MY Opinion

[TRAGChick]

I wasn't comparing Augeri's "vocal help" to Perry's back up. But Augeri has been slammed for backup vocals-ERIC

No; that would be LEAD Vocals.

SP has said in interviews that he, Neal, Ross, Jon, and Smitty would sometimes stand in a circle around the mic and record big harmony vocals for use later on @ that night's concert.

OK; fine.

But when you start to employ that to a guy who is singing LEAD.....

...big no-no.

[Granny]

Augeri brought a more personal touch to Butterfly to be certain. (did they play it live? I'm not sure).

They played it opening night of the '05 tour.
I remember because amidst the sea of bad reviews pouring in, people remarked how it was one of the few songs of the evening were Augeri's voice didn't crack or croak.

I saw the second nite of the tour and he didn't sing it. Thank God! I hate that song. Well, it probably would have been good if SP sang it.
June 29, 2005 in San diego Coors Amphitheatre.
Granny

[Matthew]

Augeri brougt a more personal approach to the music.

What do you mean, Eric?

To me as I have said many many times before, Perry is the voice of Rock, many try to be like him and many more fream of being like him. Heck when I was a kid, I wanted to sing like him, but Bob Dylan was more my approach . Perry for lack of a better word, has a Rock God status. High aand lofty every one waiting to hear him sing or say something. Heck, I would pay to hear him sing the phonebook. Perry has played it smart, andy new song, cd, or tour, is an event.
Augeri is not that way. Augeri is a good singer in an impossible stituation. HIs voice is good, but not god like. He does his best, gives his best. Heck that could be any ole joe up there (who can sing and sound somewhat like Perry), giving his best and doing a good job. I like the songs he wrote, they spoke to me on a personal level, was it the lyics, the way they were sang, I don't know. I like a lot. He was over the top, sing near impossible vocals. Augeri made me feel like I could sing along and be part of the band
That is not a slam on Augeri, say he is a bad singer, or Perry like he was to out there. Perry is my favorite singer, followed by DeYoung, Kevin Chalfant, Lou Gramm, and Augeri is 5th or 6th on my list.
Hope that answers that question

Okay - I get you now, Eric. I thought you were saying that Augeri brought more genuine soul to his singing than Perry did.

It's funny - I love all that Rock God stuff and the fact that Perry ISN"T any old Joe....that he is part of an elite...and so on. Perry's voice (and yes - maybe all his helicopters and limoes and big shot behaviour back in the day) takes me out of the mundane and ordinary aspects of my life...and that's why it seems so magical I guess.

But...I hadn't ever thought about the fact that maybe it's easier to identify with Augeri...to see him as 'one of us'...and that this 'everyman' quality can create just as strong a bond.

That was a great defence of Augeri, Eric. First time in ages - if ever- that an Augeri fan has made me understand
the appeal of the guy - or why they might actually prefer the guy despite Perry's superior talent.

[Matthew]

Abitaman wrote:
Augeri brougt a more personal approach to the music.

Brought MORE of a personal approach than Perry? Maybe on the tune or two that he wrote or co-wrote. Augeri brought a more personal touch to Butterfly to be certain. (did they play it live? I'm not sure). As far as Augeri doing anything personal with the classic catalog that Perry didn't do (as writer or co-writer), you have soared far, far into the galaxy and
landed on Uranus. Try again.

Not Uranus--Pluto--the dwarf one now.!!! I saw SA perform live--the only thing I can say is that he was personal with the audience.

Strange - SA barely spoke to the audience when I saw him. But this was in June this year...so I didn't catch him in his prime.

[Enigma869]

When I was a kid and JOURNEY was "it" the rumors flew about SP using a "special" mic. I'm sure there was truth to that.

You're such a typical Augeri Head, Fyre. You just can't bring yourself to admit that Perry was an extraordinary singer - and have to minimize his talent in order to prop up the surrogate. And you can't accept that Auigeri fooled his fans either - so again - you have to scrape the barrel to find a 'similar' examples in Perry's career - again to justify and excuse the shortcomings of the surrogate.

It must be so exhausting for you - and others like you - to keep coming up with all these slippery arguments to elevate Augeri to Perry's level...or failing that...to try to drag Perry down to Augeri's level.


