All You Conservative Bush Folk

[Gibby]

You absolutely cannot allow Iran to have nuclear weapons. To argue that they should have them because we (US) do is ridiculous not matter what political party you choose to follow.

I like what someone said earlier about the country slowly getting back into a 9/10 mentality. I think it is sadly true. 9/11 changed everything including George Bush's presidency. Whether or not his policies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been good or bad really cannot be accurately and responsibly argued until years from now.

[Behshad]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

[Scarab Pilot]

Lewinsky was a dumb point.

No its not. He was distracted from what was going on with the growing threat of terrorism on our shores.

I voted for him twice and would've again.

That's good - he could only run for two terms.

The debt was the lowest it's ever been. Economically, I was doing the best I ever had.

Thank Reagans economic policies for that. Clinton didn't do anything.

The world had a favorable impression of the US.

I could care less who in the world likes us and who doesn't. This isnt a beauty pagent. I know the Dems like to be liked but that's their problem.

I could give a crap about a sexual scandal. Big friggin' deal. The real crime was all the money that was wasted on investigating him. Ridiculous.

It shows a lack of integrity and decency as the president of the United States. It got 3000 Americans killed.

While Bush has been in office, the debt's become the biggest in history and the world hates us, and we're in a war that we shouldn't be in. What's to like there?

"Don't talk to you like you're an idiot?" Okay, but the fact that you voted Bush twice seems to illustrate otherwise . WHY would you vote for him twice? Really, I'm curious. Go to PM if you wish. Why would anybody?

Dems can't keep us safe - period. Clinton proved that.

We all have different opinions and we're all entitled to them. Didn't mean to implicate your idiocy or piss anybody off actually. We should be able to express different opinions and still have some common ground.

Name your common ground. It cannot be that 'everyone hates Bush - he's an idiot."

I'm not an anti-Bush wack job just to jump on the bandwagon. I've always been one (:))and I'm proud to be able to say I never voted for him or his daddy. Doesn't mean I thought Kerry was God, but I just can't stand behind what's going on now. Collin Powell couldn't either so I guess I'm in good company.

I never said the Bushes were the Second Coming. I was sick of Clinton/Gore. Gore would have been a bigger puss.

Regarding your last statement, I'm GLAD America is arguing with itself. It shows that we're waking up to what the F is going on. What is going on with Bin Laden has nothing to do with Iraq.

Not true. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. Iraq had everything to do with providing aid and comfort to terrorist groups and the possibility that Iraqs weapons programs could be given to terrorists to be used against us. Have you seen the southern border? Wide freaking open to anyone wanting to bring across some dangerous weapons.

All of these people are tied together via Radical Islam. Some are Sunni (Bin Laden & Saddam) and some are Shite (Iranian prez). They hate each other - but they hate us more. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Sunnis and Shites will work together to eliminate a common foe - example Israel.

[brywool]

You absolutely cannot allow Iran to have nuclear weapons. To argue that they should have them because we (US) do is ridiculous not matter what political party you choose to follow.

I like what someone said earlier about the country slowly getting back into a 9/10 mentality. I think it is sadly true. 9/11 changed everything including George Bush's presidency. Whether or not his policies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been good or bad really cannot be accurately and responsibly argued until years from now.

Gibby- how can we dictate what a country can and cannot do? That makes us hypocrits doesn't it? Trust me, I ain't for them having nukes (NUCLEAR), but I think the UN and the WORLD has to stop it and not always the US.

[Scarab Pilot]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

Hmm. Have you noticed the growing Muslum population in Europe? Europe is backing away from us because right now they are surrounded by Muslums due to lax immigration rules. Do some research on the riots in Paris that have been on-going for the past two years. There are places in Paris the police will not go because of Muslum youth who have been rioting and killing cops.

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Surf the net and find out. Its more complicated than the US making our allies mad. They are in a bad spot and may actually be calling on us like they did in WW2.


Also we can say "politcs and religion dont mix" and I agree, but our enemies are set in that mindset, so we need to learn how to deal with them on that level. They are not going to play by the rules we impose on ourselves.

[brywool]

Lewinsky was a dumb point.

[No its not. He was distracted from what was going on with the growing threat of terrorism on our shores.

