Herbie Was Always The Constant....

[Greg]

However, if we go back and take a look at Journey's road in the last 21 years, I'd have to say that Herbie is soley responsible for Journey's legacy.

That's a joke, right?

Not at all. Who got Steve Perry in the band? Who got Jon Cain in the band? Sure, Gregg Rollie was good, but the combination of Perry, Schon, and Cain is what made Journey the success they are today....but without HH, Journey WOULD NOT have been as successful. Sure, Journey had a couple of radio hits on ROR...but ROR was soooooooooo much weaker of an album than Frontiers and definitely Escape. The truth of the matter is, Journey wouldn't have been as close to success as what they were without Herbie Herbert. Without HH, no Steve Perry and Journey remains a progressive rock fusion band.

Just think, if Herbie was still in control of the band in the second half of the 80's, Journey probably would've put out at least two more strong Escape - Frontiers type of albums. When Perry was handed the keys, the band eventually fell apart. Now, the same thing is happening with Cain and Schon holding the keys. Perry, Cain, and Schon are all great musicians.....the best this industry has ever seen, but talents with egos like they have needed a manager like HH to keep them grounded, together, writing music, and performing.

Yep. HH was a great business manager who contributed to the success of Journey. But implying he was the only reason for their success is a bit over the top.

Well, maybe to say he was soley the reason is a bit over the top, but he deserves the large majority of the credit. Sure, he had a great product to manage, but he was the one who put that product together. Without HH, the finished product would have never seen the light of day. And really, all I am saying in this thread is basically a proven point that Journey has made for me. That is, without the right management in place, the band will never reach its fullest potential. Disagree with that all you want, but Journey has proven that.

[Greg]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

[Playitloudforme]

He was the right management at the time, with the right product at the right time. He worked them like a product.... just take a look at that show schedule they kept up. Super human effort during their prime.

However....Product and times have changed.

[Greg]

He was the right management at the time, with the right product at the right time. He worked them like a product.... just take a look at that show schedule they kept up. Super human effort during their prime.

However....Product and times have changed.

Yes, and certainly I felt when Journey released TBF, they had the right management at that particular time with the type of product that they were offering. And, maybe hindsight is 20/20, but if they had not taken the ROR route...had kept up with the Frontiers sound...I wonder if one or two more albums like that would have gotten them into the RnR HOF?

[Greg]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

Fine ! Roll your eyes . You could have easily done a search !! How do you know what you are writing is true?? It is your perception ...... Smartass !!!!

Well you're quite rude. There is no need for name calling. What are you, 14? I certainly respect your input and if you are in the know, more power to you. However, this is a free forum board and I am giving my opinion on things. I don't care if you agree with it or not, but show someone respect who at least tries to debate in a civil, adult manner. I've done nothing to you and don't warrant such hostility.

[Cate]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

Fine ! Roll your eyes . You could have easily done a search !! How do you know what you are writing is true?? It is your perception ...... Smartass !!!!

Well you're quite rude. There is no need for name calling. What are you, 14? I certainly respect your input and if you are in the know, more power to you. However, this is a free forum board and I am giving my opinion on things. I don't care if you agree with it or not, but show someone respect who at least tries to debate in a civil, adult manner. I've done nothing to you and don't warrant such hostility.

You were the one who was rude !!! Read your first sentence! You are welcome for the link and there should be a few more for your entertainment

[Greg]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

Fine ! Roll your eyes . You could have easily done a search !! How do you know what you are writing is true?? It is your perception ...... Smartass !!!!

Well you're quite rude. There is no need for name calling. What are you, 14? I certainly respect your input and if you are in the know, more power to you. However, this is a free forum board and I am giving my opinion on things. I don't care if you agree with it or not, but show someone respect who at least tries to debate in a civil, adult manner. I've done nothing to you and don't warrant such hostility.

You were the one who was rude !!! Read your first sentence! You are welcome for the link and there should be a few more for your entertainment

Geez...I wasn't being rude. I said, explain yourself. That wasn't being rude, sorry if you took it that way. Maybe I should've have said, "Will you pretty please with sugar on top tell me your side of the story?"

[Cate]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

This is the post I was refering to > The first sentence ,Sarcasm ....

[Rick]

[Cate]

:D

[Shadowsong]

I always wondered why "Cain" was chosen as his stage name:

"In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord. But Abel brought the milk from the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering, but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast. Then the Lord said to Cain, "Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must master it." Now Cain said to his brother Abel, "Let's go out to the field." And while they were in the field, Cain attacked his brother Abel and killed him." - Genesis 4:3-8

The story continues with God approaching Cain asking about Abel's whereabouts. In a response that has become a well-known saying, Cain answers, "Am I my brother's keeper?"

