Jonathan Cain's Transformation

[GollyWally]

Has Jonothan Cain always been considered extremely arrogant? When he first joined the band in 81 through ROR he always seemed kind of dorky and even humble to be surrouned by talented players like Neal, Perry and Smith. He even spoke so affectionatley how the connection with fans during live shows, etc.

Did he change over the years, as he started to feel his oats, or was it all a facade and the real Jonathon Cain finally just bubbbled to the surface?

I'm curious what you folks think.

[Matthew]

I think Herbie saw through the aw shucks, God-fearing nice boy from Chicago schtick the moment he met him at the airport.

Plus I always felt that the personality and career of Cain's first wife maybe gave us a few hints about Cain's darker side....

[JrnySuxBalls]

Didn't you guys see him cry on Behind The Music? He's quite sensitive you know.

[Matthew]

Didn't you guys see him cry on Behind The Music? He's quite sensitive you know.

[Saint John]

I'll give you guys the condensed story about what an asshole he is. I get Meet and Greet passes. My buddy is getting TBF signed by Friga. He turns and yells "Hey Neal." He points to Perry on the back of the CD and starts ragging "Look at me, I'm standing by myself. I always have to be alone. Look, I'm looking the other way." There was more, too. That's not it verbatum, but you get the general idea. I was stunned. He turned our Meet and Greet into a nightmare. Schon stood there laughing. I haven't really liked either one of them since. If Journey's management reads this site, put him/them on here and let's here him deny it. They won't, because he/they CAN'T. For once, they slipped and weren't able to keep their backstabbing name-calling behind the scenes.

[GollyWally]

Very interesting story, Saint John. Besides, how much control did SP really have over that photo shoot anyway? Doesn't the photographer and production team sort of control that sort of stuff. I've seen many band publicity shots were the lead singer is posed diffrently from the other band members - to stand out from the crowd since in most cases he or she is the face of band. It's not really that unusual a practice, is it? Cain sounds extremely jealous that despite 9 years of trying the band has never been able to crawl out of the giant footprint that Perry left. The band has never even come CLOSE to having a hit single since Perry left. In fact, here in the Atlanta area, I've never even heard a non-Perry Journey song of the radio. ZERO airplay.

Cain's milked Perry's legacy for nine years, yet has the effrontery to stab the guy in the bag who he used to talk about with such reverence. Incredible.

[Saint John]

I should say that this happened at least 5 years ago. Can't remember the specific tour, BUT I'd bet my friend can tell me the actual month and year. My best GUESS is 1999 or 2000.

[Matthew]

Cain sounds extremely jealous that despite 9 years of trying the band has never been able to crawl out of the giant footprint that Perry left.

I wonder if it's pride more than jealousy? Of all the members of Journey who would have felt hurt by Perry's withdrawl from the scene it would have to be Cain. As a song-writing team they were phenomenally productive and successful. I can imagine Cain would have taken Perry's rejection of that relationship far more to heart than Schon did of his....

[Matthew]

Has Jonothan Cain always been considered extremely arrogant? When he first joined the band in 81 through ROR he always seemed kind of dorky and even humble to be surrouned by talented players like Neal, Perry and Smith. He even spoke so affectionatley how the connection with fans during live shows, etc.

Did he change over the years, as he started to feel his oats, or was it all a facade and the real Jonathon Cain finally just bubbbled to the surface?

I'm curious what you folks think.

Actually...this is true of Schon too. In the 80s he looked all smiley and relaxed...and then almost overnight he started to look like a brooding ogre. Maybe they both started to look and act weird at the same time?

[Liz22562]

Sorry to go against the grain here, but I had the pleasure of meeting Jon Cain when they performed at Ruth Eckerd Hall in Clearwater, FL.

I was fortunate enough to get backstage and was able to speak with him for a few minutes. Our conversation was, of course, regarding music. My daughter plays several instruments, one of which is the piano. He was more than kind enough to answer a few questions I had. At no point in time was he stand-offish, rude or made me feel as though I was of no importance.