Would it really hurt to admit the truth? To accept that the talent and the contribution to the band of the two singers aren't equal in any way at all?

Well said, Matthew! I'm not sure how anyone could put Augeri in the same league as Perry. For the record, I don't dislike Augeri and never have. I think the guy has a good voice and actually enjoyed Arrival, a lot. Red13 was forgettable, and Generations was plain AWFUL! To address Fyre's point about the people he is accusing of making Perry an "icon", here is a newsflash for you...Perry's voice made him an icon, period, end of story!

I say if you enjoy Augeri more than Perry...that's certainly your right. Enjoy away. Just don't be so shocked when there are many more who prefer the voice that actually made all the songs Augeri was singing famous! Augeri is a good singer. He simply doesn't have the range Perry had, and I'm sure he'd be the first to admit that. I'm quite sure that if the story of Augeri's vocal issues are indeed factual, they were probably brought on by him attempting to get in the neighborhood of Perry's soaring vocals, night, after night! There is probably a reason you haven't heard a voice anywhere close to Perry's range since he departed from the music scene...It's simply a voice that can't be copied (in spite of sooooo many trying)!

John from Boston

[The_Noble_Cause]

Strange - SA barely spoke to the audience when I saw him. But this was in June this year...so I didn't catch him in his prime.

Back in his prime, Augeri would improv all the time.
Be it jumping on speakers, messing with Deen's cymbals, or in general playing with the crowd - u name it.
However, when you are singing to a tape u have to remain fairly stationary.
His range of motion and interaction became limited once they went to tape.

[SteveForever]

Strange - SA barely spoke to the audience when I saw him. But this was in June this year...so I didn't catch him in his prime.

Back in his prime, Augeri would improv all the time.
Be it jumping on speakers, messing with Deen's cymbals, or in general playing with the crowd - u name it.
However, when you are singing to a tape u have to remain fairly stationary.
His range of motion and interaction became limited once they went to tape.

zzzzz-zzzzzz

[The_Noble_Cause]

zzzzz-zzzzzz

If you were half the Augeri fan you claim to be, you would've discovered this stuff out on your own a long time ago.
As one of this forum's staunchest Augeri supporters, I have absolutely no reason to fabricate and spout bullshit.

[Matthew]

Strange - SA barely spoke to the audience when I saw him. But this was in June this year...so I didn't catch him in his prime.

Back in his prime, Augeri would improv all the time.
Be it jumping on speakers, messing with Deen's cymbals, or in general playing with the crowd - u name it.
However, when you are singing to a tape u have to remain fairly stationary.
His range of motion and interaction became limited once they went to tape.

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock?" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some integrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

Certain portions of songs were opened up to allow him to address the audience nightly.
As Dean has already pointed out, the most obvious one was FITH.
If someone were to post various FITH live from '05, u would find him addressing the crowd in the same identical spot again and again and again....

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some intergrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

He's always spoken strongly about a frontman's crowd interaction.
Using tapes in '05 he really wasn't able to do that very much.
He would go up front and shake a few hands, but that was about it.

[Lula]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock?" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some integrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

I was not there, so I cannot say. I will say that I have pretty much agreed with your opinions on most things and this is so contradictory to many reviews. I really wish there was a dvd cuz I'm thinking it was not as great as so many have said. Maybe the boys can make it up with a JSS show or two.

[Matthew]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

Certain portions of songs were opened up to allow him to address the audience nightly.
As Dean has already pointed out, the most obvious one was FITH.
If someone were to post various FITH live from '05, u would find him addressing the crowd in the same identical spot again and again and again....

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some intergrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

He's always spoken strongly about a frontman's crowd interaction.
Using tapes in '05 he really wasn't able to do that very much.
He would go up front and shake a few hands, but that was about it.

TNC - I'm convinced by all the evidence I've heard re: TapeGate - but there were a few songs that night which seemed live - only because Augeri seemed to be struggling so much. Yet - especially on the recent material off Generations - he sounded absolutely fine again. Plus he didn't give off a 'vibe' or an energy if you know what I mean...there was definitely something crucial missing in his interaction - even when singing - with the crowd.