Finally, seeing through Cain's deception, as "the voice of Abel's blood is screaming to God from the ground", God curses Cain to wander the earth. Cain is overwhelmed by this and appeals in fear of being killed by other men, and so God places a mark on Cain so that he would not be killed, stating that "whoever kills Cain, vengeance shall be upon him sevenfold". Cain then departs, "to the land wandering".

Some may not get it
But I like your style!!!!
What a gift
let him wander
unable to die
never knowing true love in his heart
an empty soul withering in the sands of time
doomed to a curse greater than all eternity

[MRMUSIC413]

I've dealt professionally with Herbie and his business partner Sandy many times over the last 20 years...
in saying that, Sandy was always a good guy to us...[You figure out the rest]

I've also dealt with Perry, Schon, & Cain professionally on many occasions as well...[Good luck telling them apart as far
as being "honest and professional"...there was always a dishonest angle and it was usually about money.. go figure.]

I've also had a few friends who have been managed by both Herbert and Azoff... they both were usually
described as "typical ruthless managers".... [How surprizing]

Bottom line: None... I repeat, NONE of the people mentioned above are anyone you'd call "honest and professional".

Though I don't know Jeff, he is better off, honestly... from what I understand he's a good guy who deserves better than that type
of treatment.

[ArnelRox]

Ok I'm a bit confused. In April u said:

"Amen... I used to have a friends who worked with Herbie, and he was always brutally honest about
the attitudes of Cain, Perry, etc..."

Now 2 mths later, u say u worked w/Herbie professionally urself. Which is it? U or ur friend? Or is that one & the same?

It's funny b/c I have "friends" who dealt w/Perry & they said he is always honest & very professional. I also have "friends" who dealt w/Friga & Fro & they were anything but. Heck they have even contradicted themselves in interviews.

I totally agree that Jeff is better off w/out Friga & Fro. He once told a very nice story about his encounters w/Perry tho. Painted a picture of Perry as a stellar person which jives w/what I said above.

Care to clear up this confusion & enlighten us further? Or do u like the mystique & contradictions?

I've dealt professionally with Herbie and his business partner Sandy many times over the last 20 years...
in saying that, Sandy was always a good guy to us...[You figure out the rest]

I've also dealt with Perry, Schon, & Cain professionally on many occasions as well...[Good luck telling them apart as far
as being "honest and professional"...there was always a dishonest angle and it was usually about money.. go figure.]

I've also had a few friends who have been managed by both Herbert and Azoff... they both were usually
described as "typical ruthless managers".... [How surprizing]

Bottom line: None... I repeat, NONE of the people mentioned above are anyone you'd call "honest and professional".

Though I don't know Jeff, he is better off, honestly... from what I understand he's a good guy who deserves better than that type
of treatment.

[MRMUSIC413]

Care to clear up this confusion & enlighten us further? Or do u like the mystique & contradictions?

Easy, killer... not a contradiction. I've dealt with him on a professional level and so have colleagues... and obviously notes are compared. (Without going into a lot of detail, I dealt with him professionally and a handful of friends dealt with him professionally - none of us worked FOR or WITH his management group.) Herbie was always blunt... blunt about everything. I'd speak to him on the phone once in awhile or see him on the road on the rare occasion. (Obviously, as you could tell in my last post, I'm not a big fan of his personality and practices...but he does spill it when he feels the need to...and he's done that frequently with Cain & Perry...but tends to give Schon a bit of a pass...which I always found odd...but whatever...) I can only assume my use of the phrase "brutally honest" in regards to Herbie being out spoken tripped you up when I made it clear I wasn't an HH supporter by lumping him in with the others mentioned as not "honest & professional" in this thread.

And where do you get mystique...? LOL Honestly, don't you see enough crap on the internet where people let their balls hang out and stupidly feel the need to give everything but their age, social security #, home address, and phone number on these boards just to shine a light on themselves. I said what I've said... take it as an opinion based on interaction or feel free to disregard it as you see fit... no need to evaluate it or me any harder. I have to admit, I do find it kind of overboard that you dug up a 2-3 month old post that was made off the cuff and felt the need to over analyze it as you have. But I guess that is "the internet" for ya...

I was simply commenting on the JSS situation with the variables I've seen first hand and discussed with friends in similar situations... and I think the guy deserves better than a working relationship with any of the guys I mentioned, etc. (Again, never met Jeff... just commenting on past practices and behavior of the "other side" as I saw it... and as the old saying goes "Tigers rarely change their stripes...")