Come on man, that's just stupid shit. He was distracted because the Republicans were on a buggerin' witch hunt. WHO CARES who he diddles? He was trying to get back to business and the Repubs and Televangelists wanted him to talk about getting a hummer on live TV. Ridiculous.

The debt was the lowest it's ever been. Economically, I was doing the best I ever had.

Thank Regans economic policies for that. Clinton didn't do anything.

BS!! Oh God, now you're gonna bring out Reagan. Talk about being distracted. He didn't even know what the F was going on half the time!

The world had a favorable impression of the US.

I could care less who in the world likes us and who doesn't. This isnt a beauty pagent. I know the Dems like to be liked but that's their problem.

I don't agree. Without the world support, we're on our own and that's not good.

I could give a crap about a sexual scandal. Big friggin' deal. The real crime was all the money that was wasted on investigating him. Ridiculous.

It shows a lack of integrity and decency as the president of the United States. It got 3000 Americans killed.

And what got the 3000 americans killed in Iraq? And Why? "Lack of integrity". Jesus, Kennedy was doing Marilyn Monroe. You probably woulda hated him too.

"Don't talk to you like you're an idiot?" Okay, but the fact that you voted Bush twice seems to illustrate otherwise . WHY would you vote for him twice? Really, I'm curious. Go to PM if you wish. Why would anybody?

Dems can't keep us safe - period. Clinton proved that.

I don't remeber America getting bombed on Clinton's watch.

911 was on Bush's watch. Not Clinton's.

We all have different opinions and we're all entitled to them. Didn't mean to implicate your idiocy or piss anybody off actually. We should be able to express different opinions and still have some common ground.

Name your common ground. It cannot be that 'everyone hates Bush - he's an idiot."

Not speaking politically. Sorry, was trying to extend an olive branch. I guess since you won't take it, I should just bomb you.

I'm not an anti-Bush wack job just to jump on the bandwagon. I've always been one (:))and I'm proud to be able to say I never voted for him or his daddy. Doesn't mean I thought Kerry was God, but I just can't stand behind what's going on now. Collin Powell couldn't either so I guess I'm in good company.

I never said the Bushes were the Second Coming. I was sick of Clinton/Gore. Gore would have been a bigger puss.

This is the first thing you've said that I agree with (Gore)

Regarding your last statement, I'm GLAD America is arguing with itself. It shows that we're waking up to what the F is going on. What is going on with Bin Laden has nothing to do with Iraq.

Not true. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. Iraq had everything to do with providing aid and comfort to terrorist groups and the possibility that Iraqs weapons programs could be given to terrorists to be used against us. Have you seen the southern border? Wide freaking open to anyone wanting to bring across some dangerous weapons.

Umm, the terrorist cells for 911 were operating HERE. In America. Should we bomb ourselves?

All of these people are tied together via Radical Islam. Some are Sunni (Bin Laden & Saddam) and some are Shite (Iranian prez). They hate each other - but they hate us more. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Sunnis and Shites will work together to eliminate a common foe - example Israel.

Radical Religion is crap no matter how you paint it. You're either bombing buildings or blowing up abortion doctors. No thanks, you can have it...

[Rick]

The only reason the US doesn't want Iran to have nukes is because of the power it gives them. It is the same thing as North Korea. They have nukes, and we can't do one thing to them because of it. If Iran gets nuclear weapons, then we won't be able to control them. They become untouchable. The US isn't afraid they are going to run right out and blow up Israel, but it will give Iran a whole lot more leverage. The US loses it's grip on that country. The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

[Behshad]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

Hmm. Have you noticed the growing Muslum population in Europe? Europe is backing away from us because right now they are surrounded by Muslums due to lax immigration rules. Do some research on the riots in Paris that have been on-going for the past two years. There are places in Paris the police will not go because of Muslum youth who have been rioting and killing cops.

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Surf the net and find out. Its more complicated than the US making our allies mad. They are in a bad spot and may actually be calling on us like they did in WW2.


Also we can say "politcs and religion dont mix" and I agree, but our enemies are set in that mindset, so we need to learn how to deal with them on that level. They are not going to play by the rules we impose on ourselves.

