why steve perry will never rejoin journey

[ohsherrie]

Too bad there's not a good study on the subject since it's fairly rare but I would be willing to bet that most women who get an abortion after being raped now regret having done that.

Bullshit. U obviously haven't spent much time w/rape victims! I have & I don't know one who regretted aborting the baby. I know PLENTY who regretted carrying the child to term tho. That was extremely rough.

Quit betting. Go work w/rape victims then come back & spout ur actual findings!

I've heard testimonials from rape victims who did abort and said the exact opposite, so don't give me that crap.

Do you really think you've heard more on this subject than Susie and I have Dave? Do you really think that?

[ArnelRox]

I've heard testimonials from rape victims who did abort and said the exact opposite, so don't give me that crap.

Here's my testimonial. I was raped by a family member & got pregnant. I was 16 at the time. I aborted the baby. I don't regret it. Not one bit. There's my crap. Stick it in ur pipe & smoke it. Now u have heard a different testimonial.

[Lula]

Too bad there's not a good study on the subject since it's fairly rare but I would be willing to bet that most women who get an abortion after being raped now regret having done that.

Bullshit. U obviously haven't spent much time w/rape victims! I have & I don't know one who regretted aborting the baby. I know PLENTY who regretted carrying the child to term tho. That was extremely rough.

Quit betting. Go work w/rape victims then come back & spout ur actual findings!

I've heard testimonials from rape victims who did abort and said the exact opposite, so don't give me that crap.

Goes to show you the importance of letting the individual woman make the choice that is right for her.

[conversationpc]

However, when your religious beliefs lead you to link yourself with a particular political party then you need to look at the further ramifications of that party's related policies.

There are a ton of black southern churches who align themselves with the Democratic party who would cry racism on that remark.

[conversationpc]

Here's my testimonial. I was raped by a family member & got pregnant. I was 16 at the time. I aborted the baby. I don't regret it. Not one bit. There's my crap. Stick it in ur pipe & smoke it. Now u have heard a different testimonial.

That sucks that it happened to you. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

[conversationpc]

Too bad there's not a good study on the subject since it's fairly rare but I would be willing to bet that most women who get an abortion after being raped now regret having done that.

Bullshit. U obviously haven't spent much time w/rape victims! I have & I don't know one who regretted aborting the baby. I know PLENTY who regretted carrying the child to term tho. That was extremely rough.

Quit betting. Go work w/rape victims then come back & spout ur actual findings!

I've heard testimonials from rape victims who did abort and said the exact opposite, so don't give me that crap.

Do you really think you've heard more on this subject than Susie and I have Dave? Do you really think that?

I never said that. Yet another instance of twisting my words to what you wanted to hear me say.

[ohsherrie]

Holy shit, I thought I was sorta conservative, Deano and Sherrie, but you just linked abortion to surplus population control?


This isn't China.


Kill them because they're born into poorness?

No that's absolutely not what we're saying and you know it. We're saying that when the mother either doesn't want the child, can't afford to raise the child, or there will be medical issues resulting in either the mother or the child, the conservatives who don't want abortion to be legal have to come up with some way to economically support the results of that morally judgemental legislation.

[ArnelRox]

Here's my testimonial. I was raped by a family member & got pregnant. I was 16 at the time. I aborted the baby. I don't regret it. Not one bit. There's my crap. Stick it in ur pipe & smoke it. Now u have heard a different testimonial.

That sucks that it happened to you. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Really? I thought it was all just crap to u? Would u like all the gory details about what my disgusting but super conservative very religious stepfather beat the crap out of me. He beat me so much that there simply couldn't be any crap left. Then he raped me on top of it all. But it's all ok. He went to mass every day during Lent & was a pillar of his religious community. Just ask anyone what a great Catholic man he is even today.

How DARE u tell me that's crap. U have no idea what it was like to live that. U have no idea what it's like to run away from home at 16 & find ur own way in this world w/those kinds of scars. I've done a REALLY great job of it. I did the right thing & anyone who DARES to say otherwise, I will turn into that Russian muscle woman & beat the crap out of them.