Though our discussion was brief, he was very kind.

[GollyWally]

You make a good point, Matthew. Cain and Perry wrote some incredible stuff together. In fact, their synergy as songwriters is what has been missing in the newer music to me.

It's intereseting that Cain is apparently the one who called Perry and told him to piss or get off the pot regarding the TBF tour. I always wondered why Cain made that phone call and not Neal or someone else. Maybe since the two were so close he thought if ANYBODY could get Perry to move it was him. When Perry didn't, he was left in the unenviable position of "firing" the greatest lead singer in rock history (IMO).

[AR]

Here's some information concerning Friga's transformation from Google:

http://www.soyouwanna.com/site/syws/sex ... efull.html

Your welcome Frigs, hope that helped.

[Matthew]

Sorry to against the grain here, but I had the pleasure of meeting Jon Cain when they performed at Ruth Eckerd Hall in Clearwater, FL.

I was fortunate enough to get backstage and was able to speak with him for a few minutes. Our conversation was, of course, regarding music. My daughter plays several instruments, one of which is the piano. He was more than kind enough to answer a few questions I had. At no point in time was he stand-offish, rude or made me feel as though I was of no importance.

Though our discussion was brief, he was very kind.

Glad to hear it, Liz. I'm a huge fan of the guy, anyway...

Also - isn't he always raising money for charity with the local church choir and stuff like that? Sounds kind of lame and cliched I know...but it's more than I do for anyone.

[jrnysc]

I am one who believes people eventually show their true colors. It's just like employees. When they first come to work, most of the are pretty dog gone good, if not great people. However, once they settle into their element, that is when you find out what you are truly dealing with.

I have told this story before, but since we are on the subject, I will give ya a story about Friga. Went to the Baltimore show I guess 3 or 4 years ago. I found one 5 star hotel there, and figured that had to be where they were staying. Got there the day before the show, and never saw them, the buses, or anything. I had always wanted to meet those guys, a couple at least! Long story short, come to find out they got in late the day of the show because they had been off for a few days prior. After the show, I was standing at the ATM with my Journey shirt on. Someone tapped me on the shoulder and said "how was the show?' I turned around and it was freakin Ross Valory!! My dumb ass said "are you Ross?', to which he replied "yep. Well, I think so!!" He was funny and as cool as he could be. Offered me a glass of tequila (which I hate), and asked me to take a walk with him and smoke a cig. I then met their tour manager, whose name was initials, but cannot remember for sure what they were. JT I think. He proceeded to tell me where everyone was. He told me Deen and Neal had already headed to Connecticut for a show the next night. Ross was there, Steve A. was on the bus not feeling well, and he said "Jon is in the shower, and will be down shortly. You can speak with him here in the lobby before we board the bus". I was excited as hell. I finally get to meet Jonathan Cain. Well, about 5 minutes later he got off the elevator with a jogging suit on and a bag over his shoulder. The manager told him to hurry up and board the bus because they had an all night bus ride. Jon gave him a sort of nasty look and kept walking. Out of respect, I waited till he got near me, and took about two steps towards him, when he looked at me and said "what do you want?" I was stunned and appalled. I stood there speechless for a moment and said "nothing, nothing at all". I started walking towards the elevator when a couple walked up to me all excited and ask me if I got his autograph. I said "no, I don't want it either". I told them what happened and they couldn't believe it. A few days later I emailed the chick that runs his website, and told her what happened and would she please pass along to him I did not appreciate how he treated me. Never heard another word. Not like I expected to anyway.

[Liz22562]

Matthew,

Jon does a lot of charity work on the side. He is very involved with his kids and their schools to help raise money, put together concerts, etc.

A lot of people are different at work then they are at home......

[Matthew]

You make a good point, Matthew. Cain and Perry wrote some incredible stuff together. In fact, their synergy as songwriters is what has been missing in the newer music to me.