Youre missin the point dude,,,, there are also muslims in the states,, does this mean that we have to start a civil war now?
My point was that , it started off by muslims hatin us , but Bush managed to get the europeans to hate us....
And it shows about your level of inteligence when you say you dont care about what the world thinks of us.... this is not youre hillbilly neighbour hood where you think your the tough guy cause your old ride is surrounded by 2 feet of grass and you dont care about what your neighbours think,..... this is real world, and if we wouldnt care about what the world thinks about us, we wouldnt have become the most powerful nation in the world,,,, remember we didnt just forced them to respect us,, we EARNED it by the way so many leaders worked so hard for,,,, do you think we would even exist as a UNITED country if we would have had 3-4 more presidents like Bush the past 50 years? HELL NO!

[brywool]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

Hmm. Have you noticed the growing Muslum population in Europe? Europe is backing away from us because right now they are surrounded by Muslums due to lax immigration rules. Do some research on the riots in Paris that have been on-going for the past two years. There are places in Paris the police will not go because of Muslum youth who have been rioting and killing cops.

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Surf the net and find out. Its more complicated than the US making our allies mad. They are in a bad spot and may actually be calling on us like they did in WW2.


Also we can say "politcs and religion dont mix" and I agree, but our enemies are set in that mindset, so we need to learn how to deal with them on that level. They are not going to play by the rules we impose on ourselves.

So, should we just go in and kill them because they're muslims????

[Scarab Pilot]

Come on man, that's just stupid shit. He was distracted because the Republicans were on a buggerin' witch hunt. WHO CARES who he diddles? He was trying to get back to business and the Repubs and Televangelists wanted him to talk about getting a hummer on live TV. Ridiculous.

You lost me here. It has everything to do with keeping an eye on the ball. If you are easily compromised you are a liability. Clinton did his thinking with his little head.

The debt was the lowest it's ever been. Economically, I was doing the best I ever had.

Thank Regans economic policies for that. Clinton didn't do anything.

BS!! Oh God, now you're gonna bring out Reagan. Talk about being distracted. He didn't even know what the F was going on half the time! [/quote]

Economies grow and change over time, not at the turn of who is in office. Many economists have proven that Clinton inherited the economy that was in recovery. If I remember correctly the IT bubble burst under Clinton.

I don't agree. Without the world support, we're on our own.

See my post to Behshad. Europe is overrun with Muslims. See that post.

While Bush has been in office, the debt's become the biggest in history and the world hates us, and we're in a war that we shouldn't be in. What's to like there?[/quote]

As I said, I have not been happy with a lot of this. This may be any area of common ground.

911 was on Bush's watch. Not Clinton's.

Which the 9/11 committee showed started being planned and carried out under Clintons watch. Please, this didn't start on 9-11. It started in 1979 in Iran after the fall of the Shah.

Name your common ground. It cannot be that 'everyone hates Bush - he's an idiot."

Not speaking politically.

Well, what do you consider common ground?

Umm, the terrorist cells for 911 were operating HERE. In America. Should we bomb ourselves?

Actually, the 19 terrorists were Saudi who used our lax visa rules to come here. Do we bomb Saudia Arabia - whenever you're ready. The Saudis have never been our friends.

What makes them worse than radical christians? Same diff to me. Radical Religion is crap no matter how you paint it.

First, this is offensive to me as a Christian. Second, when was the last time radical Christians blew up or killed ANYONE?

[RossValoryRocks]

The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

What kind of Crack are you smoking? The President of Iraq has said it is his wish to bring about the the end of the world. He is what is termed a "apocalyptic Shiite". He want the return of Muhammad al-Mahdi...a savior figure in Islam.

He actively denies the Holocaust happened.

He would nuke Isreal in a heartbeat the consequences be damned. He would view it as the fullfilment of Prophecy.

[Scarab Pilot]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

Hmm. Have you noticed the growing Muslum population in Europe? Europe is backing away from us because right now they are surrounded by Muslums due to lax immigration rules. Do some research on the riots in Paris that have been on-going for the past two years. There are places in Paris the police will not go because of Muslum youth who have been rioting and killing cops.

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Surf the net and find out. Its more complicated than the US making our allies mad. They are in a bad spot and may actually be calling on us like they did in WW2.


Also we can say "politcs and religion dont mix" and I agree, but our enemies are set in that mindset, so we need to learn how to deal with them on that level. They are not going to play by the rules we impose on ourselves.