[Red13JoePa]

And adoption's out of the question why, again?





I'd love a study too, of how many abortions are really committed out physical life-threatening necessity, how many are committed because a raped woman doesn't want the baby, and how many are just flat out "don't feel like it/inconvenience" abortions.

[ohsherrie]

I've heard testimonials from rape victims who did abort and said the exact opposite, so don't give me that crap.

I never said that. Yet another instance of twisting my words to what you wanted to hear me say.

So your statement above wasn't meant to imply that more rape victims regret their abortions than not because you've heard such testimony?

In your previous post you said you had a hard time believing that those women didn't regret it later. You can't have it both ways. Either most of them regret it or they don't.

[conversationpc]

Really? I thought it was all just crap to u? Would u like all the gory details about what my disgusting but super conservative very religious stepfather beat the crap out of me. He beat me so much that there simply couldn't be any crap left. Then he raped me on top of it all. But it's all ok. He went to mass every day during Lent & was a pillar of his religious community. Just ask anyone what a great Catholic man he is even today.

How DARE u tell me that's crap. U have no idea what it was like to live that. U have no idea what it's like to run away from home at 16 & find ur own way in this world w/those kinds of scars. I've done a REALLY great job of it. I did the right thing & anyone who DARES to say otherwise, I will turn into that Russian muscle woman & beat the crap out of them.

Unbe-frickin'-lievable. I guess I should never attempt to express sympathy for anyone.

[Socratic Methodist]

I'd like to chirp in on this topic.....

Abortion, whether it is murder or not is irrelavent...

The core issue to 95% of the women abortion relates to is this: 'No one is going to tell me what to do'.

So abortion is reduced to NOT whether or not she is killing an innocent life, but to whether someone should tell them what to do concerning their body.

And abortion is 'birth control AFTER the fact'. Kinda sad, really. Let me be irresponsible, have sex....I'll just abort it when the time comes. great philosophy.

The pro-choice camp will dodge the murder slant on every level, pushing, instead - the 'it is MY choice' mantra.

It is still murder, and it is wrong. If you don't want the child, have it then give it away. There are PLENTY of people who would give away their life savings to have a child.

Summary:

Interviewer: Ma'am, do you consider yourself a murderer because you had an abortion?
Murderer: No one is gonna tell me what to do with my body!

Case closed!

[ArnelRox]

And adoption's out of the question why, again?

What an asshole! U expect a woman to carry a baby to term after she's been raped by her stepfather. Ask ur wife if she'd do it. Ask ur sister. Ask ur mother.

[ArnelRox]

Really? I thought it was all just crap to u? Would u like all the gory details about what my disgusting but super conservative very religious stepfather beat the crap out of me. He beat me so much that there simply couldn't be any crap left. Then he raped me on top of it all. But it's all ok. He went to mass every day during Lent & was a pillar of his religious community. Just ask anyone what a great Catholic man he is even today.

How DARE u tell me that's crap. U have no idea what it was like to live that. U have no idea what it's like to run away from home at 16 & find ur own way in this world w/those kinds of scars. I've done a REALLY great job of it. I did the right thing & anyone who DARES to say otherwise, I will turn into that Russian muscle woman & beat the crap out of them.

Unbe-frickin'-lievable. I guess I should never attempt to express sympathy for anyone.

Unbelievable that u said it was crap before I told u my story & that all rape victims regret aborting. Am I supposed to just say "oh that's okay".

[Red13JoePa]

And we know Dave, myself, or ANY pro life people have never had personal unpleasant experience with rape, unexpected pregnancies and the question of abortion how?


We may not be posting about it on forums but still.

[ohsherrie]

And adoption's out of the question why, again?

How many crack babies, or other children who are physically or mentally damaged due to their parents' poverty or lifestyle, do you suppose get adopted?