It's intereseting that Cain is apparently the one who called Perry and told him to piss or get off the pot regarding the TBF tour. I always wondered why Cain made that phone call and not Neal or someone else. Maybe since the two were so close he thought if ANYBODY could get Perry to move it was him. When Perry didn't, he was left in the unenviable position of "firing" the greatest lead singer in rock history (IMO).

That's true, GW - they must have thought that Cain had the 'special relationship' with Perry. I mean...Neal was actually the most senior member...but maybe he had the most obviously firey relationship. Whereas I can imagine Perry and Cain had real camarderie back in 80s. After all...both Perry and Cain were the new guys...taking the band in a new direction....and the band enjoyed success beyond their wildest dreams as a result. That must be an incredible bond.

Even ROR...often derided as a Perry solo album..always seemed just as much a Cain record to me. Look at the presence he has on the record...far more than on any other Journey album.

And in the BTM it was Cain - wasn't it? - who was most obviously upset, resentful and perplexed that Perry hadn't spoken to him for years after ROR.

Sure, there were a practical and financial issues to resolve in '98 - but I wonder if part of it was Cain feeling that he was going to 'get in there first' this time to protect himself.

Anyway, it would make sense then that it seems to be Cain - more than anyone else - who can't seem to let go of the Perry years.

[jrnysc]

You are correct. It has been brought up by both Perry and Cain in interviews over the years about their close relationship. That is why he is the one who made the call.

[conversationpc]

You are correct. It has been brought up by both Perry and Cain in interviews over the years about their close relationship. That is why he is the one who made the call.

Well, at least one of them actually called Perry, unlike what they did with Jeff.

[Matthew]

I was excited as hell. I finally get to meet Jonathan Cain. Well, about 5 minutes later he got off the elevator with a jogging suit on and a bag over his shoulder. The manager told him to hurry up and board the bus because they had an all night bus ride. Jon gave him a sort of nasty look and kept walking. Out of respect, I waited till he got near me, and took about two steps towards him, when he looked at me and said "what do you want?"

That sounds rough, Jrnysc. What a nightmare. I had the same experience with a soccer hero of mine. Best to keep a distance from people who you look up to but don't actually know, isn't it?

[Matthew]

You are correct. It has been brought up by both Perry and Cain in interviews over the years about their close relationship. That is why he is the one who made the call.

Well, at least one of them actually called Perry, unlike what they did with Jeff.

Wasn't Cain the one who broke the news to Smith and Valory too? Or have I got that wrong?

[jrnysc]

I was excited as hell. I finally get to meet Jonathan Cain. Well, about 5 minutes later he got off the elevator with a jogging suit on and a bag over his shoulder. The manager told him to hurry up and board the bus because they had an all night bus ride. Jon gave him a sort of nasty look and kept walking. Out of respect, I waited till he got near me, and took about two steps towards him, when he looked at me and said "what do you want?"

That sounds rough, Jrnysc. What a nightmare. I had the same experience with a soccer hero of mine. Best to keep a distance from people who you look up to but don't actually know, isn't it?

Yes Matthew it is. Unfortunately I found out the hard way. It was cool meeting Ross at least. I asked Ross "can I get a picture with you?", and he smiled and said "if you have a camera, I have a face!!"

[jrnysc]

You are correct. It has been brought up by both Perry and Cain in interviews over the years about their close relationship. That is why he is the one who made the call.

Well, at least one of them actually called Perry, unlike what they did with Jeff.

Wasn't Cain the one who broke the news to Smith and Valory too? Or have I got that wrong?

I can't remember how that went down. Perhaps Cain will answer that one for us while he is keeping a watchful eye on us.

[Vocalsmanvocals]

I have to go against the grain as well. In Jon Cain's 2004 DVD, Shine on Chicago, right before the Journey medley, he talks about missing Steve Perry as an old friend and writing partner. He said it so sincerce as well. If Cain was acting, he should receive the Oscar, but you could tell the guy was genuine.

About that elevator story, these guys are just human. I have had the chance to hang out with celebrities. Not all of them can be Mary Poppins nice nice 24/7.