Make of it what you will...nothing more, nothing less...

(Update: For the record... I just went back through my old posts trying to get a feel for this post in April you mentioned and it turns out I posted it just a few days ago, not April...LOL Shows you how much it meant to me, or should to you or anyone else for that matter. Take it easy.)

[ArnelRox]

Easy, killer...

Never killed anything in my life. But I have a bullshitometer in me!

not a contradiction. I've dealt with him on a professional level and so have colleagues. (Without going into detail, I dealt with him professionally and a handful of friends dealt with him professionally

NOT a contradiction? hmm. Previously (whenever) u had "a friends" (as u typed it) who dealt w/him. Today in an earlier post, u dealt w/him. Now, in this post u dealt w/him & a handful of friends did. Will ur entire family have dealt w/him by tomorrow? Or ur high school/college?

Herbie was always blunt... blunt about everything.

I am too. Have u noticed?

I can only assume my use of the phrase "brutally honest" in regards to Herbie being out spoken tripped you up when I made it clear I wasn't an HH supporter.

Obviously u misread. I was "tripped" about (a) ur contradictory statement & (b) u saying Perry was not honest. I'm a loon. I admit it. & I've simply heard a LOT different about Perry. U got some proof otherwise? Put it out here. Otherwise, don't give "opinions" u can't back up.

And where do you get mystique...?

See above. Try reading it this time.

Honestly, don't you see enough crap on the internet where people let their balls hang out and stupidly feel the need to give everything but their age, social security #, home address, and phone number on these boards just to shine a light on themselves.

No.

I said what I've said... take it as an opinion based on interaction or feel free to disregard it as you see fit... no need to evaluate it or me any harder.

Yeah there is. U slammed Perry. Prove what u say or don't say it.

I have to admit, I do find it kind of overboard that you dug up a 2-3 month old post that was made off the cuff and felt the need to over analyze it as you have.

Just trying to figure out where u are coming from. That's all.

[MRMUSIC413]

Wow... I'm dense. I just realized you didn't care about the sum of the parts I was discussing, or Herbie, or me only putting some of "me out there", etc...... your a Perry fanatic. The Perry thing pissed you off...

LOL Jesus Christ... Nevermind. I'll make it easy and just take the ridiculous insult about your bullshit-o meter and your desire to "arm twist"...and say "Whatever you say, pal...you're right". Didn't realize the kid's had "rules" on posting opinions. (Guess they'd rather make up their "own minds" from heresay and magazines. Holy shit...so be it... If I'm a bullshitter to you, please, by all f**kin' means continue to believe that ... rather go that route than have a childish debate to validate my background...)

I'll just forget the past 20 some odd years and the numerous bands and management folks who left both a good and bad impression,
truly sorry to have wasted your time by saying what was on my mind. Didn't know we had to label situations or colleagues to
be "allowed" to post opinions we felt strongly about. And at my age, I have no desire to debate who takes bigger shits in the woods.
I was simply adding my two cents that I wrongly assumed would be more interesting then the usual, "I heard from a guy I once met".
I always enjoy talking the ins and out of the business with those that could relate - but by opening up on this topic I was clearly wrong that it
would be acceptable here.

Anyway, thanks for the warm welcome. When I post , I'll just post the usual run of the mill crap everybody posts from now on.

(Word of advice though: Big world out there. Some of us could have a bit more background as someone other than a suspicious fan. Don't nail everybody to the cross for every single word they do or do not utter on a message board. Some like to talk music but do value their privacy and that of colleagues...that really shouldn't be too hard to figure out.)

[Wheels Of Fyre]

Ok I'm a bit confused. In April u said:

"Amen... I used to have a friends who worked with Herbie, and he was always brutally honest about
the attitudes of Cain, Perry, etc..."

Now 2 mths later, u say u worked w/Herbie professionally urself. Which is it? U or ur friend? Or is that one & the same?

It's funny b/c I have "friends" who dealt w/Perry & they said he is always honest & very professional. I also have "friends" who dealt w/Friga & Fro & they were anything but. Heck they have even contradicted themselves in interviews.

I totally agree that Jeff is better off w/out Friga & Fro. He once told a very nice story about his encounters w/Perry tho. Painted a picture of Perry as a stellar person which jives w/what I said above.

Care to clear up this confusion & enlighten us further? Or do u like the mystique & contradictions?

I've dealt professionally with Herbie and his business partner Sandy many times over the last 20 years...
in saying that, Sandy was always a good guy to us...[You figure out the rest]

I've also dealt with Perry, Schon, & Cain professionally on many occasions as well...[Good luck telling them apart as far
as being "honest and professional"...there was always a dishonest angle and it was usually about money.. go figure.]

