New Journey Era: Do's and Dont's

[VH#1]

Replace the official forum moderators w/ people under the age of 60.

And if there's a mod who is chronologically under 60, replace him/her with someone who thinks younger than 60.

There's a mod who is a college student, where have you been?

That's covered under my statement: "And if there's a mod who is chronologically under 60..."

Try looking up the word 'chronologically'.

[SteveForever]

DO:
1. Hire on a solid producer (Rick Rubin, Scott Humphreys, Terry Brown, Roy Thomas Baker) and keep Kev Elson on as engineer.

2. Get into a classic, "All Analog" studio and let Elson get that ESCAPE/FRONTIERS era sound back. Get away from the digital realm! Its too crisp and unfeeling. Get back to the tru warmth of Analog tape, real tube amped guitar tones, tape-delay echos, old style reverbs...

3. TAKE YOUR TIME AND COLLECTIVELY WRITE SOLID MATERIAL! Don't rush and throw together a bunch of unused and rehashed material like you did with GENERATIONS. Take FULL advantage od Jeff's writing skills and spend 3-6 months really working strong material.

4. It worked great with Perry/Rolie - try at least one track with Jeff/Friga sharing vocals and harmonies

5. Go back to the "One Word" album title, have Mouse do some killer oil-painted artwork (again, get away from the didital realm, it is stale and boring!), and then get out on the road, ALONE, and showcase the hell out of that new material!

6. There's 7 races left... DO A NASCAR WEEKEND!!! The band plays 1-2 songs pre-race, Neal SHREDS the SSB and let Jeff SCREAM those 3 famous words!!!



DON'T:
1. Don't worry about writing 'a hit' or 'monster ballad', i.e. Don't try to force the magic. Let it all come natural.

2. Do not EVER let Ross sing lead again

3. Do not do another double-bill, greatest hits, nostalgia tour. Go out on your own and 'ram the new material down our throats!"

4. Don't lose faith in your fans - write and release the music that is in your hearts... Chances are, what you come up with will blow us ALL away and then some


Just my 2 cents...
These are the things I would try to accomplish if I were manager for a day

This is great Carl!!! they need to hire you!
One more thing.... Have a a huge Launch Party for the their fans-let them know in advance so people can be there for pics. and meet and greet!
Also, getting the new cd into major stores where people shop-like Costco, Frye music is hard to find and usually in a mall.

[conversationpc]

5. Go back to the "One Word" album title, have Mouse do some killer oil-painted artwork (again, get away from the didital realm, it is stale and boring!), and then get out on the road, ALONE, and showcase the hell out of that new material!

Go back? The last two albums have both been one word titles. The artwork has been substandard, though.

[NealIsGod]

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

[Enigma869]

Use 1 singer only. 1 SINGER I say!

Best advice, yet! I'm convinced this is why Generations sucked so bad! Who the hell ever thought everyone in Journey had the ability to sing lead? To those who think Cain can sing...Have you heard him sing Faithfully? I realize the dude wrote the song, but after hearing him sing the tune...YIKES! Hearing Cain's version of that song is the BEST evidence on the planet that not just anyone could have made these classic Journey songs the hits they became with Perry's voice(In spite of what that dope Monker wants you to believe!) Also, the comment that Neal's voice was "fine" on "No More Lies". This is Journey..."fine" isn't going to cut it! Let Neal be the brilliant guitarist he is and leave the singing to people who actually have the ability to sing. I've said it 1000 times, and I'll say it once more...Unless you're The Eagles, there should only ever be one guy singing lead!

John from Boston

[conversationpc]

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

Good one. At first glance, I though it was a license plate number.

[Just Mindy]

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

I like that one.

[Carlitto H@kk]

Go back? The last two albums have both been one word titles. The artwork has been substandard, though.

You are correct. I should've said, and this is what I meant, "Stick with the "One Word" titles... Sorry

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

That's pretty cool!