But...looking back it didn't appear that his vocals were being layered over on ALL the songs. Do you believe - like Deano - that he was lipping 95% of the time. If so - why sing along to a tape where he is struggling?

it's possible I guess that on this particular show - which was the opening night of the European tour - after a fairly long lay-off - that Augeri tried to sing live on a few tracks that night...and they went to 95% AFTER the Edinburgh show. I was amazed by the glowing reviews of Augeri's singing on the next two dates in Milton Keynes and Manchester.

So is it fair to say that Augeri lipped 95% of MOST or SOME shows?

[Matthew]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock?" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some integrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

I was not there, so I cannot say. I will say that I have pretty much agreed with your opinions on most things and this is so contradictory to many reviews. I really wish there was a dvd cuz I'm thinking it was not as great as so many have said. Maybe the boys can make it up with a JSS show or two.

Lula - I think most of the rave reviews came from the Manchester show. But yes - I've read glowing reports of the Edinburgh show too - but I do wonder whether the UK crowd - having not seen Journey tour here since 1980 - were so passionate and excited to be seeing them at all that it was in fact the atmosphere (which definitely was amazing) rather than the actual performance which made it such a great night for many people.

And don't get me wrong - Neal Schon was BRILLIANT that night - and Deen too. But there was a marked difference between their performances and Augeri's.

[Lula]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock?" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some integrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

I was not there, so I cannot say. I will say that I have pretty much agreed with your opinions on most things and this is so contradictory to many reviews. I really wish there was a dvd cuz I'm thinking it was not as great as so many have said. Maybe the boys can make it up with a JSS show or two.

Lula - I think most of the rave reviews came from the Manchester show. But yes - I've read glowing reports of the Edinburgh show too - but I do wonder whether the UK crowd - having not seen Journey tour here since 1980 - were so passionate and excited to be seeing them at all that it was in fact the atmosphere (which definitely was amazing) rather than the actual performance which made it such a great night for many people.

Yes, quite possibly. There is something to be said about Neal on stage .

[Matthew]

Really? God...I find that so hard to imagine. You're right - Augeri was indeed stationary throughout the show...and honestly...he addressed the crowd once or twice at most ("Do you want to rock?" he asked at one point...in this totally tired, dutiful way)...and he kept leaving the stage too at every available opportunity.

If he really was a good guy or a musician with some integrity then the use of pre-recorded lead vocal tapes must have been so soul-destroying for him - and his performance that night certainly gave the impression that he wasn't happy to be up there.

I was not there, so I cannot say. I will say that I have pretty much agreed with your opinions on most things and this is so contradictory to many reviews. I really wish there was a dvd cuz I'm thinking it was not as great as so many have said. Maybe the boys can make it up with a JSS show or two.

Lula - I think most of the rave reviews came from the Manchester show. But yes - I've read glowing reports of the Edinburgh show too - but I do wonder whether the UK crowd - having not seen Journey tour here since 1980 - were so passionate and excited to be seeing them at all that it was in fact the atmosphere (which definitely was amazing) rather than the actual performance which made it such a great night for many people.

Yes, quite possibly. There is something to be said about Neal on stage .

I thought he sounded better than ever...

[The_Noble_Cause]

TNC - I'm convinced by all the evidence I've heard re: TapeGate - but there were a few songs that night which seemed live - only because Augeri seemed to be struggling so much. Yet - especially on the recent material off Generations - he sounded absolutely fine again. Plus he didn't give off a 'vibe' or an energy if you know what I mean...there was definitely something crucial missing in his interaction - even when singing - with the crowd.

But...looking back it didn't appear that his vocals were being layered over on ALL the songs. Do you believe - like Deano - that he was lipping 95% of the time. If so - why sing along to a tape where he is struggling?

it's possible I guess that on this particular show - which was the opening night of the European tour - after a fairly long lay-off - that Augeri tried to sing live on a few tracks that night...and they went to 95% AFTER the Edinburgh show. I was amazed by the glowing reviews of Augeri's singing on the next two dates in Milton Keynes and Manchester.

So is it fair to say that Augeri lipped 95% of MOST or SOME shows?

I'm no heavyweight music industry insider, but the only song Augeri sang 100% live during the '05 US tour was "Loving Touching Squeezing". It was strategically placed at the end so that the fans would chalk up Augeri's haggard vocal performance to it being the final song of a long set. I imagine it would be the same for the UK mini-tour.
He would also sing portions of other songs. Some placed in the middle, but usually placed at the very end.
He would sing the end of the song ranging from a minute to 2 minutes and then would segue into the next song.
Cue tape.