Youre missin the point dude,,,, there are also muslims in the states,, does this mean that we have to start a civil war now?

No, of course not, silly! There are plenty of great muslims here in the US - and I mean that seriously.

My point was that , it started off by muslims hatin us , but Bush managed to get the europeans to hate us....
And it shows about your level of inteligence when you say you dont care about what the world thinks of us.... this is not youre hillbilly neighbour hood where you think your the tough guy cause your old ride is surrounded by 2 feet of grass and you dont care about what your neighbours think,..... this is real world, and if we wouldnt care about what the world thinks about us, we wouldnt have become the most powerful nation in the world,,,, remember we didnt just forced them to respect us,, we EARNED it by the way so many leaders worked so hard for,,,, do you think we would even exist as a UNITED country if we would have had 3-4 more presidents like Bush the past 50 years? HELL NO!

Well, I guess this is where we part company. If you want to carry on a reasonable discussion without being insulting - then we can talk. Otherwise it was nice while it lasted.

[Barb]

The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

What kind of Crack are you smoking? The President of Iraq has said it is his wish to bring about the the end of the world. He is what is termed a "apocalyptic Shiite". He want the return of Muhammad al-Mahdi...a savior figure in Islam.

He actively denies the Holocaust happened.

He would nuke Isreal in a heartbeat the consequences be damned. He would view it as the fullfilment of Prophecy.

EXACTLY! This is why these people are so dangerous - they don't give a crap if they die! They think it is an honor to die for Allah.

[Behshad]

First, this is offensive to me as a Christian. Second, when was the last time radical Christians blew up or killed ANYONE?

Booohooo,, so YOU feel offended if someone puts down your religion but then you dont give a damn if someone else's religions and beliefs are connected with crimes!?
Let me guess, next you gonna blame Oklahoma bombing on Muslims!?


And if 9/11 was planned since 1979, then why do you feel that Clinton is the only responsible one!? why not um lets say, your BushDaddy!?

[Scarab Pilot]

First, this is offensive to me as a Christian. Second, when was the last time radical Christians blew up or killed ANYONE?

Booohooo,, so YOU feel offended if someone puts down your religion but then you dont give a damn if someone else's religions and beliefs are connected with crimes!?
Let me guess, next you gonna blame Oklahoma bombing on Muslims!?


And if 9/11 was planned since 1979, then why do you feel that Clinton is the only responsible one!? why not um lets say, your BushDaddy!?

Grow up. Please.

[Behshad]

What is setting us up more for an attack isn't president Bush. Its Political Correctness and the lack of a unified front in the face of our enemies.

This is a good point. However, is the entire world our enemy? Seems to be more and more every day. We have less allies than we did at the beginning of this mess. We can't say "Muslims" are the enemy, yet that's what some would wish. Even Bush has used the word "Crusade" in his speeches. As someone else said "Religion and Politics" don't mix. YUP. We ain't gonna solve it here.
So what, now we talk about Augeri's red leather pants or some shit?

You made a good point there.
Its not just muslims,,,,,
after 9/11 we had all the europeans on our side with their sympathy and support,,, they even supported us going after those respoinsible in Afghanistan,,,,, but when we changed directions and told UN "FUCK YOU " and went to Iraq for the wrong reasons is when most european nations started hating us and our goerment,, and theyre not muslims,,,,
Now, what about them leather pants!?

Hmm. Have you noticed the growing Muslum population in Europe? Europe is backing away from us because right now they are surrounded by Muslums due to lax immigration rules. Do some research on the riots in Paris that have been on-going for the past two years. There are places in Paris the police will not go because of Muslum youth who have been rioting and killing cops.

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Surf the net and find out. Its more complicated than the US making our allies mad. They are in a bad spot and may actually be calling on us like they did in WW2.


Also we can say "politcs and religion dont mix" and I agree, but our enemies are set in that mindset, so we need to learn how to deal with them on that level. They are not going to play by the rules we impose on ourselves.

Youre missin the point dude,,,, there are also muslims in the states,, does this mean that we have to start a civil war now?

No, of course not, silly! There are plenty of great muslims here in the US - and I mean that seriously.