I'm thinking of "PURSUIT"...
Get back to that subtle storyline - Infinity, Evolution, Departure, Captured, ESCAPE, Frontiers...
PURSUIT = No longer remaining passive. No Longer holding back. Going for it all, going to battle against the idiotic corporate Music Machine!!!!

[bionic]

DO:
1. Hire on a solid producer (Rick Rubin, Scott Humphreys, Terry Brown, Roy Thomas Baker) and keep Kev Elson on as engineer.

2. Get into a classic, "All Analog" studio and let Elson get that ESCAPE/FRONTIERS era sound back. Get away from the digital realm! Its too crisp and unfeeling. Get back to the tru warmth of Analog tape, real tube amped guitar tones, tape-delay echos, old style reverbs...

3. TAKE YOUR TIME AND COLLECTIVELY WRITE SOLID MATERIAL! Don't rush and throw together a bunch of unused and rehashed material like you did with GENERATIONS. Take FULL advantage od Jeff's writing skills and spend 3-6 months really working strong material.

4. It worked great with Perry/Rolie - try at least one track with Jeff/Friga sharing vocals and harmonies

5. Go back to the "One Word" album title, have Mouse do some killer oil-painted artwork (again, get away from the didital realm, it is stale and boring!), and then get out on the road, ALONE, and showcase the hell out of that new material!

6. There's 7 races left... DO A NASCAR WEEKEND!!! The band plays 1-2 songs pre-race, Neal SHREDS the SSB and let Jeff SCREAM those 3 famous words!!!



DON'T:
1. Don't worry about writing 'a hit' or 'monster ballad', i.e. Don't try to force the magic. Let it all come natural.

2. Do not EVER let Ross sing lead again

3. Do not do another double-bill, greatest hits, nostalgia tour. Go out on your own and 'ram the new material down our throats!"

4. Don't lose faith in your fans - write and release the music that is in your hearts... Chances are, what you come up with will blow us ALL away and then some


Just my 2 cents...
These are the things I would try to accomplish if I were manager for a day

Well said sir,now if only Neal would read this

[Red13JoePa]

Elson IS a "solid" producer. The band's best works have come w/ Kevcat in that chair. Elson produce, Fraser as engineer.

[The_Noble_Cause]

(unless I need background music in my truck when I go gay bashing).


Next..

I know you are joking TNC, but I don't want that kind of comment here please.

Did I fail to mention how I concurrently target stray kangaroos and bushwacking aborigines with my truck when I go on the prowl to dent in some fag skull?
J/K
Love your nation and your people.
I will abide by your rules.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Elson IS a "solid" producer. The band's best works have come w/ Kevcat in that chair. Elson produce, Fraser as engineer.

I agree sorta...but some of "Generations" sounds muddy.
Shirley's work on TBF was top notch and much clearer (if over produced).

I say keep Elson, but take ur time doing it.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Who the hell ever thought everyone in Journey had the ability to sing lead?

Probably no one.
The thinking was probably more along the lines of "why give Augeri the brunt of vocal chores when he is already fading?"

Also, Cain has a fine, competent voice.
Nothing special, but not ear-splittingly horrible.

[whocares]

Cain's voice is fine for his solo stuff, but NOwhere near lead singer quality even for only one song, for Journey. I've said many times that his version (the first solo version) of Faithfully is just terrible in my book. I could sing that way. I would have been happier with just an instrumental version rather than him singing it.

I'd like a Jeff/Deen "duet" type of song, in the old style. But keep in mind those were written when it was Perry and Rolie doing the vocals, not sure if they'd be able to pull it off and have tons of people happy these days.

[Red13JoePa]

Who the hell ever thought everyone in Journey had the ability to sing lead?

Probably no one.
The thinking was probably more along the lines of "why give Augeri the brunt of vocal chores when he is already fading?"

