notes. I played this to friends of mine who are not Augeri fans -- and not even Journey fans. They didn't hear a tape. On the second track, Be Good To Yourself, supposedly, the vocal was identical to the Vegas DVD. I listened to both over and over and over again. I stopped them and started them -- and to me, there were differences. I'm not a professional -- but I did sing with a band and in theatre many years ago. I have a good ear. Unless Deano meant some other Vegas track, it wasn't the DVD. Also, they said the track skipped at about 30 seconds. I could not find where it skipped.

Where I'm confused is that all 3 of these so called offers of proof are very different from one another. I don't see any consistency and nothing convinced me beyond a reasonable doubt. I admit I'm an Augeri fan ... but I really wanted to know exactly what happened and I spent a lot of time trying to figure it out and to be honest, when I started, I was leaning more towards it being the truth than it not being the truth. But I was not about to comment until I had done my own investigating.

Some other statements were made as to how Steve could possibly have sung so well on 6/5 and by 7/4, he was barely able to sing. Those people must not have sung very much in their lives. It happened to me in a theatrical production from one night to the next and for a week therafter. I had to have my understudy take over because I simply could not hit a note. I reached for a note during a rehearsal and obviously reached too high and my voice literally gave out. Actually, mine sounded a lot worse than Steve Augeri's on that Faithfully boot. The same thing has happened to friends of mine who sang in bands or were aspiring singers. Heck, it even happened to a friend of mine who did the karaoke competition circuit! Her voice went out in the middle of a contest in the middle of her final song.

If there is some other proof out there that I have missed while reading the archives, I'd very much like to hear it and would appreciate if someone would point me in that direction. So far, I have seen nothing that convinces me.
But that's just my opinion. Each person is entitled to his/her own opinion.

[The_Noble_Cause]

With all due respect to you sir or madam, I read an awful lot of the archives on this subject. I'm sure I missed some and I suspect some may have been deleted. The music industry professionals that I saw remark on this were a Swedish guy and Jeremey. The internet is anonymous and we can never be sure who people are behind their remarks. I don't know for sure the Swedish guy is who he says he is, do you? Jeremey is, as far as I can tell, the lead singer for a Journey Tribute Band and he appears to be a very nice guy.

Save yourself the trouble of writing next time.
The Noticeboard industry professionals I mentioned were neither Svante the Swede nor Jeremy Hudsnicker.

[Dano]

All band members are equal partners. I'm sure of that. They are also responsible for their own actions.

The idea that anyone forced Augeri to commit fraud or that he did not know prerecorded tapes were playing is just absurd.

We don't know for sure there were prerecorded tapes ... but if there were ... ALL the band members went along with it. No one forced them to do it either, did they? They could have stood up and said "I am better than this. I won't be a part of any fraud. I have a reputation as a musician."

But if what you're saying is true, then NOT ONE of them did. So they ALL defrauded you ... yet, you ONLY blame Steve. How can that be? I'll tell you why .. because if it's true, not only did they ALL defraud you, but they then manipulated you into blaming their fall guy. And if you're playing along with that, you're playing right into their hand. And what does that make you? Their puppet. Does that feel good?

Agreed. That's a good majority of the problem I have with all this. Everyone seems to have given Neal and the rest of the band a free pass on the whole debacle. I would have to guess that the whole band was in on it, if it happened (I am one of those who is still not fully convinced).

If indeed this is the case, whether they all agreed is another thing altogether, but to crucify Augeri like this and to not lay blame all the way around is mind-boggling to me. The man did his job spectacularly (in my opinion-we obviously know there are many who didn't like Augeri) for the better part of his tenure. Most people take great pride in their craft, and anyone who has met Steve or read interviews with him knows how much he loves to sing. It had to be terrible to get up there and know he might not make it through a show. Again, the man loves to sing. It is his livelihood. I just can't imagine that he was fine with this in any way, shape or form. Tapes or not, by all accounts he was destroying his voice trying his damndest to sing anyway. I've gotta give credit for that, at the very least.

[siobhan222]

whatever the case, Fraud in "the real world" would get most all of us prison terms.

I dont' agree with making Augeri the fall guy, it's just what happened.

Well obviously rules in the music world are different. I didn't hear about Milli Vannilli (sp?) going to prison. Or Ashlee Simpson. Some have said that Steve Tyler has used tapes. Others said Madonna did. And many more. In the 60s and 70s, no bands performed live on variety shows. It was all taped. They didn't go to jail as far as I know.

How can you allow Augeri to be made the fall guy and let the rest of the band off free -- knowing that if this is true -- and you seem to believe it is -- then every single one of the rest of the band knew about it. And they all want you to make Steve the fall guy? How can you allow them to manipulate you like that and still have self respect?

[nolippin]

The "Swedish Guy"'s name is Svante Petterson(forgive me, if I misspelled it, Svante) and He posts here under the nic "swepett". He has been very forthcoming with both his credentials and his knowledge of the Swedish show.

Perhaps you could direct your questions to him.

[siobhan222]

But if what you're saying is true, then NOT ONE of them did. So they ALL defrauded you ... yet, you ONLY blame Steve. How can that be? I'll tell you why .. because if it's true, not only did they ALL defraud you, but they then manipulated you into blaming their fall guy. And if you're playing along with that, you're playing right into their hand. And what does that make you? Their puppet. Does that feel good?

What can we say?
We all are fans and love the music and want to see Journey live up to their legacy and the talent that reverberates within each of its members.

So it's okay to believe this -- know that all the band participated -- know they made Augeri the fall guy -- and yet support the band in what they've done? What if they do it again with their next singer, or their drummer, or keyboard player or even their guitarist? Will that be okay with you too? Where do you draw the line?

And how can you blame Steve Augeri ONLY?

[siobhan222]

Yes, but the point is that if it had not been Augeri, they would have gone on with someone else. There would have STILL been a Journey.

I have to agree with nolippin on this point. They *were* determined to hire a singer. If it hadn't been Augeri, it would have been someone else.

[A Fire Inside]

ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!

Wrong.

If I create a band and have a stake in it, and someone (Steve Perry) leaves, but retains his percentage, I sure as hell am not going to make Deen or Steve A full members.

C'mon. PM me if you really want stories.

I also doubt that Deen and Steve are as high on the food chain as Neal and Jon.

I put very little blame on Augeri himself for this... scandal. My opinion has always been that the guys didn't appreciate him and they didn't treat him like he was (bad joke warning) part of the band. I can see someone (Neal? Azoff? Someone?) basically making him do this. There's no way a pro singer would go out and keep singing (even with help) on another tour if his vocals were in jeopardy.

[The_Noble_Cause]

So it's okay to believe this -- know that all the band participated -- know they made Augeri the fall guy -- and yet support the band in what they've done? What if they do it again with their next singer

They won't.
Jeff's got balls.
They tell him to lip and he will say "go fuck yourself!"

[siobhan222]

It's true. We're all pretty passionate about this, one way or another. We do love this band a whole lot, don't we?

Just a week or so ago, Steve Augeri was a part of that "whole". Today, he's dirt in many people's eyes. Or was he always "dirt" in their eyes anyway because he wasn't Steve Perry? Will those that disliked Augeri now flock behind Soto even though he's not Perry? If so, why?

[siobhan222]

Save yourself the trouble of writing next time.
The industry professionals I mentioned were neither Svante the Swede nor Jeremy Hudsnicker.

Would you kindly name them and direct me to their posts then please?