My point was that , it started off by muslims hatin us , but Bush managed to get the europeans to hate us....
And it shows about your level of inteligence when you say you dont care about what the world thinks of us.... this is not youre hillbilly neighbour hood where you think your the tough guy cause your old ride is surrounded by 2 feet of grass and you dont care about what your neighbours think,..... this is real world, and if we wouldnt care about what the world thinks about us, we wouldnt have become the most powerful nation in the world,,,, remember we didnt just forced them to respect us,, we EARNED it by the way so many leaders worked so hard for,,,, do you think we would even exist as a UNITED country if we would have had 3-4 more presidents like Bush the past 50 years? HELL NO!

Well, I guess this is where we part company. If you want to carry on a reasonable discussion without being insulting - then we can talk. Otherwise it was nice while it lasted.

If you think personal attacks should part our company then shouldnt we have done 20 posts ago!?
Good think you can check and see who started the personal attacks first.
I am just making bold statements.

[Behshad]

The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

What kind of Crack are you smoking? The President of Iraq has said it is his wish to bring about the the end of the world. He is what is termed a "apocalyptic Shiite". He want the return of Muhammad al-Mahdi...a savior figure in Islam.

He actively denies the Holocaust happened.

He would nuke Isreal in a heartbeat the consequences be damned. He would view it as the fullfilment of Prophecy.

All you said above is correct, except one thing,,,, I think you meant the president of IRAN,,, I knew what you meant,, but dont want others to attack you for a smal typo...

[RossValoryRocks]

First, this is offensive to me as a Christian. Second, when was the last time radical Christians blew up or killed ANYONE?

Booohooo,, so YOU feel offended if someone puts down your religion but then you dont give a damn if someone else's religions and beliefs are connected with crimes!?
Let me guess, next you gonna blame Oklahoma bombing on Muslims!?


And if 9/11 was planned since 1979, then why do you feel that Clinton is the only responsible one!? why not um lets say, your BushDaddy!?

Well in this era of Political Correctness being offended is all it takes...and since you and all your liberal pals feed off of the PC thing I think you should be more understanding of his feelings.

And actually there is a VERY firm link between McVeigh and Iraqi intellegence. SO..YEAH they fucking helped to plan it.

You would think that after the FIRST attack on the World Trade Center by Radical Muslims that Clinton would have done SOMETHING...ANYTHING...but know...he hung in the Oral Office and got a good BJ and blew up an aspirin factory in Sudan! Yay Willie! Good for you.

[RossValoryRocks]

The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

What kind of Crack are you smoking? The President of Iraq has said it is his wish to bring about the the end of the world. He is what is termed a "apocalyptic Shiite". He want the return of Muhammad al-Mahdi...a savior figure in Islam.

He actively denies the Holocaust happened.

He would nuke Isreal in a heartbeat the consequences be damned. He would view it as the fullfilment of Prophecy.

All you said above is correct, except one thing,,,, I think you meant the president of IRAN,,, I knew what you meant,, but dont want others to attack you for a smal typo...

Yup typo...Sorry...

[Tom Jrnyfn]

The thing is, Iran knows they aren't going to be able to shoot off their nukes at anyone because they know the US and Europe will turn their country into a parking lot.

What kind of Crack are you smoking? The President of Iraq has said it is his wish to bring about the the end of the world. He is what is termed a "apocalyptic Shiite". He want the return of Muhammad al-Mahdi...a savior figure in Islam.

He actively denies the Holocaust happened.

He would nuke Isreal in a heartbeat the consequences be damned. He would view it as the fullfilment of Prophecy.

Correct..The strife between and Islam and Christianity go back thousands of years and will never end until the return of Christ..When Sarah and Abraham sent Hagar and Ishmael away to protect Isaac, the division started and lasts to this day..

[Matthew]

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Well, we nearly had problems from about five individuals - but overall the Muslim population lives here very peacefully.

As for the Iran issue...is there any evidence to suggest that the USA would actually win a war against them?

Even hardcore neoconservatives - such as Pearle and Fukayama - are now criticizing the ineptitude and naiveity of the Bush administration's war in Iraq (a war which has hugely increased Iran's power and influence in the region). Even the US military itself has had a terrible relationship with the White House and the Pentagon. It's all a total shambles.