Ding Ding Ding!!! Preservation was the key during those sessions.
Also in a live setting, I still roll w/ giving JDouble S a blow for a few tunes. Let's LEARN from infamy, er, history. Give Deen 1 song and do the underrated Every Generation (JSS, you play rythm guitar at all ?)
Or GC of ISD.

[SF-Dano]

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

Like it

Also, the comment that Neal's voice was "fine" on "No More Lies". This is Journey..."fine" isn't going to cut it! Let Neal be the brilliant guitarist he is and leave the singing to people who actually have the ability to sing. I've said it 1000 times, and I'll say it once more...Unless you're The Eagles, there should only ever be one guy singing lead!

Uh Yea, like Joe Walsh, Don Henly, and Glenn Fry(sp?) have such stellar vocal ability, with great range. Come on.

[Moon Beam]

I'd like a Jeff/Deen "duet" type of song, in the old style. But keep in mind those were written when it was Perry and Rolie doing the vocals, not sure if they'd be able to pull it off and have tons of people happy these days.

Like we are ever happy with anything anyway
jus kiddin

[ArnelRox]

I'd like a Jeff/Deen "duet" type of song, in the old style. But keep in mind those were written when it was Perry and Rolie doing the vocals, not sure if they'd be able to pull it off and have tons of people happy these days.

I'd like to hear Jeff & Dean duet on some of those old songs in concert. I think their voices complement each other well. Although Jeff can go real high as well, Deen can really do those "wailing" kind of high notes easily & the two of these guys together would be great. I think they could also do new stuff together. But it would be awesome if they pulled out the old stuff for concerts at least. PLEASE!

[Carlitto H@kk]

Elson IS a "solid" producer. The band's best works have come w/ Kevcat in that chair. Elson produce, Fraser as engineer.

You're right, Elson IS a solid producer but...
I think Journey needs a big shot in the arm, creativity-wise, and that's what a producer is there for.
It's the Engineer that is usually responsible for the overall "Sound" that a band gets in the studio.
Elson is incredible, especially back in the day of "All Anaolog".
I meant NO disrespect to Elson at all, I LOVE the guy, he's Journey's 6th man easily.
But I think a fresh, modern Producer would really help get the creative juices flowing while Elson could capture that magic "to tape" not "to ProTools" and we would wind up with one HELLA GOOD album

Again, just my 2 cents...
Things I'd 'suggest' if I were manager for a day

[The_Noble_Cause]

Do: Much like the current Queen sans Freddie, this band needs to start talking about Steve Perry like he is dead. I know he is alive and well, but VH1 Behind-the-Music's revisionist spin on the facts have many fans feeling as if Perry was unfairly taken out with the trash. He left you guys in the lurch, not the other way around! This needs to be hamered home as often as a GOP convention shamelessly mentions 9-11.
"Perry doesn't want to work and our fans want to hear the music."
Memorize that.
It is ur mantra and needs to be repeated in every interview and promotional appearance.

[Enigma869]

The next album's name's gotta be R38ORN

Like it

Also, the comment that Neal's voice was "fine" on "No More Lies". This is Journey..."fine" isn't going to cut it! Let Neal be the brilliant guitarist he is and leave the singing to people who actually have the ability to sing. I've said it 1000 times, and I'll say it once more...Unless you're The Eagles, there should only ever be one guy singing lead!

Uh Yea, like Joe Walsh, Don Henly, and Glenn Fry(sp?) have such stellar vocal ability, with great range. Come on.

Hey...I'll give you the fact that Walsh was an average singer (but, he still at least had one huge hit with him singing vocals...Can Neal say the same thing?), but if you're putting Schon into the same category as Henley and Frey, you're freakin' STONED or completely tone deaf! Listen...I have no problem with you being a Schon rump shawab, but don't tell me that the guy's voice is comparable to Don Henley! I mean does anyone else on the planet (including Neal, himself) really believe something this idiotic??