I've also had a few friends who have been managed by both Herbert and Azoff... they both were usually
described as "typical ruthless managers".... [How surprizing]

Bottom line: None... I repeat, NONE of the people mentioned above are anyone you'd call "honest and professional".

Though I don't know Jeff, he is better off, honestly... from what I understand he's a good guy who deserves better than that type
of treatment.

Nice to se you back in the game!

[MRMUSIC413]

[

Nice to see you back in the game!

I assume you're talking to the prosecuting attorney, right ?

[cetera]

Wow... I'm dense. I just realized you didn't care about the sum of the parts I was discussing, or Herbie, or me only putting some of "me out there", etc...... your a Perry fanatic. The Perry thing pissed you off...

LOL Jesus Christ... Nevermind. I'll make it easy and just take the ridiculous insult about your bullshit-o meter and your desire to "arm twist"...and say "Whatever you say, pal...you're right". Didn't realize the kid's had "rules" on posting opinions. (Guess they'd rather make up their "own minds" from heresay and magazines. Holy shit...so be it... If I'm a bullshitter to you, please, by all f**kin' means continue to believe that ... rather go that route than have a childish debate to validate my background...)

I'll just forget the past 20 some odd years and the numerous bands and management folks who left both a good and bad impression,
truly sorry to have wasted your time by saying what was on my mind. Didn't know we had to label situations or colleagues to
be "allowed" to post opinions we felt strongly about. And at my age, I have no desire to debate who takes bigger shits in the woods.
I was simply adding my two cents that I wrongly assumed would be more interesting then the usual, "I heard from a guy I once met".
I always enjoy talking the ins and out of the business with those that could relate - but by opening up on this topic I was clearly wrong that it
would be acceptable here.

Anyway, thanks for the warm welcome. When I post , I'll just post the usual run of the mill crap everybody posts from now on.

(Word of advice though: Big world out there. Some of us could have a bit more background as someone other than a suspicious fan. Don't nail everybody to the cross for every single word they do or do not utter on a message board. Some like to talk music but do value their privacy and that of colleagues...that really shouldn't be too hard to figure out.)

Come on now.... industry experience, genuine contacts etc mean NOTHING to a loon!

[Rockindeano]

Cetera is gay.

[Moon Beam]

Careful Dean I'm sure that a few posts could be pulled out
that question your sexuality.


Nevermind me, just felt like jumping in.
No matter what thread I open today, fighting's in play.
Kinda felt left out.

[cetera]

Cetera is gay.

I see your vocabulary hasn't improved any....

And there I was, just about to congratulate you on your latest blog..... interesting stuff.

Play nice......

[bionic]

I used to be here all the time way back when. I lurk here still, but it is only when something major comes up that I post anymore. As the song goes... "I've got livin' to do." I'm not real bent out of shape about the latest fiasco in Journey-land. When they gave their whole "If it was going on, we didn't know about it" excuse about the tapegate scandal, and then axed Steve Augeri, I basically felt that the end was coming for the band. No matter how good the band could have possibly been with Jeff Scott Soto, they have to know where their bread is buttered. If they could get Steve Perry back, count me in. Short of that, Journey will be a thing of the past for me.

How about another Herbie interview i am sure he would have some things to say!

[Greg]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

This is the post I was refering to > The first sentence ,Sarcasm ....

Well, I'd say you're pretty thin-skinned if you call that rude.

[Greg]

Wow... I'm dense. I just realized you didn't care about the sum of the parts I was discussing, or Herbie, or me only putting some of "me out there", etc...... your a Perry fanatic. The Perry thing pissed you off...

LOL Jesus Christ... Nevermind. I'll make it easy and just take the ridiculous insult about your bullshit-o meter and your desire to "arm twist"...and say "Whatever you say, pal...you're right". Didn't realize the kid's had "rules" on posting opinions. (Guess they'd rather make up their "own minds" from heresay and magazines. Holy shit...so be it... If I'm a bullshitter to you, please, by all f**kin' means continue to believe that ... rather go that route than have a childish debate to validate my background...)

I'll just forget the past 20 some odd years and the numerous bands and management folks who left both a good and bad impression,
truly sorry to have wasted your time by saying what was on my mind. Didn't know we had to label situations or colleagues to
be "allowed" to post opinions we felt strongly about. And at my age, I have no desire to debate who takes bigger shits in the woods.
I was simply adding my two cents that I wrongly assumed would be more interesting then the usual, "I heard from a guy I once met".
I always enjoy talking the ins and out of the business with those that could relate - but by opening up on this topic I was clearly wrong that it
would be acceptable here.