Surely no-one in their right mind believes that America is capable of a successful campaign in Iran?

[RossValoryRocks]

What about Britian - our biggest ally? Have you read the problems they are having with their Muslum population? Its deeper than the headlines on CNN or NBC. There is more going on with this problem than what those who want power in America are telling us.

Well, we nearly had problems from about five individuals - but overall the Muslim population lives here very peacefully.

As for the Iran issue...is there any evidence to suggest that the USA would actually win a war against them?

Even hardcore neoconservatives - such as Pearle and Fukayama - are now criticizing the ineptitude and naiveity of the Bush administration's war in Iraq (a war which has hugely increased Iran's power and influence in the region). Even the US military itself has had a terrible relationship with the White House and the Pentagon. It's all a total shambles.

Surely no-one in their right mind believes that America is capable of a successful campaign in Iran?

If we do it right...sure we can...circa Nazi Germany 1944-45...massive bombing of the infrastructure and populace until the surrender. Now that would win Iran...but would open up a whole other can...or cans even...of worms.

Everyone wants a nice clean little war, ala Iraq and Desert Shield/Storm (Which I participated in BTW) and they tend to forget that GREAT changes to the world require great sacrafice...except the radical Islamo-facists types...they are more than willing to do so...the liberals better wake up too...if these people win the first people going under the sword are the "Perveyors of filth, pederasty, and homosexuality..." so Rosie O'Donnell, Ellen D, and most of your Democratic organizations will be the first to go.

[Gibby]

You absolutely cannot allow Iran to have nuclear weapons. To argue that they should have them because we (US) do is ridiculous not matter what political party you choose to follow.

I like what someone said earlier about the country slowly getting back into a 9/10 mentality. I think it is sadly true. 9/11 changed everything including George Bush's presidency. Whether or not his policies in Afghanistan and Iraq have been good or bad really cannot be accurately and responsibly argued until years from now.

Gibby- how can we dictate what a country can and cannot do? That makes us hypocrits doesn't it? Trust me, I ain't for them having nukes (NUCLEAR), but I think the UN and the WORLD has to stop it and not always the US.

Hypocritical - I suppose - in a perfect world. This is not a perfect world though. Nukes in the hands of countries that would like to obliterate entire populations of people is far worse than being a hypocrit in terms of international policy. Just my opinion but I think it does take a nation like the US to step in for the good of the entire world. I'm no expert on the middle east but it seems there is just a different kind of mentality. There is a certain percentage of the population that seems to be plain ol' crazy/insane and for some reason, some of these folks end up in high positions of power while so many other good people have to live under their thumbs and in constant fear. I don't know why anyone would strap on a bomb to blow themselves and others off the face of the earth. I don't know why you would want to slap a statue with your shoe. I don't understand religious fundamentalism peppered with such hatred and disregard for human life and human rights.

I do know that if you allow these kinds of folks the ability to manufacture and harbor nuclear weapons, there is nothing good that can come of it. Honestly Brywool, I'd like to see no nukes in any country but that's just not plausible. The only nuclear control left is to limit their accessibility.

[ohsherrie]

I've been trying to decide how I feel about this ever since Dean started the thread, but I can't. My mind keeps going back to the fact that it wouldn't be an issue if Bush hadn't invaded Iraq. He depleted our military resources on a personal vendetta. He called it "the war on terror" to take advantage of the nation's emotional patriotic fervor after 9/11, and ultimately made it necessary to fight the war on terror there rather than in Afghanistan where it should have been fought all along. Are we going to now take on the entire Middle East? If so, who has sons and daughters that they're willing to sacrifice for it? We don't have enough military personnel to do what he has committed us to. People are through volunteering. Who wants to see their children and grandchildren drafted? I don't.

This is another instance in a long line of Bush's fucking of this country. I don't have a clue as to how we're going to get out of it without further egregious loss of American lives.

[conversationpc]

Most Christians believe it's wrong Period. Fine, they can step up and adopt the babies of rapists and they can bury the moms that die during child birth because even though there were forseen complications, a late term abortion couldn't happen.

I believe abortion is wrong except in cases where the life of the mother is in jeopardy. I don't see how that makes me a "religious fanatic". Also, as far as the President's affiliations are concerned, I'm sure there were some unsavory associations during Clinton's presidency also, so that's really a non-issue.