I'd love a study too, of how many abortions are really committed out physical life-threatening necessity, how many are committed because a raped woman doesn't want the baby, and how many are just flat out "don't feel like it/inconvenience" abortions.

I think the majority are commited out of inconvenience. But, I think that in most cases the inconvenience is due to poverty and ignorance rather than a lifestyle choice by the mother.

[Red13JoePa]

And adoption's out of the question why, again?

What an asshole! U expect a woman to carry a baby to term after she's been raped by her stepfather. Ask ur wife if she'd do it. Ask ur sister. Ask ur mother.

Wife and mom are pro life too.

Sisters, I might have some that either aren;t or sit on the fence.

[conversationpc]

How many crack babies, or other children who are physically or mentally damaged due to their parents' poverty or lifestyle, do you suppose get adopted?

Answer? Not enough but still lots. My daughter suffered because of her birthmother's alcoholism and will consider to suffer the effects of it for the rest of her life. Yet she was adopted and thousands like her are adopted. Friends of ours adopted an FAS baby. My wife and I fostered a newborn baby born addicted to several drugs. I am always amazed at how many parents are willing to adopt children with these problems.

[ohsherrie]

I'd like to chirp in on this topic.....

Abortion, whether it is murder or not is irrelavent...

The core issue to 95% of the women abortion relates to is this: 'No one is going to tell me what to do'.

So abortion is reduced to NOT whether or not she is killing an innocent life, but to whether someone should tell them what to do concerning their body.

And abortion is 'birth control AFTER the fact'. Kinda sad, really. Let me be irresponsible, have sex....I'll just abort it when the time comes. great philosophy.

The pro-choice camp will dodge the murder slant on every level, pushing, instead - the 'it is MY choice' mantra.

It is still murder, and it is wrong. If you don't want the child, have it then give it away. There are PLENTY of people who would give away their life savings to have a child.

Summary:

Interviewer: Ma'am, do you consider yourself a murderer because you had an abortion?
Murderer: No one is gonna tell me what to do with my body!

Case closed!

I think you're wrong there Socrates. I know I've heard that attitude myself and I can't say I totally disagree with it when the sexual act wasn't a choice or when the woman's health is involved. No one should be able to tell a woman she has to bear a child of rape or give birth when her life or health is as risk But I don't think that "it's my body and I'll do what I want with it" attitude is the core issue.

[Rick]

Well I think we've heard a lot of angles on this subject, and have taken this thread completely off topic. What's say the conversation of the off topic subject is finished and we return this thread to it's original discussion.

Steve Perry will never rejoin Journey because he's afraid people will go to discussion boards and discuss his return only to have the thread hijacked and taken off topic.

[ArnelRox]

Wife and mom are pro life too.

Sisters, I might have some that either aren;t or sit on the fence.

That wasn't the issue. If ur wife was raped, would u expect her to carry the child? Would she want to? How about ur mom?

How would u feel if one of ur sisters was raped & aborted? Would u judge her, stop talking to her?

Think about it. Then answer honestly.

[Socratic Methodist]

I'd like to chirp in on this topic.....

Abortion, whether it is murder or not is irrelavent...

The core issue to 95% of the women abortion relates to is this: 'No one is going to tell me what to do'.

So abortion is reduced to NOT whether or not she is killing an innocent life, but to whether someone should tell them what to do concerning their body.

And abortion is 'birth control AFTER the fact'. Kinda sad, really. Let me be irresponsible, have sex....I'll just abort it when the time comes. great philosophy.

The pro-choice camp will dodge the murder slant on every level, pushing, instead - the 'it is MY choice' mantra.

It is still murder, and it is wrong. If you don't want the child, have it then give it away. There are PLENTY of people who would give away their life savings to have a child.

Summary:

Interviewer: Ma'am, do you consider yourself a murderer because you had an abortion?
Murderer: No one is gonna tell me what to do with my body!

Case closed!