John from Boston

[The_Noble_Cause]

Don't: Stop comparing every new vocalist to Steve Perry. Don't make the same mistake with Jeff as u did with Steve. Jeff is Jeff. By telling people "this guy is better than Perry" you are setting up every vocalist to fail and also alienating die-hard Perryloons that may have given you a shot otherwise. Say Jeff carries on in the "soul-stirring Journey vocalist tradition", but don't put down Perry.

Yes, the Perry-die hards are certfiably bonkers, but they are also potential ticket buyers!

[Enigma869]

Also, Cain has a fine, competent voice.
Nothing special, but not ear-splittingly horrible.

Sorry TNC...I'm with whocares on this one! Have you actually listened to Cain singing Faithfully??? It is absolutely, positively 100% "ear-splittingly horrible"! I honestly never knew that song could sound quite that awful, until I heard Cain's rendition of it!

John from Boston

[NealIsGod]

John, you seem like one of those people who thinks their opinion is fact. I agree with you most of the time, but I am sure there are those who don't.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Sorry TNC...I'm with whocares on this one! Have you actually listened to Cain singing Faithfully??? It is absolutely, positively 100% "ear-splittingly horrible"! I honestly never knew that song could sound quite that awful, until I heard Cain's rendition of it!

John from Boston

Yes...have heard much of his stuff. Have commented that at times it sounds like he sings out of one really badly clogged nostril. I still think he has a decent enough voice for duets and minimal parts.
It's sounds like Gregg Rolie's lesser talented brother (doesn't have that gruff-edge).

[Carlitto H@kk]

I'd like a Jeff/Deen "duet" type of song, in the old style. But keep in mind those were written when it was Perry and Rolie doing the vocals, not sure if they'd be able to pull it off and have tons of people happy these days.

The only reason I would not want to hear a Jeff/Deen duet is because, when Jeff turns on the 'Perry' (listen to Coming Home on the SS album), he and Deen would sound too similar. That's what made the Perry/Rolie volleys so great; there voice were both very different and distinct. I agree that Friga doesn't have the pipes to carry an entire 'Journey' song on his own but a Perry/Rolie-esque duet with Jeff might just be pretty damn sensational.
Just my opinion...

[Red13JoePa]

But Cain won't be singing Faithfully in concert, he'll be doing the songs he can pull off. And I happen to agree w/ a lot of the people here, nothing wrong with, in fact it's good to hear JC covering some of the old Rolie duet parts live.
And I love EG....

[Enigma869]

John, you seem like one of those people who thinks their opinion is fact. I agree with you most of the time, but I am sure there are those who don't.

Sorry you feel that way, NIG, but no big deal here! This is only the internet, dude! I never said my opinion was fact! It's fact to my ears, only! And to my ears, Cain sucks, period, end of story! I will tell you that one good thing (and only ONE) came out of me listening to Cain's rendition of Faithfully...It made me realize just how talented Perry was!

John from Boston

[whocares]

don't get me wrong, I'd love to have another "just the same way" type of song going on, I'm just not sure they could do something or would WANT to do something like that. I'd say their chances of a female duet are greater.

Enigma, the absolute worst version of Faithfully that I've heard, was Lori Morgan's version of the song. I actually liked her (for her looks at least) until she butchered that song. Jon has what I call a demo voice, good enough for demo's but not lead singing material at all.

I wouldn't mind a CD of Jon's best songs that he's written with or for other bands, as long as someone else sang the vocals on it. I'd love to hear "Remember The Hero's" or "Allies" or some such songs, in that way.

[Carlitto H@kk]

don't get me wrong, I'd love to have another "just the same way" type of song going on, I'm just not sure they could do something or would WANT to do something like that. I'd say their chances of a female duet are greater.

Their chances at "A Hit" are better with a female duet.
But for the long-time fans, a duet of Jeff and Friga would be considered a"deep track", a song that wouldn't be considered a radio choice but would be a fave of the bigger fans. make sense?