Anyway, thanks for the warm welcome. When I post , I'll just post the usual run of the mill crap everybody posts from now on.

(Word of advice though: Big world out there. Some of us could have a bit more background as someone other than a suspicious fan. Don't nail everybody to the cross for every single word they do or do not utter on a message board. Some like to talk music but do value their privacy and that of colleagues...that really shouldn't be too hard to figure out.)

AMEN BROTHA!!!!!

[Cate]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

This is the post I was refering to > The first sentence ,Sarcasm ....

Well, I'd say you're pretty thin-skinned if you call that rude.

No Einstein, I called you a smartass and you called me rude ! Review your posts.

[Greg]

THANK YOU!!!! That wasn't so hard now was it?:roll:

Now yes, I will definitely agree with you...if all of that stuff is true, then HH was a piece of crap for stealing from the band. However, in regards to the product itself, HH still deserves most of the credit for making Journey successful in the 80's. And...when the band members themselves (Perry, Friga, Schon..etc..) started having more control of the band, they showed that they made wrong decisions...professionally. I'm not talking about the corporate part of things. Perry got too much control and it showed on ROR. Now, Neal and Cain have too much control, and look at what is happening to the band. That, really, is my whole point. Not trying to crown anybody saint.

This is the post I was refering to > The first sentence ,Sarcasm ....

Well, I'd say you're pretty thin-skinned if you call that rude.

No Einstein, I called you a smartass and you called me rude ! Review your posts.

And at this point....who honestly gives a rat's ass? I certainly don't. If I was that rude to you and you're taking it this far, then you probably deserved it. Just do us both a favor and stop whining about it and move on to another topic.

[SDinVA]

I used to be here all the time way back when. I lurk here still, but it is only when something major comes up that I post anymore. As the song goes... "I've got livin' to do." I'm not real bent out of shape about the latest fiasco in Journey-land. When they gave their whole "If it was going on, we didn't know about it" excuse about the tapegate scandal, and then axed Steve Augeri, I basically felt that the end was coming for the band. No matter how good the band could have possibly been with Jeff Scott Soto, they have to know where their bread is buttered. If they could get Steve Perry back, count me in. Short of that, Journey will be a thing of the past for me.

Ditto L2Do. I have been a loyal follower of this band since '79, regardless of frontman for many years. Ironically, I was at Jeff's first show in Bristow and last show in Leesburg. Jeff brought a breath of fresh air to this band - period. His show in Bristow was given zero prep, and he quickly won the fans over. Same in Leesburg. There were maybe 500 folks there and they all were saying, "...this guys awesome..what energy...great voice.."! The comments were so positive and nothing short of flattering to Jeff. So what's the problem??? For these guys to jettison him in the manner in which they did, is shortsighted at best. I believe with him in the lineup, it was going to bring them back to the forefront somewhat and offer a different and edgier sound (Jeff's "Lost in Translation" CD for example - kick ass if you don't have it folks) that fans outside the existing fan base would dig.

IMHO, they have royally f***ed themselves and have obviously alienated their fan base, and don't give shit. Unless they bring back Perry (which will take an act of the Lord almighty), I think this may spell the end for these guys - cuz the word is out!! I think their egos finally got the better of them. After all my pontification, I'm with you. I've spent my last dime on this band.

Great interview with Herbie as well bro. Great insight to the Journey machine...

Peace.

[livin2do]

I used to be here all the time way back when. I lurk here still, but it is only when something major comes up that I post anymore. As the song goes... "I've got livin' to do." I'm not real bent out of shape about the latest fiasco in Journey-land. When they gave their whole "If it was going on, we didn't know about it" excuse about the tapegate scandal, and then axed Steve Augeri, I basically felt that the end was coming for the band. No matter how good the band could have possibly been with Jeff Scott Soto, they have to know where their bread is buttered. If they could get Steve Perry back, count me in. Short of that, Journey will be a thing of the past for me.

How about another Herbie interview i am sure he would have some things to say!

My interview with Herbie covered every question I ever wanted answered about the band. But, since he hasn't had any further professional involvement with Journey, I personally don't see what additional insight he might have as it relates to their most recent shake-up. When I spoke with him, he was already so far past his time with the band. He just agreed to tell his side of the story because it had gotten such little time in the Behind the Music special. I thanked him for sharing it with me, and have no desire to cover the same ground with him again.

[daytrpr]

Uh...Herbie was certainly no angel.

As I pointed out in this post, they basically did the same thing when they brought in Perry. And that was Herbie's idea. So if you're wondering where Neal learned how to treat bandmates...