I think you're wrong there Socrates. I know I've heard that attitude myself and I can't say I totally disagree with it when the sexual act wasn't a choice or when the woman's health is involved. No one should be able to tell a woman she has to bear a child of rape or give birth when her life or health is as risk But I don't think that "it's my body and I'll do what I want with it" attitude is the core issue.

Not attacking YOU....

But the typical response is always about RAPE, and health....cause that's the ONLY excuse there is.....I wasn't referring to either instance, because those COMBINED are less than the ones who abort because of the 'inconvenience factor'...or 'birth control AFTER the fact'..

Also, how can you say the core issue isn't 'it's my body and I'll do with it what I want', when the name of the movement is the 'Pro-CHOICE' movement....the second word is CHOICE.....At lease the pro-life movement includes the word that it is most concerned with - LIFE.

If I was Pro-freedom....wouldn't you assume I was concerned with...ummm....say......FREEDOM?!
So if someone is Pro-CHOICE, I assume they are MORE concerned with the CHOICE, and not the LIFE....

[Red13JoePa]

I think the majority are commited out of inconvenience. But, I think that in most cases the inconvenience is due to poverty and ignorance rather than a lifestyle choice by the mother.

Poor have always been here and always will be. It is a fact of life everywhere.
If that either bothers your conscience or your sense of middles class security so much that you want to allow the slaughtering of babies because of it that's on you.

[ArnelRox]

And abortion is 'birth control AFTER the fact'. Kinda sad, really. Let me be irresponsible, have sex....I'll just abort it when the time comes. great philosophy.

Excuse me but at 16, I was a virgin. I wasn't thinking about having sex or getting pregnant or any of the above. I hadn't given ANY thought to birth control simply b/c there was no need. When my stepfather raped me & I became pregnant, I had to learn a LOT fast. Are u saying here that I should have (a) anticipated that my stepfather would rape me & (b) use birth control just in case?

Come on. That's bullshit.

[NealIsGod]

I think the majority are commited out of inconvenience. But, I think that in most cases the inconvenience is due to poverty and ignorance rather than a lifestyle choice by the mother.

Poor have always been here and always will be. It is a fact of life everywhere.
If that either bothers your conscience or your sense of middles class security so much that you want to allow the slaughtering of babies because of it that's on you.

Wow.

[Red13JoePa]

Wife and mom are pro life too.

Sisters, I might have some that either aren;t or sit on the fence.

That wasn't the issue. If ur wife was raped, would u expect her to carry the child?

It certainly was the issue.

You're either pro life or you aren't.

[Rockindeano]

You're either pro life or you aren't.

Really? I vote PRO-CHOICE and have 2 kids with two enroute.

It is a personal, individual decision, and last time I looked, it's a right in this country, to have an abortion. I am not about to let any religeous zealots tell my daughter, wife or sister what they can or cannot do to their body,

[ArnelRox]

Wife and mom are pro life too.

Sisters, I might have some that either aren;t or sit on the fence.

That wasn't the issue. If ur wife was raped, would u expect her to carry the child?

It certainly was the issue.

You're either pro life or you aren't.

So answer my questions then.

[ArnelRox]

You're either pro life or you aren't.

Really? I vote PRO-CHOICE and have 2 kids with two enroute.

It is a personal, individual decision, and last time I looked, it's a right in this country, to have an abortion. I am not about to let any religeous zealots tell my daughter, wife or sister what they can or cannot do to their body,

Thank u Deano. Major kudos to u. We need MORE people like u in this world.

[RedWingFan]

That wasn't the issue. If ur wife was raped, would u expect her to carry the child? Would she want to? How about ur mom?

How would u feel if one of ur sisters was raped & aborted? Would u judge her, stop talking to her?

Think about it. Then answer honestly.

Why is this example always brought up when 99% of abortions are performed out of convenience? So men and women can behave how they want only to kill the innocent later.
If it were my sister? I would want her to carry it and either love him or her or put it up for adoption.