[junky]

He's always spoken strongly about a frontman's crowd interaction.
Using tapes in '05 he really wasn't able to do that very much.
He would go up front and shake a few hands, but that was about it.

SA did more than shake few hands in 05.

He would often pick kids up out of the crowd and dance with them, we called a friend on our cell phone during Anytime and he grabbed the phone and started singing into it, always acknowlegding people he recognised from other shows with a 'hey, how you doin'.

It was almost as if he had more of a connection to the crowd than to the songs.

[Matthew]

He would also sing portions of other songs. Some placed in the middle, but usually placed at the very end.
He would sing the end of the song ranging from a minute to 2 minutes and then would segue into the next song.
Cue tape.

Okay...that totally explains it. Thanks.

[The_Noble_Cause]

SA did more than shake few hands in 05.

He would often pick kids up out of the crowd and dance with them

During what song?
According to my information the only song he could possibly have done this would be LTS.

we called a friend on our cell phone during Anytime and he grabbed the phone and started singing into it, always acknowlegding people he recognised from other shows with a 'hey, how you doin'.

I know this sounds far fetched, but that was probably tape.
The FTW/Anytime duets with Jon and Deen were tape.
The Escape duet with Deen was tape, as well.

This is not to imply that Deen is taped. He sings his ass off.

As the tour went on Augeri became a pro at it.
He had been lipping to select songs on and off as early as 2003.

It was almost as if he had more of a connection to the crowd than to the songs.

I'd certainly agree with that in tours gone by, but as someone PMed me today, "during '05 Steve acted like a robot."

[Abitaman]

I wasn't comparing Augeri's "vocal help" to Perry's back up. But Augeri has been slammed for backup vocals-ERIC

No; that would be LEAD Vocals.

SP has said in interviews that he, Neal, Ross, Jon, and Smitty would sometimes stand in a circle around the mic and record big harmony vocals for use later on @ that night's concert.

OK; fine.

But when you start to employ that to a guy who is singing LEAD.....

...big no-no.

You a;; are trying to read more into what I said than what is really there. If I had meant LEAD vocals, I would have said Lead vocals. My entire topic on my thread was BACK ground vocals. FRONT BACK, see they look as different as they sound. My conversation was not about Perry or Augeri on Lead.

But again I don't believe to full story on the Augeri part as you do, again my believe..-ERIC

[Abitaman]

Augeri brougt a more personal approach to the music.

What do you mean, Eric?

To me as I have said many many times before, Perry is the voice of Rock, many try to be like him and many more fream of being like him. Heck when I was a kid, I wanted to sing like him, but Bob Dylan was more my approach . Perry for lack of a better word, has a Rock God status. High aand lofty every one waiting to hear him sing or say something. Heck, I would pay to hear him sing the phonebook. Perry has played it smart, andy new song, cd, or tour, is an event.
Augeri is not that way. Augeri is a good singer in an impossible stituation. HIs voice is good, but not god like. He does his best, gives his best. Heck that could be any ole joe up there (who can sing and sound somewhat like Perry), giving his best and doing a good job. I like the songs he wrote, they spoke to me on a personal level, was it the lyics, the way they were sang, I don't know. I like a lot. He was over the top, sing near impossible vocals. Augeri made me feel like I could sing along and be part of the band
That is not a slam on Augeri, say he is a bad singer, or Perry like he was to out there. Perry is my favorite singer, followed by DeYoung, Kevin Chalfant, Lou Gramm, and Augeri is 5th or 6th on my list.
Hope that answers that question

Okay - I get you now, Eric. I thought you were saying that Augeri brought more genuine soul to his singing than Perry did.

It's funny - I love all that Rock God stuff and the fact that Perry ISN"T any old Joe....that he is part of an elite...and so on. Perry's voice (and yes - maybe all his helicopters and limoes and big shot behaviour back in the day) takes me out of the mundane and ordinary aspects of my life...and that's why it seems so magical I guess.

But...I hadn't ever thought about the fact that maybe it's easier to identify with Augeri...to see him as 'one of us'...and that this 'everyman' quality can create just as strong a bond.