As far as adoption goes, I can almost guarantee you that the percentage of Christian families who adopt is much higher as compared to the general population. Count myself among those whose families have adopted and also served as foster parents for the types of mothers for whom you speak. Mine and families like mine "step up" all the time. Unfortunately, the need is so great because others, besides Christians, aren't stepping up. Lots of people hear about the need for foster parents and say, "Oh, that's so nice that you're a foster parent. I couldn't do that." That's a load of crap.

I think we can all agree that abortion is a nasty thing and that it should be very rare.

[conversationpc]

One thing to keep in mind with the whole Iraq situation is that one reason Bush may have done this is to have a military presence in Iraq as a means of counter-balancing Iran as the major threat in the Middle East. This is something I've heard a couple of commentators talking about and, the more I hear about it, the more I see it as a real possibility.

[Behshad]

I've been trying to decide how I feel about this ever since Dean started the thread, but I can't. My mind keeps going back to the fact that it wouldn't be an issue if Bush hadn't invaded Iraq. He depleted our military resources on a personal vendetta. He called it "the war on terror" to take advantage of the nation's emotional patriotic fervor after 9/11, and ultimately made it necessary to fight the war on terror there rather than in Afghanistan where it should have been fought all along. Are we going to now take on the entire Middle East? If so, who has sons and daughters that they're willing to sacrifice for it? We don't have enough military personnel to do what he has committed us to. People are through volunteering. Who wants to see their children and grandchildren drafted? I don't.

This is another instance in a long line of Bush's fucking of this country. I don't have a clue as to how we're going to get out of it without further egregious loss of American lives.

As usual you and your posts make sense Sherrie If half the population of our nation were at the same level of intelligence as you and brywool, we wouldnt have to deal with half the problems we deal with now.

[ohsherrie]

One thing to keep in mind with the whole Iraq situation is that one reason Bush may have done this is to have a military presence in Iraq as a means of counter-balancing Iran as the major threat in the Middle East. This is something I've heard a couple of commentators talking about and, the more I hear about it, the more I see it as a real possibility.

That's bullshit Dave. In other words, Republican Party spin.

[RossValoryRocks]

I've been trying to decide how I feel about this ever since Dean started the thread, but I can't. My mind keeps going back to the fact that it wouldn't be an issue if Bush hadn't invaded Iraq. He depleted our military resources on a personal vendetta. He called it "the war on terror" to take advantage of the nation's emotional patriotic fervor after 9/11, and ultimately made it necessary to fight the war on terror there rather than in Afghanistan where it should have been fought all along. Are we going to now take on the entire Middle East? If so, who has sons and daughters that they're willing to sacrifice for it? We don't have enough military personnel to do what he has committed us to. People are through volunteering. Who wants to see their children and grandchildren drafted? I don't.

This is another instance in a long line of Bush's fucking of this country. I don't have a clue as to how we're going to get out of it without further egregious loss of American lives.

Convienent to forget that Hillary C. and a bunch of others acting on the same intelligence as President Bush said Saddam posed a threat to us. Now that is convienent politically they throw the President to the wolves.

[Behshad]

Most Christians believe it's wrong Period. Fine, they can step up and adopt the babies of rapists and they can bury the moms that die during child birth because even though there were forseen complications, a late term abortion couldn't happen.

I believe abortion is wrong except in cases where the life of the mother is in jeopardy. I don't see how that makes me a "religious fanatic". Also, as far as the President's affiliations are concerned, I'm sure there were some unsavory associations during Clinton's presidency also, so that's really a non-issue.

As far as adoption goes, I can almost guarantee you that the percentage of Christian families who adopt is much higher as compared to the general population. Count myself among those whose families have adopted and also served as foster parents for the types of mothers for whom you speak. Mine and families like mine "step up" all the time. Unfortunately, the need is so great because others, besides Christians, aren't stepping up. Lots of people hear about the need for foster parents and say, "Oh, that's so nice that you're a foster parent. I couldn't do that." That's a load of crap.

I think we can all agree that abortion is a nasty thing and that it should be very rare.

I personaly disagree with abortion. But should my personal opinions affect someone elses decision?
I think if we take the rights away from the person who wants to go through with it, then where do we stop?