[jrnysc]

I have to go against the grain as well. In Jon Cain's 2004 DVD, Shine on Chicago, right before the Journey medley, he talks about missing Steve Perry as an old friend and writing partner. He said it so sincerce as well. If Cain was acting, he should receive the Oscar, but you could tell the guy was genuine.

About that elevator story, these guys are just human. I have had the chance to hang out with celebrities. Not all of them can be Mary Poppins nice nice 24/7.

I understand your point. The other side of that, however, is that if it were not for people like us, he would not be living the kind of life he is today. I am a paying customer, just like any other business. He doesn't have to be Mary Poppins, but he shouldn't be that rude either. Just good business sense.

[brywool]

Didn't you guys see him cry on Behind The Music? He's quite sensitive you know.

Ya know, that didn't bug me so much. I could totally see that.
However, I remember in Frontiers and Beyond, he kind of did that while talking on the phone to a journalist and I thought "geez, dude, grow some". The kid thing, I have no problem with. That'd be one hell of a sobering band memory. Yikes. It was plain that it really affected him and Perry a lot.

Aw, shucks kids, I'm an old softy!

[nolippin]

I wouldn't be so skeptical, if he had actually shed a tear. but his eyes were dry!

Didn't you guys see him cry on Behind The Music? He's quite sensitive you know.

Ya know, that didn't bug me so much. I could totally see that.
However, I remember in Frontiers and Beyond, he kind of did that while talking on the phone to a journalist and I thought "geez, dude, grow some". The kid thing, I have no problem with. That'd be one hell of a sobering band memory. Yikes. It was plain that it really affected him and Perry a lot.

Aw, shucks kids, I'm an old softy!

[RunningAlone Pgh]

I'll give you guys the condensed story about what an asshole he is. I get Meet and Greet passes. My buddy is getting TBF signed by Friga. He turns and yells "Hey Neal." He points to Perry on the back of the CD and starts ragging "Look at me, I'm standing by myself. I always have to be alone. Look, I'm looking the other way." There was more, too. That's not it verbatum, but you get the general idea. I was stunned. He turned our Meet and Greet into a nightmare. Schon stood there laughing. I haven't really liked either one of them since. If Journey's management reads this site, put him/them on here and let's here him deny it. They won't, because he/they CAN'T. For once, they slipped and weren't able to keep their backstabbing name-calling behind the scenes.

Cain's backstabbing is really ironic considering that when he was going through a very dark period after his marriage broke up, Jon said Perry "gave a damn", went to his home, stayed with him and "pulled me out of the hole". Jon talked about it in interviews afterwards ~ I think one was in BAM. I probably have the article somewhere at home.

I've heard a bunch of stories about what an asshole he can be from former insiders. He's a hell of an actor, putting on the Mr. Nice Guy face when need be.

[Vocalsmanvocals]

I have to go against the grain as well. In Jon Cain's 2004 DVD, Shine on Chicago, right before the Journey medley, he talks about missing Steve Perry as an old friend and writing partner. He said it so sincerce as well. If Cain was acting, he should receive the Oscar, but you could tell the guy was genuine.

About that elevator story, these guys are just human. I have had the chance to hang out with celebrities. Not all of them can be Mary Poppins nice nice 24/7.

I understand your point. The other side of that, however, is that if it were not for people like us, he would not be living the kind of life he is today. I am a paying customer, just like any other business. He doesn't have to be Mary Poppins, but he shouldn't be that rude either. Just good business sense.

True!

[brywool]

Cain's got nothing on Schon.

[GollyWally]

Certainly the guy's ego must have ballooned with the success that followed his advent with Escape and Frontiers.
Though I must confess, it must be tough living under a microscope 24/7 where everything you do or say is getting scrutinized by so many people. Given THAT, you do do owe your fans, because as a fellow poster noted, the fans are the ones putting you up in the 5-Star Hotel you can traipse through dissing them on your way out the door.

Though from the story above, it looks like Ross knows whose buttering the bread! I've always heard he was a nice guy.