That was a great defence of Augeri, Eric. First time in ages - if ever- that an Augeri fan has made me understand
the appeal of the guy - or why they might actually prefer the guy despite Perry's superior talent.

and I have NEVER argued the fact that Perry isn't the best singer in the world, because he is. Owe everything (I think) that he has done, if not I need to get it. But most people think I have something against Perry by liking Augeri, and it is not true.... Now I just have about 68 other people on this site to have them see thinks like I do, they have to agree, just see...-ERIC

[The_Noble_Cause]

But again I don't believe to full story on the Augeri part as you do, again my believe..-ERIC

Then as a bootleg archivist you should hang your head in shame.
You hold the smoking gun right in the palm of your hands.

Luckily for Journey, you are stone deaf.

[Abitaman]

...and I would like to see Augeri back to prove he can overcome, and if not....they need to move on-ERIC

[The_Noble_Cause]

...and I would like to see Augeri back to prove he can overcome,

Won't happen. If that were the case, the band would've given him the time-off he needed to convalesce.
Instead, they toured and toured some more.
Indirectly forcing him right out of the band.

...and if not....they need to move on-ERIC

It's already happened.
Jeff and Neal can't wait to put the Augeri-era behind them.

[SteveForever]

zzzzz-zzzzzz

If you were half the Augeri fan you claim to be, you would've discovered this stuff out on your own a long time ago.
As one of this forum's staunchest Augeri supporters, I have absolutely no reason to fabricate and spout bullshit.

WhAAAAAT!? find me one thread where I claim to be a big supporter of Augeri, I've never even seen him perform. I love his voice and I like him on FITH and a few others, but my screen name is for Mr. Steve Perry, not Augeri. the zzzzz-zzzzs were for can we find a new controversy to discuss and chat about, this one is worn out like your, uh...ummm...never mind

[squirt1]

All I can say is 77-83 & 86 ticket sales were huge.So were album sales(add TBF to album sales) The band post '98 were only somewhat more sucessful than pre '77 Journey and that is because they could tour on Perry era hits.

[Abitaman]

that can be said about just any band now adays-ERIC

[junky]

SA did more than shake few hands in 05.

He would often pick kids up out of the crowd and dance with them

During what song?
According to my information the only song he could possibly have done this would be LTS.

we called a friend on our cell phone during Anytime and he grabbed the phone and started singing into it, always acknowlegding people he recognised from other shows with a 'hey, how you doin'.

I know this sounds far fetched, but that was probably tape.
The FTW/Anytime duets with Jon and Deen were tape.
The Escape duet with Deen was tape, as well.

This is not to imply that Deen is taped. He sings his ass off.

As the tour went on Augeri became a pro at it.
He had been lipping to select songs on and off as early as 2003.

It was almost as if he had more of a connection to the crowd than to the songs.

I'd certainly agree with that in tours gone by, but as someone PMed me today, "during '05 Steve acted like a robot."

I'm not sure which songs he picked the kids up on.
One of the times is on the Beacon DVD, I think.

As far as the other things I mentioned, you missed my point. last year, I went 6 shows and SA interacted with crowd quite a bit, physically, but not vocally, if that makes any sense. He spoke to me and my husband during the show and it was not caught on the mic. It was when he wasn't (supposed) to be singing. But, I agree when singing or whatever; he was very robotic. Though Deano even said himself, SA was beating his hand on his heart for effect when miming so maybe not.

[The_Noble_Cause]

WhAAAAAT!? find me one thread where I claim to be a big supporter of Augeri, I've never even seen him perform.

Which only makes your overly defensive reaction all the more stupid.
Somebody mentioned Augeri's subdued on-stage performance, and I'm not allowed to comment on it?

[fred_journeyman]

So many people criticize SA for weak vocals on his albums but fail to recognize that his were straight up vocals with no technical help. Apparently he only used technology when he was sick.

This would explain why Augeri sounds "thin" most of the time. I remember the first time I heard ARRIVAL, that was the first thing I noticed.

As far as Perry doubling, tripling or quadrupling his vocals, I'm not sure he did it so that his vocals would sound more powerful. He may have done it because he didn't really trust anyone else to be able to harmonize with him as well as he could have with his own voice. Like I said, I'm not sure...but I'll ask him next time I see him...